His finances: I don't understand

[RuedeRivoli]

Hi all,

 

Back 2015, I worked with a guy who is three years younger than me (I'm 26, he's 23). He was an undergraduate student at the time and I had just finished college. We both had a crush on each other, but I made it clear I didn't want to date him because I don't date people I work with. He ended up leaving the company and so did I shortly after.

 

Fast forward in 2016, I moved abroad for work and he wound up moving to the same city for his graduate degree. We reconnected and started dating in October.

 

Now, I have been experiencing slight problems with him. He comes from a well-off background, but his parents aren't funding his master's degree, so he had to take out a loan. I know it's his business, but the issue is he always mentions how broke he is and how much debt he has. He's got a lot of job interviews lined up and a great CV, so I am sure he will find a job upon graduation, but I don't understand why he keeps venting about his finances every single time we see each other. Maybe he's not used to struggling or he just wants to vent. I don't know. It makes me feel uncomfortable when he tells me: 'You have a job, and I am broke'.

 

The issue is I often take ownership of the tab without asking him when we got on dates and he one time went off on me saying he feels 'emasculated him' whenever I pay for the both of us. I understand how it makes him feel, but I'm not paying because I feel sorry for him. I pay because it's my turn. Yet, he complains aout me paying and then about his finances.

 

I'm not entirely sure how to react. I keep telling him it's only temporary and he'll be fine once he gets a job, but it seems to really be a constant topic.

 

Just so we're clear, he's never ever asked me for money or even asked me to pay for anything. I'm the one of pays without giving him the chance to check the tab.

 

What should I do? What is he trying to say?

 

Thanks!

[Wiseman2]

This is simple. Stop grabbing the check. Let him whine about money but do not "fix" his problems by check-grabbing.

 

In fact stop talking about money altogether, since his finances are his and yours are yours. Change the subject. He can ask mom and dad for money if he really needs it.

 

Stop reassuring him, coddling him, etc. He's a grown man and can figure out his finances, debt, job search, etc. Hopefully you don't live together?

We reconnected and started dating in October. he keeps venting about his finances every single time we see each other. The issue is I often take ownership of the tab without asking him when we got on dates and he one time went off on me saying it 'emasculated him' that I paid for the both of us.

[RuedeRivoli]

This is simple. Stop grabbing the check. Let him whine about money but do not "fix" his problems by check-grabbing.

 

In fact stop talking about money altogether, since his finances are his and yours are yours. Change the subject. He can ask mom and dad for money if he really needs it.

 

Stop reassuring him, coddling him, etc. He's a grown man and can figure out his finances, debt, job search, etc. Hopefully you don't live together?

 

Oh boy, no. We don't live together.

 

Yes, I was wondering if I should set some boundaries regarding these finances talks, because mine are certainly none of his business.

 

Stop reassuring him? I understand your perspective, but when you're dating someone, shouldn't you be slightly concerned with their well-being?

That said, if I wind up telling him the same reassuring words over and over again, I'm bound to reach my limit.

[abitbroken]

Consider that he is just venting about finances and do not try to pick up the tab unless he specifically say she forgot his wallet could you pick this one up - or you agree ahead of time to get the movie and he gets dinner. And go on cheap dates.

 

Its likely that he was born with a silver spoon. Mommy and daddy paid for his whole life and now he finally has to figure things out for himself. He could have worked and saved for his master's or taken a job that wasn't his dream job where the company paid for his masters. Precious snowflake actually has bills now and its hurting him.

 

It would bother me that he has the attitude to complain rather than looking at his sitiuation as a means to an end.

[RuedeRivoli]

Consider that he is just venting about finances and do not try to pick up the tab unless he specifically say she forgot his wallet could you pick this one up - or you agree ahead of time to get the movie and he gets dinner. And go on cheap dates.

