Dating women in their late 20's/early 30's get's kinda weird for me

[KJones1]

I just wanted to share my thoughts on this issue of mine on this forum.

 

I have been in 2 serious relationships since 18, both of which lasted for years and for reasons went by the wayside. I have dated enough (like most healthy people do when they are looking for the right person to be their partner for the rest of their lives), and as such have dated before, after, and in-between these serious relationships to know what the red flags are, green lights, deal breakers, and of course the keepers, like we all kinda intuit or know to look for.

 

Well, I am 28, finishing professional school and now have started encountering something that I didn't encounter when I was dating before, and that is that women in their later 20's and very early 30's really have babies on their minds and it comes up really early on in the dating process. Now please don't get me wrong, I want children one day and I think I could be a great dad, but I find that talking about babies early on put's me off a little and makes me feel strange dating this person after that.

 

It doesn't take an doctor or psychologist to understand that this is because of the difference in med and women insofar that women's reproductive years will come to an end by the time their are 36 and of course being childless or nulliparous (not having borne a child yet) around late 20's early 30's starts starts to weigh heavily on a women's mind because with the biological hard limit set by nature, and most likely societal and family pressures to have children around this time. And so, I am sure women would want to know if the man their are dating wants the same thing too.

 

But I have to tell you, it feels weird for me to go into dating and within a month or two of dating this baby issue comes up. It puts pressure on me really soon to take the relationship to a 'serious' level way too soon. After talking with a older and much wiser cousin of mine, she says that she has noticed that people who start dating in their late 20's early 30s and are the same, the relationship goes quick and ends up with marriage fast.

 

In my prior serious relationships, talking about kids and marriage, etc came up after some time being together, but before then we were focused on each other and making each other happy. But now if I date women around my age or slightly older, this topic comes up fast and it feels the relationship gets serious too quickly.

 

I always imagined that I fall in love with a great woman and explore the world and life and have fun together for a couple years together for some time and that having a child together would be the ultimate expression of our love.

 

But I guess the reality is that if I date a women who is in their late 20's early 30's have babies on their mind's whether they know it consciously or not and they come into a relationship with that on their mind. I guess I better get used to that if I date women around my age.

 

It just makes me feel weird already having that pressure on early in the relationship and that a child isn't the expression of love between two people, but more of necessary evolutionary biological function that a women desperately would like to fulfill ASAP with a suitable candidate. I speak somewhat fasciously now regarding the statement before this, but it is not too far from my true feelings. Probably other guys out there who feel that same pressure way too soon.

 

I am very sure that not ever single woman late 20's early 30's think this way or deliberately go out into a relationship with families on their mind, but now I am a little spooked and it makes me feel that I should date only women who are younger than me, which to me sounds like a terrible thing to say.

 

Am I wrong to feel this way or is anything i have said just plain stupid or wrong minded? Am I right?

[Batya33]

No, it doesn't come to an end at 36, not by far. And I commend women who make it clear from early on that their goal is marriage and family in the not too distant future (whether or not there is a biologica clock concern) -- not speifiically to the guy sitting accross from them, but in general. If that is not your goal, then move on to someone who has compatible goals with you. Of course a focus or obsession on that topic is uncomfortable and can be bizarre, but a matter of fact discussion of goals that include marriage and family is great to get out on the table as early as possible so that no one's time is wasted.

 

I had my first child when I was 42, naturally, complication free pregnancy. I knew by the time I was 19 that I wanted marriage and family and knew by the time I was in my mid 20s that I wasn't going to date someone who wasn't enthusiastic about having children in the not too distant future. Never had trouble meeting men who wanted the same thing.

 

I think it's great that you know you are not in a rush to have children - I am not judging that at all - but I think you should change your mindset about women who bring that up early on and certainly do your homework about your misunderstanding about when a woman is no longer able to conceive a child.

[Ms Darcy]

It just makes me feel weird already having that pressure on early in the relationship and that a child isn't the expression of love between two people, but more of necessary evolutionary biological function that a women desperately would like to fulfill ASAP with a suitable candidate. I speak somewhat fasciously now regarding the statement before this, but it is not too far from my true feelings. Probably other guys out there who feel that same pressure way too soon.

...

 

Am I wrong to feel this way or is anything i have said just plain stupid or wrong minded? Am I right?

 

There is no right or wrong, but I would say that you shouldn't equate your feelings with the truth. Just because you view bringing up kids early on in dating as a sign that the women are trying to pressure you and "that a child isn't the expression of love between two people, but more of necessary evolutionary biological function that a women desperately would like to fulfill ASAP with a suitable candidate" doesn't mean it's true in any sense of the word.

