What the hell do I do? Fight alone or let stuff happen?

[BossCheese]

Ok so a family member is getting married. The wedding date is still many months away, but already there are a lot of red flags popping up with this wedding. So many, in fact, that the only people that don't seem to see the red flags are the couple. It's starting to become clear that somebody needs to have a talk with the soon-to-be groom (my cousin) about this whole thing, but a very strong family trait is a very strong aversion to confontation, so such talks wouldn't go well. So, most of my family has cowed itself into the idea that they're engaged, the wedding will take place, what happens will happens, and there's nothing anybody can do about any of it despite the many red flags that are already starting to say that this won't be a very long marriage.

 

Red flag #1 for me is that the girl is my cousin's first real girlfriend ever. They met in college, dated for a year or so after graduation, then jumped right into the engagement. He never dated around or had any other girlfriends, so it's my opinion (as well as the opinion of many others in the family) that he never really 'explored his options' so-to-speak. There's a strong sense that he's marrying the first face to smile back.

 

Red flag #2 was that I once witnessed his dad ask him outright "Is this what you want to do?" he just sort've shrugged, hesitated, and said "Yeah I guess so" in the same way that you'd reply to the fast food employee that's asking you if you want to supersize your pepsi for only a quarter more. I'm no expert in the area, but it seems to me that if you have met the person of your dreams that you want to spend the rest of your life with, you'd respond to that question much more enthusiastically and without hesitation. There's a sense that he's doing all of this because he thinks he's just supposed to do it. He just seems to be going through the motions.

 

Red flag #3 They don't really have the body language of a couple. I've only seen them hold hands once in the two or three years they've been together. I've never seen a quick hug or peck on the cheek, or even very much physical contact of any sort. I mean, there's this one couple I know that are a perfect match for each other. They rarely don't have physical contact and they're always posting cute messages to each other on thier facebook walls. I've never seen such a cute message posted on either my cousin's or his fiances wall. ever.

 

Red flag#4 I fully 100% agree that a wedding celebration is more for the bride than it is for the groom- I've been in enough bridal parties to know that. As such, I fully agree that the bride's say takes precedence in virtually every question that should arise reguarding the wedding. But there's one chioce I've always believed that the bride can't touch: who the best man and groomsmen are. I think that it's the right of the guy to pick his best pals to stand up there with him. Well, this girl hasn't given my cousin that right. She chose the grooms and even the best man. Bad as it is to say this about family, if my cousin doesn't have the spine to tell this girl that he picks his friends and not her, then I don't think he has the spine to be an effective leader of a marriage. It hurts bad to say that about blood, but * * * * who can argue with that?

 

There are a lot more red flags to pop up, but those are the big ones...plenty of little flags here and there. Now comes the problem: as stated, nobody in my family has the balls to say anythnig to him even at the time when this talk needs to take place. I'm the one single person who's decided that he needs to hear all of this, but if I do talk to him, I know that my family is so averse to confrontation that I'm effectively standing alone with nobody at my back. The reason this falls to me is that I've been his best ally and his right hand man since age 7. He's more than a cousin: he's a brother till the end. Everybody in my family thinks that I should be the best man rather than this guy that the fiance has picked for him.

 

I once nearly killed myself saving him from drowning. He knows that once I'm off my leash I don't go down without a fight. I've taken punishment to save him from his mistakes in the past. Now he's faced with another possible mistake. Should I stick my neck out (all alone) for him again and save him from his own wedding (or die trying)? Or should I just keep it to myself with the rest of the family- accept he could be making a big mistake and be happy keeping my thoughts to myself? (BTW I'm slated to be an usher)

[annie24]

I would take him out to dinner or drinks one night, and say casually that you have a few concerns about the wedding - that he doesn't seem "as into it" as other grooms are at this stage, and that he seems to be kind of doing what she tells him to (including picking his best man - that is something he should choose). I'd tell him that as his friend and cousin, you are concerned that he's making a life-long committment to someone he doesn't seem all that crazy about.