 

Its likely that he was born with a silver spoon. Mommy and daddy paid for his whole life and now he finally has to figure things out for himself. He could have worked and saved for his master's or taken a job that wasn't his dream job where the company paid for his masters. Precious snowflake actually has bills now and its hurting him.

 

It would bother me that he has the attitude to complain rather than looking at his sitiuation as a means to an end.

 

Yes, I agree. I think he doesn't know how to fend for himself. I know he worked this summer and the tuition is high, but in my opinion, he could find a part-time job. I won't tell him that though, because I am not his mother. As for not picking up the tab, I would, but it makes me feel uncomfortable to a degree. This may be a good idea though.

 

I understand he is venting, but if he does it every single time we go out or even talk via message, I won't be able to contain myself no more. I once dated someone who was jobless at the time and was close to finishing paying his student loans ... never did he vent about his finances once! He paid for the both of us each time and those dates we not cheap. If he hadn't told me about his job situation, I wouldn't have known anything about his finances because he never vented/complained.

[Wiseman2]

Excellent you don't live together. What a nightmare that would become, since after dating only a few months there are so many red flags already.

 

Yes, stop mommying him. He can worry about his finances all he wants. Change the subject rather than feed this whining and complaining.

Stop reassuring him? if I wind up telling him the same reassuring words over and over again, I'm bound to reach my limit.

[abitbroken]

Yes, I agree. I think he doesn't know how to fend for himself. I know he worked this summer and the tuition is high, but in my opinion, he could find a part-time job. I won't tell him that though, because I am not his mother.

 

I understand he is venting, but if he does it every single time we go out or even talk via message, I won't be able to contain myself no more. I once dated someone who was jobless at the time and was close to finishing paying his student loans ... never did he vent about his finances once! He paid for the both of us each time. If he hadn't told me about his job situation, I wouldn't have known anything about his finances because he never vented/complained.

 

I think that you should steer the conversation more and if he keeps complaining say "I am sorry you are upset about your student loan. Let's talk about something else..." If he keeps persistence, tell him to call you back later on when he would like to talk about something different.

[abitbroken]

Honestly, this really tells you about his outlook in life. People who have student loans don't have to pay them back until after they graduate - and treat them as a matter of fact, not something to complain about every single day. The relationship is very young. I think you will know very soon if this guy is going to be able to hack it. if all he talks about is complain, complain, complain and he is not being constructive about things - then I might say the relationship might have a short shelflife. 23 in school and 26 out in the work world can be very different.

[RuedeRivoli]

Excellent you don't live together. What a nightmare that would become, since after dating only a few months there are so many red flags already.

 

Yes, stop mommying him. He can worry about his finances all he wants. Change the subject rather than feed this whining and complaining.

 

Actually, on Friday, I opened told him: 'I'm not your mom' for something unrelated, but I think he really wants me to 'mommy' him to a degree. I feel as though I'm too mature for him at this stage. We're clearly at different stages of our lives. This 'relationship' feels rather one-sided to me. I'm the one cheering him up/pulling him up and I don't think he's really bringing anything to the table.

 

Even when we go on dates, it's always under his own terms.

 

I would never live with someone until I'm sure they're stable 1. financially 2. professionally 3. emotionally. Dating is fine because there's still distance, but moving in with someone is a major commitment. This ain't happening.

 

As for red flags, I whole-heartedly agree. I've been taking it extremely slow because the more I go, the more I see things I didn't expect. I'll be gone for a month for Christmas, that will give me some time to think without him in the background. There's something really off.

[Wiseman2]

Lol. Excellent!

Actually, on Friday, I opened told him: 'I'm not your mom'

]

[Ms Darcy]

If a guy went off on me for paying, I would stop dating him.

[Sportster2005]

This has nothing to do with debt, or his abilities, or the silver spoon so many resentful people are quick to point out. The issue is he's a complainer. If it wasn't about debt, he would be complaining about something else. He'll likely continue to be a complainer. He will change when he's ready to, not sooner. If he changes, it will because he decides to, no one else.

