My girlfriend went to a sex club

[giraffe1]

My girlfriend and I have been together for 6 years. We love each other very much and own a house together. Until the last few months, I was convinced she was the girl I wanted to marry. We have talked about marriage and children a lot and she is very keen on them.

 

We are both quite laid back and liberal in our relationship. We both go out with our own groups of friends, sometimes clubbing, and sometimes go out together, mixing groups of friends.

 

She has cheated on my once in the past - about 2 years in. Our relationship seemed to be going well but one night she came home and said she had kissed a stranger in a nightclub and gone back to his house. She said she was very drunk but they did not have sex. She was wracked with guilt, told me straight away and I believe her entirely. I know that she told me the truth here.

 

Recently, we have been on a few nights out together. Even when I'm there, if she's drunk, she always likes to be the centre of attention and clearly enjoys the attention of other men. This hurts to see. Whilst she's not dirty dancing with them, when she's drunk, she acts like a singleton.

 

We hardly see each other during the week because she works extremely long hours. But when she does have spare time, she prioritises doing things with her friends over doing things with me. I don't want to stop her from going out with her friends, but we rarely have time together alone apart from at bedtime. As a result, we rarely have sex.

 

She has just got back from a girly weekend to a European city with friends. As soon as she got home, she told me they had all been to a sex club - a nightclub but where some people are dressed in fetish gear and some (but not all) people are having open sex with strangers. She was saying this in a "isn't this funny" kind of way - she and her friends had gone there at the end of the night to see what it was like - but I felt very hurt. There's no suggestion she actually participated in anything (I know she'd feel really guilty and would tell me if she did). But it still feel very painful to me.

 

I enjoy going out with my friends and together with her. And everyone likes some attention from the opposite sex from time to time. But I don't seem to need it as much as her. I've been to a strip club before with friends as part of something similar to a batchelor party, but only early on in the relationship - and I think going for a night out in a place where strangers are having open sex is a step too far.

 

I'm generally very liberal in our relationship but the timing at which this has come has hit me hard. I can't imagine life apart from her but I feel hurt. Please help.

[OptomisticGirl]

I really don't see any difference in her going to a sex club and you going to a strip club. The sex may not be open in a strip club, but it happens behind close doors. No difference.

[giraffe1]

I went to a strip club when we had been together for just under a year as part of a sports club foreign tour. We stayed for about and hour and some of the guys had lapdances. I didn't because I was in a relationship.

 

What makes me feel awkward about the sex club is that it's all very overt. I know my girlfriend and her friends went into a special room where most people were having sex with other people. Watching other couples having sex is a big no-go for me in a relationship. If my friends had wanted me to do that, I'd have said 'no'.

 

This is also in the context that she likes to flirt and get lots of attention from guys on nights out in normal nightclubs. When I'm out clubbing with friends, I don't go looking for it with other women, i.e. dirty dancing etc. She acts like she's single even when I'm there with her. So thinking of her with just her friends, drunk and in a sex club is quite painful for me.

[OptomisticGirl]

Do you watch porn?

 

I can understand why it would make you feel uncomfortable and we are allowed our boundaries but you can't correlate going to a strip club early in your relationship with her going to this. It's a bit extreme to go to one of these but as I said, I see no difference in the two, one does sex in the open and the other doesn't.

 

It sounds like your girlfriend is a very sexual person. Noting wrong with that but you need to make a decision on whether you are really okay with how she's behaving.

[lalalollipops]

Strip clubs are normal for guys though. And there is a diff btwn going to one and going to a club where the sex is happening everywhere around you.

 

That, and the fact she already cheated on him before. Eh. I would suggest talking to her about it, and telling her you feel uncomfortable when she pushes the boundaries of your relationship. Tell her how it makes you feel and sort out some 'rules' so to speak. If this can't be changed, I would seriously be reevaluating the relationship.

[OptomisticGirl]

Strip clubs are normal for guys though. And there is a diff btwn going to one and going to a club where the sex is happening everywhere around you.