 

and then shut the hell up. after that - it's all on him - you've said your piece.

[Fudgie]

Red flag #1: Who cares? Not everyone "plays the field" prior to marriage. At least they dated for some time before marrying so they know each other well and know that they can get along with each other. You don't need to "sow your seed" with a bunch of women before you settle down.

 

Red flag #2: Might be valid. Maybe he's just a private person with his emotions? Or he may not really feel strongly.

 

Red flag #3: Not all "awesome" couples need to have public or Facebook make-out sessions. I certainly wouldn't do the FB stuff if I were on FB again. I think it's obnoxious.

 

Red flag #4: Yes, this seems right. She seems controlling.

 

I would talk to him about your concerns, alone, one-on-one. Just have him listen. Then back off. Because it's a choice he needs to make on his own.

[annie24]

I do agree with Fudgie - I forgot to make those points. Yes, some people do marry the first person they date, some people are not affectionate in public or overly gushy on FB. Some people are more private. I do find it worrisome the way you describe it - he is 'going with the flow' as opposed to seeming like he's a really active and equal participant in this process/relationship.

[jenny_mcs]

#1- This is seriously stupid. If you find the person you want to spend the rest of your life with, you can't marry them- you have to go out and date other people? Ridiculous.

 

#2- Can't comment on this without knowing your cousin. Maybe he felt embarrassed and put on the spot by his dad asking him that in front of other people.

 

#3- Again, so stupid. They aren't right for each other because they don't leave cutesy FB messages for each other? LOL. I guess my husband and I shouldn't have gotten married!

 

#4- OK, now we are getting down to your real beef. You think you should be your cousin's best man, and someone else is filling that role. You are jealous and feel pushed aside.

 

You need to talk to your cousin and tell him that you feel hurt by this. Don't make it an attack on his fiancee. He will choose her- as he should.

 

Honestly, I don't think your concerns amount to more than jealousy about the fact that you are not the best man.

 

Oh, and this "if my cousin doesn't have the spine to tell this girl that he picks his friends and not her, then I don't think he has the spine to be an effective leader of a marriage"- all I can say is thank God it is 2011 and no one expects the husband to "lead" his wife.

[BossCheese]

Ok fair enough mabey I could've phrased things a little different. I'll give Fudgie the benefit of the doubt on his points. But one thing that definitiely is true is that my cousin is nothing like he used to be. He used to be the 'My way or the highway, take s*** from nobody' type of guy. Now it seems he's like a robot on a chain. I'm going to have a word with him. Definitely not going to be popular with him, his fiance, or the rest of my family, but it seems the consensus is to at least try doing something. Just wish I had a family member to back me up on this if things don't work out one-on-one.

[Capricorn3]

In cases like this I always strongly believe in MYOB. No-one has a clue what goes on behind closed doors, so to speak, and they could be the happiest couple for all you know. It has nothing to do with anyone else how they lead their lives. If they've already been together for 3 years that's a fairly good indication that they are doing ok. If their marriage does end some years later, that's their business (imo).

[BossCheese]

And no- I'm not jealous. I'd be just as happy to have no job at all. It's the idea that she isn't letting him have his right. He hasn't said it outright, but he has hinted to the fact that he's upset that he didn't have that right. I'm upset and worked up because he got screwed.

[annie24]

'My way or the highway, take s*** from nobody' type of guy. Now it seems he's like a robot on a chain.

 

somewhere in there, there's a happy medium. 'my way or the highway' is one extreme, so is being a doormat. you can have a spine and stand up for yourself. I've seen some people get married because they are 25 (or whatever) and say, 'ok, now it's time to get married and settle down' and they do so with the first person who crosses their path. and then they realize years later they were never in love. i think that's a big problem.

 

is jenny right? i'm sure that there is some jealousy that you weren't asked to be best man - but is there more to that story?

[annie24]

In cases like this I always strongly believe in MYOB. No-one has a clue what goes on behind closed doors, so to speak, and they could be the happiest couple for all you know. It has nothing to do with anyone else how they lead their lives. If they've already been together for 3 years that's a fairly good indication that they are doing ok. If their marriage does end some years later, that's their business (imo).

