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reinventmyself
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I can see how the apology was unattractive, went on a second date with a guy once who wouldn't stop apologising for various things (including his shoes! Which I didn't even notice until he said it and it looked fine!) so unattractive. The date got so bad I just wanted to get out of there, the upside was it makes for a funny story.

 

I also think the cuddle thing was cute and that he asked if you were in fact ok with it, I think it's considerate. How was he to know you weren't just being polite and just silently lying there in discomfort? Especially when you insisted on just sleeping in the same room, no sex, I think he may not know whether you would be comfortable with any physical touching at all or where you draw the line between ok and not ok?

 

Assertiveness is good but I think focusing too much on it and you rob yourself the opportunity to potentially meet someone great but are initially a bit shy or awkward. I think give it at least a few dates and see if it gets better. My current bf was awkward during the first few dates, he actually told me beforehand that he's shy when it comes to initial dating and not good with dating in general (but good with relationships). Lucky for him I knew him before we dated so I knew he was assertive and confident otherwise, and thought it was adorable that I made him nervous haha...

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Aww, I think it a bit cute that he got shy like that..but the cuddling was a step in the right direction...so there is progress, even though just a baby-step. Just keep rolling with it, I think it too soon to tell...and you seem to enjoy his company so what's the harm!

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I am looking forward to another date with M on Friday. We've been texting every day and he really does have a playful sense of humor that I like. We are currently working opposite schedules or we may have arranged to see each other mid week.

 

Question . I didn't really care for the way he kissed! Yikes. . Kissing is HUGE for me. Is this a deal breaker?

That and with the shyness I am again questioning whether we are a match.

Would you consider addressing this and seeing if this is changeable or would it be deal breaker?

 

I get the best way to handle these things is to not mention it as a criticism but propose it was a question. .

Maybe `how do you like to be kissed?' and `I like it this way"

 

Oh wow .. I am feeling silly for proposing this question but it leads my concern to go further.

If I don't like the way he kissed is this indicative of the other physical aspects??

 

Need to mention but with not too much detail . .It wasn't horrible, just a little too aggressive, especially for a first kiss.

(I already had a tonsillectomy, I don't need another, if you get my drift.) 2nd round actually caused me to pull away and stop.

Edited by reinventmyself
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I would bring it up with him, just gently. See if he changes or you two get used to each other. I've had to give a number of people I went on dates with (that I was serious about seeing where it goes) gentle hints of what I preferred or what wasn't working for me, such as saying "just a bit less tongue" while kissing, instead of bringing it up like a formal/serious thing some other time.

 

They all took it well, it was interesting though only one (current bf) actually improved, and it was because he was a bit nervous/not as relaxed the first few times, once I pointed it out, he got back to his usual kissing style and it was all good. Other guys though, one changed a little bit and it didn't bother me that much to begin with so we both adapted to each others style. The other one was actually bad (think octopus on your face), I tried it twice, gave him hints both times, he did it better for like 10 seconds then reverted back to his normal style, I literally just wanted it to end while we were kissing lol! Needless to say I had to drop him.

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Can you just tell him that you thought it was a bit too forward for you, for now?

 

It wasn't necessary the forwardness of it as much as the technique.

OK .. Ill be graphic . His tongue was very stiff and jabbed roughly down my throat. . Even in the throws of passion this would make me run from the room.

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Well even using tongue at all is pretty forward this early!!

 

You know it started off perfect and then went south.

Maybe it was because of the moment I jumped on his bed and surprised him . . he may have got alittle excited. . I went back for second kiss and got more of the same. Again. .even if it was excitement it wasn't enjoyable.

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Ya, I had this problem with one of my exes...same tongue thing. One night when we were kissing, I gently said that I wasn't used to that much tongue or that I usually don't kiss with so much tongue (or something like that) and then I said "I like to kiss like this" and then I showed him....unfortunately, the kissing was always bad between us, to the point were after a short time I just stopped kissing him, and the sex was also bad...our relationship didn't last long....I don't want to be a downer, sorry, lol, my ex had an ego and had issues with me being honest about this stuff, so if your guy is ok with listening to your needs then it probably won't be a problem....just be gentle when you tell him

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Ya, I had this problem with one of my exes...same tongue thing. One night when we were kissing, I gently said that I wasn't used to that much tongue or that I usually don't kiss with so much tongue (or something like that) and then I said "I like to kiss like this" and then I showed him....unfortunately, the kissing was always bad between us, to the point were after a short time I just stopped kissing him, and the sex was also bad...our relationship didn't last long....I don't want to be a downer, sorry, lol, my ex had an ego and had issues with me being honest about this stuff, so if your guy is ok with listening to your needs then it probably won't be a problem....just be gentle when you tell him

 

 

This is my concern and I am forecasting a little here and taking into consideration the lack of assertiveness may not translate well into our physical relationship.

IF it does indeed go "there".

 

I am also guilty of looking for signs to bolt. .So I need to settle down here a little and relax.

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Yea I don't think you can fix a bad kisser, I actually asked a few of my friends who have not-so-good-kisser partners when I was seeing the octopus guy (lol because he was such a nice guy I really wanted to like him, and they said they tried to "teach" them but it doesn't work. After that I had one more date (third date) with octopus guy to give it one more shot, it didn't work so I gave up.