 

That, and the fact she already cheated on him before. Eh. I would suggest talking to her about it, and telling her you feel uncomfortable when she pushes the boundaries of your relationship. Tell her how it makes you feel and sort out some 'rules' so to speak. If this can't be changed, I would seriously be reevaluating the relationship.

 

I think it's going to be hard for him to insert boundaries into this relationship this far in to it though. It's been six years and she's cheated on him. No matter how you look at it, he's pretty much given her the all go to do whatever she feels because he took her back. She knows she can push the boundaries because he's taken her back before after she's pushed against those boundaries before. I have a feeling this is how she is and he's either a) got to live with it or b) leave.

[lanaa]

You are overreacting ,you are pushing her away only

[lanaa]

she seems to like to have fun and if you continue objecting she might leave you,there is a great chance....let her enjoy life,she doesnt cheat..she even told you this,its not infidelty

 

as someone said,you watch porn? thats the same

[giraffe1]

I don't think she pushes the boundaries because she knows she can get away with it. I know she'd never hurt me intentionally. But I think she does it because she's nostalgic about single life and likes the attention. She doesn't get that attention from me. I try, but every time I try to arrange a date/dinner/something fun to do alone, she's too busy with work or has other plans with friends. I'd like to do something spontaneous but seeing her flirt with other men dampens my willingness to do so and makes me feel low.

 

At the same time, she says she wants marriage, babies etc...

 

I have watched porn before. I know that she has too. I have watched it in the past normally when we've not been seeing each other for a long time due to her working long hours and we haven't had sex for a long time. When we do see each other lots, especially in the holidays, we have sex regularly and I don't feel any need to watch it.

[giraffe1]

I know what you mean about porn. When I have watched it in the past, I feel terrible afterwards. Terrible not because of watching it, but because it makes me think about the sex and time together that is lacking from our relationship. Maybe it's just me, but I don't think that watching porn in that sort of context is the same as going to a sex club. I know she's watched porn in the past and, whilst it wasn't nice to find out, it never made me think about whether we should stay together or not. But actually watching people having sex in a club, even being invited to join in and most likely being propositioned by lots of naked guys, for me, feels very close to actually cheating.

[giraffe1]

she seems to like to have fun and if you continue objecting she might leave you,there is a great chance....let her enjoy life,she doesnt cheat..she even told you this,its not infidelty

 

as someone said,you watch porn? thats the same

 

It may be pushing her away. But it's not a case of me continuing to object. I've only recently started to object. I was always fine with her going out clubbing with her friends as I did with mine. But now that I've seen first-hand how much she craves the attention of other men even when I'm there, after 6 years together, I'm starting to object...

 

This, combined with things like her introducing me as a 'friend' to some people, not saying 'I love you' on the telephone when she's around certain people, makes me feel she doesn't value me enough as a boyfriend.

[Fudgie]

This, combined with things like her introducing me as a 'friend' to some people, not saying 'I love you' on the telephone when she's around certain people, makes me feel she doesn't value me enough as a boyfriend.

 

I find this totally unacceptable and disrespectful.

[Crazyaboutdogs]

I am not sure why you are still with this woman...and I wouldn't trust her at all. She went home with another guy and claims she didn't have sex...I don't buy it. She openly flirts with other men in front of you and blows you off when you want to be with her and be romantic with her. She goes to a club where sex is part of the evening's entertainment. Quite frankly I think you are trusting a woman who is making it very clear that she CAN'T be trusted. You have chosen the bad girl just like many women choose bad boys and hope their love will change the bad boy into a good boy. You are hoping your love will change the bad girl into the good girl. Nope, she will never be a good girl...she is completely disrespectful to you and you keep saying you are hurt but you trust her. If this is a woman you want to marry then be prepared for a lifetime with someone who will never really be true to you.

[giraffe1]

I am picking up on things that are out of the norm though. Most of the time, we treat each other in a very warm and loving way. We are very close in terms of physical contact, hugging and kissing, but there is very little time for sex given her long working hours when she comes home exhausted. I don't see her out seeking the attention of other men in clubs ALL the time. It tends to be when she's a bit more drunk. Also, she only introduced me as a friend a few times to people we were meeting briefly. But it felt like she wasn't proud to have me as her boyfriend.

