Online Dating for the 2nd Time - A Journal

[notalady]

Agreed, Yeoja does sound promising!

 

How can Eroica tell if you're "fed up" if you're only texting? Lol... I feel like she's gonna be one of those to really want to push marriage and children relatively quickly if you do date.

[NorthDallas40]

How can Eroica tell if you're "fed up" if you're only texting? Lol... I feel like she's gonna be one of those to really want to push marriage and children relatively quickly if you do date.

 

Exactly.

 

So for our sunny, warm, steep, uphill, no-shade hike, YEOJA showed up in a formless, baggy (except for tights) all-black ensemble, including a big jacket that was completely unnecessary given the weather. Not that I was expecting a form-fitting sexy sports outfit, but it was almost like she was deliberately making herself unappealing and somewhat dowdy, even though she could probably look pretty amazing if she gave it half a chance.

 

And even the conversation was a bit uninspiring this time, with my comments and questions rarely yielding responses that were particularly interesting, even though to her credit, our talk never flagged. She was as pleasant and polite as before, but it really felt like I was hanging out with a platonic co-worker with no chemistry beyond surface friendship.

 

Naturally, this could just be an indication of her reserved personality, but really, did she really have to choose menstrual cramps and after-bedtime gas as topics of discussion? Come on, save it for the 2nd year of dating, if you need to bring it up at all.

 

Knowing she was probably anti-drug, I also let her know I smoke pot when the subject came up, but I couldn’t really read her reaction on that.

 

So all in all, this was a pleasant but fairly ho-hum second outing. I’m still willing to go out with her again to see if she warms up at all, and I think she’d be up for a third meetup.

 

But to be completely honest, I don’t see anything longterm here unless she really expresses an enthusiastic interest in me soon, and only then, only if the sex is ing amazing. But given her "You should message me if” section stating "You're just not looking for sex partner,” I wouldn’t bet on that either. And on that note, again I didn't feel inspired to kiss her when we parted. Oh well, guess I’ll just have to wait and see.

[notalady]

I've had plenty of first dates that were amazing then completely different on the second and third (if there is one) date.

 

Although I don't think what she said about not looking for a sex partner means she doesn't enjoy sex or isn't into it, it just means she doesn't want casual or sex only, perfectly fine sentiment, just a pointless statement in a profile, as people looking for casual don't really care if you've written it as something you don't want.

 

As for her outfit, I think it sounds perfectly fine for a hike, baggy top and tights can look quite trendy. But I've met guys who dressed...fine, but just not to my preference (usually way under-dressed), so I get that.

[Batya33]

I've had plenty of first dates that were amazing then completely different on the second and third (if there is one) date.

 

Although I don't think what she said about not looking for a sex partner means she doesn't enjoy sex or isn't into it, it just means she doesn't want casual or sex only, perfectly fine sentiment, just a pointless statement in a profile, as people looking for casual don't really care if you've written it as something you don't want.

 

As for her outfit, I think it sounds perfectly fine for a hike, baggy top and tights can look quite trendy. But I've met guys who dressed...fine, but just not to my preference (usually way under-dressed), so I get that.

 

I agree. Also I am a person who gets cold very quickly so if I'm hiking in an area that might be cooler I likely will bring a jacket or sweater especially if there might be a plan to go out in the evening. Hiking is one of those things where the person really should choose comfort over style IMO.

[NorthDallas40]

Forget the outfit. Let's focus on the whole "talking at length about menstrual cramps and having gas after bedtime on a second date" thing. HOT OR NOT?

[Batya33]

Forget the outfit. Let's focus on the whole "talking at length about menstrual cramps and having gas after bedtime on a second date" thing. HOT OR NOT?

 

I went out with a gas focused guy like that -maybe I saw him one more time (whole convo before we went to the restaurant he agreed to over what he could and could not eat due to his digestive issues). I agree with you.

[notalady]

Forget the outfit. Let's focus on the whole "talking at length about menstrual cramps and having gas after bedtime on a second date" thing. HOT OR NOT?

