There is a certain subsection of the population that will never find a partner

[Circe]

I honestly see a pattern of some men trying to lower females self confidence/worth so they can get better chances with women. Oh well, we don't have to listen to them really.

 

I know a guy who does that.. It's dispicable and I imagine a complete turn off for the kind of women he actually wants to attract.

[newwave]

I know a guy who does that.. It's dispicable and I imagine a complete turn off for the kind of women he actually wants to attract.

 

I once went out with a guy from an online site who tried to give me "constructive" advice. Needless to say that was the first and last date. I don't need a guy to tell me how I should change my appearance or anything in my life to please him.

[Circe]

Absolutely. If he's doing it because he thinks it's appropriate to tell you what he thinks is "wrong" with you, the first time he meets you, there's something wrong there. If he's doing it to get your self-esteem down then there is something very, very, very, very wrong there. Real men don't do that.

[dr_styles]

It wasn't until I was around 24 that I started getting down. And that was because I realized that the life I wanted, the marriage, the kids, the one soulmate that would make my life heaven, wasn't there and possibly would never exist for me. And that is why I sank down into depression.

 

Heaps of people me included have fallen victim to that; where we plod along all those years up till then thinking "I work hard, stay clean, stay friendly; she'll be right" only to realise it doesn't work that way. Yes it is a hard pill to swallow because suddenly all these goals you had in mind are actually at risk and this is where people spilling out clichés more just creates more resentment imo.

 

You're a realistic guy, something I can appreciate, then stick to things which are realistic, things you actually believe yourself. Think about it, "Do and girls will be naturally be attracted to you", well to me that sounds bloody familiar to "Do work hard and girls will be naturally attracted to you". So do those things in your list, and do them because they are what's making you unhappy, not because of the promise of girls. Don't even think of that, because that is leading you back to the "I've done all this and I'm still alone" vibe.

 

You need get into the position of "I'm giving it my best day-to-day" rather than "I've done my best and it's still not good enough". The latter is essentially giving up, the former is actually realistically believable even if it has no guarantees. I hate wishy-washy vague advice myself, so in practice this means doing the things in your list.

[The Wire]

Yeah, you really just need to plod along, no sense getting down about it because it's not going to help the situation. Keep on truckin' and just hope for the best, if things don't work out and life deals you a cruel hand at least you can say you gave it your all, life's one big coin flip really.

[bulletproof]

I disagree, life does suck. Good people die, bad people live, bad things happen, good people end up lonely and bad people end up in relationships, etc.

 

Being realistic is NOT being negative. Because life is not all happiness and roses.

 

Good people live also, and good things happen. Your thinking is so extreme. There are shades of grey in life, not just good and bad, evil and not evil. If you were truly "realistic" as you like to say, you'd actually feel quite neutral towards life, because for every bad thing you can think of there is likely a good thing happening as well. But you are programmed to see only the negative.

 

And honestly, if you are that convinced that the world is such a terrible place, then get out and change it.

[LightbulbSun]

Good people live also, and good things happen. Your thinking is so extreme. There are shades of grey in life, not just good and bad, evil and not evil. If you were truly "realistic" as you like to say, you'd actually feel quite neutral towards life, because for every bad thing you can think of there is likely a good thing happening as well. But you are programmed to see only the negative.

 

And honestly, if you are that convinced that the world is such a terrible place, then get out and change it.

 

You know, there IS beauty in life. I guess my post came accross as overly negative, but I recognize things that make me smile. Just hearing a new song or seeing a movie or seeing happy couples together can cheer me up. Or seeing my sister's kids, who always make me smile.

 

I guess I was really down when I wrote that. But the truth is, we make our own destinies, and while there is some darkness, there is light too. You can't have the light without the darkness.

[penelope13]

LBS, if you want specific help in regards to confidence and dating, why don't you describe some of your specific experiences, so we can give you some input?

[LAYAAN]

Yeah, shy girls have it just as hard as shy guys.

(That is something I can't admit on the other forum, without getting into a huge altercation.)

Are you trying to be sarcastic? I know at least 5 shy guys, who are rich and not bad looking. Their GFs aggressively went after them. Don't tell me that shy guys have problem. We live in a western world where women actively ask men out. Sure, they are few in number, but they are out there. As a man what you need is money. Rest is all solved. As a woman what you need is young age and good looks. Rest all is solved.

