How much is too much before I quit?

[berry15]

I am going to try and make a long story short, although it may be difficult. I have been dating a man for the past 2 years, 1 year of which has been long distance. We fell in love and made plans for a beautiful future and the first year was wonderful but things have gone down hill since then. I broke up with him about 1 year ago because of the constant fighting and turmoil, he says he was unhappy with my behavior, outburts and controlling facets of my personality. We were apart for about 2 months during which I met another man and dated him for a while but I soon realized I missed my ex and I came running back to him. He took me back and we had a string of break up's during this time. I knew he was speaking to other women and it really brought out an immense amount of jealousy and bitter feelings within me. For about 5 months I was acting out, being very aggressive, controlling, checking his phone records and being extremely possessive. Although neither of us is perfect I would like to stay out of the realm of blaming him and take the blame for my own actions which in retrospect I realize were completely overboard and lead to him not wanting to be with me. A few weeks ago, I had another outburst and he broke up with me. I went NC for a few days, but then he started calling me with a friendly undertone. I let it go on for a few days until I asked where we stand and he said he doesn't believe I will ever change and he doesn't think we could work things out. I promised him up and down that I will change and do the things he has asked from me in terms of my behavior towards him because I truly do love him and want a future with him. He says he's heard the same promises over and over and nothing has changed the last 20 times. I guess I just always thought I would let time take its course and things would work themselves out. However, this strategy failed me and now when I really am willing to change, it seems it's too late. He invited me out for dinner last night which was a really nice time but when we got back to his place he was texting another woman who I know he turns to whenever we break up. I can go NC, but he calls or texts me anyway so I don't know what to do at this point. I am in this awful circle where the same thing keeps happening. I mess up, beg him, please and promise to change ... he takes me back and we end up having another fight somewhere down the line which leads to a break up.

 

He says this time he doesn't think I will change and doesn't trust that I will change and he feels he's put my happiness before his for way too long. I really do want to change for him but I'm not sure how much is too much before I just quit on the whole relationship. I love him with all my heart but I don't know how to make him see that I really am willing to change this time around and I am being serious about working things out. It's different this time because I feel as though I am losing him and that thought alone breaks me down into tears and heartache. Also, right now I have a whole lot going on at work which could determine my future and I need his support the most because he is my best friend but we keep fighting and it's bringing down my work which could have a drastic impact on my future. I don't know how to make him realize that I will truly change for him and be a better person towards him, he just doesn't believe it and nothing I say seems to make the light bulb click in his heart and mind. I do know that he loves me, that is not a question in my mind but he says how much of this can he take. He says he is hurt and since I keep doing the same things over and over to him it's emotinally abusive towards him and he doesn't think it'll stop if he takes me back again. I really can't live without him and want him back, how to make him see that I mean it this time is the question ...

[endy]

Well actions speak louder than words. You've shown repeatidly that you aren't going to change. So why would YOU even want to get back together. Getting him back isn't going to change who you are. You don't change for another person. You change for YOU.

 

Your issues are probably deep rooted into childhood. This takes looking deeply, realization to why these issues exist, and time to change. A LOT of time. If you go back to the relationship then no, things won't change.

 

You've described a very unhealthy unloving relationship above. I don't think you really have any idea what love is. If you did you would want him to be happy. Although you say you love him, your actions describe otherwise. The above is not what love is.

 

I don't think it would be wise to go back to the relationship at all. As far as NC goes, you need to go NC for you and not respond to his texts. Obviously this relationship is in a repetative cycle. Until you change for you, it sounds like you won't be in a healthy relationship period. By the way I'm sure he isn't innocent either. Like attracts like.

 

You can say you love someone, but not understand it. Love in a relationship has a lot to do with how you treat another. Love is born out of compassion, understanding, insight... the ability to end your suffering and the others by clear communication and understanding... NOT anger. You have the ability to recognize anger etc. You don't react out of pain caused by another, but take that anger, calm it, understand it, and see it from their view first before you discuss it.

 

I think there's a lot for you both to work on individually. Obviously this is a repeating unhealthy cycle. Start by examining your childhood to realize why you are the way you are. Read the book reconciliation by thich nhat hahn.

