confusing situation -- how to proceed?

[baffled]

Hey all. I've been browsing this forum for a couple weeks just to get a feel for things. I went through a gut-wrenching break up about 6 weeks ago. There are tons of relevant details, but I'll let them come out as necessary as the thread proceeds. I've posted on another unrelated forum dealing with her psychological issues, but this one seems to be more suited to my problem right now.

 

OK, so here goes. We had been together over 4 years; lived together about 1.5 years. 6 weeks ago, on a Monday, I catch her chatting online with a guy. This, by itself, doesn't bother me at all. I trust her and am confident in our relationship, so my reaction ordinarily would be ok whatever, as I don't care if she has guy friends. I see two lines, both written by him. I don't remember the first one, but the last one reads "it sounds like he left you a long time ago". I pause for a few seconds because at first I felt there was no way he was talking about me. I then ask, of course, "what are you guys talking about?" She hesitates, looks at me, and says "baffled (that's me I have to leave". I say "uhh, what?" There is some fighting, I don't blow up or anything. She says things later like "I'm not leaving you", "This isn't my apartment, it's OUR apartment" (when I say well I guess it's your apartment now). Very contradictory stuff (TONS of contradictory things over the past 6 weeks, I'll explain more later). Says she needs to go home to her parents and needs time to think. I tell her that's fine. For the most part, during the weirdness, I was very calm and understanding -- I definitely didn't blow up or anything.

 

An important tidbit -- over a year ago, I caught her chatting with another guy online. She was telling him that she thought I didn't think she was pretty anymore. I broke up with her, she cried, I took her back within 10 minutes because I felt guilty (I thought it was my fault she felt that way). I will get this out of the way -- I was great to her, she knows this, her whole family knows this. She is diagnosed OCD, depression -- she has VERY low self esteem (but she's effing gorgeous) and craves attention from guys pathologically. She's had really really bad past relationships -- the worst one when she was 15, she's 29 now. I can go more into that later if it becomes relevant. She's never acted on anything (I'm positive of this), she just wants everyone to think she's beautiful and perfect. She eats it up when people tell her she's pretty. Her self esteem was particularly low a month or so before the break up occurred.

 

So anyway, she goes to her parents, I hang out that evening with her brother in law -- one of my best friends. He says she's at home crying, her sister tells me she can't sleep and is taking benadryl to make her pass out, etc. In her brother-in-law's words, "Well, it's a good sign that we're out here drinking and she's at home crying her eyes out." Her sister pulls me aside that day and tells me what's going on. She tells me things that in the recent past my ex had told her that she is afraid I didn't want children and that she'd be "trapping me" (I always told her I wanted kids, but she believed that it was for her, not me. This worried her constantly apparently). She felt she couldn't talk to me without it turning into a huge fight (not true, part of her psychological problems -- she ALWAYS feels people are criticizing her and is afraid of any conflict... not just with me). Other things that her sister may or may not have told me then (we've talked a lot, we're really good friends) -- I treated her more like a roommate than a girlfriend and lover, I was really cold about finances (we'd been going through a lot of financial stress the past two months), I didn't give her enough attention (this was somewhat innacurate, my ex told me this was false later -- what she meant is she just craves attention in general and can't help herself. It wasn't anything to do with me), etc. I text her that night: "I'm sorry. I love you so much. Take as much time as you need".

 

I call her the next morning. She's in tears and says "I'm so sorry, I'm coming home". She arrives ~45 minutes later, and immediately tells me "that was the biggest mistake I've ever made, you're the love of my life". I go to her, hug her, and cry. Tell her you have to talk to me when you're having problems, don't bottle stuff up. We talk for a bit, do the make up thing. She cries during sex when I tell her she's beautiful. She takes a nap as she hasn't slept at all lately, and we decide to go out to eat after she gets up. During the ride there, she has a panic attack, says "I can't do it anymore, baffled (that's me)". I am worried about her at this point -- I have no idea what's wrong and with her psychological problems I don't know what to think. Right after she says this, I ask what's wrong and hold her hand, "she says no no no, I can't think straight. God what's wrong with my brain" She has problems with racing thoughts and anxiety. Keeps apologizing to me, I tell her it's ok, just to relax. From the moment she came back, I was as loving and understanding as possible to her -- never got angry with her strange behavior (even now I'm still as understanding as possible and never yell at her or anything).

 

We stop and get some fast food. We come home, I make her smile and laugh even though she's confused and in tears the whole time. She goes back to her parents, as she's leaving I hold her and kiss her, tell her "Take as much time as you need. Don't think of all the bad stuff, think of the good times." She cries and says "there were a lot of good times". She's gone again.

 

She calls me the next morning and I haven't slept. She tells me it's over, and she's calm about it. I start to choke up, ask why, and she tells me she doesn't know. I'm a mess all day. Not in a MILLION years did I think that was going to be her final answer -- I saw NO signs this was coming at all. I call her the next morning and she says she's on her way with her dad to get her stuff.

 

She gets here and she's crying way more than I am. Says she doesn't know why she has to leave, she just needs to be alone right now and needs time to think. She's hugging me tight and kissing me, apologizing for how she's acting. I tell her to promise me that if she gets straightened out and wants to come back, to not be afraid to come back (so she doesn't think she ruined anything). She promises, and says "I don't know if I'll be back... but you can't wait on me". As she's getting all her stuff, she breaks out in tears a few times. She keeps telling me she loves me and still loves me. We give our goodbyes and I love you's, and she's crying her eyes out as she walks away. That's it. Oh, she comes back ~40 minutes later b/c she forgot her clothes. She seems much more emotionally distant and very drained, almost zombie-like. Grabs her clothes and leaves a few minutes later.

 

I call her two days later to say I miss her, no response, leave a voicemail. Her brother calls me two days after that, tells me what he knows -- doesn't know why she did this. I think she's sick, and so did he for awhile. But, during the conversation he says she's not sick and that I need to stop thinking that. He said she might be getting annoyed that I told him and her sister that I thought she was sick (they BOTH also thought so too though??). He also says she told him that "I love him, but I'm not in love with him anymore". This crushes me. I call her, leave a message saying I'm sorry for thinking she's sick and I understand now. Still no contact from her at this point. Her brother calls me again 5 days later and said he just got off the phone with her. He mentioned he was about to call me. She starts getting emotional and crying and says "God (brother), I love him so much, but...". That's it.

 

I talk to her sister and brother and brother-in-law on and off after this. I'm really close with all of them. None of them really understand what happened -- they had no clue this was coming and no idea she was feeling this way. I call her a week or so later to wish her luck on a huge test she had, tell her I love her. Call her on valentine's day just to wish her happy v-day and see how she did on her test (it was the same day). This was 2.5 weeks after the break up.