 

Perhaps these women want families and children are a part of that family. What I would suggest to you is to make your stance about children and family clear from the beginning so you don't need to feel pressured.

[fragmint]

think of it this way - if women do that it makes it easier for you to spot out ones who DONT EVER want kids while you do in the future. it just saves everyone time if everyone knows what they want.

 

i dont think its wrong for you to feel this way, it can be overwhelming but not all women want to rush into things just because they are hitting their mid 30's soon.

[KJones1]

Sorry, I should have been clear that a woman is very capable of having a child up till menopause, but the chances that a woman will have a child with an chromosomal abnormality such as trisomies 13 (Patau Syndrome), 18 (Edwards Syndrome), 21 (Down's syndrome) increases exponentially at age 36 and I am sure every woman wants to give their child the best chances of having a healthy life, which would mean having a child before age 36. link removed But like you, there are many children born to women in their 40s who are healthy.

[OntheWire]

Just date who you're compatible with. If they happen to be younger women for the most part, then so be it.

[Tanzi]

Hmmm ... I was 37 when I had my third baby and most people I know have had babies in their early 40s. I am not aware of any one of them having abnormalities. I get what you are saying but I think we have evolved somewhat and are capable of producing healthy babies well into our 40s.

 

Anyhow getting back to the point of your thread ... perhaps these women are just laying their cards on the table right from the beginning so that they know that the are with someone who is travelling along the same path as them and not a completely different one. It doen't mean that they want to have babies right now or even with you but there is little point in falling for someone who wants something different out of life.

 

When me and my ex met on-line we talked immediately about the distance between us. We were over 5 hours apart and we knew it was silly getting into something with such a huge obstacle in the way ... we made it clear from the beginning that if we were in a LDR that was going well both of us would be prepared to move at some point. It didn't mean we wanted to move to be together at that point ... we just removed the obstacle so we both knew there was a reason to carry on going forwards .

 

Different situations I know ... but the thought process is the same.

[WickedSunrise]

I know MANY people who have had trouble having children after 35. At least five couples (family friends & aunt and uncles). I know it's possible to have children later and many people do, but many women (including myself) want to have children at a younger age. Reduces the risks of complications in your pregnancy, you are more likely to be successful at becoming pregnant, and your children are more likely to be healthier. Not even with chromosomal abnormalities... for one of my aunts and uncles, they had a few miscarriages (they were in their early 40s) and when they were successful my cousin was born pre-mature with underdeveloped lungs. She's a happy 8 year old today, but has had lung issues and sometimes needs an inhaler.

 

But anyways... I think that if the women that you are dating at simply asking about your interests in having children later, even if it's really early, that it is fine! Do you really want to find out 6 months in that your goals for a family do not line up? If they are obsessing over it then I can imagine why that would be a little weird. There shouldn't be pressure. If you really like a woman, could you simply say to them that you really like them, are glad that your ideas of a family match and that you are dating for a future, but right now you're interesting in just enjoying each other?

[Tanzi]

Just because you view bringing up kids early on in dating as a sign that the women are trying to pressure you and "that a child isn't the expression of love between two people, but more of necessary evolutionary biological function that a women desperately would like to fulfill ASAP with a suitable candidate" doesn't mean it's true in any sense of the word.

 

I love this.

[shes2smart]

Well...I think it's just part of the process of figuring out if you're compatible with someone. "Kids" is one of the big areas of compatiblity...mainly because it's one of those things where there really is no way to compromise -- you either have 'em or you don't, there's no in between.

 

We all get to pick what our relationship goals are. I think it only makes sense to take the time to 1. figure out what yours are and 2. be up front and brutally honest about them from the beginning. When the topic comes up with these women, I think you need to take a step back and evaluate what they're saying vs what you are hearing. Are they saying they want to have a baby sooner rather than later OR are they saying they want to have YOUR baby sooner rather than later? There's a difference between those two things. The first statement is simply a statement of her goals and (probably) seeing if you have shared goals. If she's saying statement #1, she may or may not mean statement #2....but if all you're hearing is statement #2, it's no wonder you're getting weirded out.