[dr_styles]

I think this one's heavily region dependent too. I had a friend from an Asian country tell me if you're a "rich guy" in a management style position in their country - which is not hard with a very low average income - you can basically pick and choose because the girls will come after you with those traits, and not just the gold diggers.

 

Some countries obviously different. In some countries you can probably forget about dating a particular race for example. I could try but I'd be chasing the 1-in-a-million group.

 

Though to clarify I don't think any of this applies so much to LBS, living in a western country in the majority race.

[LightbulbSun]

Are you trying to be sarcastic? I know at least 5 shy guys, who are rich and not bad looking. Their GFs aggressively went after them. Don't tell me that shy guys have problem. We live in a western world where women actively ask men out. Sure, they are few in number, but they are out there. As a man what you need is money. Rest is all solved. As a woman what you need is young age and good looks. Rest all is solved.

 

No, I'm not being sarcastic. I was being serious.

 

And I don't believe that these are true. One of the most successful players I ever knew was flat broke. And I've seen some extremely good looking women who are incel - men don't ask them out.

 

Obviously I'm not the only one who generalizes, based upon this post. And I mentioned about the multi-millionaire who couldn't get a date. If you're shy, male or female, it's the kiss of death.

[Lowconfidence]

Are you trying to be sarcastic? I know at least 5 shy guys, who are rich and not bad looking. Their GFs aggressively went after them. Don't tell me that shy guys have problem. We live in a western world where women actively ask men out. As a man what you need is money. As a woman what you need is young age and good looks.

 

But not every man will have money. If the 5 shy guys weren't rich but middle class or even lower would they have been aggressively pursued? Probably not.

 

On average, the shy guy has it harder because men will approach more to shy women. In fact a lot of guys probably prefer shy women since they don't have a flock of male friends around them all the time. The only time shy women have it harder is if they are unattractive AND shy.

[LightbulbSun]

But not every man will have money. If the 5 shy guys weren't rich but middle class or even lower would they have been aggressively pursued? Probably not.

 

On average, the shy guy has it harder because men will approach more to shy women. In fact a lot of guys probably prefer shy women since they don't have a flock of male friends around them all the time. The only time shy women have it harder is if they are unattractive AND shy.

 

Exactly my point.

 

And if an attractive girl is too shy to reciprocate, she'll never get into a relationship. That was the point I was making - that shyness is bad for BOTH genders.

[cpc28655]

I don't even need to read the op to answer this question with a little common sense. Given the world population, and the ratio of males and females, the is of course some people that will be alone their whole lives. I hate to compare dating to a game, but I think that it is the best comparison. In any game, there are winners and losers. Does that mean you don't bother playing the game?

[BriarRose]

LBS, if you want specific help in regards to confidence and dating, why don't you describe some of your specific experiences, so we can give you some input?

 

Agreed. You say you have no luck/experience in dating and intimacy, but when did you last ask someone out? How did you do it? And what kind of women are you asking?

[Sparkly Eyes]

But not every man will have money. If the 5 shy guys weren't rich but middle class or even lower would they have been aggressively pursued? Probably not.

 

On average, the shy guy has it harder because men will approach more to shy women. In fact a lot of guys probably prefer shy women since they don't have a flock of male friends around them all the time. The only time shy women have it harder is if they are unattractive AND shy.

 

Actually the same goes for men. An attractive shy guy will have it easier too. I see women coming on to good looking guys all the time. Not that long ago I was dancing with my friend and there was a very cute shy guy there. Both of us tried to dance with him, but he shied away and left after a while.

[pinkelephant]

Lightbulb: I just realized that I mistaken you for another poster FathomFear. I believe he is gay, but I never found him effeminate (gay doesn't equate feminine), in fact it's the opposite. I'm not sure if there's actual similarities between the two of you; I have a really twisted view of people online and I never keep track of who's who. I lump a bunch together. I guess it's just their essence that's the same. Anyway, point is, I actually LIKE what you post and you remind me of him. I think that's probably one of the reasons behind why you're mistaken for a gay guy on this forum. That you might be similar to a poster who is.

[LightbulbSun]

Lightbulb: I just realized that I mistaken you for another poster FathomFear. I believe he is gay, but I never found him effeminate (gay doesn't equate feminine), in fact it's the opposite. I'm not sure if there's actual similarities between the two of you; I have a really twisted view of people online and I never keep track of who's who. I lump a bunch together. I guess it's just their essence that's the same. Anyway, point is, I actually LIKE what you post and you remind me of him. I think that's probably one of the reasons behind why you're mistaken for a gay guy on this forum. That you might be similar to a poster who is.