 

Totally HOT!

 

Jokes lol...

 

Yea that's way too much for the first few dates, or even months of dating. One year + maybe, that's when my boyfriend and I started really sharing that kind of stuff haha... though we did make quite a few fart and poop jokes before that, immature I know lol...

[abitbroken]

Forget the outfit. Let's focus on the whole "talking at length about menstrual cramps and having gas after bedtime on a second date" thing. HOT OR NOT?

 

It might be her attempt to preempt why she was dressed in baggy clothes and tights and that she wasn't as energetic. but due to this being her second language, maybe it makes her a little more frank. I have noticed that there are subtleties sometimes missed in translation. Maybe next time she brings up gas, make a lighthearted joke or say "i usually don't talk about our gas on a third date.." with a smile and change the subject. If that's really the only bad thing - i would take that over being a psycho or being married.

 

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Dakota seems to be keeping your friendship on the downlow... intersting... but you never know what to expect with her.

 

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I can understand asking if you are just looking for casual sex, etc. You did but "sex positive" on your profile right? maybe she is letting you know that she's not down with immediate sex. No hangups doesn't always have to equal a lack of caution at first.

[NorthDallas40]

Still texting with EROICA as of yesterday, and we have very tentative plans to meet next weekend.

 

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With quite a bit of hesitation, I texted YEOJA about going out this Friday night. She replied that next Friday would be better and I replied that would be fine, but this coming weekend or sometime next week could work, too. FWIW, she hasn't been on OKC since the 23rd, a few days after we started conversing.

 

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DAKOTA texted yesterday to say she had fun this weekend and we should get together again.

[NorthDallas40]

Ran through our set twice with the band last night and though they’re learning the songs structurally enough to get through all 10 tunes, they sounded pretty lousy. They’re off rhythmically, not really getting the “feel” right, and the bassplayer was texting constantly throughout practice dealing with one of his other bands. Yeah, being in a band is just like dating in many ways.

 

So this morning I sent messages to the four other musicians I’ve been pursuing about being the secondary “shadow” band to see about jamming two weeks from now, but no replies yet.

 

In better news, about two months ago a local label owner had asked me about playing keyboards to back up one of his artists. I liked the music and the singer is great, so I was eager to audition But he never really followed up until a couple of days ago, when he asked if I could do two shows with her next month! So it looks like I’m “in” without even having played with them yet. Which is flattering, but also daunting.

 

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I texted EROICA today with lunch ideas for this Saturday but no reply so far.

 

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As of now, I have YEOJA penciled in for dinner in 8 days but I’m not sure it will actually happen, or if I want it to happen. She may genuinely be busy until then (she didn’t offer any days between now and then), but given our lukewarm 2nd meet up, I feel like she may just be stalling in hopes I’ll give up. Which I might.

 

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Got matched on CMB with massage therapist SUZUKI (39, 5’6”) yesterday, I messaged her, she replied, and we’re now planning a tea meetup or dinner for this coming Sunday. I tried to make small talk on the app, even mentioning a mutual FB friend who’s a former go-go dancer turned musician/performance artist, but she kinda just stuck to the mechanics of meeting up. She appears very attractive, but I have a feeling we won’t have anything in common and that she’ll be “out of my league” - whether in an absolute sense, or just her own opinion

[NorthDallas40]

The "shadow" 2nd band guys all said they're available for Wed in two weeks, so hopefully that will pan out. In addition, the drummer asked if I wanted to jam with him in a separate project he's getting together for a local breakdancing class, whose teacher is one of the pioneers of the style in the 70s. Should be fun.

 

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EROICA got back to me, so we're 95% of the way to finalizing lunch tomorrow.

 

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I just sent SUZUKI some ideas for tea/coffee (her preference) or dinner (my preference) for Sunday afternoon or evening.

