Having trouble "Friendzoning" guys.

[sammiegolucky]

I tend to become friends with men faster than with other women, i just have a bit of a more man-ish personality and slightly boyish interests, so I tend to have more in common with men. Thing is, I am not a tomboy - I dress very feminine and wear make-up & perfume so I think my personality is at odds with how I look. This ends up causing a lot of who I consider good friends to, at one point or another, have feelings towards me.

 

I have never, ever managed to handle this well, and it has only every ended in tears. None of the men have ever directly asked me out, they have only ever been subtle with their hints, and tried to get me out alone and just generally been VERY nice with a few compliments thrown in... so there has never been anything for me to "reject" specifically, so I've tried handling it in different ways -by acting oblivious and naive, i've tried being presumptious and telling them firmly "no", I've tried dropping occasional hints and how good a FRIEND he is, i've also tried making sure he hears that I'm interested in other men, or been very open in talking about who i'm seeing. None of it works, but does it EVER work?

 

I wish I could make friends with other women easier, but i just have so little in common with other women and I feel like a bit of an outcast in the company of women. They also think I *try* to attract these men and I have been accused of reeling them in and then throwing them away. I don't want to change the way I dress or act just for their approval. But then again, is the way I'm dressing and acting REALLY BAD? Why should I have to stop? I'm not that amazing looking and I am self consious, so I don't wear revealing clothing at all, unless out at a party or nightclub.... usually I am scruffy and homely, but i seem to be emanating this "girlfriend material" impression to all guys I meet and when I reject them I can tell it really hurts them.

 

I feel like I have no real friends because I am aware that the male friends I do have may not be there forever because if I don't mess it up by hurting their feelings, they will get a girlfriend who will disapprove of me and then that will be that.

 

I struggle to build true friendships with women because I get the feeling they dislike me/ accuse me of being a flirt/ or just dont have that much in common with them, or I find their ideas of friendship too intense where I need to tell them everything. I like how with men it's so much more chilled out and nothing is mandatory information but yet you know you have the freedom to spill your guts if you need to. Is this openness what is cause these men to fall for me? Why is being my friend such a crap thing that they end up falling out with me?

 

I also do not think I flirt, I have a very blunt personality, I don't compliment these guys on their looks - ever, and I don't *try* to attract them. I know I can be very intense when having a conversation and I make a lot of eye contact and I make sure to listen intently - maybe this is being misconstrued as interest.

 

I don't understand though, because these guys have many other female friends. I refuse to believe that it's because I'm so apparently amazingly irresistible (because I am most certainly NOT that - I barely manage to brush up as nice looking even at my very best).

 

Guys, how do you deal with being friendzoned and how best should a woman go about it? Or is it just doomed to fail regardless of how its done?

 

Has anyone else found themselves in the position where the only friends they make are those who might have feelings for them, and then when that inevitable day comes where you have to reject them, you then have to say goodbye to that person?

[DancingFool]

I've always had more guy friends than girl friends. Just like you, I make friends with guys easily, but find it much harder to make friends with girls. However, I do have a very good group of close girl friends and I have admit that it's important to have. One tip for you for that is realize that you are not the only girl like that. There are plenty of us out there and we actually make very good friends to each other. Rather then trying to fit in with girls where you just don't get each other, maybe try to connect with more kindred spirits.

 

As for the guys, honestly, it's all about awareness and proper boundaries. Awareness in a sense that there are a whole lot of guys out there who will pretend to be your friend when they really want more from the get go and you need to learn to spot them quickly. The faster you can weed them out, the better you'll be off. They are not your friend anyway. They are just a wolf in sheep's clothing. So all your hints and clues and whatever is really an exercise in futility. They hear you, the don't want to get because that was never their agenda. They figure they will break you down and bend you their way eventually. When it doesn't happen, of course there is anger, bitterness, tears of frustration, etc. Best way to deal with that is never let it go that long and that far. Cut them off sooner, as soon as you become aware that their interest is more than just friendship.