 

I find out two days later while hanging out with her bro-in-law that she drove to see this guy she was chatting with online. He lives 7-8 hours away. This KILLS me. No one in her family knew she was doing this until the day before she left -- she left immediately after her test. She doesn't tell her schizophrenic mother where she's going or to call to say she's ok (this is waaaay out of character for her, she would never do anything to make her mom worry as this contributes to her psychosis). Her sister is furious at her, talking trash and making fun of her. She tells me "the only reason she's doing this is for attention, and she chose this guy because he lives so far away and she can be done with him when she's done with him". I text her that night I find out: "Text me when you're on your way home so I know you're ok. You don't have to call me." I'm so understanding and nice about it because she just seems so ridiculously confused right now and she's not at all the same person I've known for 4 years. Her sister acknowledges this, and says she REALLY needs help.

 

She comes back 5-6 days later. I find out from her sister 1.5 weeks or so after that that this guy lied to her about everything. He was 12 years older than he said he was. Total scumbag. She found out his age the last day she was there by going through his wallet (she was suspicious from the beginning). He still denied it after she showed him his I.D. She is crushed and depressed -- hates her new job on top of everything. Tells her sister "she misses her friend" (referring to me).

 

I ended up sending her a letter, telling everything I felt I needed to tell her because she won't talk to me. This is about 6 weeks after the break up, 2.5 weeks after her road trip to see this guy. She calls me immediately after she reads it.

 

I'll break this up into another post... getting long.

[baffled]

Basically, the intent of the letter was to make sure she knew how I felt about children -- that I wanted them for myself and her. Children were a HUGE deal to her. She once told me she felt like her life would be a failure if she didn't have kids. She talked about it constantly, especially over the past couple months. I would always tell her that I wanted kids too, that we just needed to wait until we were finished with school and had a steady income (which was just right around the corner). There was other stuff in the letter of course, but that was my main point in sending it because this was such a sticking point for her and I KNEW she felt that I didn't want kids for myself. Turns out I was right to feel this way.

 

OK -- so she reads the letter and calls me. Says we need to talk and wants to meet Saturday (3 days ago now). I go over to her parents house. We hang out for about two hours and talk about everything. It was one of the most open, real conversations I've had with anyone. She tells me early on "I still love you but I'm not in love with you anymore". I saw it coming at this point. She doesn't want to get back together. At this point I ask if she slept with the guy, and she says yes. I ask her if he made her feel the way I made her feel, and she says "No, he and the whole situation disgusted me". I ask her why she went out there, and she says it was just an uncontrollable impulse, she needed the drive to clear her head, and she wasn't planning to go out there, she just did. Her sister previously had told me the same thing -- basically it was her being crazy. The whole "impulse" thing is related to her OCD probably. She's till talking to him occassionally. Her sister says it's because she doesn't have a backbone and is afraid to tell him "no, you disgust me, leave me alone". Of course, part of her is probably still into him and wants him for "companionship" (whatever companionship someone over the internet can provide) since she's not with me anymore, and she's not being completely honest with me or her sister about that.

 

Anyway, I ask her about the letter, and how it made her feel... if it made her question her decision. She hesitates, and I ask "or did it just make you feel guilty". She kept reiterating over and over how guilty she feels about what she did to me -- she has insane guilt issues related to her depression and low self esteem (not just with this situation, with everything). She says it just made her feel guilty.

 

I ask her why she didn't talk to me for 6 weeks. She said she didn't really know or understand how she felt, or what her true feelings were about me until a week ago. (really, it took that long???) She said she thought, despite my non-pushy voicemails and texts, that I HATED her. The letter made her realize that she had to call me. She also confessed that she really believed all the irrational things I thought she believed -- that I didn't really want kids, that I didn't think she was pretty anymore, that she couldn't talk to me about important stuff, that I didn't love her, etc.

 

The conversation we had was amazing. We go for a long walk and she confesses it felt a little awkward for her because it was the first time we were together and weren't a couple. I was surprised by this because everything seemed so natural. It was like old times -- we could talk about anything and everything openly and freely, none of this BS about her feeling like she couldn't talk to me. We had several moments where we were staring deeply into each others eyes. From my end, it still felt there was a strong connection there. At one point she's crying and I brush her hair away from her eye, she doesn't recoil or anything but doesn't really do anything in response either. We say our goodbyes, she hugs me tightly and we kiss each other on the cheek.

 

I had plans to hang out with her brother-in-law afterwards so we go to a bar for a drink. Her sister comes too and we talk. Apparently, my ex called her right after I left and she was in tears. This surprises me, because I felt great after I left and she seemed to be perfectly fine too. Her sister also said that she talked to my ex after she read the letter and it did indeed make her confused again (which contradicted what she told me earlier), and her sister basically told her "those are natural feelings, you still have to talk to him though". Basically, it seems like her sister quashed her feelings there and her confusion/questioning things. Which, looking back, is kind of annoying because I KNOW her and I KNOW the letter affected her deeply, but her sister kind of negated that to some extent. But, the ex was apparently scared and wanted to cancel the meeting, but her sister convinced her not to, and I'm grateful for that.

 

I need to drop some of her stuff off at her parents house. I'm thinking of doing that in a week or so, then cutting off contact for awhile. I don't know how long yet, and was wondering what everyone's opinion is. The ex says she still wants to be friends and hang out once in awhile.

 

 

 

 

Now, WHY is this so confusing for me? Well, first off all there were no signs. Yes, we were stressed lately about things, and she was on her online game a lot. I had to prepare a huge project for school, which cut into our time the last month or two before the break up. She had her huge test to study for too. But, when we did hang out, we still had fun -- no signs of any problems. We still were having great sex, and it was only SLIGHTLY less infrequent, if at all, due to our busy schedules. I allowed her to play her online game a lot and didn't say anything because I knew she liked it, and she used it to unwind and escape from things for awhile. Since she was studying for her test so hard, there was no problem on my end with this. I "knew" things were going to be fine when she was done.

 

She ALWAYS told me right up until the end... for the past 4 years... that I was all she ever wanted. She felt she would never find anyone like me. She wanted to spend her life with me and wanted me to be the father of her children. We were looking at wedding rings just over Thanksgiving break and Christmas, only 2 months and a month before our break up, respectively. Just two days before this all started, she told me she still wanted to convert to my religion -- I never ever prompted her feelings of this at all. She had just been putting it off (and me too) because of lack of time. She told me the week of the break up (when she came back that Tuesday), that she would follow me anywhere for work or if I decided to go for a Ph.D. She ALWAYS said she would follow me anywhere, and I had no reason to doubt this because she always loved me more than I've ever seen anyone love another person.

