Grrrr..... I feel like he's still subtly trying to control me....

[lavenderdove]

One thing you have to realize is that selfish and manipulative people are often cheaters and liars as well... They do whatever makes THEM feel good, regardless of the impact on others.

 

So even if you asked him straight out if he is cheating or what is going on, there is a good chance he will just lie rather than face the consequences. Honest people who don't lie and cheat just can't fathom this about selfish/narcissistic people, that they would cheat on and lie to someone they love. But it happens all the time.

 

Regarding the incident with the married woman, i think he told you this because he DID cheat. He was searching for the source of your deep anger and trying to manipulate you out of it. So I would intuit that he DID cheat, and he was testing to see if perhaps this woman (or her husband) contacted you or someone you knew and the story got back to you and that is why you are enraged. So he tells some pre-emptive lies to try to cover for that and salve your anger.

 

Look at it logically. What are the odds that he turned her down and she immediately ran home and spilled all to her husband and ended up mysteriously in a mental hospital. And how did the husband get ahold of the email addresses of all his colleagues? He has to know their names, their user names, the husband's company email etc.? No way. And then he doesn't want you to tell his mother? If he did no wrong, why should he care if his mother knows he had dinner and the old friend is nuts? It just makes absolutely no sense.

 

The thing is liars frequently mix particles of truth with lies to try to get you to buy the story. But the simplest explanation is the best one. Look at it logically. Here is what i think happened... He went out to dinner with her. He started a flaming affair with her. They try to cover up the affair by messing around with Facebook. The husband finds out and all hell breaks loose. And/or he talks to someone he is close to at work about the affair, and he is afraid that person might have contacted YOU so he cooks up a story about people at work hearing falsely from the husband and is checking to see if you found out that way.

 

It is actually an extrememly common thing for people to claim their exes or affair partners are 'crazy' to cover up the affair. i.e., 'don't listen to her, she's crazy and not telling the truth.' So perhaps he is testing to see if the woman called you, and if you said so, he would say, don't listen to her she's crazy.

 

He is following an extremely common profile/lies for someone who has an affair and is trying to deny it, and testing to see what you do and don't know. Your being anger with him is very out of character for you, so he's thinking, gee, she must have found out about the affair somehow, i'll see what she knows and find a way to deny it.

 

And it follows his own profile... doesn't he get close to you, then when he sees some woman that attracts him, off he goes for a while, then when that breaks up, back he comes. He left and went off with the athletic trainer then came back when that fell apart, then he hooks up with this other woman and a couple months later breaks up with you again, probably due to his affair heating up with her. Then that explodes in his face, and he's back hanging around you again.

 

I can say based on my own experience that he is showing a very common womanizer/cheater/liar profile, and he will drag you in and spit you out based on his mood and status with other women. I think this guy is very good at manipulating and lying to other people and living a double life with multiple women. There are plenty of men who do this, and they look for trusting loving women as partners because they can pull the wool over their eyes.

 

I just think this guy is bad news. I think you are an honest loving person who has gotten sucked into his world. You have little honeymoon periods with him, but he is a chameleon changing his stripes based on his mood du jour, and jerks you around because of it.

 

I would genuinely suggest counseling for you. Counselors really just help point you out of the fog and help you see how things really are and give you the tools to help you thru difficult times. It doesn't mean you're crazy, it just means you need a little help getting past this. btw, it is also very common for women involved with men like this to be total wrecks and basket cases by the time they end with these types of men. The men gaslight, manipulate, lie, cheat, and jerk the woman around so much she doesn't know which end is up. So call a counselor, and don't ever contact this guy again. He is bad news and NOT who you hoped he would be.

[prettymommy]

Is it plausible he was cheating? Yes? Is it possible he wasn't and was being honest? Yes as well. I think you can twist it either way.

 

All I do know is it would have been very difficult HAD it indeed be going on while we were together. She lives in the Midwest, 1500 miles away from here, and she was here for four days for some training and went back home after that. One of those nights he was with me, and he kept in touch with me often over those days. He never hid the fact she was coming to town and they were going to hang out (which I would assume if there was indeed an affair going on). She had posts on his FB page that appeared just friendly prior to her visit, asking to coordinate logistics, so it doesn't appear she was hiding anything either. He never even went on travel when we reconciled for those couple months there in the spring, so I know he didn't go visit her. Was it possible they were carrying on emotionally? Maybe, but doesn't seem likely. My ex needs instant gratification. An email love affair, from my point of view, wouldn't be doing it for him.

 

As for his desire for his mother to not know... I know she did know about him having dinner with the high school friend (my ex's mother and high school friend/wife exchanged posts about it on FB from what I remember). I just don't think my ex wanted his mother to know about how this girl came out to him and how the husband stalked him, b/c, well, of how his mother is. She gets all worried and wound up about stuff like that. If she heard her son's job was possibly jepordized..... in this economy, who wouldn't worry?