 

Boundaries in that don't try to make your guy friends into your girl friends if that makes any sense. The good guy friends that I've had for years, the friendship revolves around a mutual hobby or activity, not around emotional bonding. We don't talk or text every single day, we don't hang out one on one all the time, I don't lean on them to fix things for me like they are my bf, etc. If they have girl problems, we'll talk, if I have guy problems and need a manspeak to womanspeak translation, I'll get a straight answer from them, but that's kind of where things stop. We are not going to run to each other and give hugs and that's what keeps a friendship from warping into more on either side. Besides that, the gf's are then happy with me and don't feel threatened.

[GinNJuice]

If you are even mildly attractive, then any single guy is going to want to sleep with you, not be your friend. How much spine he has about it and the number of other dating options available will dictate his approach, . Some guys can be your friend legitimately, but typically only if they have other girls date. The rest will just pine over you at the secret shrine in their closet, while hating every guy you date.

 

I was friendzoned a couple times in highschool, but have since grown a pair. I'm never friendzoned now, because if I like a girl, I ask her out and if she says no she's pretty much dead to me, unless she has something to offer in another area, immediately.

 

Anyway, I don't think you're hurt to lose a friend, but the attention that you get from them.

[pl3asehelp]

You don't become friends with men easier than you do with women. These men aren't friends, they are just nice to you to sleep with you and when they realize it's not gonna happen, they bolt or if they're weak, try to wait you out and wait for a vulnerable moment. You're confusing friendship with attraction and romantic interest.

[Snny]

I feel like I have no real friends because I am aware that the male friends I do have may not be there forever because if I don't mess it up by hurting their feelings, they will get a girlfriend who will disapprove of me and then that will be that.

If these men are going to end up hurt, then they were never really your friend. They are playing the friendzone to get with you and hope they can bone you. Simple as that.

 

It doesn't matter how if a man is in a relationship- they can still be tempted to cheat. If they are in stable, highly committed relationships where they are spending more time with their wives, then you can be good friends with them. You have to watch for signs whether they are truatworthy. But NO single young man wants to be friends with a woman. They want nothing to do with a friendship and that is how it is.

 

I get where you are coming from. I LOVE working on my car and have not been able to find another woman who holds that same passion. Even when I was at car shows, most guys either wanted to lolligag over me than my muscle car I worked on it while some had the arrogant nerve to say something along the lines of "Nice car! Did your daddy give you that?" And refusing to believe that a woman can ever desire to own, paid herself, and did all the mechanical work (their way of projecting insecurity of a woman owning a better car than the one they drove to the show).

 

Anyway, no matter how similar you are or have the same interest as a man, you will always be different. If you cannot find a female friend, then you are not looking in the right places. There are some catty girls out there, but as you have proven to yourself, not all of them are.

[mhowe]

What is your age? That can be a big factor in this whole scenario.

 

And I agree w/ pl3asehelp --- you are flirting, they are attracted to it --- and when you decide no and try to fz them, they get ticked off. Or hang around like flies.

[Fudgie]

You say you're feminine...you dress feminine, wear make-up/perfume....I find it hard to believe that you don't have anything in common with other women because honestly, it sounds like you DO have some feminine interests because of how you take care of yourself and how you dress. My reluctance to dress feminine/fashionably, wear make-up and perfume has actually put me at odds with other women, some of whom think I'm "weird", lazy, or see me as some "fix up" project because they think I'm unattractive.

 

I think in terms of male friends, you should seek out male friends who are already coupled up. Make an effort to get to know both them and their significant other. This will allow you to have a male friend who will be much, much less likely to like you and you may also make a new female friend, and it would give you more experience on finding female friends that you relate to. If you include both of them and are friendly to both, then jealousy shouldn't be an issue. Girls tend to get mad when you're spending one on one time with their bf but don't make any effort to include them.

