Infidelity -- self-deception, lack of self-control or what?

[Celadon]

Seems to me that no one really intends to cheat on his/her significant other, but even so, some people don't manage to stop themselves from cheating. So do you think that the reason people DO cheat is because of they are deceiving themselves as they slip into the affair? Or do they lack self-control?

 

When I was in my 20s, I allowed myself to have a crush on a guy while I was dating someone else (who was long distance but that's beside the point). And I've had crushes on other men when *I* was single but they were not available. So I'm not speaking from a viewpoint of judgment. (I've never had an emotional OR physical affair, though.)

 

I'm a big believer in the fact that people can keep themselves out of affairs, so I'm wondering why some don't, can't or won't. I think it has to do with self-deception ("It's only drinks..." "It's because my wife won't pay attention to me..." "We're just friends, and I can control myself") and somehow justifying their actions to themselves.

 

I guess my other question is: If you think it's a lack of self-control or a matter of self-deception, what can people do to KEEP themselves from having an affair. I meet people who think they "just won't" cheat but obviously ... some people do!

[rosephase]

I cheated in the past and then I realized that I simply didn't want to be monogamous. One of the hardest parts (and most necessary parts) in ethical non-monogamy is being honest with yourself and your partners about your intentions.

 

Culturally we tend to shy away from admitting when we like someone (relationship or not) because we become more vulnerable when we admit our attraction. Once you admit you want something/someone you face rejection. I think we build very complex ways around that idea of rejection by hiding what we want from ourselves and others. Being honest with yourself isn't simple and then being honest with others can be even more complex (and impossible if you can't be honest with yourself) Not that I think that is what is happening with _all_ people who cheat there are a lot of different reasons but I think self deception is a way that people "who would never cheat" end up in situations way over the line.

[blackhawks1287]

It a matter of all the above. There is something that the cheaters are lacking not only with the relationship, but within themselves. They need to get it outside of the relationship because they are not getting it that way.

 

That is my perspective.

 

They justify it based on those reasons, and I do not think they really ever feel the incredible self guilt for their actions. People are inherently selfish and seek out ways to get what they want, whether they are doing it consciously or subconsciously. So as they do these things they don't think it is necessarily bad unless there are outside forces that make them feel that way ya know?

 

If that makes any sense at all....

[Glowguy]

I think the self deception is a consequence or symptom of lack of self control. The solution is pretty simple. Any interaction with the potential crush should be stifled and their efforts should not be encouraged or reciprocated. Basically it all comes down to discipline and enforcing boundaries.

[browney2]

Speaking from the viewpoint of someone who has been approached by several married men and men in relationships I have never met a man who "accidentally" approached me. It takes effort! Married men are the most confident men because there are no risks, It does not matter to them if they strike out with you cause they're going home to their wives either way. They are the most difficult to get rid of. I know wives would like to think that single women seduce their poor defenseless husbands or that they "don't know how this happened" but most of the time that is just NOT TRUE. Monogamy is hard work but if you don't have the will power then forget about it. It does not help you to be strong to hear things like "I couldn't help it" because you can. Its not an accident. It does not matter that you are unhappy ... that's no excuse to screw over the rest of us. Having a crush on someone when you are in a relationship is passive and may even be natural. Forming a relationship with that person is something you CAN help.

 

I don't think people can't be faithful its that they won't. Societal rules make it seem ok. We've indulged people in the "I couldn't help it" mentality and that is why they can't.

[browney2]

... and saying that there was "something missing in my relationship" is just an attempt to deflect blame because the real thing missing from the relationship is the cheating partner. Its all apart of the attempt to make your problems someone else's fault and it cannot help you. You have to accept responsibility for your actions! ............. I'm really tired of married men if you can't tell

[blackhawks1287]

I don't think people can't be faithful its that they won't. Societal rules make it seem ok. We've indulged people in the "I couldn't help it" mentality and that is why they can't.