 

By the way you said repeatidly you would change. You would change when you don't have him anymore. Then you get back to your security blanket. You don't change. Change takes time and a lot of it. There is nothing that you can say or that you realized in this short amount of time that can make you snap your fingers and allow for change. You need to do this yourself for yourself. Not for him because he isn't there anymore.

[berry15]

Endy - my reply to you got deleted for some reason so I will make this one shorter. I do love him and his happiness means everything to me. Seeing him happy and smiling warms my soul and the fact that I feel like I might be the course of much of his unhappiness really kills me inside. I can't sleep, eat, think straight knowing that I have possibly destroyed something that was so incredible. I have been meeting with a therapist to solve my issues and am truly willing to change not just for himself, but for myself. This change will not only benefit this relationship but all other relationships I have in work, love, etc down the road. I never changed or took the change into my own hands in the past because I just felt like being passive and letting time run its course would fix our problems.

 

I have an event with him in a week and I am not really sure how to act until then. Go NC until the event or keep it friendly during the week? I just want to minimize all tension with him but really I want him to see a change within me, because my words are just that, words. Actions speak louder, I just don't know what will make him see clearly how much I do care about him and am on a path to change...

[BlueAngle]

you sound like me 3 years ago. I thought I loved him and could not live without him. He took me back over and over again. But we ended up breaking up permanently and I realized that I did not love him. I loved myself more. After the breakup, I dated other guys and tried to understand the meaning of love. I tried to learn about myself and let go of my problems so I could have a better relationship in the future.

 

For you, the best solution is: let him go and work on urself. U need to be independent. U need to let go of ur problems. U need to be alone. When u feel that u have changed, then u can reach out to him if he is available.

[BlueAngle]

you can private message me to talk if u want. I was exactly like you a few years ago so I understand how u feel.

 

If you can let him go completely, that is when you will start to change.

[berry15]

I can't figure out how to private message, I think because I am new I don't have the option to PM. Maybe you can try to message me? I would like to speak to you.

 

I feel like I can't let go because I messed up and I know the relationship is salvageable. He himself asked me to give him some space, not "investigate" his daily life, not call so many times a day and we will figure out a way to work things out. I know I am on a path of positive change and I just want that to be reflected in my relationship, the hardest part is backing off and giving him what he needs. It's awful.

[BlueAngle]

I know. I was like that. He was my first bf and I got a lot of issues then. I was so attached. He asked me for the same thing and I did not give it to him and ended up breaking up for good. When we first broke up, gosh I was so bad, I even stalked him and called him so many times. I begged etc and did all the not to do things. But at the end, because of that, I became a better person today. I am more happy than when I was in a relationship and now looking back, I realized that I didn't love him. I just could not deal with my problems and that is y I could not let him go.

 

I know it's so hard. It was so hard for me that I thought of dying. But I didn't because I knew it was not worth it. I cried so much and everyone around me got so scared for me. People thought I would forever depressed. U can do it. It's hard but let it go completely. I meant COMPLETELY!

[BlueAngle]

This is kind of relationship never works out even if he takes u back right now. U will start acting up again. The only way that it might work out is let it go and don't think about the relationship. Focus on u and make urself happy. If he is the right one, then he will be 4ever yours. If he is not, then u will meet someone else. It's not the end of the world. Heart can change.

 

And I was like you. I knew that he was not going to take me back and I was so desperate. I searched around and found this website. My obsession was for him to take me back.

[Lithp]

Actions speak louder, I just don't know what will make him see clearly how much I do care about him and am on a path to change...

 

That's the thing right there, and I have been through this with my boyfriend in the past many times There is nothing you can say at this point that will make him see anything clearly. It's in your actions. He will have to know you by the things that you do and see the change for himself in order to realise that you're willing to be a better person for the relationship. It may take months or years and it may not even happen at all now, but unfortunately that is the position you have put yourself in by promising to change so many times and then going back to your old ways. You will have to show him with your actions consistently that you have changed for the better.

 

It's really just that simple - change first, and then he will see it clearly and do what he wants with it.

