Why do some men really think their opinions are valid when it comes to abortion

[Reflective]

I don't mean to be rude here but I see it time and time again, geez even my male friends get so angry. They tell me "if my girlfriend ever aborted it's over its my decision too. it's my child."

 

actually its not anything but a clump of cells. Its not really your decision to make. Yes you may have lender your sperm but how does that entitle you to tell a woman what to do with her own body?

You're not the one having to suffer, risking your own life for a child you don't want, you're not the one goingn through body, chemical, emotional and psychological changes all in a span of 9 months. so I don't really think men have a say.. maybe their input is needed but where do some

men get off thinking they can tell a women what to do with her own body?

 

"It's my baby too." technically it's not a baby yet.

"You're selfish" What is selfish about someone knowing they are not ready emotionally, financially etc to raise a child! And doing the one single responsible thing - aborting?

"Put it up for adoption" (See points up there I've listed to a few examples of what women are risking when deciding to have a child) And why would a woman that doesn't even want the child waste her time having it only to put it away somewhere else? Adoption isn't a walk in a park. Foster homes, dont get me stated.

"Close your legs" so it's okay for you to have sex with whoever you want. Do what you want with your own body. But god forbid a women does just that.

 

Any idea guys? To why some men think their opinions and that they assume they get a final say in whether a woman as a child or not?

[FathomFear]

Reflective, I think you're going to get the same answer as you do with the rest of your "Why do guys think X/Y/Z" threads. The fact is that you're young and immaturity will still be prominent.

 

For the record, I'm almost 32 and don't know any guys in real life who believe they have a "final say" or other such nonsense. I think most people understand that it's ultimately the woman's choice, but at the same time I think it's tactful to make sure that the father's opinion is at least heard and taken into consideration. As I'm sure you could imagine it would be frustrating not to be heard at all in such a situation, and unfortunatley that does happen to many guys.

 

You should also understand that "It's just a lump of cells" is your own viewpoint and not something everyone will hold, usually for various religious reasons. I'm not going to go further than that as these forums do not permit religious or political debate, but you should probably work to be more empathetic in that area.

[ApocalypseDreams]

Agree 100% with this guy. I'd rep it but I've gotta spread the love apparently.

[Reflective]

Of course you haven't. You don't reside where I do But there are guys that do think they have a right to say what a women can do. They really can't.

 

What's immature about my thread? It's a question to why some men delude themselves into thinking they have a right to tell a woman what she can and should do to her body, if god forbid she complies than he uses the "don't have sex" argument. That's what's immature. Also just because I'm younger than you, doesn't mean I'm immature. Nice fallacy bud.

 

You remind me of those pitiful people that think just because they are older any young person they come into contact with, automatically doesn't know as much as they do, so they better take their advice because they are so much more experienced/older. If you were really that much older and mature as you claim to be, you wouldn't feel the need to overcompensate or project the fact that you're older. It doesn't mean anything. I should ask another question:

 

 

How do some people get off thinking just because they are older that this automatically makes them entitled to assume they know more/ experienced more and anyone younger is immature for the sake of being younger. Delusional. This was a general observation not just towards you.

[Reflective]

Also, what does religion have to do with it? Are you insinuating that there are

people out there that lead lives according to a bunch of written rules? Is that what you're telling me?

 

Why would someone that is not prepared financially emotionally etc have a child?

Should a mother addicted to drugs, is a prostitute etc not abort her child while consuming an endless amount of drugs, poisoning the child btw, give birth and ruin the child's life? and make her responsibility societies?

 

All for the sake of some illogical faith?

[-John-]

Also agreed.

 

If I was in a relationship with someone and she got pregnant and wanted an abortion, and then treated me (the father) as though my opinion on the matter was invalid, we would no longer be together.

 

Reminds me of a guy I met in a therapy group once. His girlfriend had gotten pregnant and wanted an abortion. He didn't, and was willing to sacrifice everything (school, etc.) to raise the child. On his own, if necessary. Anyway, she got the abortion. He understood ultimately it was her choice, but she had treated him pretty much like the OP describes: as though his opinion didn't matter, etc. Probably one of the saddest stories I've ever heard.

[quantumst8]

Eh...

 

These types of issues could be somewhat avoided with better communication. I agree it's a woman's choice, but a man should find out the woman's stance on the subject before he sleeps with her. If she says ahead of time that she doesn't believe in abortion and then she gets pregnant, I don't think she should be allowed to change her mind after the fact. But if the guy never asks, then he doesn't have much room for complaint with whatever she decides.

[Moontiger]

You should also understand that "It's just a lump of cells" is your own viewpoint and not something everyone will hold, usually for various religious reasons. I'm not going to go further than that as these forums do not permit religious or political debate, but you should probably work to be more empathetic in that area.