 

Not only society, but the vast amount of people that also share that mentality to let temptation eat at you...This statement fueled me lol...It is true, it is not that they couldn't help it...it is because they did not want to...they wanted to cheat and that makes them even worse. I do not care what you are lacking within yourself or the relationship. When you cheat while lying to your partner..married or not..you are weak in a very small sense, because you could be the most successful person. You are weak because you need the desire, the partner to fall back on, the thrill, the anything you gain out of it.

[Moontiger]

Overall, I think is about maturity and the mentality a person has about relationships. Some people just never reach the maturity level that is needed to make a long-term relationship work.

[Calvin68]

I intended to cheat in my first marriage. After years of complaining about not getting sex, I finally plotted out how I was going to have sex outside of my marriage. It wasn't a lack of self control and there was no self deception. I had an unmet need and my wife was refusing to meet it. So I took matters into my own hand and satisfied my need.

[RadicalDreamer]

Okay, I'll bite. Whether it's "okay" to cheat, and whether someone has a "right" to consider themselves unhappy are TWO SEPARATE ISSUES. Interestingly enough, cheaters and those who are cheated on are often equally prone to confusing the two.

 

Cheating is never okay. Ever. There are no circumstances that can make it so. It involves outright lies and betrayal of trust. It involves someone being willing to hurt someone else. As someone who cheated and knows what they did is inexcusable, I find any attempt to justify infidelity crass and irresponsible.

 

Equally crass is the notion that everyone who is unhappy in a relationship is just unwilling to work at it. As someone who banged their head against a wall in marriage, I call absolute bull on this. Yes, sometimes people are lazy and just don't want to work at it. And other times, they work at it for years and get little in return.

 

Sometimes they do the right thing and lay down a serious ultimatum to leave if things don't improve. Sometimes they deceive themselves into thinking that the 50% they get is all they deserve for the 100% they give. And sometimes, they do the absolute wrong thing and cheat.

 

The problem is, society seems to label people who are honest and leave due to unhappiness with the same sort of contempt that they do for cheaters. People as a whole seem to be just a little too comfortable assuming that everyone else just needs to eat bitter and deal with it.

[reidqa]

Radical,

 

Also never forget the lowering of standards as in my story.

 

There was no courtship by ex or OM.

 

Yet the standards that night was animal driven.

 

If I would have stayed no doubt tradegy would have been the end game.

[Celadon]

Does anyone think there's something cheaters could have done beforehand to stop themselves from crossing the line? (Aside from the intentional cheater, I mean....)

 

Not to sound completely simplistic, but would it have helped to make a commitment to oneself early on that -- should you be in such and such situation, or start feeling feelings for someone other than your significant other -- that you would immediately take steps to get out of the situation, to stop communicating with the person or decrease contact? To be devil's advocate, why WOULDN'T that work?

[redswim30]

I think there are plethora of reasons, and it is unfair to shoebox every circumstance into simplified categories. No one in their life has NEVER hurt someone, so I think it very unfair to say that "if you hurt someone because you cheated you are obviously a "this" or a "that". I'm not saying that cheating is right, just that people who cheat aren't necessarily "out to hurt" someone. Many people who have cheated will say " I never thought I would do that". People are human, people have lapses in judgement. And many people if placed in a circumstance in which they feel "trapped" will lash out in unexpected ways. My personal opinion is still that cheating is merely a symptom of a larger problem that either hasn't been identified or has been left unresolved.

[redswim30]

Not to sound completely simplistic, but would it have helped to make a commitment to oneself early on that -- should you be in such and such situation, or start feeling feelings for someone other than your significant other -- that you would immediately take steps to get out of the situation, to stop communicating with the person or decrease contact? To be devil's advocate, why WOULDN'T that work?

 

Just to play devil's advocate back-

What if you fell in love ? You might stop communicating, but that doesn't mean your feelings would go away. - This is STILL lying to your SO.

OR What if your SO was ignoring you when you told them, "I want to work on things. I am starting to have feelings for someone else." but they didn't care or didn't attempt to try with you cause they were just assuming you'd never leave them ?

[Glowguy]

My personal opinion is still that cheating is merely a symptom of a larger problem that either hasn't been identified or has been left unresolved.

 

I really really disagree with that reasoning and it's touted here all the time. I think it's deflection and justification. I can find plenty of examples on this site where that's not the case at all. Some people are just selfish and do not care who they trample on.