 

I still feel like she has to be confused to some extent. When looking at EVERYTHING (and there is still some stuff I can elaborate on, so feel free to ask as it comes up), it still just doesn't make sense to me. What the heck is going on, and what should I do? I still love her, and I believe she's the love of my life. I am willing to forgive her for everything, although obviously IF she ever comes back we need to work on a lot of things that I was completely unaware of until now.

 

Thanks for any help.

[baffled]

One other piece of important info. I may make other posts as I think of stuff.

 

During our conversation 3 days ago, I asked her how long she had been feeling this way. She told me she first had thoughts of leaving a year ago when I caught her chatting with this other guy. (This guy was pretty much the definition of a loser, and she said there was NO way she ever considered leaving me for him -- there is absolutely no reason for me to doubt this. She again, told me that he called her pretty based on pictures from her myspace, and she ate it up and that was that).

 

My impression of her saying this was not that her thoughts of leaving were an incessant feeling for the past year (although I didn't ask her), it's just the first time in the relationship it had crossed her mind. The weird thing is, I broke up with HER, and she begged me to take her back at the time. The other weird thing -- she said the thoughts had nothing to do with me or the relationship. She said she felt unbelievable guilt for doing it, and she had a ridiculously strong desire to be punished. I never really punished her for it though, and I told her that I couldn't because I loved her and couldn't hurt her. But since I didn't, it made her feel even more guilt, and she considered leaving.

 

Me and her brother both think that perhaps the biggest reason for her leaving was the "guilt" from me catching her again. She told me that she told herself that she would NEVER get caught up in such a situation again, yet here she was. When this started that Monday she said "What if I hurt you again? I can't control myself. What if I do it again? What if I cheat on you?" I asked her if she had, she immediately said no. I asked her if she ever came close or thought about it, she immediately said no. I'm 99.9% sure she never cheated on me, and her family is sure too. She would never have had the opportunity anyway without anyone knowing, so I have no reason to doubt this. Her brother thinks she is afraid she would hurt me again.

 

Her bro also said (and I thought this was part of the problem as well), that she didn't want to hold me back in any way. She knew I had thought about going to some really good schools away from home for a Ph.D. or M.D., and as I said before she always said she'd follow me anywhere. But, with the economy the way it is, her family is in dire financial straights. She is living with them and helping them out, and she is very content with this at the moment. She knows that with me (or at least believed that), she probably can't do this. Now that the time had come where we may move away within the next 1 - 1.5 years, she was afraid and knew she couldn't do it. Deep down she knew she couldn't leave her family. Her brother and I both think this contributed to things a lot, but she never directly said this.

 

BUT SHE NEVER TALKED TO ME ABOUT ANY OF THIS. The only reason I was even considering moving away was because she told me soooo many times that she would follow me anywhere, and she wanted to. If she needed to stay at home with the family, I'm sure I would have thought about things for awhile, but I know I would have been perfectly happy staying here. So bah.

 

There's just so many potential reasons for all this and I can't fully comprehend it all. I think it may have been everything put together, "a perfect storm" as my friend put it, that drove her away. I just don't know.

[Drac07]

You're right. This is pretty confusing.

 

It sounds like she is in dire need of professional help, for one thing. I'm amazed at your forbearance; not many people would be willing to forgive so much. Something that's unclear: she said she slept with him but that she didn't cheat on you?

 

I think it's pretty obvious that it's in your best interest to let her go. I think it's also pretty obvious that you don't much care about your interests when hers are at stake. So, what to do? It sounds like her apparent need for validation will continue to create problems like this in the future. You can't realistically expect that this won't just happen again and again. But you seem to know all that.

 

If you think she's really the love of your life, the only thing you can do is whatever you think is best for her. Urge her into counselling or be persistent with her, or yeah, even let her go and let her family take care of her. The omnipresent disclaimer here is that you know her better than anyone on here, long posts notwithstanding.

 

Not sure I didn't tell you anything you don't already know, but hopefully it helps. All the best.

 

Draco

[Drac07]

You're right. This is pretty confusing.

 

It sounds like she is in dire need of professional help, for one thing. I'm amazed at your forbearance; not many people would be willing to forgive so much. Something that's unclear: she said she slept with him but that she didn't cheat on you?

 

I think it's pretty obvious that it's in your best interest to let her go. I think it's also pretty obvious that you don't much care about your interests when hers are at stake. So, what to do? It sounds like her apparent need for validation will continue to create problems like this in the future. You can't realistically expect that this won't just happen again and again. But you seem to know all that.

 

If you think she's really the love of your life, the only thing you can do is whatever you think is best for her. Urge her into counselling or be persistent with her, or yeah, even let her go and let her family take care of her. The omnipresent disclaimer here is that you know her better than anyone on here, long posts notwithstanding.

 

Not sure I didn't tell you anything you don't already know, but hopefully it helps. All the best.

 

Draco

[baffled]

Thanks Draco. Yeah, it was a long post, but I wanted to get it out there

 

Something that's unclear: she said she slept with him but that she didn't cheat on you?

 

I was referring to her not cheating me at any point during our relationship (that she only was seeking attention, nothing more, before all this happened). We were broken up when she went out there. Yeah, it was REALLY soon, and it sucks, but at least she didn't head out there before she split with me.

 

So, what to do? It sounds like her apparent need for validation will continue to create problems like this in the future. You can't realistically expect that this won't just happen again and again. But you seem to know all that.

 

If you think she's really the love of your life, the only thing you can do is whatever you think is best for her. Urge her into counselling or be persistent with her, or yeah, even let her go and let her family take care of her.

 

Yes, it is likely it could create future problems. But the craziness of the current situation aside, the ONLY thing she's ever done that's even remotely close to this is chat with that one other guy a year ago. And once I caught her there, she deleted everything to do with him no questions asked. No further problems with this type of thing until now.

 

Also, as far as counselling/therapy goes, she acknowledged when I met with her 3 days ago (and during the week of our break up) that she is really messed up right now and needs help. She said 3 days ago a priority of hers is to get health insurance and therapy. When we first met, she was on therapy/meds for her OCD and depression, but her insurance lapsed shortly after. There were literally zero problems in our relationship until maybe two years in -- she was great and I don't even remember a single fight in the first 2-2.5 years. But then she occassionally started random fights with me over stupid stuff. It wasn't all that often, and she always apologized for them though, so I let it go. I rarely even verbally fought back because some of the fights were so silly. But yeah, even considering this, I think we fought much less than a lot of couples that "make it".

 

I mean, if she came back, I'd definitely have to evaluate the situation carefully, but knowing her I think there's a good chance with therapy that there would be no risk for this in the future.