 

I know it may sound like I'm now making excuses for her. But we've been together for a long time and there has also been a lot of love in our relationship. Very unsure of what to do.

[OptomisticGirl]

Sometimes love is just not enough, sadly.

 

I don't see her going any different than you going to a strip club. Women's jobs in strip clubs is to get e most money out of guys - this happens by suggesting lap dances and shaking their boobs in your face. You might not have accepted lap dances, but you were still IN in an establishment were the concept is sexual. Dame applies to her. She went in but let's assume, she didn't say yes to any suggestions of sleeping with guys. It might make your skin crawl but I'm sure the same thing happened in the strip club with you.

 

Other then that, she is being highly disrespectful and it sounds like this relationship is the last thing she wants. I'm getting married next month and I in no way miss the single life.

[In the Dark]

Regardless liberal couple or not, her behavior states she is not over being single and I doubt her behavior will change as her friends seem to be the same way regardless of them being single or not.

[DN]

i think you are focusing too much on the sex club and other people focusing too much on you going to the strip club. This is only relevant because it has brought to the fore things that are really more important - i.e.

She enjoys the attention of other men. This hurts to see. Whilst she's not dirty dancing with them, when she's drunk, she acts like a singleton.

 

We hardly see each other during the week because she works extremely long hours. But when she does have spare time, she prioritises doing things with her friends over doing things with me. I don't want to stop her from going out with her friends, but we rarely have time together alone apart from at bedtime. As a result, we rarely have sex.

She dirty dances with other men, acts as if she is single when out with her girlfriends, prioritizes going out with them rather than being with you and you rarely have sex.

 

This isn't a healthy relationship.

[FathomFear]

I really don't see any difference in her going to a sex club and you going to a strip club. The sex may not be open in a strip club, but it happens behind close doors. No difference.

 

To be fair, most strip clubs don't engage in prostitution. You might get that impression while watching TV as that is how strip clubs tend to be represented in dramas and such, but in reality it's different. There are huge financial and legal risks if a strip club were to be busted for prostitution. Heck, there would be huge risks even if a strip club tried to encourage a stripper down that path.

 

I think the club element is most irrelevant though. You can go to any kind of club as a voyeur and not participate. I would be most upset that she doesn't seem that engaged in the relationship and flirts with everyone else right in front of you. It sounds like in general that you're not a good match.

[Imthatguy]

i think you are focusing too much on the sex club and other people focusing too much on you going to the strip club. This is only relevant because it has brought to the fore things that are really more important - i.e.

She dirty dances with other men, acts as if she is single when out with her girlfriends, prioritizes going out with them rather than being with you and you rarely have sex.

 

This isn't a healthy relationship.

 

I think he said she didn't dirty dance he said "whilst she's not dirty dancing with them" aka she's not.

 

I still agree with you though on this isn't a healthy relationship. Especially with the early on cheating. Personally I could never forgive someone for cheating on me, or at least I could never trust them again that's for certain. And once the trust is gone the relationship goes as well..

[WindowTo]

I agree that you need to drop the sex club thing. It sounds like she went in more as an amused observer than anything and you are holding a huge double standard with you having gone to a strip club. If you were not officially together when you went then that would be ok, but it doesn't sound that way. On the other hand, her behavior of calling you her friend and having cheated on you are pretty bad. If a girl kisses and goes home with a guy, it sounds more likely that the guy didn't fully seduce her to get her in bed, but she may very well have liked him to have the right moves at the time. In my book, if something like that happens there is no coming back from it because it speaks volumes about their nature, their attraction to you, their boundaries, and their level of respect for you and themselves. There are plenty of women out there who want you to commit to them but absolutely love male attention and see nothing hurtful in pursuing it while they are in a relationship. Often they rationalize such behavior because while sorts of flirting often give plausable deniability, it is blaringly obvious to anyone who is not brain dead. My advice: don't focus on the sex club, don't bring it up. Sit down and think about all of these other factors that make up your feelings on the matter and the implications. Then try and describe the way you feel to her before you try making any demands. Making demands is not as effective as drumming up empathy, understanding, and good communication.