[RadicalDreamer]

I really really disagree with that reasoning and it's touted here all the time. I think it's deflection and justification.

A reason and a moral justification are not the same thing. Not every action has a moral justification, but almost every action has an underlying cause. In this case, the reasoning may be something someone doesn't find in a relationship. Cheating is the wrong way to go about it, but simply dismissing every person who cheats as an uncaring sociopath (I don't think you've done this, but many people here have) is not only turning a blind eye to the issue, it's vastly overestimating the sociopath population.

I can find plenty of examples on this site where that's not the case at all. Some people are just selfish and do not care who they trample on.

Absolutely. There are people who just do it for kicks and screw everyone else. But not all cheaters are those kind of people, and not all of those kind of people are cheaters. Many of them find more socially acceptable methods of breaking others' hearts.

[Glowguy]

I certainly don't believe that all cheaters are sociopaths, but I do believe they are 100% wrong and if they are a mature adult who has been in several close relationships then they have full knowledge of the hurt and damage they can potentially cause their partner by cheating on them. In most cases I think the reason has more to do with self control than problems in the relationship. I know that's not always the case and I certainly understand it a little better in certain extreme cases (youth, revenge, abuse, neglect, etc...). In those cases then yes, it may be a symptom.

 

But, A broad sweeping statement that cheating is symptom of a larger problem is really meant to absolve the cheater and I suspect that most people who use that kind of reasoning are cheaters themselves. In many cases cheating is the problem and the offending party is 100% accountable for that.

[redswim30]

But, A broad sweeping statement that cheating is symptom of a larger problem is really meant to absolve the cheater and I suspect that most people who use that kind of reasoning are cheaters themselves. In many cases cheating is the problem and the offending party is 100% accountable for that.

 

Glowguy, it is just my opinion as I stated. You are free to disagree. But let me point out from your own broad sweeping statement -I am not a cheater nor have I ever cheated on any partner I've ever had. In fact, my ex-husband cheated on me. I don't think cheating is right, my opinion is not meant to absolve cheating just to express my opinion that many times cheating is a cause and effect situation. Not that it is right or justified. I do believe people are accountable for their decision to cheat. I just don't believe in condemning someone for all eternity for cheating. And I also believe that if someone was genuinely in love and felt great about their relationship, they would not feel the desire to cheat in the first place. That there is some seed of something wrong in the relationship, whether it be accurate, perceived or inaccurate. Of course, there are exceptions. I just don't believe that every person who cheats is a hate-filled moral-free monster who is hell-bent on harming others. Incidentally, I don't feel that way about my ex. I don't believe he went out and thought, " Gee, how can I hurt my wife to the fullest degree today?" But he did hurt me, badly. He did take responsability for his cheating, he was sorry. But there was a LOT wrong in our relationship that caused it to happen. Issues that weren't addressed, etc. I own up to that. For me to sit here and say, " He was just an evil person who didn't care" would not only be lazy and arrogant of me, it would be inaccurate. Do I think it's my fault he cheated- No, of course not. And of course I think it was a poor decision on his part. But do I believe there was a lot wrong in our relationship that caused him to cheat ? Yes. There is a difference between thinking cheating is morally wrong and unacceptable (which I do) versus thinking about what caused it to happen. Sometimes there is no underlying reason, but IMVHO usually there is. (even if just one person feels that way)

[lonelyjo]

I can relate to the statement that the biggest thing missing in the cheater's relationship is themselves.

It's 100% wrong - but also very misguided, to escape problems by looking to anyone else.

I think that was the root problem in my marriage too. We got married quite young, and I saw it as an escape from an unhappy childhood - way back then, I had set myself up. I tried too hard to please and in the end felt lonely and lost.

After having an affair, it will only be harder to make my way in the world.