 

One thing that I forgot to mention, is that recently she's been going through a LOT of stress. I saw her dad one day, and he was just as confused about this as I was, and he said the only thing he could think of that caused this was stress from her test. Off the top of my head: her huge nursing board licensing test, stress about money/paying rent and bills because our money was tight, quit smoking recently, VERY low self esteem and conscious of her slight weight gain since hanging out with an old friend of hers (they used to both be anorexic, and she had been talking about starving herself since they hung out), turns 30 this year which she has made a big deal out of, no children yet, I hadn't proposed and she didn't know when I had planned to (I think this was a big deal to her... but since she left I'm not so sure anymore... I know it used to be a big deal), family stress with several family members being laid off, her mom having schizophrenia and her insurance lapsing from her dad getting laid off, being ultra addicted to this video game of her's surely caused her to distance herself (she was on it 6-8 hours a night, but I let it go b/c of her test), and I'm sure the guy she was chatting with was filling her head with BS. I could probably think of more.

 

The absurdity of this situation aside, she was amazing to me for the 4 years we were together. I could have never, ever seen her doing this, no matter how stressed she was or how 'crazy' she got. I think that's why I'm being so willing to forgive and understanding... I'm really not as big of a pushover as this thread makes me sound like at least I don't think so. She is just like a totally different person right now and I don't understand it.

[Drac07]

Hopefully she'll calm down when her life does, then. It's hard times for many and I have several friends who have sat for their RN cert as well. I've never seen such a group of strung out people! I hope you're right and it's just a stress problem. And to quit smoking on top of all of that! Phew. It's an awful lot.

 

If you want her back, sounds like the best you can do is stick it out and remind her that you're there. And maybe some subtle hints from her family would help, too.

 

Draco

[baffled]

I'm planning on calling her next week at some point to drop the rest of her stuff off. I was originally then planning to disappear for awhile (3-4 weeks or more), other than hanging out with her family as we're all close friends, and of course not really bring up the ex. I was thinking that, even though a lot of this might still be confusion/stress/mental issues, there's really no way I can know for sure as she's been so erratic. And either way, I think that no contact for a month or so... or a bit more, will get her to think about me and start to regret what she did. I made it VERY clear that I love her to death, and it sure felt like we reconnected at least a bit 3 days ago (could be reading too much into it though).

 

The only thing (and it's a big thing) that I'm worried about if I don't contact her for awhile is her going back to feeling that I don't love her, and I think there's a decent chance she's way too passive and insecure right now to initiate contact -- even if she really wants to call me. Just something to think about.

 

You said basically "stick it out and remind her that you're there". Is giving her a month or so to think about stuff ok? Or should I make weekly (or whatever) calls to talk? I just don't want to mess anything up here.

[Drac07]

Personally, I don't try to play games with any relationships. That is, I wouldn't try to think of ways to get her to miss me - I would call and let her know I'm there. Even though, to you, you may have been VERY clear about your feelings, maybe it wasn't that clear to her - or like you said, it may become muddled in time without reinforcement.

 

Now, if she doesn't want to talk to you at all, that's something different. Admittedly a fine line, especially when you don't know what's actually on her mind. It will always boil down to your best judgement.

 

Draco

[baffled]

Yeah, I hate having to play games too. I think I'm justifying it in this instance with a "well, she probably really does need time to think about things, and there's no harm in giving that to her" Oh yeah, add to the stress list -- her FIRST JOB as a nurse, after only 3 weeks of training, is director of nursing of her mother's nursing home. She just started as DON on Monday, so she's definitely not through the stress yet.

 

I don't know how much stock to put in the "I'm not in love with you anymore" at this point. God, she used to be crazy about me. I'm sure I could have given her more romantic attention lately, but with school and all the past couple months were stressful so we didn't get to do as much together. Can someone fall out of love that fast? Even though our couple time together was less frequent, she still seemed to have tons of fun doing stuff with me. Not to mention the looking at rings bit recently, and all her "normal" spend her life with me comments she'd make. Should I 100% take her word for it, or is it possible she's saying it for other reasons? I can think of some, but I don't want to type them out because then I feel like I'm grasping at straws and look silly

 

Lastly, on another board, I had a "relationship guru" who has written a book about getting your ex back tell me to either 1) date someone else and have it get back to her and/or 2) disappear for AT LEAST 3 months. I didn't type out the situation really at all, just told the board about her psych problems. He is virtually certain, though, that she left due to lost attraction or respect because "that's what it always is". Even after her "not in love with you" comment, I'm skeptical that it's mostly lost attraction.... It's probably some, but 3 months of NC seems like an awfully long time given the situation. Oh, he also said the talk we had 4 days ago now was a "huge mistake that's difficult to recover from" because it gave her some closure. I dunno...

 

I want to take what he said into consideration, but am I correct in at least partially sticking to my guns because this situation seems very different than most? Giving her NO reinforcement for 3 months could be a gigantic mistake, IMO... but maybe not

 

Need more input!! What does everyone else think my strategy should be? Is a LITTLE NC ok since our last talk seemed to go so well? Should it be longer? Should it be none at all? Should I ask her out for coffee or lunch in a week or two? I must know!

[baffled]

Hi again! I'm a bit drunk right now, but I thought of this idea earlier so I'm not just being drunk and stupid at the moment.

 

So... I had a friend suggest asking her to go to a concert at some time. We used to go to a decent amount back in the day -- always had a great time. I thought it was a great idea overall, but definitely too soon.

 

Well, I got a random email today from a concert venue in town. Two bands that she LOVES are playing there a bit over two months from now. One of the bands we went to see out of town back in the first year we were dating and had a fantastic time. The kicker is it is the day before her 30th birthday.

 

I want to ask her to go when I drop the rest of her stuff off next week. I'm going to ask if she thinks at that point she'd be comfortable hanging out as friends (since she felt a bit awkward last weekend), then tell her about the show and see if she wants to go as a birthday present. I figure 2+ months from now would be plenty of time for her to clear her head and think about stuff, and the bands will get her thinking about the good times we had together.

 

It sounds like a fantastic idea to me, but will I crash and burn?

 

Can I get more opinions on the situation? Drac07 has been fantastic, but I'd like some others' opinions.

[baffled]

bump. Sorry for the length of the posts, but I would appreciate it if anyone else could give their opinions as to what's going on and what I should do. There are times when I'm just so sure I can get her back, but there are others where I think it's hopeless

[odile]

Good lord, that was a long read!

 

I'd like to compose a reply, but even the little notes I was taking while reading your post are a page long!