 

The lesson here is no problem can be solved by trying to change someone else's behavior. And by complaining about other's behavior you're merely making the noise louder. Accept his behavior, or move on. Those are your two, and only two choices.

[RuedeRivoli]

I worked with him and to be fair, he never complained about a single thing then. He was actually one of those people who would see the positive in everything.

[Fudgie]

I'm wondering if he is conflicted when it comes to paying: he wants to pay because "he's the man" and it's expected/feels good but on the other hand, his money situation isn't that great so maybe he really does want you to pick up the tab for him - but he doesn't want to admit that to himself.

 

I mean, I'm someone who likes to go Dutch so I don't know. Feels unfair for one person to pay for everything in a dating relationship.

[DancingFool]

I worked with him and to be fair, he never complained about a single thing then. He was actually one of those people who would see the positive in everything.

 

It's possible that what you saw at work was his work persona. What you see now is his more true dating/relationship persona and he is being a whiner no matter how you look at it. Could also be that getting into debt stressed him and he is acting out on that and that is not good. As in he doesn't handle even minor stress well.

 

Overall he sounds more like a cantankerous manchild than a man. That is never going to change. He'll be 50 and still the same, so if you see it as a red flag, stop wasting your time on him. You aren't going to please a manchild no matter what you do. He will always whine about something or worse, start pitching tantrums. This has nothing to do with his parents or upbringing, btw. It's just him.

[RuedeRivoli]

I'm wondering if he is conflicted when it comes to paying: he wants to pay because "he's the man" and it's expected/feels good but on the other hand, his money situation isn't that great so maybe he really does want you to pick up the tab for him - but he doesn't want to admit that to himself.

 

I mean, I'm someone who likes to go Dutch so I don't know. Feels unfair for one person to pay for everything in a dating relationship.

 

This is what crossed my mind too.

 

Part of me things he feels uncomfortable because he cannot afford to 'pay' or take me on nice dates, so he brings up the loans situation so that I am aware of the reason why those are 'cheap' dates which I sometimes pay for. He doesn't want to directly tell me: 'I can't afford to take you on dates', so he's giving me subtle hints through his complaining.

 

I know deep down inside he feels relieved when I pick up the tab. That's for sure, because it's less money spent (and maybe deep down inside, I'm subconsciously doing it because of this very reason).

 

I'm fairly adamant that if he had a job or a good financial situation, this question wouldn't even come into the equation.

[RuedeRivoli]

It's possible that what you saw at work was his work persona. What you see now is his more true dating/relationship persona and he is being a whiner no matter how you look at it. Could also be that getting into debt stressed him and he is acting out on that and that is not good. As in he doesn't handle even minor stress well.

 

Overall he sounds more like a cantankerous manchild than a man. That is never going to change. He'll be 50 and still the same, so if you see it as a red flag, stop wasting your time on him. You aren't going to please a manchild no matter what you do. He will always whine about something or worse, start pitching tantrums. This has nothing to do with his parents or upbringing, btw. It's just him.

 

This is something I agree on completely. He's one of those people who throw tantrums when they don't get their way.

 

For instance on Friday ... He knew I had a Christmas Party that I was obligated to attend (work function) and I told him I wouldn't be able to see him. Yet he managed to convince me to see him that day. Fine, I told him I'd meet him up at 9.30 pm (which meant I had to leave the party early). Next thing I know, he's texting me non-stop betweem 9 and 9.20 to ask me where I am and why I'm taking so long when I had warned him that I'd be leaving at 9.30 at the earliest. I didn't give him a specific time. At 9.35, I had left the party to go join him, he told me: 'Forget about it, we'll see each other when I get back here after Christmas'. At that stage, I was so annoyed that I told him we have to meet since I left that party early.