 

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I surprisingly got an unsolicited match from an attractive Asian woman on CMB... but she's 55. Also got a couple of "likes" from two attractive Asian women on OKC but one looks overweight, and the other looks like she used to be skinny but has also put on some pounds since her older pics. None seem to have anything in common with me, but it's unusual that three semi-attractive Asian women have "made the first move" towards me online. Times must be getting tough :splat:

[NorthDallas40]

I saw EROICA sitting outside the restaurant this afternoon and just like I feared, though she's 38, she looks like she's in her early 50s. She's not unattractive (her face is pleasant but plain, and her build is average, not fat nor slim), but her hair and clothes looked like they came straight of a late-1980s mother's get-together. On sight, no way would anyone think we were well-matched.

 

Which makes it all the more frustrating that the conversation over our 3-hour lunch & walk was really good! She's smart, politically aware, a good listener, insightful, artistically talented (she's written and drawn her own male gay-themed manga for years - and her art is great!), and despite apologizing for her poor English (it wasn't), she's a really great conversationalist. She even seemed to really enjoy talking to me too.

 

Based on our talk alone, I'd definitely ask her out a second time.

 

But the fact remains that she looks like she could be the boring mother of a college graduate, not someone who's never had a child. I don't think I could ever be very attracted to her physically, especially when the location where we met was filled with extremely attractive Asian women around her age. My eye was wandering constantly, and I doubt that would change.

 

If her personality was in YEOJA's body, I'd probably be proposing.

 

But the fact is that even though YEOJA is 44, if 38-yo EROICA was walking with her, most people would probably assume that they were a mother-daughter couple, with EROICA in the matron role.

 

Dammit.

[itsallgrand]

Oh wow. So question: beyond hair and clothes ( which can be altered easily), if you imagine her 'done up' would you find her attractive? Because she sounds like a hidden gem.

[NorthDallas40]

Oh wow. So question: beyond hair and clothes ( which can be altered easily), if you imagine her 'done up' would you find her attractive? Because she sounds like a hidden gem.

 

Her face isn't conventionally pretty but she could definitely look more attractive, even sexy, if she tried. But I doubt that will happen. Which is sad because she does appear to be relatively hidden and gem-like.

[notalady]

Her face isn't conventionally pretty but she could definitely look more attractive, even sexy, if she tried. But I doubt that will happen. Which is sad because she does appear to be relatively hidden and gem-like.

 

I know someone in their mid 30s who was very plain looking before she got divorced, totally revamped her style after she got divorced and now look much prettier with a bit of make up and sexy style (although not to my taste as it seems a bit too sexy for someone over the age of say...25 lol), so you never know.

 

That being said, I'm sure she would appreciate dating someone who finds her attractive as is rather than having to change.

[Batya33]

I know someone in their mid 30s who was very plain looking before she got divorced, totally revamped her style after she got divorced and now look much prettier with a bit of make up and sexy style (although not to my taste as it seems a bit too sexy for someone over the age of say...25 lol), so you never know.

 

That being said, I'm sure she would appreciate dating someone who finds her attractive as is rather than having to change.

 

Definitely. Let her go and find someone who finds her attractive as is (and perhaps enjoys seeing her get dressed up, etc but that's not the core of the attraction). I dated someone when I was in my 20s who was very handsome and full of himself. He asked me to wear more makeup for our next date, even suggesting that his mother would take me for a professional makeover. (The night we met I had a cold and likely looked pale- and I knew I wouldn't infect him lol since it was just a first meet). I was appalled and he thought the suggestion was totally fine. I was young and stupid so I kept the next date even though I was offended- never had that experience before -the opposite "you don't need makeup" That was our last date. Years later I saw in the newspaper that he married a fashion designer. Which is exactly as it should be- and with your preference it should be that you avoid women whose style is to present themselves as they are, the age they are and unconcerned with "plain" or otherwise (and I am distinguishing this from wanting someone who is fit/healthy looking/leads a healthful lifestyle). Those women are just not for you and asking a woman like that to change is unfair and won't really work in any realistic way. Leave her be so she can find someone who thinks she sparkles and so she doesn't have to prematurely lose her dinner because she is constantly catching you checking out other women.