 

I'm not offended at all, Fathom is one of my favorite posters here. And yeah, that could explain it.

[Betteroffalone]

Everyone posting here is the product of sex. Our behaviours and emotions are the product of evolution, whose purpose is the advancement of evolution. Including love and loneliness.

 

We don't exist to find 'love' but to reproduce. Pairbonding exists only so that offspring can survive into maturity. So yeah, there have always been those who sex eludes and those who get a disproportionate amount. If you're dominant, handsome and wealthy you'll get plenty. If you're a poor submissive runt then probably not. We're random sprites in a computer simulation with selection paramaters that exclude a good chunk of the population. The result is not predetermined, but probabilistic.

 

It's not politically correct to say this, but romantic love is a fiction.

 

Well that's depressing!

[LightbulbSun]

Well that's depressing!

 

I agree. I believe in love, even if I never find it.

 

People that end up married 60+ years, and keep the fire burning...now that's true love!

[BriarRose]

I agree. I believe in love, even if I never find it.

 

People that end up married 60+ years, and keep the fire burning...now that's true love!

 

Sometimes people that have been together for many years are just together for the kids or financial security - it's not necessarily because they are still deeply in love. Although I believe true love does exist.

[sweetpea03]

Agree or disagree?

 

Disagree. You really need to work on your self-confidence, as most people find confidence attractive. I didn't start dating until later than most, only began in college. Some people date at a younger age and some at an older age. You have a lot of time to find someone to date and be with. I just think that you need to work more on yourself and be happy with yourself. If you don't love yourself, you cannot love someone else. I know it sounds cliche, but it is true. If you are not happy with yourself, you will never be happy with someone and probably won't find someone if you constantly put yourself down. Focus on you for a while and do things you enjoy. Then you can slowly meet women who have similar interests/beliefs and ask them out.

[newwave]

Sometimes people that have been together for many years are just together for the kids or financial security - it's not necessarily because they are still deeply in love. Although I believe true love does exist.

 

I know of two cases where there is soulmate love and it's my parents and maternal grandparents. They are both so happy and like as well as love their mate. I often think my paternal grandparents, though they were married 55 years until passing on weren't happy. My paternal grandfather was abusive and since she was never a citizen (she was British) I think this is why she stayed.

[Jetta]

Even ugly guys get girls, they just have to put themselves out there. Heck half the famous men are what I would consider unattractive, some even ugly. My ex husband had these ears that made him ugly. His face was fine but those ears just awful. My first ex husband wasn't attractive to me either, buy his body was. He was so muscular his butt was hard. Man I miss that body, but he was a cheater and became abusive to me so I left. Anyway the 2nd guy also had a descent body but those ears were awful.

 

If you really want a woman work out and become buff, that will turn a head or two. Then put yourself out there, you may get rejected here and there but eventually you won't or if your anything like my ex's persistence paid off. They didn't accept my no, or disinterest, and kept on trying. Eventually I figured what the heck I'd give them a shot and well that was a mistake on my part but I had some outside pressures as well in both cases.

[FathomFear]

Lightbulb: I just realized that I mistaken you for another poster FathomFear. I believe he is gay, but I never found him effeminate (gay doesn't equate feminine), in fact it's the opposite. I'm not sure if there's actual similarities between the two of you; I have a really twisted view of people online and I never keep track of who's who. I lump a bunch together. I guess it's just their essence that's the same. Anyway, point is, I actually LIKE what you post and you remind me of him. I think that's probably one of the reasons behind why you're mistaken for a gay guy on this forum. That you might be similar to a poster who is.

 

Yeah, I definitely empathize where LBS is coming from. We're in similar situations but for different reasons. He's straight but has lucked out with women, and I'm gay and still have yet to experience dating/etc due to spending a lot of time in the closet and now living in a small town.

 

For me, I go through very long periods where my solitude doesn't bother me. I can literally go for a year or so where I'll barely even linger on the fact that I'm alone, never dated, never had sex. Then suddenly it hits me with full force and puts me into a depression for a few months. And then the feeling goes away again. It's weird.

 

Ultimately, no matter how someone arrives in this position, I think it's important to try to tackle it in baby steps. Refine your diet, work out, extend social networks, practice overcoming anxiety, move to a different city--all are possibilities. I'm working on a few such items now, and although I suspect it won't do much for me I want to go down trying. Otherwise I will just regret it later.