[OptomisticGirl]

I think he said she didn't dirty dance he said "whilst she's not dirty dancing with them" aka she's not.

 

I still agree with you though on this isn't a healthy relationship. Especially with the early on cheating. Personally I could never forgive someone for cheating on me, or at least I could never trust them again that's for certain. And once the trust is gone the relationship goes as well..

 

I agree the club thing is irrelevant, but the OP seems bent on ignoring other facets - the really bad facets - of his relationship and concentrating on her doing this. Most strip clubs don't offer prostitution but it's the fact that they ARE there to offer you some kind of sexualized thing, be it rubbing their boobs in your face or a lap dance. You can obviously say no as the OP did as I"m sure you can so no in the club his girlfriend went to. Set that aside, the real problem lies in her wanting to be single but being with him. As long as he's hooked on the 'she went to this club' thing, he won't ever see the real problem.

[giraffe1]

I realise that the underlying problem is that she acts like a singleton. And that that probably suggests that, whilst she likes the security and familiarity of being in a relationship, she can't let go of the excitement of receiving male attention from outside the relationship.

 

The reason I focussed on the sex club is because that was the latest thing she did that spelled out 'single' for me - and the thought of it gave me the creeps. I still think there are some distinctions between her visiting a sex club recently and me visiting a strip club early on in the relationship. Firstly, naked women paid to dance on poles and platforms for the most part doesn't, to me, seem as close to infidelity as going to a place to watch lots of people having penetrative sex with strangers for fun. It seems pretty raw. To me, the strip club seemed pretty fake (perhaps I just went to a rather tame one). Secondly, my girlfriend knows, I think, that I'm not a big flirt on nights out. She is, so imagining how she felt in the sex club makes me even more uncomfortable.

 

It seems like I'm in the minority here though.

[WindowTo]

I realise that the underlying problem is that she acts like a singleton. And that that probably suggests that, whilst she likes the security and familiarity of being in a relationship, she can't let go of the excitement of receiving male attention from outside the relationship.

 

This is a good, distilled, not overly analytical view of the situation. Hold on to this sentence in case you need to explain yourself later. Just remember that you will probably receive either the "Im not doing anything wrong" defense or the less subtle: tries to put you first but her heart is really still into getting male attention so the relationship fails move/she torpedoes it by distancing herself until you boil over with frustration.

 

As for the strip club thing, I get what you are saying, the spirit of the two things seem uneven because of the difference in intentions of you two, and they may well be. However, your assessments of the strip club vs sex club are entirely arbitrary. To many the difference between watching people have sex and watching one person rub their privates on eachother is nil as far as the impact it can have on a relationship.

[capilot]

I don't think the sex club is the problem here (unless she lied about not participating).

 

... one night she came home and said she had kissed a stranger in a nightclub and gone back to his house.... when she does have spare time, she prioritises doing things with her friends over doing things with me...

 

But these are HUGE red flags.

 

This, combined with things like her introducing me as a 'friend' to some people, not saying 'I love you' on the telephone when she's around certain people, makes me feel she doesn't value me enough as a boyfriend.

I find this totally unacceptable and disrespectful.

 

As is this. I agree with Fudgie.

 

This girl is NOT ready to settle down. You're the guy who provides a "home base" for her to return to after partying. Does she even pay rent?

[giraffe1]

Thank you for the replies. They are helping me to think things through. She was back from holiday for the last two nights and she knew something was wrong (I didn't feel I should hug her as we slept and was much quieter than usual). Now she is away until the end of the week with some friends on holiday and I need to use the time to think.

 

Is there any way to fix this? We've been together since we were 19 and I swore to myself I'd do everything I could to try and work things out if they ever went wrong. I don't like giving up. Perhaps if I moved into my brother's home (5 minutes down the road) and we started things again, slowly? Went for dates and took our time before spending nights together again? Maybe it would make us realise whether we did actually want to be together for each other's company and not just for the security of having a partner and a housemate?