[rivercitystein]

Sure, go ahead and ask her about the concert but don't be surprised if she can't give you a definite answer. She can't tell you whether or not she will be comfortable hanging out with you as friends in 2 months. She won't know until the day gets a lot closer. Did you ever look into any assistance she may be eligible for in regards to her medication? How much does the RX cost a month? Considering how much you know about her psychological disorders I find it odd that her RX cost was not put into your monthly budget.

[odile]

You say:

I don't know how much stock to put in the "I'm not in love with you anymore" at this point. God, she used to be crazy about me.

Used to is the key statement.

We cannot assume that what she felt before is what she feels now, even if we may wish it so.

There may be love there, but the situation is very complex, and it's time to hunker down and examine what it is that may be going on.

 

You thought you had a solid relationship, and point to what you see as a few indicators-- for example that as a couple you hardly fought.

 

But then she occassionally started random fights with me over stupid stuff. It wasn't all that often, and she always apologized for them though, so I let it go. I rarely even verbally fought back because some of the fights were so silly. But yeah, even considering this, I think we fought much less than a lot of couples that "make it".

 

Well, let me tell you-- not fighting is not an indicator of a good relationship.

In fact, good couples do sometimes fight, and know how to fight healthily.

They hash out concerns and disagreements, and find pro-active solutions together.

Sweeping stuff under the rug (in your case), or failure to disclose things (in her case) are not appropriate solutions to concerns.

 

In fact, such seemingly placid relationships-- where two people make 'nice' just to get along (while sometimes hiding what they might really feel) can often blow up, as they have in this instance.

 

But the craziness of the current situation aside, the ONLY thing she's ever done that's even remotely close to this is chat with that one other guy a year ago. And once I caught her there, she deleted everything to do with him no questions asked. No further problems with this type of thing until now.

 

No questions asked? Mmhmm. She didn't want your feathers to be ruffled... but she didn't necessarily want to stop doing whatever she was doing, either. And she lied to you (by omission, at the least) about that situation, so how do you know is there weren't other situations that you were in the dark about?

 

"She told me she first had thoughts of leaving a year ago when I caught her chatting with this other guy".

 

So, she withheld her true feelings/concerns from you. If she had been that close to breaking up then-- and you were never spoken with about how seriously she'd considered this-- then clearly there were some unresolved issues lurking about (either between you, or with this other man/men, or both).

 

All of a sudden, you are learning things about her that you didn't know before.

Let's look at a year ago (saw it in your depression thread), when she almost broke up with you just before she was meant to move in together with you.

(sidenote-- any chance that at that time, she may have panicked at moving the relationship closer to a commitment that she was unsure of?)

 

Just because you are taken by surprise by all of this does not mean that it was out of the blue.

She lied regarding her involvement w/others. She took A YEAR to make a move to some potentially greener pasture.

Dear, this is not impulse.

Perhaps she had not slept with anyone yet (how can we be sure?), but it is certainly clear that she was having an emotional affair (or two, or who knows how many-- behind your back. and lying to your face on a daily basis by leading you to believe that she was not doing what she was doing).

[odile]

Just for the sake of argument, let's pretend that it was "impulse".

She still ran off to taste something else (something she'd been craving for a year-- i.e., something that perhaps you weren't able to provide) rather than speak to you about her needs.

 

Ohhh, but she's insecure, you say. I agree with you there, but I think we are viewing the nature of these insecurities very differently.

You see them as an explanation (almost justification), and you empathise. I see this level of insecurity as danger.

 

Let's look at this other guy, the one that she most recently broke up with you over.

She says he's "disgusting", and you think that maybe she's just too insecure to have turned down his advances?

I say baloney-- she went way out of her way to see this guy!

 

Badmouthing him now says one of 2 things, either:

 

1.) She's lying to throw you off target (so that you feel secure again, and will not protest when she continues looking around), or

2.) She's so unstable, and so in need of attention that she's willing to sleep with someone she finds disgusting.

And if (2) If this is the case, then how will you ever be able to be trust that she's not going to do it with someone else?

Worse-- how do you know that she's not been doing it with you?

A user will use people for attention, for money, shelter, power-- for whatever it is that they need.

You are a pretty constant supply of unconditional support, wouldn't you say?

 

If she felt "disgust" it was more likely self-loathing for wanting to be with another man, and indulging in it.

(I'll say more about the guilt in a minute)

 

In any case, there has way too much deception going on.

 

You're worried about various other stresses that may have impacted the relationship, but no matter-- the same core problems keep cropping up:

 

BUT SHE NEVER TALKED TO ME ABOUT ANY OF THIS. The only reason I was even considering moving away was because she told me soooo many times that she would follow me anywhere

 

 

It's horrible when the words and actions of people just don't add up.

Obviously it's hard to put stock in anything she says when by your own admission she is being so erratic.

[odile]

So, instead of trusting her (which you clearly can't), it sounds like you are relying a great deal on what her family says to you.

Her family has been advising you, as they no doubt have been advising her.

 

It's nice that they like you, and that you like them, but there are all sorts of complications with this level of involvement.

We encounter a variety of problems here: the family is impacting the choices that you make, and they are likely influencing her, as well.

 

They no doubt have the best intentions, and clearly they want things to work out between you.

Nice, except for they have this on their agenda-- they are not allowing things to happen as they may, and so are interfering.

 

You are relying on what they say as much as you are on what she says and does.

Unless this is an open relationship involving all of the members, this is not the way that things ought be balanced-- this relationship should be primarily between YOU and YOUR GIRLFRIEND.

 

In regard to you, they are colouring your ability to think for yourself.

One example is that they saw fit to pick and choose what they were and weren't open with you about: They didn't tell you about her near break-down and return home, yet disclose what they want you to hear (encouragement, etc).

 

If you are relying on them, rather than your intellect here, then you are liable to miss clues.

You say that none of them think that she cheated on you. This could be reassuring, but it is no guarantee.

Liars and cheaters can be incredibly smooth, and if she can be duplicitous enough that you-- the person she lives with--

didn't know certain bits of information until a year after the fact, for example, then couldn't she just as easily hide things from them?

 

If you wonder why she might hide things from them, consider that she might be conflicted regarding loyalties.

Because you are so close to her family, she may be worried that anything she says to them will be leaked to you, and so feels the need to play all cards very close to her chest. She doesn't want to lose you until she's ready.

 

As far as the influence her family may have on encouraging her to cling to a relationship that she is obviously conflicted about, consider how much she goes out of her way not to upset her mother

(

she would never do anything to make her mom worry as this contributes to her psychosis

)

 

And, if she is really, really insecure, (needs the amount of external validation that you are indicating), she may also question whether her family loves her unconditionally. Perhaps she sees your closeness to them as a threat; like if the two of you break up, that she will not just disappoint (and potentially lose) you, but that she will be disappointing the rest of her support network-- all of whom seem to really be pushing for this relationship to work.