 

I ran into something similar when I was in my late 30's, single & dating and ready to get married. Quite often, what I intended to be a simple statement of my relationship goals ("to get into a relationship leading to marriage sooner rather than later") was completely misinterpreted to mean "I want to marry YOU." Didn't mean that at all. Heck, I brought this up early on -- I didn't even really know the guy, how could I know I wanted to marry HIM, specifically? But I did know where I wanted to end up....and simply wanted to see if he saw himself going the same way and on what kind of timeline. If he didn't see himself going that way at all or not for a good long while, ther was no point in continuing the interaction. If we both were looking to end up at the same destination, then it was worth the time to figure out if we were compatible with and attracted to one another.

 

I cannot tell you how many times I had to explain this concept to men I was meeting. I didn't have to explain it to my husband -- he got it. Then again, he had taken the time to figure out what he wanted in terms of a relationship before he ever met me.

 

By the way, I have my doubts about this "biological clock"/"baby madness" stuff you and others have talked about. I never wanted kids (decided that around age 15) and have yet to hear a single "tick" or have one second of feeling like I wanted to be a mommy. Much as I'd like to believe I'm some sort of one-of-a-kind, unique creature, I don't have enough ego to buy that. Just by sheer numbers of people, there certainly must be other women who don't have the "mommy" mentality. Rather than dating younger, maybe you oughta look for one of them and see if you'd be compatible in other ways.

[OntheWire]

Rather than dating younger, maybe you oughta look for one of them and see if you'd be compatible in other ways.

 

I don't think there's any reason to rule out someone just because of their age. If they're younger and compatible, he should date them. If they're older and compatible, date them. It should be about compatibility, not age.

[shes2smart]

I don't think there's any reason to rule out someone just because of their age. If they're younger and compatible, he should date them. If they're older and compatible, date them. It should be about compatibility, not age.

 

Perhaps I did not word that well. I was actually getting at the same point you were, just from the other side -- that he shouldn't rule out women his age or older by assuming they have Baby Fever, because some of them won't.

 

I'd be the last person to discourage dating based on an age difference...my last bf was 18 years older than me, and my husband is 11 years my junior.

[Batya33]

Sorry, I should have been clear that a woman is very capable of having a child up till menopause, but the chances that a woman will have a child with an chromosomal abnormality such as trisomies 13 (Patau Syndrome), 18 (Edwards Syndrome), 21 (Down's syndrome) increases exponentially at age 36 and I am sure every woman wants to give their child the best chances of having a healthy life, which would mean having a child before age 36. link removed But like you, there are many children born to women in their 40s who are healthy.

 

 

Yes, you are right that the risks increase but with very early in utero testing (often non-invasive to the fetus) the risks are dramatically decreased that the child will be born with Down's or similar. There are many children born to women in their 20s and 30s who unfortunately are not healthy and certain risks are the same and are not age dependent.

 

And, no, I didn't think I had to have children before age 36 in order to give my child the best chances at a healthy life, because I did my homework and understood that while certain risks increased, others did not and other risks decreased - such as, for example, my being in a stable relationship and financially stable increased after age 36, and other factors as well.

[lilypadgirl]

When I was younger I had the luxury of time and the luxury of not knowing what I wanted. That was what dating is for. So, the more dating experience I have, the better I know what I want and less time I want to waste on relationships that just won't work because of compatibility/long term goal issues. That's just a recipe for heartbreak (as evident in my last break up).

 

Although women are having babies at a later and later stage and without complications, and if I don't meet the right guy until later then so be it. I will definitely NOT bring a baby into the world without the loving support of both parents. However, timing and the biological clock is important and I do want to give my kids the best shot at being healthy and complication free.

 

I agree that it's nice to have a relationship flow naturally and for the emotions to build and for the two of you to figure it out as you go. Many girls bring up the baby issue early not to pressure you into having a baby, but just to know that when someday comes and you're ready to take the relationship to the next level, you're not going to hit a brick wall.

 

In my opinion and I mean this with no judgment or disrespect, I think these feelings you have come because you might not be ready to think about long term commitment because you're still trying to figure out what you want. That's totally good and you should go out and date and figure it out. But in my experience guys that are ready to settle down in the near future are glad to have these issues out there early on as they don't want to waste time either.

[Nixee]

KJones.... I do completely understand where you are coming from. I just want to put that out there first. I don't really disagree with you at all - I like it when a relationship builds naturally, when there is no pressure, and when a child could be the natural highest expression of love, etc etc.

 

What I just feel the need to point out is that as a male, you will simply never lose your ability to reproduce ...and you will never ever feel that same pressure of time that a woman feels. So... while I can agree with you on an idealistic level... on a philosophical level... Even as I type this, I am a 30-year old woman with no children who hates to admit I sometimes feel anxious and worried about the child thing. Yes... I DO put it aside. And NO, I don't ever bring it up and pressure a new guy I'm dating.