 

I do think you need to examine your behaviour and see if you're being flirty. If you are being flirty with men that you're not interested in, you need to stop. Don't ever flirt with someone unless you actually WANT to be with them. Learn how to be charming and funny and personable without being flirty. It's a good trait to have.

[Realitynut]

I dunno. I'm torn about this. I have a male friend that i met thru meetup. He and another girl that i REALLY liked went on an overnite trip together and we had a great time! The girl sat in the front seat...him in the back. I was sorta seeing a guy at the time. We were both on POF and he asked me out hiking 'as a friend', i agreed. He asked me out on a 'date', i said NO. I had a few very disappointing first meets on pof, so i canceled myself off, and ALL dating sites. I had my friend Tom over for supper soon after. I made it clear that i did not want to date him, but just be a friend. He seemed ok with that. BTW, the girl that i liked was married and had other gf's so was not available like Tom. He was more of a loner, and said he didn't have men friends who liked to do the same things i did.

 

So we went camping and kayaking. It was a GREAT month in Oct. Now i am working on his house. It had been hurt by big winds, plus he's a man and alone...need i say more...ugh.

 

Well.....on New Years Eve he tried to kiss me. I wouldn't. And said i'd have to be really drunk first.

 

Hurt his feelings. I am not attracted to him at all. But we txt daily, i stay overnight at his house, sleep on the couch. We camped in a small tent, and we are planning a trip to Florida to kayak this spring.

 

But him wanting more puts pressure on me that i don't want. I told him a few months ago, wouldn't you rather be friends for 20 years, than date and get all that emotional baggage, and break up in 6 months??? He said no, he wants sex before he dies.

 

Btw we are in our mid to late 50's.

 

I can EASILY be friends with a guy with no sex. Heck, i didn't have sex with my husband for 15 years!!! lol

 

But men are wired differently. Since i turned him down with the kiss...he has been crankier lately.

 

I want the laughter and fun we had back. I don't want to be leading him on....and repeatedly have said that we are just friends. I also told him that i am not looking for a boyfriend at this point. He takes up all my time.

 

He's sort of Friend with Benefits without the Benefits. Why can't men just be friends. All the girls i know are married. ugh.

[DancingFool]

This is not friendship. You are treating this guy as a substitute relationship except without the sexual benefits, which is rather selfish and cruel. A perfect illustration of lacking friendship boundaries and blurring lines of friends/relationship/bf substitute/emotional bonding that goes beyond just friends, etc.

[Glowguy]

I think being direct is the best way to go. I can have trouble interpreting subtle clues and a lot of guys are persistent because they are used to chasing women (which is often encouraged). Getting friendzoned stings the ego a bit but I would much rather know then waste any energy trying to pursue something that isn't going to happen. I appreciate blunt honesty when it comes to things like this. Any guy that is truly your friend is not going to just ditch you because you aren't attracted to him.

[GinNJuice]

Agree with DancingFool. RealityNut, I can see why you are torn about this. You, like the OP, are quite selfish and don't want to admit it.

[Mari]

It is possible to have a really good guy friend. I happen to be a guy that can be really good friends with a girl, almost like a brother. The thing is, I can only do this with a girl I have zero attraction to or is not my personality type. Anything other than that I stay away. The girls that I am friends with have a high chance of developing feelings for me, but I make it clear that I don't see them that way. I never see them that way, they can wear whatever they want, do whatever they want and it's obvious that I'm never checking them out. They are like a guy to me so then it works. So yeah, not all guys are trying to build a relationship. For some of the girls, I know their husbands too, and they've seen me sit there talking to their wives. They also know, I feel zero attraction to their wife and am happy that some other guy finds them attractive.

[mau5]

I saw your ava & I remember you mentioning your situation in my thread (I developed feelings for a friend. Kept my mouth shut for a long time... sort of, hoping it would pass. She left for a long time & ended up rejecting me before she left)

 

There was someone else who replied to your situation mentioning that he was sure he hopes one day you'll see the light. It just stuck with me somehow. Now reading he has tried to kiss you again. I'm kinda suprised this is still going on. How many times have you told him already? I completely agree with DancingFool. This is indeed no friendship & you are also partly to blame. Just as in my situation. I'm sure she had a clue but went along with it & blurred the lines. We still talk though but i really don't expect anything anymore. And this friendship probably won't survive another 5 years. But that's life i guess...

