Rapidly approaching the end of my rope...

[Robnewman76]

Hi all...

 

First things first, this is my first post about this, here or anywhere. To be honest, I'm not even sure what to expect... I guess I'm hoping for some advice, or suggestions that may help me get things back on track with my marriage, as right now I don't see much future in it.

 

I'll try and keep it concise.

 

We've been married for 14 years now, spending the first 6 in the UK (I am British, my wife is American), then moving to the US 9 years ago. When we were in the UK, things were great... we had some issues, but what relationship doesn't. Overall, we were very much in love, we spend a great deal of time together with joint activities and exploring the UK and Europe.

 

Then we moved back to the US. At first, it was business as usual, but it very rapidly changed and the relationship chilled dramatically. This change was very much in line with the move back to the US. Admittedly, shortly (perhaps a year) after I arrived, I went back to school in Florida to get my pilot's ratings. I was away from home for 9 months. Following this, I took a job to build my hours in California. The entire time I was away, I was very aware that I needed to keep the relationship going somehow, and did what I could with cards, letters and little gifts... More importantly, I invited my wife to come stay with me on multiple occasions. Somehow, there was always an excuse as to why she could not visit.

 

Cracks had already begun to show by this point, so I left a good job, with good pay and took a job with far fewer prospects and much lower pay closer to home (in Portland) to try and give my wife the ability to come visit more often (and remove some of the other excuses that she had used in the past), but despite this move, I saw here twice in 7 months (not counting the 5 times I drove home to spend time with her).

 

So I got my first airline job... now I was living at home. Yet somehow it was empty... the phrase "living as roommates" gets tossed around a lot, but it's pretty accurate in this case. Fast forward 6 more months, I got a job pretty much out of my home base... but yet again, it's only gotten worse.

 

About 2 and half years ago, while out to breakfast one day, I was informed that my wife was frustrated that all out efforts to have a kid were not working, and that we should no longer even try. We should just accept that we would never have kids. I was left with very few options here. I wanted kids then, I still want kids now... But as with all things, there were many excuses as to why we shouldn't. I took the position of supporting my wife's decision.

 

shortly after that, we bought a house, and then a few months after that, we stopped having any sexual encounters entirely. I was still wanting, but in the end the constant rejection was far more painful than the frustration and lack any intimacy.

 

That was over two years ago now. Things have stabilized into very superficial marriage. There's no drive, no intimacy, no sex, it's very one sided (I basically do all the cooking, cleaning, repair work etc), and she barely leaves the house for anything. When she does, it's never outside of the city limits. Despite all this, I still "love" my wife... but it's the kind of love you have for a best friend. We still laugh, and I'd say we're still great friends... but while this may seem whiny, even a little selfish, I'm no longer satisfied with what out relationship has become.

 

I want more commitment, I want someone to help me do the chores, I want to at least have my desire to have kids acknowledged (even if there's nothing we can do about it). I know it's unlikely to ever get back "the beginning"; relationships naturally change and evolve over time, but my wife currently seems incapable of providing even the barest of marriages. Essentially, I'm married, but I no longer have a wife.

 

We have talked about this many times in the past, but nothing ever seems to change (more often than not simply getting rationalized by "it's not my fault, it's this"). I've done and continue to do all I can to try and coax some kind of change for the positive, but it's beginning to look hopeless. I'm 40, and I don't want to spend the next 40 years miserable.

 

Any suggestions will be very gratefully received...

[ut03n9]

I'm going through my 2nd divorce and it's not something I would wish on anybody. Have you expressed your frustrations, have you seen a counselor. Don't give up without making every possible effort. Best friends are hard to find....

[catfeeder]

I would suggest to wife that I want to learn how to be a better husband for her, so I'd like her to think of something she wants from me in exchange for seeing a marriage counselor with me.

 

I'd also visit with an attorney for an information interview. I'd want to learn all of my options given the laws in my location, as well as the steps I'd need to take given each option. Then I'd have the information I'd need to make informed decisions later, depending on wife's response to my suggestion of counseling.

 

From there, if wife is not willing to participate, I'd decide which of my options I want to pursue.

[Edmund Exley]

I think some of the issues here may revolve around the inability to have children and what that may have done to psyche. Was this because of your wife being unable? Have you two had any form of therapy? That can be a very depressing thing to face, and she may be dealing with subconscious depression or feelings of inadequacies.