 

If I were getting married and one of my friends had some serious doubts, I'd want to hear about it. Now, I might choose to ignore it, but at least she said it.

 

I've heard - and I think that this is true - that sometimes, the friends are the best predictor on if the marriage will succeed or fail. Haven't you ever seen 2 people get married and you knew that right from the wedding they would get divorced? The friends can sometimes see things that people who are getting married can't....

[petite]

People grow up and change. He might have been a "my way or the highway" type of guy before but she obviously is very special to him and they've found a happy medium. Some people don't want to explore other options, it's just how they are, just as there are couples that are extremely affectionate in private but not in public. Just because you or the family have certain opinions about the relationship does not mean it's doomed.

 

Of course some people post cute message son facebook and pictures of them kissing and some simply don't. The fairly isn't entitled to see their affection, there are people that just don't like to be affectionate in front of their family. You seem bitter about not being chosen to be the best man, and perhaps that's making you doubt their relationship/ future marriage.

 

If you really feel that you want to speak up then do so, but be prepared for consequences because you don't know how he will react. He might thank you for saying what you think, but he also might hold it against you because he could be of the opinion that it's none of your or anyone elses business.

[OptomisticGirl]

#1 - many people get married to the first person they meet. People (such as I) have no desire to put as many notches on my bed post before I settle down, neither did my fiance. This red flag, IMO, is just a personal opinion you are reflecting on to your cousin.

 

#2 - This is a slight red flag but it could not be. Depends on the context he was asked and his mood at the time.

 

#3 - Not every couple is PDA crazy. Not every couple will hold hands all the time or post 'oh my god, I didn't breath today because you weren't next to me' messages on each other's facebook walls. Again, this is a personal obversation you are putting onto them and highly unfair.

 

#4 - This is a tad controlling but do YOU know for certain your cousin wanted to pick his own party on that side? Unless he came to you with this complaint, you are an observer looking in on a relationship - that wall may seem like glass to you but it's a very murky glass.

 

If you have concerns talk to him, but also realize it's very easy to stick one's nose in another's business without having all the facts about how their relationship runs. A lot of your 'red flags' are actually how YOU view a relationship and probably arent red flags within their relationship.

 

As well, I am a 'my way or the highway' kind of person and I have completely changed from how I was 2 years ago to how I am now because I love my fiance and I realize that mentality is not healthy. Doesn't mean I'm a door mat but I am far less 'my way, my way, my way' than I was before.

[annie24]

As for #4 - is it possible that he did make the choice, but is blaming it on her to not hurt your feelings? some people do stuff like that - blame something on their partner to make it easier to say no.

[Mesemene]

Have you tried suggesting they attend pre-marital counseling sessions? Even in a good relationship, it can help to have that uninvolved third party to see weaknesses in communication, or potential conflicts for planning ahead. It's something you could suggest that might help without screaming "What are you doing, man???"

[annie24]

^^^ that's a good suggestion.

[petite]

Have you tried suggesting they attend pre-marital counseling sessions? Even in a good relationship, it can help to have that uninvolved third party to see weaknesses in communication, or potential conflicts for planning ahead. It's something you could suggest that might help without screaming "What are you doing, man???"

 

I think this is a bad idea. I don't disagree that pre-marital counseling works, we're doing it even though fundamentally there aren't any massive problems. However, I'd soon put my cousin in place if he or she suggested that my relationship needed it; especially if they don't know anything about my relationship because I didn't tell them and all they are basing their opinion on is what they see or think. It could really offend his cousin. Unless his cousin has discussed major issue within the relationship with him and then suggesting counseling would be okay, but not in the case of the OP at this point.