 

However, it can be important for a woman in my shoes to get to know her potential mates/suitors/partners for real compatibility. If you are thinking long term AND you know you want kids.... what is the point of having a nice romantic affair with someone who doesn't want kids.... or who doesn't want them for 10 years when you are already in your early 30s? Sometimes certain questions just need to be asked to figure out where you stand. Maybe that is seen as pressure.

 

In an ideal world... if I find a mate who I know wants kids and who I feel I really connect with and strong love is developing between us.... rushing to babies right away isn't at all the first thing on my mind. As long as I feel confident we are headed in the same direction with the same goals... that is what matters to me.

 

Sometimes we just have kids on the mind because we don't want our window of opportunity to pass if we start to settle with the wrong person.

[annie24]

But now if I date women around my age or slightly older, this topic comes up fast and it feels the relationship gets serious too quickly.

 

well, there are two things going on here. like a lot of posters said really well, she's just putting out her goals, and like you mention, there is a time limit on her to have children. The desire to have children is a very strong biological desire, so it makes sense that she would want to figure out where you stand on the issue without wasting 2-3 years of her life.

 

the next is that you say things get 'serious' quickly. which kind of sounds like to me that you are interested in dating casually for a while. whereas these women might be dating to try to find their future husband and father of their children. when you say you want to get married and have kids in the future, how future are we talking? 5 years? 10 years? 15 years? could be that these women are on a different time scale.

 

and the next thing is that there are plenty of women who don't want kids (I myself am on the fence and have never talked about it early in the dating process at all!) And there are 22 years olds with baby fever as well.

 

i think when the woman states early on that she's looking to have children, i think it's ok for you to state as well what you are looking for and when. and just figure out if your timescales mesh.

[KJones1]

I seemed to have touched a nerve for some people. I hope I wasn’t offensive and really hope that this thread was useful or at least food-for-thought.

 

I think for the most part I am probably over-reading into what these women I have gone out and dated meant when they talk about babies, and babies names, and how great a mom they are going to be and how many kids they want and that they want to send their kids to private school and so on. But does it have to be so soon in a relationship? And the answer from reading everyone’s responses is yes. Why not gauge where a man is in his life and where he sees himself in terms of relationship, family, etc. b/c as stated above, who wants to waste time on someone who doesn't have the same goals in the same time-frame as they do? (by the way, I don't have a time frame for kids, I guess before I am old. ) At the same time, it does still weirds me out slightly.

 

I think what may have happened to me was perhaps a string of bad luck with women who may have had ‘baby mania’ more than most. But at the same time, I certainly know, as it has been explained to me by several good female friends, that women definitely experience time differently because there is a hard limit for women and reproduction vs. guys who can have kids virtually till they die if they have a willing female. The reason why this conversation has come up several times is the profession I am in. It takes a ton of schooling to do this job and then so by the end of it, you are around 26-28 depending when you started typically. Then you need another 4 years of training, and then you get your real job.

 

The age 36 to someone who is in their early 20’s seems ages away, believe me. When I started school, it felt that I had all the time in the world. I am going to be 29 this year, which surprises the heck out of me b/c I think, ‘where did the time go?’ High pressure school makes time go by quickly and so I still feel like I am the young brash idiot I was when I started, until I think about it enough, and then I am like, ‘oh yeah, I am almost 29. Dang.’

 

I suppose that is where my hang up is, I still feel young and since I have been trapped in school, it has felt that my life has been on hold, vs. friends of mine who started working straight out of college, living working and they are talking about families etc because they have gone through the natural process of falling in love, learning about their partners, and then years later, decide they are ready, emotionally and financially to have child.

 

To contrast, many female counterparts who in order to get to where they want to be, they have to sacrifice having a family so that they are free to pursue their professional dreams (think lawyers, doctors, bonds tradesmen, etc.) So by the time they hit their professional goal, they are 30 and then they are like, ‘I am 30, OMG, I need to have a kid soon.’

 

This is where I come in b/c I am attracted to these successful and attractive women who have finally hit the upstroke in their career. But, nature is unfair to women in the modern world because as soon as they hit their upstroke, there is nature knocking saying, 'you need to have a baby soon, or else face consequences.'

 

So, when I have gone out with these lovely women, I feel they are out on a mission to find the right guy and it becomes more of an interview process instead of falling in love, letting time bring us closer together, and then the ‘let’s have a baby because I love you so much.’