[sammiegolucky]

Wow, thanks for such an amazing response.

 

DancingFool - I don't think I am the only woman like this + I would LOVE to meet women more like me but I suppose I'm not sure where. I work in a male dominated field & went to several colleges to become educated- and usually the men outnumbered the women to the point where I was at times, the only female. So, the lack of opportunity is probably a big part of my problem.... I will try and see about addressing this, not sure how yet. Thanks!

 

 

GinNJuice - "I ask her out and if she says no she's pretty much dead to me"

 

 

pl3asehelp - I know what you mean, but my situation isn't this simple because the men I am talking about are men in work & university, where "everyone" is friends. I am only ever responding to them when they speak to me & when they do it's not exactly the kind of things where I can get away with telling him to **** off. It's just mutual interests in innocent things such as music +TV and being able to rely on one another for help in work, or to dog-sit etc (and this isn't exclusively between me and that man, this kind of exchange happens in a 4-5 way group).... and then BOOM - The drama happens.

 

Snny - "NO single young man wants to be friends with a woman. They want nothing to do with a friendship and that is how it is."

 

mhowe - I am 25 & the people in my peer group can be of varying ages, from very young (18) to much older (45) ... the drama has happened with various ages. ------ & I don't think Pl3asehelp ever said I was flirting - & I stand by what I said - I have not been flirting. in fact I have made sure to avoid anything that might be construed as flirting. Flirting is quite a deliberate thing, + my intentions have never been romantic towards these men + I have never even had the shadow of a romantic thought towards them.

 

 

Fudgie - There is a difference between wearing a little make-up und wearing conventionally feminine clothes, and having a real *interest" in beauty and fashion etc... I only participate in these things as a quick ritual in the morning. I guess: what I meant is I just dress what is conventional for a woman my age, such as, I don't dress boyish! I dress fairly plain : just that I wear skirts etc,I hope that cleared it up! & yes, I do always make an effort to include their girlfriends if they have them! The girlfriends have only ever been a little bit odd with me I suspect because I already study with her BF so she probably doesn't like that I will sometimes be with him without her: I guess. Thanks for the response but I also have to reiterate, I don't even have a flirty personality, I have a dry personality and I loathe romance and anything romantic. like I said before, my humor has been said to be a little manly.

 

 

Realitynut - Sorry to hear that it sounded like you have a nice thing going on. it's sounds a little different to my situation but it is really sad when they become horrible to you isn't it? I empathize with you a lot. We are very different ages however. Again thanks for the response and for sharing that story with me.

 

 

Glowguy - Yes, I agree. I have been honest and straight up with them before, but that ended badly & they were offended because they didn't DIRECTLY express romantic interests in me, even though it was blindingly obvious. I think he used that as an excuse so he didnt have to admit it when he was rejected. he would much rather make me look to be a vain, self-important b**** than accept what happened. you are right, they are no true friend, but my problem is that these people are about 90% of my "friends".

 

 

I am really struggling to meet women I can truley become good chums with.

 

 

I try to be warm towards everyone I meet, male or female. All I want is a bit of security in a friendship: I am extremely lonely because of this problem and seriously lack that "good" friendship.

 

I can't bring myself to be cold to a person for no other reason than if they happen to be male, that just doesn't sound like healthy behavior to me.

 

again, thanks everyone for taking time to respond to me, you have made me able to think about it more objectively and it is helping a lot. I think my mission is try and find a way good female friends with my interests....

[sammiegolucky]

Oh, more repsonsed popped up while I was writing that. GinNJuice - I'm failing to see how I am being selfish...... I am only every trying to be friendly and warm to the people I meet, and being justifiably sad when they randomly stop talking to me based on my sex/ their own hangups. I turned to this thread to seek advice on how to best handle this. I don't think there is anything selfish about that.