[Edmund Exley]

I'd hold off on the attorney until all measures fail. If she were to find out that may convince her you are already gone.

[Zaphod]

Considered adoption?

[Wiseman2]

Sorry to hear this. agree you can't spend the rest of your lives as roommates. Since your wife is from the US does she have family or friends nearby?

 

Does she work? Is she depressed or using drugs, drinking or is there a reason you can see for her inertia? You say you want kids, is that one sided as well?

 

Have you considered marriage therapy? Is there any outside affairs/interest on either of your parts? Have you consulted an attorney to considers your options, should she refuse marriage therapy?

We've been married for 14 years now, spending the first 6 in the UK (I am British, my wife is American), then moving to the US 9 years ago. There's no drive, no intimacy, no sex, it's very one sided and she barely leaves the house for anything. I still "love" my wife... but it's the kind of love you have for a best friend. I want to at least have my desire to have kids acknowledged

[DancingFool]

Can I marry you? You are truly the perfect husband with the patience of a rock. Most other men would have been long gone in your shoes.

 

That aside, I do think that the inability to conceive has likely done a number on her psyche. Is it you, is it her? Have you guys seen doctors about that? She sounds like she is suffering from some kind of depression that's probably related to that. So it's time for you and her to actually sit down and have some long serious conversations about what is happening. This is one of those where you both need to be honest with each other rather than just running away from the problem or sweeping it under the rug as "tried, failed, now we will just quit life and live as roommates". There are so many medical options nowadays to resolve this issue. Even if she is not willing, the depression needs to be treated regardless. She needs evaluation and extensive counseling.

 

Unfortunately, while you can bring it all up, you can't make her do anything. If she is not willing to get help and rejoin life, not much you can do about it. You will then need to make a decision whether you will continue to stick around or walk away.

[Lester]

"I saw here twice in 7 months (not counting the 5 times I drove home to spend time with her)."

- Seven visits in seven months?

 

Happy wife/good sex/babies is impossible with the distance your career choice has created.

[lostandhurt]

I don't see this coming from not being able to conceive, this marriage lost it's intimate connection, it's IN LOVE portion. I don't think the distance caused it either but it certainly didn't help.

The issues go much deeper and I think they reside within your wife. If she hardly ever leaves the house and just sits around I would say she is depressed. Has she ever seen a doctor? Most women that want kids and try and don't conceive go see their doctor and at least try a few less invasive and expensive treatments before they just give up. It looks like she has given up on kids, the marriage, you and being in love.

 

Since she is quick to blame other factors and not take any ownership of the problems a marriage counselor is a great way to have an outside person call her on it and help bring out what she knows/feels but doesn't want to admit or say out loud. I think some sort of individual and couples counseling will help you both a great deal even if the marriage ends.

 

Find a marriage counselor and let her know you are not willing to just keep going day by day like you have been and that you want her to attend the session with you to make your marriage better once again. If she refuses to go then go by yourself. It will help.

 

Do not settle for this life, it can be way better than what has happened.

 

Lost

[Robnewman76]

Thanks all...

 

I do feel at this stage, a counseling session or several may be in order. I have often thought of it, but I'm almost certain my wife will react negatively to the suggestion.

 

I know my wife is currently seeing a therapist due to depression. There has been a lot happen in recent years, not just the decision on kids, that has taken a toll on both of us... My wife however seems to have stalled in the recovery department. That in itself is one reason I can't bring myself to suggest that there is something that needs fixing with our marriage... she already has a lot on her plate.

 

As far as my career choice being to blame, I fully acknowledge that I was away from home for about 2 years while studying and getting qualified. We had plenty of opportunities to meet up and maintain the relationship. In fact my wife had plenty of opportunities to relocate but point blank refuses to leave the small town where we live. There was always some excuse as to why she couldn't travel that day, or why she didn't like driving at night, or she didn't like the train, etc, etc. Furthermore, I now live at home, back in that same small town. This was always the goal, and I made it in 2 years... that was many years ago now so there is no longer any physical distance. The decision to not have kids was made long after I returned home. I feel the comment that made mention that my career, and my choices are fully to blame is incredibly hostile, unappreciated and shows that you didn't even read the post in full.

 

I should also mention that there has been a lot of inappropriate actions in the past... my wife has admitted to several affairs, even going as far as to give me a "free pass" (something I am not remotely interested in) provided "she can do the same". I'm almost certain that this is down to my absence, and to a point I can even understand it. It hurts nonetheless to hear that she is willing to drive who knows where, or travel places to be with other guys when she doesn't show the same commitment to our own marriage.