Perhaps she is dreading the perceived conflicts of interest that might arise due to your closeness with her brother. In any case, what they say is affecting her decisions as well (look at the incident with the letter you sent regarding children, and the way that her sister stepped in and so easily swayed her...your girlfriend is too indecisive, and confused at the moment).

 

She's not being open, and she's not being honest.

Maybe she's having a hard time being honest with herself, but there's no way for you to stand a chance at a relationship with her until she comes to know her own mind, and to learn to be a bit more independent.

 

I do not believe that you will be able to heal her, as much as you wish that you could.

The best way for you to support her needs is to back off.

 

You mention potentially going NC for a while, and I think that it makes sense to do this indefinitely.

She's going to need some real breathing room; from you, and in a different way, from her family.

 

Unless the her family are the only friends that you have, I think that you can help this move faster if you back off a bit, and spend more time with your own family, and your other friends. When you hang out with her brother, do not discuss your personal relationship any longer.

She needs her family to be her family, and NC will not work if you are always discussing her with her kin.

 

There are many signs pointing in a dark direction, but there's no way to make sense of any of it without some time and space.

[odile]

You need to be strong about this.

 

Right now, you ARE being too easy. It's not good for either of you.

The thing here about taking time off is that she KNOWS you'll do anything, and accept anything just to have her around..

I'm sorry, but if even you haven't spelled it out in words as you have here-- that you would forgive anything just to be with her-- she can probably sense as much.

She knows you're a willing doormat, and my guess is that this is only another source of guilt-- guilt for using such a loving person (that's you) in this fashion.

 

I don't think 3 months away will change this.

I'll bet 3 months away may find her missing the comfort, and supply of validation that you regularly and unconditionally supply.

But 3 months "without reinforcement" is not long enough for her to imagine having lost you, cos she'll know (you've made it clear already) that you're there waiting.

Oh, and she will most likely return to you very soon if you'll allow it. And she will most likely cheat on you again if she does.

 

You speak of stresses that may have culminated in what you see as a "perfect storm" that drove her away?

And yet you were not fighting. You were there for her, and it was she who chose not to share with you.

There was no external "perfect storm"; there were stresses, but nothing that a healthier couple could not have weathered together.

You were not in the wrong here, as it is she that has been irresponsible-- out of control with her feelings and her conduct.

 

She even had the nerve to ask:

What if I hurt you again? I can't control myself. What if I do it again? What if I cheat on you?

 

Right now she is testing to see how much more crap you will take. And until she gets help, she will take what she can, and then some, believe me.

 

You can try to have empathy with her internal storm, if you like.

It seems you want so badly to convince yourself that the two of you can be together.

Consider this: Say somehow that all of this blows over, and you marry, and have children. What then?

If she buckles to stress in this fashion, what do you do when you have a family of your own, and even bigger stresses on a regular basis?

How will she be able to take care of your children? How will you be able to take care of your children if you have to take care of her?

 

Stay firm. Enforce the NC. You can't force her to go to therapy (though this is precisely what she needs).

But you can withdraw some of what is enabling her to continue to flounder in this fashion-- withdraw your support.

If you stay, you are accepting, and thereby encouraging the behaviour.

 

She is just too all over the place. Keep a healthy distance until she has willingly and actively taken control of her life, and worked through some therapy on her own.

One visit is not enough, and meds alone are not enough.

 

And if in a year or so you want to consider trying again, then take that time to re-evaluate how you both feel, and whether she has made any progress towards finding her own internal balance.

[baffled]

Wow! Thanks for the responses guys. I probably should have made cliff notes so you didn't have to take notes yourself odile .

 

Sure, go ahead and ask her about the concert but don't be surprised if she can't give you a definite answer. She can't tell you whether or not she will be comfortable hanging out with you as friends in 2 months. She won't know until the day gets a lot closer. Did you ever look into any assistance she may be eligible for in regards to her medication? How much does the RX cost a month? Considering how much you know about her psychological disorders I find it odd that her RX cost was not put into your monthly budget.

 

 

Turns out I should be able to get good seats to the show even if I wait awhile -- got a friend who works at the venue -- so I'm not going to ask her unless things change. odile helped convince me to be done with this, probably for good, and AT LEAST until she makes some big changes and makes the effort to really get back in touch.

 

As far as the RX goes, we were getting her meds just fine. The reason she went off them ~1 year ago for like 3 months is because... well, she didn't keep up with her psych appointments and she was afraid her doctor would yell at her because she fell behind!! I think she initially went off them because she was super addicted to her online game and didn't make the effort to go. The problem is that these type of meds often need to be re-adjusted, and she definitely needs therapy on top of it. We couldn't afford the therapy and doctor's appointments (but we could have now as we're done with school

[baffled]

Well, let me tell you-- not fighting is not an indicator of a good relationship.

In fact, good couples do sometimes fight, and know how to fight healthily.

They hash out concerns and disagreements, and find pro-active solutions together.

Sweeping stuff under the rug (in your case), or failure to disclose things (in her case) are not appropriate solutions to concerns.

 

In fact, such seemingly placid relationships-- where two people make 'nice' just to get along (while sometimes hiding what they might really feel) can often blow up, as they have in this instance.

 

 

Oh, don't get me wrong, we definitely fought sometimes. But, from my end, it was always resolved and things were fine. I never really swept stuff under the rug -- it's just that if I can deal with something myself then I don't feel the need to bring it up to her if it will bother her or cause a fight. Things were fine from my end. Of course it takes two, and things weren't fine from her end and I didn't know about it, and now I'm here.

 

No questions asked? Mmhmm. She didn't want your feathers to be ruffled... but she didn't necessarily want to stop doing whatever she was doing, either. And she lied to you (by omission, at the least) about that situation, so how do you know is there weren't other situations that you were in the dark about?

 

Well, let me clarify a bit here. She deleted everything without any prompting from me. I even told her she didn't have to delete her game as the problem wasn't with the game itself, but she insisted because it put her in a position that she didn't want to be in. She actually freaked out a day or two later and restarted her game and got her characters back (she was sooo addicted to it), but she changed her name and server to get away from the guy. I was actually playing at the time too and we would play together, and since I didn't play as much as her, she would actually play on my PC and want me to watch while I was studying or whatever. So it certainly didn't SEEM like she continued to hide stuff, but ya know there's always a chance.

 

So, she withheld her true feelings/concerns from you. If she had been that close to breaking up then-- and you were never spoken with about how seriously she'd considered this-- then clearly there were some unresolved issues lurking about (either between you, or with this other man/men, or both).