 

I am not judging women who choose to wear makeup to look younger or those who don't - it's a preference. I probably would say the same about someone who didn't lead a healthful lifestyle but at least with online you're more likely to learn that even before you meet just based on what the person likes to do/whether she's active, athletic, etc.

 

It's not "sad" that she chooses to dress/present herself the way she does-it's her choice and who's to judge it -if she was "sad" about it she'd do something about it or she'd be perhaps depressed which you'd be able to tell over time as well. It may not be in her focus/values to invest time in presenting her physical features to the outside world in any particular way. No "hidden gem" unless you think the gem part of her is her looks and should be admired by strangers on the street. Some people like that sort of thing - and that's fine. She may not and that's fine too.

 

Also maybe she was lying about her age which is another issue entirely!

[itsallgrand]

I was curious as to NDs answer to get a better idea of how much weight he puts into style when it comes to attraction.

I think his answer indicates 'a lot'.

 

And I agree totally with not going into something hoping a person will change. She sounds like a hidden gem to me in the sense that she sounds highly compatible with ND, except for her lack of emphasis on fashion. So to guys like ND, she is 'hidden'- even though he could possibly be very happy with her.

 

I'm thinking of someone now who I know who like ND, went for women who put a lot of stock into presenting themselves a certain way and looks. This man married a woman like that, and divorced her a few years ago. His current partner is much more down to earth, puts very little stock in appearances. He's the happiest he's ever been - it just took him til his 60s to realize what actually makes him happy in a relationship. He was busy keeping up appearances himself for a long time.

p

The point is the man in my example was more worried what people thought than what he wanted. It blinded him to the large amount of people who don't think like that.

[Batya33]

But ND is entitled to want what he wants in his date - and part of what he wants -like part of what most of us want - I guess is superficial/shallow. And that's ok. But since he already knows that he won't like being seen with this woman/be attracted enough to her when they're out because of her fashion/style/makeup choices he should do her a favor and let her go right now.

 

I do think it's different where the person -man or woman -dresses in ill-fitting or unclean clothes, etc - maybe I'm splitting hairs but I see that as a different issue and often as reflective of self-esteem/self-confidence. Her choices actually might reflect more self-confidence than someone who dresses to be arm candy (but of course I don't know her/her motives, if she even has any).

[NorthDallas40]

FWIW, when I said it was "sad" about EROICA's appearance, I meant for me, not her. And I do indeed think it's possible that she was lying about her age, though she didn't strike me as the sort of person to do that. I think she'd be fun to see movies with (she has good taste in that department, as far as I could tell), but not enough to date, and she lives about 40 minutes away, so she's in the rearview.

 

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As for SUZUKI, when I was checking our messages to get info about our 3:30pm meetup today, I realized I never replied when she confirmed on Friday. Ugh.

 

So at 2pm today I messaged her on CMB (she never gave me her number) to apologize and confirm. Of course she didn't respond until 3:25 (when I was almost at the coffee shop) to say that she thought lack of reply meant I couldn't make it, so she made other plans. I guess taking 2 minutes to text "are we still on for Sunday?" at any point during the weekend never occurred to her, but whatever.

 

I messaged back another apology and asked if she wanted to try for dinner this week; no reply yet. But I think this prospect is dead in the water, not only because of the scheduling SNAFU, but because she never engaged in any meaningful conversation on CMB and never gave me her number either; I don't think she ever really wanted to meet at all.

[notalady]

 

As for SUZUKI, when I was checking our messages to get info about our 3:30pm meetup today, I realized I never replied when she confirmed on Friday. Ugh.

 

So at 2pm today I messaged her on CMB (she never gave me her number) to apologize and confirm. Of course she didn't respond until 3:25 (when I was almost at the coffee shop) to say that she thought lack of reply meant I couldn't make it, so she made other plans. I guess taking 2 minutes to text "are we still on for Sunday?" at any point during the weekend never occurred to her, but whatever.

 

I messaged back another apology and asked if she wanted to try for dinner this week; no reply yet. But I think this prospect is dead in the water, not only because of the scheduling SNAFU, but because she never engaged in any meaningful conversation on CMB and never gave me her number either; I don't think she ever really wanted to meet at all.