 

I guess it’s not like college anymore where you see a pretty girl at a party and you talk about how great some band is and just hit it off not worrying about where things are going b/c it’s just fun at that point.

 

I was in a relationship recently that lasted for some time with a woman my age, and in which I was quite happy. One day the baby issue came in. I was very nonchalant about the whole thing and said 5-10 maybe, which made her pretty mad that day. I was like that because I DO still feel young and that I have all of the time in the world still. But I know that her oocytes lose their viability as time goes on and she knew that as do most females.

 

So, I think in my own head I want the natural progression of a relationship as if I was still 24 and had all of the time in the world, which as a man, I kinda do (think Tom Cruise or Larry King who had kids past 40s and 60s). But I know for a fact and for very real biological reasons, which is unfair to women to a large degree in a time where you have to go to school or work incredibly hard to be in a place where your professional goals are met, women HAVE to have a kid before a certain age otherwise there has to be some hard core medical intervention (think regular amniocentesis, in vitro fertilization and re-implantation, reproductive drugs, invasive and uncomfortable cervical procedures, increased risk of miscarriage, spontaneous abortions, autosomal anomalies like Downs, still birth, etc) to have a healthy kid after that. I know female surgeons who have waited till they felt they could finally make the time to have kids only to have to go through heroic medical intervention to get there.

 

But this is reality and nature and time wait for no one, so perhaps I need to mature up and want to have kids soon and understand that I am not 24 anymore, OR not worry about it and if I find a woman I really love again, no matter her age, let things fall as they may because who wants to be stuck with some they don't love completely. To me love is most important and truly does conquers all.

[itsallgrand]

Time marches on for all of us.

 

I don't think this is something specific to your situation - having been in school so long, and sort of been in a caccoon for your adult life (no offense intended at all).

 

LOTS of people when they reach this age (I'm 30, female, no kids) start thinking differently about their lives and possibilities. We start to realize we aren't invincible, we have a certain amount of time to do things, and so we better go after it and not put it off for later. Not just about kids either.

 

Sure, being a man, you can postpone making the big decisions if you want regarding kids - but then you also have to live with the consequences of not choosing. Not choosing is choosing.

 

Also, have you ever dated outside your little circle of professional school ? Have you tried dating maybe women who have different experiences, worldviews etc. than you and what you have been surrounded with for so long? It might be worth trying...that is what dating is for. And who knows you might find that a person with a different background than professional who spent all her time in school so far will complement you. Well, you wouldn't know unless you try anyways.

 

I guess my point is: It all depends what you really want and how willing you are to focus on that now, well aware of the time constraints we ALL face (not just women who want babies lol).

 

It's time to live your life full throttle, and maybe you need to go "crazy" for a bit to blow off all that time in school steam - - but never forget what it is you are after.

 

What is it you ultimately want? A long term relationship and a family? Or to date for a few years, then worry about it later?

 

good luck anyhoo.

[Ms Darcy]

I would agree with you that you probably need to mature a bit. But maturity does not mean wanting to have children; I think maturity in this case would be accepting your own biological development ... accepting that you are twenty-nine. Own your own truth and don't try to use biological deflections and anxiety projections to hide your desires. You don't want kids now. You might even prefer to date younger women. And you know that as a man you have plenty of time to be ambivalent about marriage and children.

 

When you spend more time talking about the so-called "baby maniacs" it reads to me that your internal fears are really exaggerating what you are hearing from these women. I'm not saying you are lying, but ... Let's look at the example of the woman you discussed above. First, this is a woman that you were in a relationship in. This suggests that you were in a situation with her that was beyond 'dating.' Presumably there was some emotional commitment and physical intimacy, which makes me believe that she felt safe and comfortable with her feelings for you, which translated into her sharing some of her dreams with you. I don't know what you said to her exactly, but from the response you gave above, I can see how she might have felt ignored, even mocked, for sharing. Non-chalant is sometimes a nice word for 'unconcerned.' Is that the way to directly address the issue in a romantic relationship? No. The mature thing to do is acknowledge her thoughts and let her know where you are with concern and attention. If she's still mad, perhaps she's not a baby maniac; perhaps she's just incompatible with you.

 

The more you drone on about women's fertility at a certain age, the more it sounds like you are talking yourself out of dating women of a certain age.

[itsallgrand]

I tried to give you some rep. Ms. Darcy but was told to spread it around.

 

Amazing post! Said it better than I did, and more directly.