[berry15]

I am on path where I keep calling him, asking where he is, what he is doing, etc. That's my controlling side and he hates it and keeps asking me to stop. I guess this is the first change that I need to show him, backing off and listening to him and giving him what he is asking for. I wish I could understand why this is so hard to do! I am glad I am not alone here and I hope I can get through this and prove to him that I will not let him down this time around. Having to wait and see how things pan out is torturous and that's what makes me feel anxious and sad ... I am the type of person who likes to solve conflict right away as I really dislike being on bad terms with people, I just want to mend things and pick up our life again

[BlueAngle]

Don't change just to get him back. If that is the case, then it's a lie. Change so that you can be a better person for urself.

[Lithp]

Constantly calling him, checking in on him, wanting to know what he's doing, etc... when he's asked you for space is more than likely going to push him away even further and just prove to him that you don't respect his wishes. You're doing well to just stay away for now. Stay with the No Contact and work on YOU. If he calls you, texts, emails, tries to contact you in any way - ignore it. This is something you need to do right now and it will show him that you're serious about working on yourself and changing.

[BlueAngle]

Life does not revolve around him. It revolves around you.

[endy]

That's what I'm saying. THOSE issues above do not change over night. Changing who you are is different than changing your behavior. You are talking about changing your behavior so you can be in a happy relationship. That does not happen inside of a relationship. It's like someone with a gambling issue. Do you think they are going to change it for someone else? No they are going to realize it's an issue, that it caused issues and then take care of it because it's not healthy for THEM.

 

You said above...

I do love him and his happiness means everything to me.

 

I don't know how old you are, how many relationships you've been in, but it takes time to understand love. True love anyways. Above I said you didn't love him. I'm speaking of true love. The first step to that is loving yourself. True happiness comes from within. Can you say you are happy with yourself and you love yourself? Do you love the person you are? It took me 12 years to realize what love is, and what love isn't.

 

It looks like you are basing your relationship and him on your happiness. If you don't have him you aren't happy. Although that's normal through a breakup... it sounds to me like you really are more codependent than anything. Meaning you feel the need to care for people and you base your happiness on how they react. Not healthy.

 

With that said, I think you need to figure yourself out first. You have said you would change over and over. It's good your going to therapy, but what you're looking for isn't inside another person. It's inside of yourself. Anything a therapist says will help you understand it if they are good. I think what is probably happening is you both rely on each other for happiness. You get back into the relationship because you miss each other and the love feelings comes back temporarily. Then it goes to hell again and the process repeats itself.

 

You have to understand you two just may not be right for each other. It usually takes several relationships for people to realize their mistakes and learn about relationships. I personally would let go altogether. Move on and better yourself. Maybe down the road it can work out. It's obvious right now you are both dependent on each other, at the very least you are, and that's just not healthy.

 

A healthy relationship is interdependent. You depend on each other only when you need to. Arguing, has anger built into it. The more you have it the more it grows and grows like a bomb. Some people repress it, some people don't take care of it like they should. Then it explodes. Obviously this happens internally as well. You have so much work to do, that nothing is going to change until you take care of all of those issues.

 

You can possibly work through it while together, but it's going to take time and patience. Especially on his end. Change happens easier when you are alone and taking time for yourself. A relationship just complicates your ability to go back to yourself and think with your mind.

[berry15]

At this point I've found it difficult to think with my mind all together. You've been very insightful Endy. I've had my fair share of relationships, breakups and heartache but nothing that comes close to this. I can say that I am happy with myself. However, like with anyone, there are moments of happiness and moments of unhappiness. Life is a roller coaster of emotions and feelings as is any relationship. This is probably the first time in my life that I feel as though I've degraded myself for someone else. My self esteem is lower and it really is upsetting because I do know my true value. My dependency right now stems from this critical position I'm in at work. Since my ex has been through it play by play I have sort of relied on him to help me get through it for the past few months. Now that I feel he sort of distanced himself from it all, it's been difficult for me to buckle down and focus on what's most important for me right now: my career and future. I know I need to pick myself up and get working on myself and my career but there is so much that drags me down it's a struggle day in and day out, I even see it taking a tole on my health because I constantly feel anxious and as if short of breath. Having listed all these negatives, I will continue to work on myself and do what's best for ME ...