[OptomisticGirl]

I think this is a bad idea. I don't disagree that pre-marital counseling works, we're doing it even though fundamentally there aren't any massive problems. However, I'd soon put my cousin in place if he or she suggested that my relationship needed it; especially if they don't know anything about my relationship because I didn't tell them and all they are basing their opinion on is what they see or think. It could really offend his cousin. Unless his cousin has discussed major issue within the relationship with him and then suggesting counseling would be okay, but not in the case of the OP at this point.

 

I 100% agree. Unless your cousin is coming to you with these issues, you can only speculate. Sure, friends sometimes can see issues we don't want to but a lot of time, friends also stick their nose were it doesn't belong or wanted.

[Capricorn3]

I 100% agree. Unless your cousin is coming to you with these issues, you can only speculate. Sure, friends sometimes can see issues we don't want to but a lot of time, friends also stick their nose were it doesn't belong or wanted.

Totally agree.

[annie24]

I think this is a bad idea. I don't disagree that pre-marital counseling works, we're doing it even though fundamentally there aren't any massive problems. However, I'd soon put my cousin in place if he or she suggested that my relationship needed it; especially if they don't know anything about my relationship because I didn't tell them and all they are basing their opinion on is what they see or think. It could really offend his cousin. Unless his cousin has discussed major issue within the relationship with him and then suggesting counseling would be okay, but not in the case of the OP at this point.

 

I think chances are that the groom-to-be will shrug off his cousin's advice - at first at least. he might sit and think about some of the issues that were brought up though. i think that the chances are that he will still go through with the wedding - but i think that is also one of the roles of your friends and family - you want them to be honest with you, no? i mean, you can still tell them to go to hell, but at least they said it before the wedding, not after.

[Mesemene]

Maybe I'm looking at it from the viewpoint of having once been young and idealistic heading into marriage - but I WISH someone had suggested it to me. It might've saved my first marriage, and all our friends thought we were a good match. There's ways to suggest things without saying "you have issues," I firmly believe anything that could be positive is worth exploring, and expressing it that way, even if all that comes about is they're a great match and learn a few new things about each other, is worth a little time.

 

It doesn't have to be suggested as "you need this," more a friendly "hey, have you considered X? I've heard a lot of good things as far as it bringing couples closer and really helping pave the way for building your lives together."

[petite]

I think when it comes to other peoples relationships we need to tread carefully because one never knows how the other person will take it. If the groom-to-be has not shared much about the relationship with the OP, and all the OP has to go on is opinions of family members (who might not like the girl much) and lack of affection in front of family (nothing unusual), and the fact that he was not asked to be the best man, the OP could very well be looked upon as a bitter meddler.

 

I would only be okay with a close friend or family member who I might have confided in to speak up or suggest relationship counseling, but if I didn't share anything, I wouldn't want their suggestions since they know nothing about my relationship. I certainly wouldn't suggest it to my cousin or friend if she never confided in me about the relationship - it's simply not my place. There are certain boundaries that should not be crossed when it comes to our friends or family members relationships, I think.

[OptomisticGirl]

Yeah. L and I poke fun at each other but not in a mean way it's just how we joke with each other. Some of my family members decided (After meeting him one time and over hearing us) to give me a 'talk' about the way he talked about me. They didn't ask what was up or try to figure out what was up but they assumed - and we all know what assume does.

 

It's very easy to place our relationship stipulations on others close to us. Sure, her picking his groomsmen (if he wasn't okay with that) is very controlling and that is something she will have to work on. But is she cheating on him? Does she hit him? Does she verbally attack him? Does she belittle him in front of you? I think those are the only situations a friend/family member can step in, with confidence, and go 'there is a problem here.'

[Staple]

Talk to him about it.

[petite]

I do agree that there are some circumstances in which family or friends can help. If I witnessed a friend being abused in a relationship or a cousin being treated badly by her partner, I would speak to her about it, but we have to accept that some people don't like others sticking their beak where it most of the time isn't wanted.

[Mesemene]

I got the impression from the original post that the OP and cousin are relatively close - at least closer than average for cousins. If not though, you're right, it could easily be seen as overstepping to say ANYTHING, even something casual, about his relationship.