 

Thank you to all those with constructive and helpful suggestions though. I feel that at this time, despite my wife's ongoing battle with her current mental health, I need to stand up and at least inform her that I feel we need help for the marriage. I'm not sure how she will react, and I'm fearful that it may only compound the issue. However, I have my own state of mind to consider too and I have been deferring that to allow my wife to recover for too long.

 

Again, to the most of you, thanks... We will see where this goes.

[catfeeder]

I do feel at this stage, a counseling session or several may be in order. I have often thought of it, but I'm almost certain my wife will react negatively to the suggestion.

 

I know my wife is currently seeing a therapist due to depression.

 

If she's already in therapy herself, why would she be opposed to seeing a therapist with you? That's your angle--tell her you want the help to learn how to be a better husband to her rather than making it about a deficiency in her. The only way to get past someone's defenses is to spell out what's in it for them. So position it in her favor, and also find out what kind of reward she wants from you in order to bribe her.

 

Bribery is the fine art of showing her how it's in her best interest to give you what you want.

 

Head high, and I hope you'll let us know how it goes.

[lostandhurt]

I had figured she had cheated on you in the past from everything you mentioned. Her depression, infidelity, unwillingness to try are all signs of someone that is trying to cause something to happen in their life one way or another. Perhaps she needs to find a new therapist if she has been seeing this one for a while and there is no improvement.

 

Now on to you. You have stayed with her through all this but it is time to step up and make one grand attempt at making your marriage better. Tell her you are very unhappy with the way OUR marriage has deteriorated and you plan on making an appointment with a marriage counselor so WE can get help rebuilding OUR relationship. If she responds negatively to the idea simply tell her that you are going and you hope she changes her mind and comes along. Then make the appointment when you are sure she can attend and go by yourself if needed. They can help you decide if you should keep trying or give up and file for divorce. Sometimes people need a shock to their system to see just how bad it has become for them to make a change. Kind of like an addict hitting rock bottom.

 

Don't threaten divorce or give time lines or ultimatums, just go to the counseling sessions and think about what is best for you and your marriage. She may very well make your choice for you.

 

Lost

[Robnewman76]

I had figured she had cheated on you in the past from everything you mentioned. Her depression, infidelity, unwillingness to try are all signs of someone that is trying to cause something to happen in their life one way or another. Perhaps she needs to find a new therapist if she has been seeing this one for a while and there is no improvement.

Lost

 

That's a great observation. The sad thing is, I've found myself in recent months without even realizing it, taking a similar approach... kind of suspending all efforts in the hopes that my wife would notice and say something... Once I recognized that in myself, I knew I had to do something other than just give up. Hence I'm gathering myself and my wits to make some kind of change, hopefully for the better, but a change all the same.

 

My wife has also been to several therapists... her current one is apparently "a good one" in as much as she hasn't complained too much about him, and seems to like his methods. That said, my wife has been a master excuse maker since I knew her... I almost feel as if she want's to remain "depressed" as that gives her a reason as to why she behaves the way she does (I've had conversations with her about this exact thing... she once convinced herself that she had Asperger's Syndrome because "that would explain my outbursts and social anxiety"... when she was tested and told she did not, she was furious rather than relieved... she had lost an excuse.)

 

But yes... This is the time to make that stand and see where it takes us.

 

I certainly appreciate all the advice... It's somewhat comforting to know there are others in the same boat.

[lostandhurt]

This is where you need to focus on you and be selfish.

 

You may not even have noticed but all her dysfunction has affected you in a very negative way. Get yourself healthy mind and body and then I think things will become more clear for you. You have lived with this so long you don't even feel how bad it truly is.

 

I agree that your wife likes having an excuse but you need to get to a point where you feel good enough and confident enough to stand up straight and state what YOU want YOUR marriage to be like. If she agrees then you both can work to that goal but if she simply wants to sit by and let the marriage die a slow death then she has made your choice for you and you can end it with few regrets.

 

Lost

[hoegaandit]

I think to be honest your marriage is gone. When you are in something day to day and have been with someone a long time, you can lose touch with what is reasonable - you have a wife who is unreasonable about moving, has had affairs without your consent, is not pulling her weight one whit and no longer a sexual partner. Ok she is depressed but this all seems pretty crazy to me. Further you indicate that you are on eggshells about even suggesting mutual counseling.