 

Then, he made it a point for me to join him at his school which was 20 minutes away instead of him coming and picking me up. He does this all the time. Every single time, he tells me 'I'm at XYZ, meet me there'. Never did he ask to pick me up. When I ask him, why don't you pick me up once instead of having me picking you up from school LIKE I'M YOUR MOM (that's where the mom part came up). He said: 'What the hell am I going to do there? I'd rather you meet me here. I've got no business going there'.

 

I told him he's got to compromise and be willing to at least meet me somewhere where I am for once. It didn't sink in. He still thought he was right.

 

Now, I'm annoyed that I left the work Christmas Party early because he spoiled it with his constant texting (granted, I wasn't enjoying myself anyway, but still ...).

[DancingFool]

This is what crossed my mind too.

 

Part of me things he feels uncomfortable because he cannot afford to 'pay' or take me on nice dates, so he brings up the loans situation so that I am aware of the reason why those are 'cheap' dates which I sometimes pay for. He doesn't want to directly tell me: 'I can't afford to take you on dates', so he's giving me subtle hints through his complaining.

 

I know deep down inside he feels relieved when I pick up the tab. That's for sure, because it's less money spent (and maybe deep down inside, I'm subconsciously doing it because of this very reason).

 

I'm fairly adamant that if he had a job or a good financial situation, this question wouldn't even come into the equation.

 

So that makes him a very insecure person who is very bad at communicating and worst of all, who is acting in a passive/aggressive manner. No, him getting a well paid job will not change these things about him. You'll just have new issues come up and more insecure passive aggressive behavior from him.....and good luck when he encounters real stress at work.....yikes...... I wouldn't want to be in your shoes and see how that goes down with him.

[DancingFool]

This is something I agree on completely. He's one of those people who throw tantrums when they don't get their way.

 

For instance on Friday ... He knew I had a Christmas Party that I was obligated to attend (work function) and I told him I wouldn't be able to see him. Yet he managed to convince me to see him that day. Fine, I told him I'd meet him up at 9.30 pm (which meant I had to leave the party early). Next thing I know, he's texting me non-stop betweem 9 and 9.20 to ask me where I am and why I'm taking so long when I had warned him that I'd be leaving at 9.30 at the earliest. I didn't give him a specific time. At 9.35, I had left the party to go join him, he told me: 'Forget about it, we'll see each other when I get back here after Christmas'. At that stage, I was so annoyed that I told him we have to meet since I left that party early.

 

Then, he made it a point for me to join him at his school which was 20 minutes away instead of him coming and picking me up. He does this all the time. Every single time, he tells me 'I'm at XYZ, meet me there'. Never did he ask to pick me up. When I ask him, why don't you pick me up once instead of having me picking you up from school LIKE I'M YOUR MOM (that's where the mom part came up). He said: 'What the hell am I going to do there? I'd rather you meet me here. I've got no business going there'.

 

I told him he's got to compromise and be willing to at least meet me somewhere where I am for once. It didn't sink in. He still thought he was right.

 

Now, I'm annoyed that I left the work Christmas Party early because he spoiled it with his constant texting (granted, I wasn't enjoying myself anyway, but still ...).

 

.....wow...the more you post the worse it gets. You do realize that not only did he throw a tantrum, but actively punished you for not meeting him when he wanted you to meet him.....

 

 

.....Yikes.....fun forest run.....like seriously please don't kid yourself that this kind of behavior will magically get fixed if only he gets a job, has no stress ever in his life, you can meet all his demands at all times so as not to piss him off.....do you see what I see? I'm actually scared for you because this guy is such a textbook bad news.

[RuedeRivoli]

Yes, I'm definitely questionning the entire 'relationship'. At first, I agreed to give him some sort of leeway, but now, it's becoming too much. He is controlling, immature and plain toxic.

 

It's not the first time he 'punishes' me over something. We got into a fight three weeks prior because I was telling him something personal and he told me 'you went way too deep here'. It hurt my feelings so I remained silent for the rest of the night, except for when I told him he hurt my feelings. He walked out on him halfway through the date. Then, he came back three weeks later with an non-apology saying: 'I couldn't handle it no more because you didn't seem to agree with anything I offered, so I stormed off. It's hard dating someone you can't please'. It wasn't even about pleasing, but yet again, he blamed me instead of fully comprehending why I was upset. It's always my fault, never his.