[Glowguy]

I don't believe he went out and thought, " Gee, how can I hurt my wife to the fullest degree today?" But he did hurt me, badly. He did take responsability for his cheating, he was sorry. But there was a LOT wrong in our relationship that caused it to happen. Issues that weren't addressed

 

Redswim, I know you are just expressing your opinion as am I. Anyway, I didn't mean to accuse you of cheating so I'm sorry if it came accross that way. I think cheating is primarily a character flaw and that's where I disagree. Someone who is disposed to cheat when times get tough (as they do in most relationships) is probably prone to cheat when times are good. IMO it usually has very little to do with the circumstances of the relationship.

[Celadon]

Just to play devil's advocate back-

What if you fell in love ? You might stop communicating, but that doesn't mean your feelings would go away. - This is STILL lying to your SO.

OR What if your SO was ignoring you when you told them, "I want to work on things. I am starting to have feelings for someone else." but they didn't care or didn't attempt to try with you cause they were just assuming you'd never leave them ?

My opinion is that you can fall in love with people throughout your life. Unless you believe in a "soulmate" and that you must be with this one and only one person, then falling in love does not determine your actions. I actually do think your feelings would go away, especially if you were careful not to allow them to deepen in the first place. Much of falling in love seems to be infatuation at first anyway. There's no reality check, no dirty dishes to clean, no financial decisions to make jointly, no seven-year-itch to deal with.

 

If there are problems in the relationship, bringing in another person by way of having an affair really doesn't do anything to solve the problems. It gives one person an escape, but that effectively is a decision by that person to end the relationship by cheating. I think it's more mature to decide to end your relationship if there are irreconcilable differences -- based ONLY on your relationship. Not because you have a potentially better option.

 

It's the hugest risk to leave a relationship without the security of having another one lined up, of course. But at least then you'll have the knowledge that you did everything you could have, and you made a clean break, and you ended it because it was OVER.

 

Also, my point about "what can you to do prevent you from cheating" is about preparation -- not moral failure. I agree that unhappiness in the relationship can lead people to want to cheat. But when I hear people say they had a lapse in judgment, I think what they really had was a lack of preparation for the time when they would be tempted to cheat. I'd bet that a lot of people have faced situations in which they COULD have cheated. But what stopped them? Not so much good judgment but a recognition of what was happening and the determination to take immediate action.

 

It's like being prepared for anything dangerous. You recognize the signs (smoke when there's a fire) and you take immediate action (get the heck outta there). I just don't understand why anyone would say, "Oops, the affair just happened," unless they are completely lacking in self-awareness.

[RadicalDreamer]

I actually do think your feelings would go away, especially if you were careful not to allow them to deepen in the first place.

Yes, one has a moral responsibility to push those to the side when they're already in a relationship, and they're faced with choice.

 

Suppressing feelings requires effort, work, exertion. On the one hand if they "allow" (stop working) something starts growing. On the other hand, to make their other relationship grow, they may have to expend effort. This is particularly difficult when that effort does not bear fruit. Given that choice, some people find themselves folding and going down the path of non-resistance. Obviously the wrong way, but that ground is well-trodden by now.

Much of falling in love seems to be infatuation at first anyway. There's no reality check, no dirty dishes to clean, no financial decisions to make jointly, no seven-year-itch to deal with.

I ran into this when our marriage counselor brought it up, and started talking about looking for sparks, passion, escaping from the day-to-day, the seven-year-itch etc. It took some time for her to realize we were on completely different pages. I realize that this describes many affairs, but doesn't begin to scratch the surface of motivations and factors that can lead to someone making the decidedly wrong choice. Go far enough on all those roads, though and you'll find they all lead to Rome.

If there are problems in the relationship, bringing in another person by way of having an affair really doesn't do anything to solve the problems. It gives one person an escape, but that effectively is a decision by that person to end the relationship by cheating. I think it's more mature to decide to end your relationship if there are irreconcilable differences -- based ONLY on your relationship. Not because you have a potentially better option.

Exactly. By turning to someone else to meet unmet needs, one lacks the motivation to correct the issue in their primary relationship. To do things the right way, you have to be able to step back without falling into the arms of someone else.

 

At the same time, it's hard to see undermining flaws in a failing relationship while you're still personally invested in it. Kind of like a gambling addiction. You know the last 1,122 times you pulled the handle of that slot machine, nothing came out. But you remember there was this one time when you got $50, so you keep trying, convinced that the next time you'll win enough to at least make up for the cost of the last 1,123 pulls.