 

How could the husband get my ex's work email and stuff? Easy. It's on the internet. The husband would just need to know my ex's name, google it, and it is pretty easy to deduce where he is working... I can't imagine it's much harder to go the extra step, look up the company directory, send out a mass email (which is what my ex said this guy did.... I've heard similiar stories before about scorned husbands and wives... It also makes sense as the timing this all went down I also noticed my ex took all his contact info off of Facebook, so...

 

Plus he didn't tell me any of this till after more than an hour, after I called him out on the trainer, the stuff about my son (which I really raged on), etc. It was pretty clear my rage was there.

 

I do believe he was telling me the truth, or maybe that's what I want to believe cause the other option is more difficult to consider, obviously, but the point for me is.... why tell me that at all? It's not respecting the boundaries he created when he broke up with me? I'm not his gf anymore and not his confident in that way. I guess that was what I'm getting out. I think he would have know if I knew about any of it, I would bring it up ( I was pretty brutally honest that night and called him out on other stuff he didn't know I knew....)

 

But it doesn't matter either way I guess. To me, it just wasn't something he should have told me about.

 

And now, of course, tonight it appears he has RSVP'd to another event for this Thursday that I RSVP's to last week. Granted, the RSVP list is 150 long, so he may not have looked through it, but still.... he knows it's with a group I am an active member of. I think maybe this time it's just better I do not go even though he said he would avoid spots he outright knows I'll be at.

[FreedomRing]

Hey PM,

 

I see the thoughts have gotten hold of you again and are circling like crazy in your head.

 

Let it go.

 

Trying to make sense of his erratic behavior actually keeps you from moving forward, concentrating on the betterment of YOU.

 

True your ex may not have looked at the guest list of this new event, but it seems you have, to know that he is coming???

 

I think you are right that you need to start appearing less and less at these events with these people. Is it fair? Absolutely not. But break ups aren't usually "fair". You also weren't being fair to yourself when you were allowing him to treat your life like a revolving door. So close it for good. If this is the way to do it, and it really matters to you about moving on and detaching yourself from him forever, then you know what you HAVE to do.

 

You have alot to offer to not just the next man, but friends as well. Let him be the leech who has to jump on bandwagons and follow crowds to boost his social life. You on the other hand, can meet/greet others as you please...but for the sake of your own sanity and peace of mind, drop off from these events where you know your ex will be.

[prettymommy]

Hey FR-

 

I started going to these events the first week of June, after the ex dropped me, as a part of healing and moving on. I've made friends in the circle, people who call and text me and invite me to informal gatherings and such now. From what I saw on FB prior to the end of July, my ex was doing something completley opposite and getting involved with some circle that was frequenting a couple particular clubs on the weekends....

 

A month and half later, he starts going to the same events hosted by the circle I started getting into. Why? I don't know. Don't care.

 

As for knowing he's going... it's only cause I went to update my RSVP last night when a girlfriend told me she wanted to come along. As I was going through the guest list to see who from my new circle is attending, I saw his profile on the RSVP list. When I had RSVP'd, only 25 or so people had RSVP's. So when I saw the gues list was over 150 (some who don't show), I was curious as to who else was coming, esp. if they were people from the social group I've been involved with this summer. I'm not obsessing (actually venting everything out the past few days has helped me to slow my mind at this point and I feel more calm then I did a couple days ago...) It's just something I noted when I started to update my RSVP.

 

He knows I'm part of these groups and have been going to several events over the past couple months. I made that point clear to him Friday night, and he said he actually had noted that when he started friending people on FB through this group and started noting I was already a friend with many of the people. Tomorrow's event would be the first group happy hour for him, though it will be my 5th or 6th. All this after he wrote me Sunday saying he would stay away if he outright saw I had RSVP'd. So, I dunno. Maybe he looked at the guest list, maybe not. I don't care.

 

I am still going. People checked in with me today to see if I was coming. My ex is not going to control me and scare me from going to events with people I have started to make friends with and who want me at this event with them. I will not once again stand down to him when he's acting inappropriately, and me not showing would send that message and basically say it's okay. Part of me moving on is making friends and expanding my social circle, which is more than 2 months of work and effort I have put into it. I'm not going to give it up b/c my ex wants to play games. I can't help that he wants to jump from social circle to social circle trying to find the right fit. No, it's not fair to me, but I won't play his game either. So screw him. This will end up to be a much larger event (100 or more people compared to the 40 or so last Friday), so it will be easier to avoid him. Plus I'm planning to arrive later, so hopefully he will have left by then.