 

I do think though if it's just difference in kissing style or first (few) date nerves, it can be adapted/worked on. I think it's worth giving it a few more dates and actually telling him this, if it doesn't work, no harm done. I actually find it a good opportunity to "test" how receptive the guy is to constructive criticism / feedback. I would want to find out this early as I wouldn't want to date someone with a big ego or get defensive/offended with constructive criticism and simple honesty like that, it is often a symptom of low-ish self esteem, lack of confidence and insecurity (as seen in a number of guys I dated in the past).

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"" I actually find it a good opportunity to "test" how receptive the guy is to constructive criticism / feedback. I would want to find out this early as I wouldn't want to date someone with a big ego or get defensive/offended with constructive criticism and simple honesty like that, it is often a symptom of low-ish self esteem, lack of confidence and insecurity ""

 

This will be the beta test, if you will. Definitely not a big ego but more of a self esteem thing I think that's going on for him. I will say he's very eager to please so I am hopeful. . but part the other school of though thinks this part should be a natural fit.

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I had another nice date with shy M last night, however I think this is running it's course. During dinner I am literally trying to drag things out of him and there were awkward silences. He had been assuring me all along that this was temporary and as he got to know me he would settle down and open up. I am convinced now that this isn't going to happen.

 

I struggle with the idea of disappointing him. We've all been on the other side of someone telling you `I am not feelin' it' and as much as it's inevitable I am not ready to do it today but I will very soon.

 

I am kind of processing the night and the things we did talk about. He does have that side of him where he asks for permission and apologizes unnecessarily at times. I felt frustrated more than once, not so much by his behavior but by the realization that this wasn't going to work. At one point he was telling me how much he liked me and told his mother and friends about me. I responded in kind and told him that I really was looking forward to having an emotional connection with him but at some point he was going to need to let his guard down in order for it to happen. I was pretty matter of fact about it and it probably came off as giving him notice. I suppose that was my intention.

 

The turning point is when he said he wanted to share something about himself. . he prefaced it by saying it was hard for him to say and a little embarrassed. He was raised Mormon as a child and no longer practices. .But due to his upbringing he didn't believe in masturbation and never has? (he's been divorced for 2 years and I can assume celibate)

 

I am not sure why he mentioned it . .after all he is sitting there with a beer in front of him. His previous upbringing doesn't prevent him from drinking but it stops him from pleasuring himself? So my mind immediately goes one step further thinking if he denies himself this basic pleasure, does he have sex outside of marriage? Was this his way of indirectly trying to tell me this? I do also recall early on he stated he wanted to get married again. (I lean towards not)

 

I suppose I could ask but at this point it doesn't matter. .

 

I am disappointed. .there are so many things I like about him . .but without a viable connection this doesn't have a chance.

 

My profile has been down for the last couple weeks and I want to put it back up. . But I know he'll notice.

Not sure that's how I want to handle this. . so for today. . I'll mull this around.

 

We do have a bike riding date tomorrow that I plan to keep. . I'll take this time to think about what I want to say to him.

Edited by reinventmyself
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Geez that is a weird situation. I think it's good to take some time to mull if you are on the fence. But I totally understand not wanting to continue if by this point you are still having to drag info out of him...He sounds like a lot of work actually...I get shyness, I used to be the shyest person alive, but when I was so shy like that i also wasn't really relationship material...the shyness and essentially fear of letting my guard down enough to be open about myself made me emotionally unavailable....

 

I also find it odd that he is shy in some ways, and that you have to pry stuff out, yet then opens up about his masturbation thing..which is a bit of an odd thing to disclose, just an odd admission this early on and a bit like TMI..?

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He was just texting me and I came right out and asked him about his convictions about sex. His answer "I've been with both me wives and 2 others, my you're mighty brave over the phone. Does that answer your question?"

It is odd that he shared what he did last night not to mention he practices one thing but not others.

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seems like he is action-packed with issues. I think he needs to work on himself a bit more to overcome his hang-ups etc. Like he isn't "ready" yet...It reminds me a bit of that move "As Good as it Gets" where the Carole says to Melvin "...Your not ready, and you are a pretty old guy to not be ready, and I'm to old to ignore that"...lol.

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During our last date M had asked me to go for a bike ride yesterday (sunday) I kept my date and had a nice time. We had breakfast before and ended with watching football at a local sports bar.

 

We had a chance to talk a bit about what he shared with me and why. He was definitely a little more open and engaging.

 

I think sitting accross a table for him is where he fumbles. Get him doing something active he's a little more relaxed.

 

One of our first dates we passed by a local casino and he showed me how to play Texas Hold Em'. I found him really attractive this particular day probably because

he was in his element and comfortable.

 

Suffice to say I guess I haven't given up on him. He has this playful, sarcastic side of him that I like. It's actually one of my favorite qualities in a man. Someone you can spar with and make each other laugh.

 

We'll see.

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so maybe the new game plan is to have your dates in his "comfy" places until he is over his shyness--activity dates are more interesting anyway, I think. It is really daunting to sit face-to-face for a few hours with someone that you don't know that well, are attracted to and want them to like you too....

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