[berry15]

It's just a matter of having the will power to follow through which is something I lack right now. My ex knew I wasn't feeling well last night so he just calls to ask how I am and if I need anything ... I say no thanks and asked where has was off to (mistake! i know!) and he says, "don't worry about it, we aren't together, don't investigate me". It's like his caring side is still there but then this apathetic, spiteful, mean side emerges and it just kills me. Am I the only one who sees this as sort of sending mixed signals? Why call me and act all boyfriend-ly only to follow it up by saying "we aren't together" - call me idiotic but this makes no sense to me and it just makes me harbor a heavier heart ...

[Lithp]

Why call me and act all boyfriend-ly only to follow it up by saying "we aren't together" - call me idiotic but this makes no sense to me and it just makes me harbor a heavier heart ...

 

He probably does care for you - checking in to make sure you're ok when you're ill is nice, but it doesn't necessarily mean he's trying to act as your boyfriend. Don't take this to mean anything. When you started in with the 'investigation', it's obvious he still holds resentment over that, and that probably upset him. Whether it was an innocent question on your part or there was something more to it, it doesn't matter - all he knows is that is something that was an issue in your relationship and it's still continuing even after he's asked you to stop and give him space, so all those negative feelings are going to come back.

 

Just don't contact him and don't answer any of his attempts to contact you from now on. That way you can focus on you and there won't be any signals at all to mix up and leave you confused.

[berry15]

I am struggling with going completely NC because I would never know how to re-initiate contact after time has passed. How does on go about re-kindling an old flame after having gone NC and working on themselves? I will still see him at an event and somewhere else the following week so I still feel like those mixed signals will be in the air despite my efforts to quash them. You are right about the negative feelings coming, I guess in order to avoid the rush of negative feelings its best to avoid those negative areas but it's also difficult to walk on egg shells all the time. Finding the balance is the worst part and if I do go full NC ... firstly, I know he would get upset if I just stopped returning his calls out of the blue and secondly, I would never know how to re-establish some sort of relationship after that time apart.

[endy]

I think what the issue is he cares for you, but you two are not emotionally compatible. I think that's it end of story. If you are unhappy in the relationship it is time for it to end period. The relationship has ran it's course a long time ago it appears. You grew together, and then you grew apart.

 

Tell him that it's over. Not to contact you anymore because you need to heal. Maybe down the road you can speak but not for now. Move on with your life, work on your career and focus on that. I don't see this ever working out because obviously it's just emotional incompatibility to me. He does not understand your emotions. That is poison for a woman in a relationship... Besides that it looks like he needs to man up a bit. This situation just obviously is not healthy. It's going to be hard to keep NC at first... but it's necessary to move on.

 

I understand you love him and you think he's the best guy. Love itself is not enough to hold a relationship together. There has got to be compatibility on a logical, emotional, and sexual level. If one of those is not present... the relationship will ultimately fail.

 

People prefer suffering that is familiar... and that's exactly why you are staying in the relationship.

[berry15]

I'm not unhappy though ... I am unhappy in the sense that my actions have made him unhappy but overall I was happy and still believe that with time the relationship has great potential. I do believe we both have a great amount of growing, learning and manning up to do. However, I don't believe something so earth shattering has occurred between us to necessitate a break up for good.

 

Neither of us cheated (although I am not so sure about what he is doing on that front now that we are broken up), neither of us hurt the other to the point of no return. This is why I feel so adamant about really changing, for myself, for my relationships with everyone around me (friends, family, boyfriends, etc). I don't want to throw out 2 years of hard work invested, emotion, time, finances, etc.

 

Endy, I know this doesn't exactly go along with everything you've said although I do partially agree with you ... If I do give him this time and space that he needs right now what would be your suggestion regarding eventually bringing up the relationship? I find an issue I have right now is that every time I speak to him I somehow manage to sneak in asking "are we going to get back together" or something along those lines. Childs play. I'm not even sure why I do it ... insecurity I guess. When if ever would be the right time to bring something like that up again?

