Ex friendships

[renaissancewoman101]

Recently I read a few threads where people posted about being friends with the ex (because they worried about them or cared about their well-being, etc), and a lot of the responders got up in arms about how it was NOT a good thing to be friends with the ex and why should they care how the ex is doing.

 

I could see why it could be bad to be friends with an ex, esp with new SO's but I don't see it as being wrong to become friends with ex's. To me, it is a sign of maturity that people can look beyond the breakup to the friendship that once was there.

 

I dunno, maybe I have such an optimistic view about ex friendships.

[JadedStar]

Well Ren you and i have kind of talked about this in great length off and on in the past, what i have said before still stands in my mind. There are a few instances where friendship with an ex is fine:

 

1) BOTH parties are over their feelings. When one is hanging on the friendship is going to become strained for her or him, or both. It is hurtful to hang onto someone you want who is moving on without you> I can't figure why anyone would willingly want this emotional torture.

2) Once over the feelings the two of you have a good and congenial friendship. In the case of one of your ex's you are friends with - that would be just fine if he respected you. If an ex disrespects you, a person should can that friendship for good. Friends should enhance our lives, not drag it down.

3) If both parties are still single when the break up is still somewhat new but they are not in love anymore they can be friends. Even if they are over each other if the relationship wasn't somewhat long ago it can really make current SO's uncomfortable, and rightfully so. They can't know for certain if the feelings truly have abated. In these cases I say the loyalty should lie with the current partner vs the ex. Sounds mean, but the current partner should get the loyalty. For instance i am casual friends with my first husband because it was so long ago and obvious that we have both moved on.

[JeckyllNHyde]

i don't find it wrong.

my bf however doesn't understand how i can be friends with an ex.

i guess you have to be able to be friends with an ex successfully to get that it can be possible and not a bad thing per se.

me and my ex care for each other. heck, we're each others best friend. however we don't hang out as regular best friends would alone, nor do we go to movies, etc.. i feel if you're in a relationship and it causes problems with yor current SO, you need to respect that too and come to a compromise where everyone is happy.

[JadedStar]

i don't find it wrong.

my bf however doesn't understand how i can be friends with an ex.

i guess you have to be able to be friends with an ex successfully to get that it can be possible and not a bad thing per se.

me and my ex care for each other. heck, we're each others best friend. however we don't hang out as regular best friends would alone, nor do we go to movies, etc.. i feel if you're in a relationship and it causes problems with yor current SO, you need to respect that too and come to a compromise where everyone is happy.

 

I also think if it compromises the relationship with the ex's current SO it should be avoided as well.

[JeckyllNHyde]

oh and I fully agree with Jaded.

Both parties HAVE to be over their feelings for each other.. otherwise it's not so much of a true friendship.

[browneyedgirl36]

I agree with all of the above.

 

Ren, we've discussed this before on other threads, and I agree with you that a lot of people think exes shouldn't be friends, but I think that in most cases, when posters respond in that way, they're considering a lot of the stuff that I quoted from JadedStar's post.

 

Case in point: Me and my ex. We are trying to be friends, but I don't think it's working for me, and I may need to cut it off. Why? Well...

 

1) He is in a relationship with someone else. This in itself wouldn't be a dealbreaker in terms of friendship, if not for the fact that...

 

2) I still have very strong feelings for him, which is compounded by the fact that...

 

3) His current relationship is having serious problems (NOT because of me - it's been on and off for years, long before I came along) and he is sending a LOT of mixed signals. I'm not going to post it all here now (I may post my own thread at some point, but I'm trying to sort it all out right now, and it's pretty jumbled in my head), but he has recently been gravitating toward me, talking about how he feels about me, etc. -- and it's very hard on me because I still have those feelings and he is not available.

 

So, I'm thinking of cutting the friendship off -- not because I'm not mature, but because I AM mature enough to admit when something is simply too hard for me to handle right now, and if I am to get over him -- for real -- that may mean limiting my interaction with him to strictly work-related conversations.

 

I totally understand your points, Ren. In a perfect world, we'd ALL be able to be friends with our exes (at least the ones we really care about and with whom we parted on reasonably good terms). The reality, though, is that it isn't always possible, at least initially. I think that definitely, down the road, even if they can't do it right away, exes CAN be friends, but sometimes a lot of time needs to pass before that can happen.