[Nixee]

 

But this is reality and nature and time wait for no one, so perhaps I need to mature up and want to have kids soon and understand that I am not 24 anymore, OR not worry about it and if I find a woman I really love again, no matter her age, let things fall as they may because who wants to be stuck with some they don't love completely. To me love is most important and truly does conquers all.

 

I really liked your whole post... but I just quoted the last bit... partly to save space, but partly because yes... maybe it is simply a maturity issue. Maybe it is just as simple as coming to terms with your age. Not always an easy feat.

 

Women are sometimes forced to do it sooner just because... well... we have to. Sometimes it hits us harder. Like it has already been mentioned - we have that expiration date on us, and it causes panic. But other than that - age and womanhood just go hand in hand. Look at the commercials on your tv - anti-aging creams, products.... it is everywhere. We are constantly programmed to be aware of it. Tick tick tick tick.

 

Men on the other hand... they get the image of growing older and more distinguished. Of dating younger women, marrying younger women... of just generally having more time.

 

I do understand where you are coming from... despite the fact that I am a female. As I said before - I also long for the ideal slower moving romance where pressure is not part of the picture. Also though... just like you - I've picked a schooling and career choice that locks me into years and years of school and a focus on my career that means my personal/romantic life falls by the wayside. Couple that with the fact that I'm a female though, and I think maybe you can start being grateful for your own position. Sure.... it sucks to feel the pressure from your dating pool... but hey, at least you don't have to put pressure on yourself. That is what a lot of women face - pressure from themselves...their family, society, etc.

 

And I certainly don't mean to belittle where you are coming from, so I hope I don't come off that way. This is just the way biology works... and unfortunately, some of it is just the pressure our society puts on us as well. There is a healthier time to have a baby, and there is also a more acceptable time to have a baby. Women who want or will eventually want children know this.

 

So yes... you are not 24 anymore, and if you are dating women your age...you are probably not dating women quite in the same mindset anymore. And that is, of course, a very very broad generalization. My best advice is to just take things with a grain of salt. If a woman asks about kids... or your want for them - answer her. Don't assume she is just trying to rush into a commitment. She can't force anything out of you anyways, and if you don't feel it... you don't feel it.

If she seems way too overeager... then maybe she isn't the girl for you - that sounds like a personality clash (you sound like a more laid back guy). I've already said myself, for instance, that while I am 30 and DO want to have kids... I in no way am over-eager or rush into that stuff right away.

 

And keep in mind - while it is easy for you to joke and say things like "5-10 years"... a lot can change. If you really are laid back about things and just want things to develop, the best thing to do is just find out that both of you would want to have kids "at some point" and then go from there. What if you fall madly in love with someone and end up having a kid in a year or two? Stranger things have happened.

[Batya33]

OP, it sounds like you did your research on the increased risks for older moms but did you forget to do your research on the increased risks to children of dads 40 and over (increased risk of autism). So before you start pointing fingers at whether women over 36 have the best interests of their children at heart when they try to conceive, consider that in 5-10 years you'll be 38 and it might be a bit difficult to have a child, let alone more than one child, before age 40 --- that is, if you're so concerned about the increased risks to the resulting child.

It sounds like the women you are meeting don't have the best, um, bedside manner, in the way they raise the issue and the timing. Feeling the pressure and subjecting a nice guy like yourself to their stress just isn't fair, I agree. What I used to do was listen to the guy discuss his life goals on the first few dates and if I heard that he wanted to travel the world for many years or go back to school and get a PhD in his 30s - and I didn't hear how or if he wanted to balance marriage/family in those plans, yes I was concerned. But I found a way to do my "due diligence" without being overbearing.

 

Also, consider changing your opinion that this is "baby mania" - what in the world is wrong with wanting a child, and wanting one badly? You make it sound like they're obsessed to the point of having lost all balance and perspective. Maybe they have but don't jump to that conclusion, ok? Just like you feel strongly about waiting, they feel strongly about having the chance to be a mother and have a family.

 

Finally, please understand that if your'e going to date women in the 35 and up range, they need someone who wants to be a father and someone who will be very supportive if there are problems conceiving or carrying a child - because there are those increased risks. Wishy washiness just isn't going to be good for the relationship or the woman's well being.

[livinginsbi]

I don't blame the women for bringing up it early on... what's the sense in wasting their time on someone who doesn't share their desire and/or timeline about having children? In the same way.. why waste your time on someone who doesn't share compatable thoughts on any other aspects of life.. like employment, hobbies, where you are going to live... everyone has what is important to them.. and having kids seem to be important to the women you date. I think it's a great thing to get out in the open early.