It's like being prepared for anything dangerous. You recognize the signs (smoke when there's a fire) and you take immediate action (get the heck outta there). I just don't understand why anyone would say, "Oops, the affair just happened," unless they are completely lacking in self-awareness.

I agree. Nothing "just happens." For some it's a split-second wrong decision. A match into gasoline. But sometimes, the smoke builds slowly, and you know it's there, but you convince yourself the fire is too small to be worth the effort of putting it out. But it all leads to the same thing- not a lack of control, but the conscious yielding thereof.

 

"Oops, it just happened," is self-deception. "How did I get here?" is an honest way of trying figure out where you went wrong. There are those who would say "Oh, you know exactly how you got there, you tramp!" They are quick to forget their own "Oops" moments in life. Some people have a moral blind-spot that activates whenever they look in the mirror.

 

Many mistakes and wrongdoings in life require a conscious decision, a temporary suspending of consequence--even those made by perfectly faithful, monogamous people. When it comes to "seeing warning signs and fleeing," cheating is no different. It's no more or less preventable.

[blackhawks1287]

 

It's the hugest risk to leave a relationship without the security of having another one lined up, of course. But at least then you'll have the knowledge that you did everything you could have, and you made a clean break, and you ended it because it was OVER.

 

This is the primary fault in all people that leave a relationship....well I can end this because I have this guy on the side. How did you get that guy on the side? You set him up emotionally...emotionally cheating your partner out of fixing the relationship or ending it mutually due to failure to meet each others or another persons needs.

 

That is wrong on so many levels.

[RadicalDreamer]

I hate to necro-post, but I wanted to add something to the factors described above.

 

Because of the sensitive nature of the subject, I will reiterate that this does not justify cheating. It's always wrong, but there is an attempt on this board to understand the reasoning behind it. Cheating does stem from selfishness, always. However, that selfishness takes many forms and turns. Sometimes it manifests as a disregard for the feelings of others. Sometimes, it is as mentioned above- fear of leaving without someone lined up waiting in the wings. But I think there's also an element of wanting to avoid causing the immediate emotional wreckage caused by an honest break up.

 

This may play into self-deception. A cheater may think that they'll cause all sorts of horrendous emotional damage, when in fact their Significant Other may be a decent, understanding, emotionally mature sort who would at least appreciate the honesty. Perhaps they themselves are insecure or have abandonment issues and may project this upon their partner. This could be due to not understanding their partner, genuine self-deception, or a combination of the two. Either way, the cheater may fabricate this as a justification to avoid dealing with the break-up.

 

But at the same time, their partner may be the sort for whom the consequences of cheating and an honest split are almost exactly the same. Look at the "Healing After Break Up or Divorce" board. It's replete with anguished, heartbroken, angry responses to both cheating, and honest, straightforward breakups. Despite the circumstances, they are often indistinguishable from one another. When the response to confronting your partner now, or cheating on your partner and being caught later is going to be "HOW COULD YOU DO THIS TO ME??? I HATE YOU I HATE YOU I'M CUTTING ALL CONTACT!! NC NC NC!! OUT OF MY LIFE, YOU HORRIBLE DEMON!!!" either way, it's actually pretty easy to see why some would opt to simply deal with it later and shove it to the side.

 

Does that make it right to cheat? No. Even if one's partner is mentally unstable or emotionally unable to deal with a straightforward split, a person still has the obligation to be honest. One lie leads to another, and when you live part of your life incognito, it's easy for the rest to slip away and to lose sight of who you really are. I'll attest to that with my own terrible experience cheating. At the same time, many people claim to want the truth, but with the unspoken expectation that the truth be convenient. It goes like this:

 

"I just want you to be honest." "[insert shocking honesty here.]" "OH MY GOD, HOW COULD YOU???"