 

I recently had an ex that I broke up with in 1991 (we were young and growing up and apart, and I didn't see a future with him), who got in contact with me (by Googling me and finding my e-mail address), and now we're friends. He is married, and his wife knows about me and is OK with him contacting me. In fact, I'm planning to visit them in their city at some point. The thing is, he was really hurt when I broke up with him -- he told me it devastated him for a LONG time -- and I wouldn't have expected him to be my friend back then. Now that a lot of time has passed and we've both grown up and moved on in our lives, we have that friendship again, and it's really nice. 17 years is a long time, I know, but I'm glad it happened at all!

[browneyedgirl36]

I also think if it compromises the relationship with the ex's current SO it should be avoided as well.

 

I agree. I work with my ex, and I have avoided calling him, e-mailing, texting, etc., out of respect for their relationship. HE is the one who has been contacting me, and I'm feeling pretty iffy about it. Their relationship has been going badly, and I think they're ready to end it, but I still don't want to do anything that causes additional strife between them.

[renaissancewoman101]

BEG, if he came to you and wanted to get back together with you, would you consider it? I do find it honorable that you are willing to remove yourself out of the picture, esp when he is having issues with his current SO and thus maybe would want to reconcile with you. I don't advocate causing strife in an ex's life, but I will be honest and say this, if I had an ex I still somewhat "liked" and if he was having problems with his current SO, I probably would be happy in my heart because maybe then he and I could reconcile (but that's neither here nor there since the ex I am friends with, his bf grudgingly accepts our friendship and I try to spend time with the both of them).

[JeckyllNHyde]

I also think if it compromises the relationship with the ex's current SO it should be avoided as well.

 

yea, true. it's so much harder having to step away specially if you have a nice friendship with the ex. and specially if they are one of the few people you can count on, but it's the right thing to do.

 

i've been there. . . kind of.

but we kind of drifted apart. (and wasn't an ex, just someone who had a big crush on me for a long time). i got my bf, he got his gf. and he seemed still bitter about me finding a bf. plus his new gf was not comfy with us talking much.

[JadedStar]

outstanding point i bolded above and one often forgotten. Many think it is a sign of weakness if they avoid a friendship with an ex they have not gotten over. I find it to be a sign of strength and in your case, a sign of "unseflishness" since he is already having problems with his SO. A strong friendship with you right now surely won't help in that dept. better to let him see if he can work it out without interference. If it doesn't work out and by chance you two cross paths again, then the playing field might have changed.

 

 

I also agree that in a perfect world, sure, we'd all be friends with ex's. In many cases it is a perfect situation since that person is comfortable and the known. But this isn't a perfect world and the friendship can hurt other people, or ourselves. Thus it is not always practical. Sometimes we have to do things for the good of other people or even what is best for ourselves even if it is hard. That is when we are practicing self constraint.

[browneyedgirl36]

BEG, if he came to you and wanted to get back together with you, would you consider it? I do find it honorable that you are willing to remove yourself out of the picture, esp when he is having issues with his current SO and thus maybe would want to reconcile with you. I don't advocate causing strife in an ex's life, but I will be honest and say this, if I had an ex I still somewhat "liked" and if he was having problems with his current SO, I probably would be happy in my heart because maybe then he and I could reconcile (but that's neither here nor there since the ex I am friends with, his bf grudgingly accepts our friendship and I try to spend time with the both of them).

 

I would consider it, yes. I love him, and would love to have him in my life. However, now is not the time for me to be heavily in his life. We discussed all of this the other night, and he clearly DOES have some feelings for me. I think he's already decided (at least as of right now) that his relationship is over, BUT...until it is, he is still with her, and I know it's best if I back off and let them sort it out in whatever way they need to, whether it's to try to make it work OR to break up. And, I wouldn't want him to dump her and come running to me -- that would be a huge red flag. He really needs time to sort himself out, and he can't do that if he comes running to me and never takes time to process everything. Things he said recently indicate that he doesn't intend to try to "rebound" with me -- he knows he shouldn't do that.

 

I admit that while I'm not "happy" that my ex and his ex are having problems, I feel some relief in the sense that I couldn't fathom why, after several failed attempts at a relationship over the last decade or so, he would continue to keep going back to her every time she wanted him back, and this is just further proof that they probably shouldn't be together. That said, I want him to be happy, and it does not make me happy to see him hurting as he admitted to me that is.