[greywolf]

You don't become friends with men easier than you do with women. These men aren't friends, they are just nice to you to sleep with you and when they realize it's not gonna happen, they bolt or if they're weak, try to wait you out and wait for a vulnerable moment. You're confusing friendship with attraction and romantic interest.

 

I pretty much agree with this. I used to think I had an easier time making friends with men as well, but the truth is that it's easy to make friends with men when they're the ones that always initiate the friendship and make it easy to be friends with them, until they learn that they won't get into your pants.

 

I still struggle to make friendships with females. I think that's partly because I'm not used to putting effort into starting a friendship with someone (never had to do that with men), and I struggle with knowing if I'm holding back too much and making myself seem closed off and unfriendly, or if I'm being too desperate and open lol. But at least with females, I know where I stand, there's no alternate agenda with them. I also never tell females that I'm bi. I used to tell them, but that has its own set of problems (women can be just as bad as men, if not worse, when they know you're bi!)

[pl3asehelp]

OP - take this post to heart. This is your issue, nothing more. I know you have excuses and think it's something else, but it's not - this is it right here. This gold nugget of advice should be given to all females when th get 'the talk' abou growing up and becoming a woman, else it takes a long time to figure it out on your own and you and others are hurt in the process.

[Glowguy]

Glowguy - Yes, I agree. I have been honest and straight up with them before, but that ended badly & they were offended because they didn't DIRECTLY express romantic interests in me, even though it was blindingly obvious. I think he used that as an excuse so he didnt have to admit it when he was rejected. he would much rather make me look to be a vain, self-important b**** than accept what happened. you are right, they are no true friend, but my problem is that these people are about 90% of my "friends".

 

Honestly that is all you can do. As long as you aren't purposefully leading them on and you are being direct and honest with them then that's all anyone can really expect. If they are not handling it well then that is 100% on them. They may not like what they hear but they should at least respect your decision. If they chose to handle things in the above manner then just chalk it up to immaturity and be glad you have weeded them out as a genuine friend. I have trouble making friends too regardless of gender - it's not easy for most people.

[Realitynut]

HA! This was the first time he tried to kiss me...and was cuz it was New Years Eve! No we are friends and he knows it! We met up through a meetup group and we have been friends for 6 months! Traveling together and hanging together for almost 4 months. He knew from day ONE he was just a 'friend', but yes everything is fine, unless he tries to get 'more friendly'. I don't see why men and women CAN'T be friends without sex? I just turned 59 and he is going to be 56 next week! Damn......we're not horny kids!

 

Plus i was inlove with my last partner, and i know what that feels like! Attraction causing you to want to KISS someone, and attraction because they are fun, like doing the same things you do, get on well, is something entirely different.

 

I mentioned that we could just go our separate ways if he wanted to look for a girlfriend....but he said that is such a hassle looking for someone that you get along with.....so YES we are still talking every day. I gave him 2 nights alone so i wouldn't smother him! lol I AM working on his kitchen cabinets......painting and staining etc.

 

I helped him get his house fixed up because that is what i enjoy doing! I told him this summer we are starting on his YARD. He has been married 3 times and been single 3 years as have i. I would NEVER have gone out with him on a dating site! I met him as a friend...and that is where it is staying.

I am not selfish in the fact that i am leading him on. We both want companionship. We both want to hike and kayak.....and not alone. So why not together? I can not help that i am *irresistible* (said with tongue in cheek of course!)

[mau5]

Of course you can only tell him what you want or expect. But he doesn't really seem to respect your decision. Maybe now he got the message but what will you do when he tries to get 'more friendly' again?

Forget about it because you want companionship or will you say: "stop, enough"? I understand you but there is definitely some truth to what DancingFool has said.

 

"He's sort of Friend with Benefits without the Benefits" Why do you describe the friendship like this? It's like you somehow realise the lines have been kinda blurry.