 

 

The more I go, the more I realize the entire dynamic is one sided. Everything has to be on his terms only. I don't feel as though I'm being treated or respected the way I should be at my age. I'm way beyond this and I know it. Deep down inside, my heart tells me I can do so much better than this. I deserve better than this. Yet, another part of me thinks he will 'improve' his behavior.

 

Then, I look at all the guys who have shown interest in the past weeks and I am wondering: 'Why am I wasting my time?'. He's adding more stress to my life because everything with him is so complicated. He refuses to meet me halfway and always has to impose his own views on me.

[Wiseman2]

Here is were firm great boundaries come in. Do not acquiesce or make these compromises.

 

"Friday I can't make it. I need to attend a work function and won't be able to interrupt colleagues to attend to my phone all night.". Then you turn off your phone.

 

Ask his folks to dispatch his nanny over there. That's what he needs.

 

Read up on Peter pan syndrome and read "Living with the Passive-Aggressive Man: Coping with Hidden Aggression" by Scott Wetzler, PhD.

T he managed to convince me.he's texting me non-stop betweem 9 and 9.20 to ask me where I am and why I'm taking so long, I'm annoyed that I left the work Christmas Party early because he spoiled it with his constant texting (granted, I wasn't enjoying myself anyway, but still ...).

[Searching88]

he's a guy. a lot of us feel like we need to be a provider. We need to prove that we're "worthy" and capable of supporting our partner, including paying for things. He might vent a lot to you because he doesn't like talking about it around anyone else and he trusts you.

 

I can admit I'm awful at expressing my frustrations and sometimes it comes out wrong and whiney. I'd say as long as you are not making comments about him not paying, which it doesn't seem like you do...then he should be okay. But at what point are you getting taken advantage of financially? There has to be SOME give and take.

[RuedeRivoli]

he's a guy. a lot of us feel like we need to be a provider. We need to prove that we're "worthy" and capable of supporting our partner, including paying for things. He might vent a lot to you because he doesn't like talking about it around anyone else and he trusts you.

 

I can admit I'm awful at expressing my frustrations and sometimes it comes out wrong and whiney. I'd say as long as you are not making comments about him not paying, which it doesn't seem like you do...then he should be okay. But at what point are you getting taken advantage of financially? There has to be SOME give and take.

 

In all honesty, I never made a single comment about him not paying. I don't paying to be honest. I actually prefer to pay, so it's fine by me. I don't think any less of him because I consciously choose to pay.

 

Then again, I don't pay every single time. He also picks up the tab (at this stage, it's 50/50 for now), but whenever I choose to, he doesn't like it. He's never asked me for money or wanted me to take him to fancy/expensive places. On that front, I definitely don't feel as though he's taking advantage of me. If we go to a fancy place, it's because I suggested it and therefore paid for it.

 

As for him trusting me, it could be the case. I mean, we hung out with his friend once and that was the only time he didn't vent!

[Ms Darcy]

he's a guy. a lot of us feel like we need to be a provider. We need to prove that we're "worthy" and capable of supporting our partner, including paying for things. He might vent a lot to you because he doesn't like talking about it around anyone else and he trusts you.

 

I can admit I'm awful at expressing my frustrations and sometimes it comes out wrong and whiney. I'd say as long as you are not making comments about him not paying, which it doesn't seem like you do...then he should be okay. But at what point are you getting taken advantage of financially? There has to be SOME give and take.

 

I think him going off on her was a dealbreaker.

[Searching88]

yeah. this situation is weird.

 

But in general, I personally would feel bad if my gf/wife paid every time. At the same time, I'd feel taken advantage of if the woman made continuous requests for going out and demanded I paid.

 

Why are these relationships so hard?!