 

Yup, agree here. I'm fairly certain there wasn't another man, as she was always at home with me, and see my comments about the online guy above. According to her, the unresolved issues were guilt from her end, and that I never "punished her" (her words). She felt terrible that she was talking to another man about me and about her problems with me. There could have been more, but nothing surfaced until a year later.

 

Let's look at a year ago (saw it in your depression thread), when she almost broke up with you just before she was meant to move in together with you.

(sidenote-- any chance that at that time, she may have panicked at moving the relationship closer to a commitment that she was unsure of?)

 

Yes, it's certainly possible. Here's the thing -- before our break up and during, she kept saying over and over how much better I was than her and that I deserved better. She would even occassionally say this before this latest debacle. I'm fairly sure this wasn't all due to guilt, it's mainly due to her low self-esteem as her saying this stuff was often in conjunction with her feeling down about herself. I think part of her was always afraid I would leave her -- we were definitely having a rough patch around that time a year ago, and I was clearly unhappy too at times but I was also clear that I felt we could work through it. Oh... we were already living together at the time, it was just a different apartment. MUCH too small for us, which I felt was a huge part of the problem as we were on top of each other 24/7. And the reason I think her thoughts were related to her depression -- (mentioned in the other thread) after one single counseling session and her getting back on her meds, she came home to her parents and said everything was fine. We moved in, and things were great for months. I'm sure she was having "doubts", but I think the best explanation given what I know is that a lot of the doubt was due to her depression and low self-esteem.

 

Just because you are taken by surprise by all of this does not mean that it was out of the blue.

She lied regarding her involvement w/others. She took A YEAR to make a move to some potentially greener pasture.

Dear, this is not impulse.

Perhaps she had not slept with anyone yet (how can we be sure?), but it is certainly clear that she was having an emotional affair (or two, or who knows how many-- behind your back. and lying to your face on a daily basis by leading you to believe that she was not doing what she was doing).

 

I agree, I don't think it was out of the blue, she had been thinking about it for some time. I don't believe she had been thinking about it for a year -- I just think a year ago is when leaving first crossed her mind. There were long stretches where she was clearly happy in the past year. But you're right, her leaving wasn't an impulse.

 

I'm not SURE she hadn't slept with anyone else, but there was really no opportunity for her to that I can see. We were always together, or she was with her family, or at work (where her mom works). IF there was cheating, I would (well, should have) known about it from her family, as they love me and would know it was unacceptable. If for nothing else, then because of STDs. Her family is pretty clearly on my side with this as much as they possibly can be. They ALL know that she screwed me over. I also know my ex well enough, that unless she was lying to me pretty much 100% the last 4+ years, that she wouldn't cheat on me physically because of the possibility of STDs (at the very least). She insisted we both get tested before we slept together initially, plus there are various other reasons for me to think she wouldn't do this. It's not something she would be nonchalant about.

 

As far as the emotional affair goes, I don't think she was lying to me on a daily basis for the last year. She was completely off of her online game until October or November, and then when she was playing again she would always play next to me on the couch or whatever. She would also routinely show me her myspace page, if for nothing else to show me comments her friends would make about me (good things), so there was no hiding of things there. It wasn't until 2 maybe 3 weeks before she left that she started playing her game upstairs while I was downstairs, and that's when she started acted weird. I attributed it to stress from her test, hah

[baffled]

She says he's "disgusting", and you think that maybe she's just too insecure to have turned down his advances?

I say baloney-- she went way out of her way to see this guy!

 

Well, my impression of things was that she certainly didn't find him disgusting initially. It was after she found out he lied to her about everything. Once she did, she immediately left. He was MUCH older than he said he was. I do think PART of the reason she slept with him so quickly was because of low self esteem -- the whole self-validation through promiscuity, needing attention and for the guy to think she's beautiful, etc. Regardless, I'm fairly positive she didn't go to him simply for sex (or at least leave me for this reason) -- there were no problems with our sex life and it was fantastic for her almost always, other than it being a little more infrequent lately (busy schedules and stress, and I had been sick for about 1.5 weeks before she left... I had to turn her down a couple times and I'm sure that didn't help her self-esteem any I DO think she went to him for her emotional needs since she even said she felt like she couldn't talk to me, and that's what was lacking that he provided. I think sleeping with him followed naturally after she had left me.

 

Badmouthing him now says one of 2 things, either:

 

1.) She's lying to throw you off target (so that you feel secure again, and will not protest when she continues looking around), or

2.) She's so unstable, and so in need of attention that she's willing to sleep with someone she finds disgusting.

And if (2) If this is the case, then how will you ever be able to be trust that she's not going to do it with someone else?

Worse-- how do you know that she's not been doing it with you?

 

Both of these could be true. As far as how do I know she's not being doing it with me (finds me disgusting)... well... haha, that would be pretty extreme but I guess I can't discount it. She was pretty darn adamant throughout our whole relationship... right up until the end (other than our rocky patch a year ago and a few other fights we had)... that she wanted to spend her life with me and have kids. Told everyone this. Her family, school friends, my friends. But yeah, I suppose she could be that nuts, who knows at this point? I'll say this, if THAT were true, then at that point I wouldn't be surprised if someone popped out and said I had been on a game show the last 4 years.

 

It's horrible when the words and actions of people just don't add up.

Obviously it's hard to put stock in anything she says when by your own admission she is being so erratic.

 

Yup. The erratic behavior has only been during/since the break up though (and during her few noticeable bouts of depression), so at least I THINK I know her fairly well when she's healthy.

[baffled]

So, instead of trusting her (which you clearly can't), it sounds like you are relying a great deal on what her family says to you.

Her family has been advising you, as they no doubt have been advising her.

 

It's nice that they like you, and that you like them, but there are all sorts of complications with this level of involvement.

We encounter a variety of problems here: the family is impacting the choices that you make, and they are likely influencing her, as well.

 

They no doubt have the best intentions, and clearly they want things to work out between you.

Nice, except for they have this on their agenda-- they are not allowing things to happen as they may, and so are interfering.

 

You are relying on what they say as much as you are on what she says and does.

 

I completely agree with the rest of your post, but I would like to point out that I'm not completely relying on stuff her family has told me. As you pointed out earlier, I realize that she is very likely not telling them things out of fear it will get leaked back to me, and there are probably things that her sister, for instance, wouldn't tell me anyway. Basically, I'm taking what they tell me as part of the puzzle, and weighting it appropriately (well behind her actions, and what I get from her directly).

 

In regard to you, they are colouring your ability to think for yourself.

One example is that they saw fit to pick and choose what they were and weren't open with you about: They didn't tell you about her near break-down and return home, yet disclose what they want you to hear (encouragement, etc).