 

I'm not trying to suggest that a person doesn't have the right to react emotionally at hearing a painful truth, such as "I don't love you anymore, and I'm not happy." I am saying that if your partner can't trust you to temper that reaction with rational thought, they're less likely to give it to you. When honesty and trust are compromised in a relationship, many terrible things, not just cheating, can come from this. We have a responsibility to act in a reasonable and compassionate manner when someone takes the time to be honest with us, no matter how painful that truth may be.

 

What I'm trying to say is that humans--even some cheaters--are sympathetic creatures by nature. When we hurt others, we hurt ourselves. In their heart of hearts, a cheater knows they are hurting their partner just as much, or more, by cheating as they would by breaking. But cheating appeals to the very human tendency to procrastinate, and to delay the inevitable. To simply make it tomorrow's problem. The best cure for this to break the cycle, is to make honesty a priority and live openly.

[ED82]

There is nothing in my mind that would ever justify cheating, I have been cheated on in the past as a younger man and know full well the damage it can cause to the person who is being cheated on.

 

I am now in a relationship with a woman who admitted to me that she cheated on her past long term relationship (process of being divorced) before they were married and did at one point try and justify it with the actions of her soon to be ex husband, she felt alone, lied to, and afraid... I did tell her that either you can cheat or you can not its either in you or its not. She fully agreed and her opinion went from blaming him to blaming herself calling herself some really bad names in the process, it seems her true believe of the situation which she repressed came to the surface.

 

Now I believe people have the capacity to change if they want and she did not cheat (or said she did not) for the time married with this guy who was abusive towards her on a daily basis. Her guilt it seems, made her stay with him as she truly believed deep down that it was her payment for the infidelity.

 

Once she dropped this bomb shell on me about the infidelity (I am the only person that knows or she has told about this) alarm bells started ringing in my head, I demanded to know every detail about the situation everything up until the act.

 

It went something like this she was in a relationship with a man (if you could call him that... long story) that lied to her constantly who was taking drugs and these were affecting him in bad ways (he introduced her to drugs) she felt alone and worthless. Then comes along 'mr bravado' a handsome man that everyone seemed to want and he knew the situation and how bad she was feeling, he gave her a shoulder to cry on and an ear to listen. Complements she was starving for and affection she dreamed off, he did this over the space of a few weeks until he found his opportune moment he was at a party with her, and decided to make a move this was just shortly after she had a massive argument with her now ex husband(mr bravado knew this).

 

She was at her lowest point and drink was involved not that she blames the drink she admitted to wanting it even if it was for the wrong reasons. The first time it happened they did not finish and he continued to ply her with drink (she should have said no I understand this but she was angry and upset still not a justification but I understand it). Until she was not able to walk straight and offered to walk her home as a friendly gesture in front of everyone. He then proceeded to finish the act now she will not agree with me that the second time was rape, but she did say she did not really want it as the guilt was already setting in but allowed it to happen regardless (because of what happened earlier she said yes once and thought this was consent enough... silly girl). I will never understand her thought process behind this but I have accepted it happened and it was in the past. I have asked her if she would stop speaking to this man as they are still friends to keep up appearances for reasons I am not going to talk about here, she has accepted it and is doing what I requested.

 

After the act she regretted it to the point that she stayed in a relationship (and married) in which she was strangled, emotionally ripped apart, verbally assaulted to name some things. She believes this was her punishment for her infidelity. When she told me about the infidelity she seen how much it hurt me and actually told me I could hit her if it would make me feel better (my heart sank) and she actually ment it, she still kills herself inside about it daily. She does not believe she deserves me and I have told her she does and this is a new page in her life and we will make a happy life together, but she is also aware that if she even kissed another man and I found out it would be over and she would never see me again.

 

So what do I believe causes infidelity, its a hard one to answer... Maturity, low moral standards, lack of self respect, low self esteem, unhappiness, loneliness, looking for control, hate, situation, and never forget that sometimes men or women will tell you just what you need to hear to get what they want. I am not saying this justifies the act on the behalf of the person committing the infidelity as its wrong, but at that time of heightened emotion you will use anything to justify what you are doing and sometimes do things you would not normally do.

 

Some people are just emotionally smarter than others they understand the consequences of what they are doing without the need to do it first, others only realise its wrong after the act and lastly some just do not care.