 

Completely agree.

 

I happen to agree with you Reflective about the whole "lump of cells" thing but the fact is there are people out there (both men and women) who do not agree. Many believe that the soul is made at the moment of conception when just two cells are present.

 

I understand your frustration but I want to encourage you to try and see this from other points of view. It will help you understand where these men are coming from.

[Reflective]

Also agreed.

 

If I was in a relationship with someone and she got pregnant and wanted an abortion, and then treated me (the father) as though my opinion on the matter was invalid, we would no longer be together.

 

Reminds me of a guy I met in a therapy group once. His girlfriend had gotten pregnant and wanted an abortion. He didn't, and was willing to sacrifice everything (school, etc.) to raise the child. On his own, if necessary. Anyway, she got the abortion. He understood ultimately it was her choice, but she had treated him pretty much like the OP describes: as though his opinion didn't matter, etc. Probably one of the saddest stories I've ever heard.

it's not that your opinion doesn't matter. It's the fact that it ultimately isn't your decision.

 

Pregnancy is rough. men will never understand it. So again it confuses me entirely to why they think they have this idea that it will be a breeze. It's not. If a woman genuinely doesn't want to keep it, if she hears that you want to keep it and she doesn't keep it, why get upset? It's her body, she's the one making the most change she has to go through a lot

more. She has to risk her life, for what? Because a man wants a child? Why not adopt. Not trying to be rude but there are kids already out there that need a dad or a mother.

[Seraphim]

Men do have a say in it. It is their genetics and their child too.

[Reflective]

Completely agree.

 

I happen to agree with you Reflective about the whole "lump of cells" thing but the fact is there are people out there (both men and women) who do not agree. Many believe that the soul is made at the moment of conception when just two cells are present.

 

I understand your frustration but I want to encourage you to try and see this from other points of view. It will help you understand where these men are coming from.

I can't understand it. I'm trying to.

 

Trust me I used to be against abortion. But than I really thought about it and looked at the bigger picture.

Why bring something unwanted into the world?

Why bring something YOU KNOW you will NOT take responsibility for into the world. For what? So that, it can be societies problem? So that the child could grow up with a slew of psychological issues - wont get into it. -

 

Why?

[Reflective]

Men do have a say in it. It is their genetics and their child too.

you mean half of his chromosomes?

Women have to deal with more. It's a fact not fiction. They might have input but it's not their decision.

[quantumst8]

I can't understand it. I'm trying to.

 

Trust me I used to be against abortion. But than I really thought about it and looked at the bigger picture.

Why bring something unwanted into the world?

Why bring something YOU KNOW you will NOT take responsibility for into the world. For what? So that, it can be societies problem? So that the child could grow up with a slew of psychological issues - wont get into it. -

 

Why?

 

Well that's a completely different thread. In fact, I think you should start it as I'm sure it will lead to some interesting discussions.

[-John-]

These types of issues could be somewhat avoided with better communication. ... If she says ahead of time that she doesn't believe in abortion and then she gets pregnant, I don't think she should be allowed to change her mind after the fact. But if the guy never asks, then he doesn't have much room for complaint with whatever she decides.

 

Excellent point. In which case, my statement should say: if a woman I was getting to know indicated that my opinion was invalid in the event of her getting pregnant, we would never be together in the first place.

 

it's not that your opinion doesn't matter.

 

The title of your thread implies otherwise.

[Seraphim]

you mean half of his chromosomes?

Women have to deal with more. It's a fact not fiction. They might have input but it's not their decision.

 

Well being I have children, it is still my perspective a man does have input. My son is who he is because his father is his father. I believe men should be given a lot more input than some women give them.

[tinkerbellkj]

I am pro-choice 100%, and my husband is pretty much pro-life. It lead to some pretty interesting conversations and in the end we agreed to disagree. The one thing we BOTH agree on is that we both have an opinion and a say on any and ALL matters. I can't imagine saying, "oh it's my choice by law" and then expecting him to take a back seat and actually still WANTING to be with me. At the same time I can't imagine him taking all of the money we saved as a family and going to Vegas with his buddies, because well, he earned most of that money, so it's "his choice" without discussing it with me.

 

I am the mother to one and baking another. Neither would be here without their father.

[FathomFear]

If you would actually read my post again, you'll notice that I wasn't calling you immature. I said that you're young and that immaturity will be prominent because you're going to be largely hanging around with young people. Just about every thread you've posted on this forum goes back to that. Guys calling you names, guys saying that you're short, etc etc. Just about all of this goes back to the age group you're in.

[avman]

This is really a political discussion merely posted for debate. Thread closed.