 

 

Sorry, don't mean to come off attacking. You should know how I roll by now... I let it out for the first few days after an incident with him, then I let it go. That is what happened over this weekend. I am actually feeling much better and positive and have since yesterday afternoon. Have been sleeping the past couple nights, appetite is returning, and I don't feel like hibernating anymore and am ready to get back out with friends. Today, I don't care to make sense of his behavior, other than to acknowledge that I think it is inappropriate and violating my boundaries, boundaries I would assume anyone would assume when they break-up with someone. That's all. Makes no point to continue to think about why he is doing what he is doing other than it is wrong and I don't understand him at all. That's really what it comes down to, isn't it?

[FreedomRing]

K i understand, i would just hate to see this be another situation where the both of you are using this "meet and greet" business as a way of keeping track of one another or a hold. Sometimes motives can be unconscious...You seemed quite disturbed and put off knowing that he was intruding on your space and circle of friends, so to now be ok with it seems a bit strange, but you know best...go and have fun, he really is not worth one iota of your attention...

[prettymommy]

I'm not okay with it. I do think he is intruding on my privacy and space, and I do think it is wrong. However, I am not going to allow him to intimidate and control me, that's all. If I avoided the event with a group I staked out first, what message would that send? That I allow him to continue to control me and my actions (at least, that is how I see it at the moment.....)

 

I think that was part of Friday night... I felt he was controlling me, invading my space. The old PM wouldn' have said a thing. This time around, I wasn't going to let him get away with it or make it pleasant for him.

 

I would rather he not attend. But I am not, and never planned to attend the event, to see him or keep tabs on him. As I said, I RSVP'd for the event long ago. It's just when I went to update my RSVP yesterday to reflect I was bringing a guest, I saw he RSVP'd for the event earlier in the day. That's all. Doesn't change my original intent for attending the event, which was to continue to socialize and build my friendships. Obviously, I have no idea what his motives are for attending, and I don't care at this point. It all very much probably has nothing to do with me. I just want to go out and have a good time with friends and I won't let him deny me that. If he does attend and if I do see him, I will just ignore him and stay focused on my friends.

 

You know I love ya for keeping me straight with myself, dontchya? ;-P

[FreedomRing]

Yes the outside perspective can be so insightful when you're in the mix of things...

 

I was moreso referring to future events which could turn into this whole "I'm going to such and such event............. wonder if he is gonna show up too argh....... and if he does so what, cause this is all about me....... and he better not even try to talk to me cause i will rip him a new one...... He' better not show!!!!" you know, head talks that become such a drag afterwhile. As far as what the message sends, wouldnt matter to me personally, because my focuse would be doing what was best for me. Talks like that in my head and noticing a trend in the social circles he's going to(MINE) would only need to happen once before I woulld just find another group altogether. To concentrate on what hte message says, i think makes it about a power struggle which would still be giving this guy your attention, in the mental/emotional sense

[prettymommy]

Hmmm.... I see your point.

 

Maybe from here on out I will assume he will be at the events instead of obsessing over it. And I will continue with my tactic, which is to ignore and not let him get to me anymore. He's not anyone I know anymore, nor someone I care to get to know.

 

Again, maybe Friday was just me needing to get it all out, to acknowledge for once that he wronged me (as much as I also allowed it). He denyed me the closure I needed when things ended in May, and I know that denial just kind of caused my anger to build. I needed to not continue to be passive about it all. So I did what I needed to do, I got my closure and I got it out of my system, I let him know what I thought of him, and now it's time to continue forward.

 

To be honest, last night when I was doing my usual run in the gym, I actually started to come to the realization how much I LIKE my life right now! I'm out and about and meeting people and making lots of friends... I almost have TOO much to do at this point, lol! But I love it. When I was with the ex, well, as much as I loved him and loved being with him, I sometimes thought things were a bit stale in terms of our social lives. We spent so much time together, alone, at home. Watching movies and TV shows, etc. He fell asleep early a lot, which kind of bugged me, since I am a night owl. And when we did go out, it was mainly movies and dinner and outdoor stuff, and some sporting events, and we may have socialized once a month or so with friends. We never really went to bars or clubs or went out dancing or did some of the other things I'm doing now. When I would suggest a night out bar hoping or dancing or with friends, he would agree, but then kind of crap out early in the evening, complaining to be tired. I guess it stings a bit to see him now doing those things I wanted to do, and I acknowledge it hurts my ego a bit, like why couldn't he do those things for me when we were together, but whatever. That's just my ego talking. I shouldn't take it personally.

 

But yeah, I think I just need to let it go. I will just assume from now on that he will be there and I will just stick to my tactic to avoiid and ignore and not allow him to get to me anymore. Not ignoring him in attempt to send any message, but in an attempt to be protective of my emotional health. But I am excited for tonight! I've had plenty of people (and several guys!), as well as the organizer of the event, check-in on me last night to see if I was attending, and showing excitment at my confirmations. That is validating and I know I will be there with people who care for me and want to be with me.