[berry15]

I also forgot to mention that I recently found out he's speaking to another woman (someone he seems to contact when we break up) and when I asked him about it prior he said "I'm not looking for another relationship, I want us to be together, but you need to work through your issues, she means nothing to me". I actually know who this woman is and I know he would never pursue her in a serious way but it bothers me that he speaks to her whenever we break up. Is that his escape route? I just can't bring myself to go NC, although the more I pine over him, the more I put myself at jeopardy of getting hurt. Why am I doing this to myself! I wish I hadn't made all of my mistakes in the first place, then I wouldn't be in this situation today. Living life day to day, working, eating, sleeping is becoming very difficult & all I want is to figure out a way to right things with the man I love again. Is it impossible to do??

[jeepman41]

You are saying you can't go NC. It's not that you can't, you don't want to, but your actions are pushing him further away. You said you want him to be happy but that means letting go with love.You need to remove yourself from the relationship. It has grown toxic and right now there is nothing you can say or do that is going to make it better.

 

When someone breaks up with you it signifies they don't want you and they don't want a relationship with you. They no longer view you as a romantic or sexual partner. Any negative behavior on your part just serves to drive a wedge further between you. You may love this person but you need to love yourself more and that means setting some healthy boundaries for yourself either in or out of a relationship.

 

Adult human relationships are based on want, not need. You don't need this person to survive. You made it before them and you can surely make it without them.

[endy]

Jeepman is correct. Look, you are seeing this through love goggles. What you have is not a loving relationship. This is a REPEAT pattern. It's enough, think about all the times you argue and yell at each other. Do you know what this does when repeated over and over again? It creates hate, and it creates resentment. That is exactly what is going on. Just YOU changing is not going to solve this.

 

He broke up with you, he is stringing you along. He will know that you will still be there unless you say I've had enough of this by going NC. No there is no right time to bring up the relationship. He made a decision and you need to respect it. You aren't and yes it's going to push him further away. Are you seriously THAT naive that you think something is not going on with this woman? I wouldn't say he's cheating but seriously? Why does he go to her every time this happens?

 

Look it's happened time and time again. You're going to continue to be a damn walking mat until you end this for good. It's not healthy for either of you. It's best that you cut ties and leave each other be.

 

A pattern does not exist for no reason. This is an ongoing thing that is repetative. Usually when you break up once it's not repairable because mutual trust is broken. No trust in a relationship is poison to it. You have broken up several times and always got back together. It IS NOT working between you two and it's not healthy. Leave it be, or keep repeating the same thing over and over.

 

It takes two people to change and make a relationship work. It takes time for that to happen. He's putting all of the responsibility on you like it's your fault. Sorry, but no relationship ends because one person is at fault. THAT is an issue in and of itself. Do this now and end it for good, or just keep on suffering. It's your choice, and eventually you'll have enough of it.

 

Read the guide at the bottom of my signature. Follow it. People that love each other don't breakup on a regular basis. They don't cause each other pain and suffering. They do the opposite. It doesn't matter your work situation etc. That's just an excuse for the breakup. Breakups are caused by needs not being meant over a long period of time or personal incompatibility.

[berry15]

I do agree with you Endy, a big problem for me is the fact that he puts all the blame on my shoulders and doesn't take any of it himself. Of course, he is partially to blame but somehow he always finds a way to turn it on me and I, as usual, accept the blame and find myself apologizing. I actually read the guide on the bottom of your signature yesterday but still find that following those steps would be almost impossible for me. It's probably naive of me to say this but I do feel like I need to give this 1 last shot and if it really is not working then I would walk away. I'm not sure when that will be because I do think we both need time and space apart so for now I will try my very best to go NC and cut all contact with him. My sticking around definitely allowed him to feel like I'll always be around no matter what he does, who he speaks to, who else he dates when we are broken up, etc.

[endy]

Do what you will. Don't say we didn't warn you. All you are doing is most likely prolonging the inevitible. Every time you go back it's just going to be more and more painful.