 

I don't know, hasn't it been often said (over and over) that if there's no confirmation there's no date and that we shouldn't wait around but to make other plans? Some people say send a text to confirm again because what's there to lose, while others say just forget about it he's not interested (remember how much it happens in MM's journal?) so I can see both sides. And often times, it's not wrong to assume the other person never responded because they are just not interested.

 

Unfortunately though, it doesn't leave much room for simple mistakes, which we all make from time to time. I don't think it's wrong or disinterested of her to not send another message to confirm, it's just an unfortunate misunderstanding at an unfortunate time.

[NorthDallas40]

I'm taking responsibility on this one, since I neglected to confirm on Friday. My work was busy and I thought I had already replied, but ultimately this one was on me.

 

That said, I'm the one who contacted first, tried to make small talk, offered my number, came up with 3 ideas for coffee and 3 ideas for dinner, and agreed to SUZUKI's preferred time. If, after all that, someone can't be bothered to just send a quick text to check in, it speaks volumes. If the situations were reversed, I would have sent a message either last night, or when a competing plan came up. I also would have given her my number if she gave me hers first. But that's me.

 

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I just texted YEOJA to see if she was still interested/available for this Friday. If she says she "has a workshop" again without offering another time, I'm done with her as well.

[NorthDallas40]

YEOJA replied 30 minutes later to accept my invite for Friday... but her texts don't really show a lot of enthusiasm.

 

ME: Still up for dinner and laughter this Friday? Lemme know!

HER: Hi ND40, yeah we can have dinner together

ME: Cool - wanna check out the comedy show after?

HER: Ok. Where is the place? I've never been comedy club

 

"Yeah we can have dinner"?? Jeez, glad I'm not intruding.

 

I realize the seeming lack of excitement may just be her reserved demeanor and/or language barrier, but ugh.

 

Also perused my OKC bookmarks and nada. I have nothing in common with the best-looking women on my list, the average-looking ones seem really boring, and the ones that share my interests are all overweight. Again, ugh.

[NorthDallas40]

Our bassplayer flaked out on another previously-confirmed rehearsal this week, but we were able to reschedule for tomorrow so crisis averted.

 

And I rehearse with the "shadow band" next week, along with that female singer's band I was asked to join... but my main band's drummer still hasn't confirmed when he's available next week to rehearse. In any case, next week will be way busy for me.

 

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After several texts over the past couple of days working out details, YEOJA and I are on for dinner & comedy club this Friday.

 

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I also got two more matches on CMB who have replied to my first message:

 

LONI (43, 5’6”) is a pretty, tan, exotic-looking project manager and actress/model who clearly has some old photos on her profile, but still looks hot in the ones that appear more recent.

 

GEMMA (45, 5’3”) is a physician who lives about 45 minutes away and is fairly pale and has a pleasant but plain/homely face. Some of her photos are definitely from 8+ years ago (one is even dated 2009), and I think we may have been matched here before and I never messaged her. Not sure, because in one photo she’s with a woman who looks similar (a sister?), so perhaps it’s the other woman with whom I was matched. Odd.

 

I’m more interested in LONI than GEMMA but I sent a second message to both of them this afternoon

 

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I also got a couple of replies from two attractive women on OKC this week, but both were so noncommittal and focused on themselves with no questions about me that I ignored them. That’s at least one thing I’ve learned since starting this journal: when to just not bother.

[NorthDallas40]

GEMMA replied, giving me her number, and like EROICA, asked if I wanted marriage and kids, because "if you are not, I'd rather not waste you time or mine

 

Obviously that's ok with me, but come on - you're 44 and haven't gone on a first date with this strange guy yet, so why the eff are you bringing this up before a freaking phone call? Whatever.

[notalady]

I think these women are really reaching the end of their reproductive years and are hyper focused on not wasting time. I bet the next man they meet that want the same thing family wise and seem remotely normal, they'd want to get married and have kids asap.