 

Life is too short for this. You had a good innings at first but I think it is time to meet someone who will be a proper spouse, and with whom you can have a family.

[Robnewman76]

So here's an update.

 

My wife and I sat down and talked everything over. I stated the things I was not happy with and that we no longer had a marriage, or even that much of a relationship anymore and that things had to change, not just for me, but for both of us. I did all the talking, and my wife did nothing but agree with all my concerns. Eventually, I asked if there was anything she wanted to add, or wanted to say... All I got was a short, simple "no".

 

I think it's clear to me now that she has been expecting this for a while, maybe even wanting it... if I'm the one being "the bad guy", then she can use that as another of her excuses.

 

Anyway, the decision has been made. We are officially seperating as soon as I get myself financially stable (currently on sick leave, but my disability insurance kicks in this month). It was a mutual decision, and ironically, she has been more cordial and put more effort into life in the last week since we made the seperation decision than the last few years combined. I'm hoping this will be good for both of us. I'm moving out, and to a different town which is better for my job.

 

No divorce on the table yet, as it would cost too much, but we're certainly headed our seperate ways. If the future brings sonething up that makes it legally required, then we'll make it official.

 

Thanks again, all here who posted... you really helped me make an informed decision and I feel quite positive about the future for both of us.

[Robnewman76]

Another update...

 

So what I thought was an amicable separation is not the case. I moved out, as we both agreed, and the first week or two was just fine. Apparently things changed quite rapidly; me texting to say hello and check things were ok every now and then is no longer welcome... in fact "how she is doing is no longer any of my business" (to quote the text message I got).

 

It's quite startling how quickly she changed her mood and I'm certainly wondering at this point if this was always her plan.

 

Well, at least now I feel more justified in looking out for myself and finally putting my own needs first for a change. We'll see where life takes me moving forward.

[Rustysuit]

I don't see any future with this women. And, frankly, I'm appalled you lasted this long with someone who clearly doesn't care for your needs. You changed countries, jobs and you even bought a house? OP, you did more than enough. I think you know what needs to be done. You'll end up hating your wife with a lot of resentment down the road wondering why you wasted all these years on someone who doesn't care.

 

I'm an hopeless romantic and I believe in workings things out, but I think this runs deeper than that.

Try counselling together or something if you wish, but as it is, you know this situation can't keep going.

[catfeeder]

Another update...

 

So what I thought was an amicable separation is not the case. I moved out, as we both agreed, and the first week or two was just fine. Apparently things changed quite rapidly; me texting to say hello and check things were ok every now and then is no longer welcome... in fact "how she is doing is no longer any of my business" (to quote the text message I got).

 

It's quite startling how quickly she changed her mood and I'm certainly wondering at this point if this was always her plan.

 

Well, at least now I feel more justified in looking out for myself and finally putting my own needs first for a change. We'll see where life takes me moving forward.

 

Have you sought legal advice?

[lostandhurt]

If I were to guess I would say she has a romantic interest and thus does not want you snooping into her new life. Only a guess...

 

This thing is dead and you need to make a legal move. If you did not file a legal separation you are the hook for each others debts.

 

Look up some legal advice and find out how to end this marriage.

 

I am sorry it turned out this way but it just might be the best thing that very happened to you.

 

Please seek out help to end this today, you have waited long enough.

 

Lost

[catfeeder]

If I were to guess I would say she has a romantic interest and thus does not want you snooping into her new life. Only a guess...

 

This thing is dead and you need to make a legal move. If you did not file a legal separation you are the hook for each others debts.

 

Look up some legal advice and find out how to end this marriage.

 

I am sorry it turned out this way but it just might be the best thing that very happened to you.

 

Please seek out help to end this today, you have waited long enough.

 

Lost

 

I agree with seeking advice, but not necessarily taking on the expense of initiating anything beyond self protection. You'll need to know more before making assumptions about what degree of action you'll want to take.

 

You need to learn best ways to protect your assets and avoid assuming further debt incurred by spouse. Frankly, I would have done this before leaving the home or any other assets in spouse's possession. SHE may have been advised to keep things amicable with you for a certain period in order for your separation to be interpreted as 'abandonment' or otherwise an argument that you have agreed to forego certain rights to certain property.

 

You don't 'know' until you've been educated by an attorney looking out for YOUR best interests. If you believe that you can't afford this counsel, I would assert that you can't afford NOT to pursue it.