 

Well, I'm fairly sure they hid the previous break-down because they didn't want it to hurt our relationship. Everything seemed fine from their end a year ago -- she went to a counselor and the problem (magically) disappeared Only her brother knew about this anyway (well, her mom and dad too I guess), and the other night was the first real opportunity he had to tell me everything he wanted to tell me. They are also not shy about giving me discouragement -- in fact, the majority of what they tell me is discouraging in the sense that she seems to very much have her mind made up right now and they let me know this. It's the lack of real, legitimate reasons for leaving that throws me off (or at least the problems she had with the relationship), as well as the stress/confusion/psych problems. Throws them off too I suppose.

[odile]

I completely agree with the rest of your post, but I would like to point out that I'm not completely relying on stuff her family has told me.

 

Fair enough, but my point was really that you should take any and all 2nd hand information with a massive grain of salt, lest you otherwise find false hope

 

Well, I'm fairly sure they hid the previous break-down because they didn't want it to hurt our relationship.

 

Clearly, but as I pointed out, it just goes to prove the point that, with the best intentions, they are picking and choosing which information they give you because they want you two to work out.

It's just foolish of them, though. Misguided, really. I mean, it wasn't necessarily their place to discuss it, but

 

A.) If they're going to be mixing themselves up in it, and disclosing things regardless, then they should have sense enough to be frank and open accross the board.

 

B.)It was the ex who should have been more open with you in the first place.

She never should have hid that from you, and it seems wrong that they supported the omission.

 

Everything seemed fine from their end a year ago -- she went to a counselor and the problem (magically) disappeared

 

Yeah, well I guess they all learned the hard way that things like that don't just "magically disappear".

Big problems require honest hard work.

Instead, stuff was swept under the rug, where it lay in wait to trip her up later.

 

Only her brother knew about this anyway (well, her mom and dad too I guess), and the other night was the first real opportunity he had to tell me everything he wanted to tell me.

 

"First opportunity", when you hang out as often as you do?

I'm sorry, but I don't buy that for a second. It may have been the first opportunity in which they felt in their judgement that you should know the truth, but I'm afraid that that's a very different thing to "first opportunity".

 

They are also not shy about giving me discouragement -- in fact, the majority of what they tell me is discouraging in the sense that she seems to very much have her mind made up right now and they let me know this.

 

I'm sorry that the outlook seems to point in a direction that isn't really what you were hoping for.

 

It's the lack of real, legitimate reasons for leaving that throws me off (or at least the problems she had with the relationship), as well as the stress/confusion/psych problems. Throws them off too I suppose.

 

Sweetie, the psych problems in this case are real, legitimate reasons.

And I'm talking way beyond the diagnosis of OCD and depression here.

It just seems like there is way too much in her head, and she's going to need professional help-- and a lot of time-- to sort through it all.

 

As for you, give yourself some time to reflect honestly on all that she's done to cause you pain, and to realistically

evaluate whether you could see her-- in her current state-- as someone whom you could legitimately call a good partner.

It's a massive disappointment, no doubt, and will be a difficult thing to come to terms with.

If you find that you're really struggling to accept and/or cope with the harsh reality of the situation, you might benefit from talking to a counselor who can help you process the grief and confusion that you are most undoubtably feeling at the moment.

[baffled]

You're great odile. Thanks for taking the time to help.

 

"First opportunity", when you hang out as often as you do?

I'm sorry, but I don't buy that for a second. It may have been the first opportunity in which they felt in their judgement that you should know the truth, but I'm afraid that that's a very different thing to "first opportunity".

 

I actually don't hang out with the brother that often. In fact, last Thursday was the first time I'd hung out with him without the ex around. We're really good friends though and have talked on the phone. It's actually the ex's brother-in-LAW that I hang out with all the time, and he intentionally keeps out of the situation due to conflict of interest (doesn't talk to his wife much about it on purpose). You're right in that he COULD have told me earlier though, but certainly thought it wasn't his place as everything seemed fine from his end until now. He honestly probably didn't even think to tell me (since it was so long ago), until we hung out b/c our conversations on the phone were fairly brief.

 

I'm sorry that the outlook seems to point in a direction that isn't really what you were hoping for.

 

Yeah, I'm still holding out hope though since her seeming "sure" of her decision was not long after the break up. They definitely think she's messed up right now. I love her so much

 

 

 

Sweetie, the psych problems in this case are real, legitimate reasons.

And I'm talking way beyond the diagnosis of OCD and depression here.

It just seems like there is way too much in her head, and she's going to need professional help-- and a lot of time-- to sort through it all.

 

Yeah. I meant more "real reasons" from my end -- all the doubts she was having about MY feelings and intentions were incorrect. The psych problems are definitely real from her end... didn't mean to imply they weren't.

 

As for you, give yourself some time to reflect honestly on all that she's done to cause you pain, and to realistically

evaluate whether you could see her-- in her current state-- as someone whom you could legitimately call a good partner.

It's a massive disappointment, no doubt, and will be a difficult thing to come to terms with.

If you find that you're really struggling to accept and/or cope with the harsh reality of the situation, you might benefit from talking to a counselor who can help you process the grief and confusion that you are most undoubtably feeling at the moment.

 

I think I'm doing much better -- the mornings are the worst as I start all over blaming myself for what happened. Thinking I didn't give her enough love, attention, listen and pay attention enough, etc. I know there isn't much I could have done though. I will surely think about things long and hard over the next several weeks.

 

Thanks again for the help!

[odile]

Yeah. I meant more "real reasons" from my end -- all the doubts she was having about MY feelings and intentions were incorrect. The psych problems are definitely real from her end... didn't mean to imply they weren't.

 

Well the psych problems seem to have a lot to do with what she simplified as "doubt".

This has nothing to do with what YOUR feelings were, or anything that you could have done to convince her. This has to do with her own warped perception.

 

Incidentally, sometimes people who feel guilty about things (like, wanting to see other people), or have fears of commitment/abandonment, or have any number of issues that cause them to feel insecure, will project that doubt as belonging to their S.O.

They'll pick fights, and create conflict as a way to get out of what they know would be a great relationship for someone, but for whatever reason isn't working for them.

It's sort of like... passive-aggressive sabotage of the relationship.

It's a way to force an "out".

 

I think I'm doing much better -- the mornings are the worst as I start all over blaming myself for what happened. Thinking I didn't give her enough love, attention, listen and pay attention enough, etc. I know there isn't much I could have done though. I will surely think about things long and hard over the next several weeks.

 

You're right to think that there wasn't much you could have done differently.

It sounds like you have a big heart, and are very loyal, and from everything you've told us, it really does seem like the girl is just in some other reality.

 

You really cannot blame yourself for this.