[bulletproof]

I agree with the other posters- being friends with an ex in and of itself is not always a bad thing. In your particular situation, however, it doesn't seem to be the healthiest relationship. Any friendship should have a mutual respect.

[JadedStar]

BEG, if he came to you and wanted to get back together with you, would you consider it? I do find it honorable that you are willing to remove yourself out of the picture, esp when he is having issues with his current SO and thus maybe would want to reconcile with you. I don't advocate causing strife in an ex's life, but I will be honest and say this, if I had an ex I still somewhat "liked" and if he was having problems with his current SO, I probably would be happy in my heart because maybe then he and I could reconcile (but that's neither here nor there since the ex I am friends with, his bf grudgingly accepts our friendship and I try to spend time with the both of them).

 

Would you really be happy knowing you were second choice? that is likely how it would play out if you reconciled by hovering over an ex going thru troubles in a relationship. All relationships have turmoil and the last thing any of them needs is a needy ex adding fuel to the fire. Sorry to say this so bluntly, but it is not a very nice thing to do.

[renaissancewoman101]

Would you really be happy knowing you were second choice? that is likely how it would play out if you reconciled by hovering over an ex going thru troubles in a relationship. All relationships have turmoil and the last thing any of them needs is a needy ex adding fuel to the fire. Sorry to say this so bluntly, but it is not a very nice thing to do.

 

JS, if I was in that situation, I would not "interfere" with the relationship but I cannot say I would not feel something in me if an ex I still cared about was having problems with his current SO, esp if he had left me for her. Words and feelings are just that, but I would NOT interfere in their relationship. To me, that would be wrong.

 

But, I would see myself as the person to be their friend, listen to them, be there for them while they went through their issues, because I care about them and want the best for them and to be a support person for them.

 

Actually, I've been somewhat in those shoes before. My best friend (crazy first ex), has had serious issues with his bf before and I've always been there for him, listening to him, comforting him, sometimes hoping that he would leave his bf (but never encouraging him to do that).

 

Not sure how to put it, but I seem to like to play the "supportive" role in my friendships AND relationships.

[JadedStar]

But see that is the problem. By you being the "supportive friend" who is also an ex who shared intimacy, that in itself can cause problems.

 

The number one cause of cheating in many surveys is when an SO is being comforted by a friend of the opposite sex and when that friend is an ex they slept with, it is magnified. That is why we say Ren that being a friend during these times is not a good or noble idea.

 

Are you being supportive and listening because you are really a good friend? Or because of the ulterior motive? I think that is a question you need to answer inside of yourself honestly. Not to us, but to yourself. If your intent is noble, you will bow down as friend because at this time it is not appropriate nor is it respectful to that ex's current relationship. That ex can find other friends. If your aim is true, you will take the selfless road and go no contact so that he can mend his fences with his partner on his own. I do not think any ex who still has feelings for the person should be there consoling and lending an ear. It is a recipe for disaster and VERY disrespectful. If that were me, i'd be pretty fired up if i had an SO getting a shoulder from an ex who still carried the torch.

[browneyedgirl36]

I agree with this, and I am struggling with this very thing right now. I already feel guilty for the little bit the ex has told me about his relationship. He should be telling HER he is unhappy -- not me. Actually, he told me that they have both agreed it's not working out but they haven't gotten any further in the discussion than that.

 

I know I need to step back, which is exactly what I'm doing. He is confused, and I don't want to add needlessly to that confusion or to any other issues he's having. Plus, I really, really don't want to get myself all tangled up in a mess. He needs to figure things out for himself and not use me as a crutch or an escape hatch. I've made it clear that I care, and that I hope things turn out well for him, but beyond that, I don't think there's anything I can or should do. I even feel guilty for saying as much as I did, for even listening as much as I did (even though we haven't discussed it extensively), and I know that I need to do the right thing and take myself out of the equation.

[renaissancewoman101]

As I once said before, I don't see it being wrong to be there as a "friend" for your ex, even if, deep in your heart, you harbor some small, teeny hope of reconciling. You once loved and cared for your ex, sometimes it is hard to stop doing so.

 

JS, in regards to my crazy first ex, we will never get back together as gf/bf because he's gay. I know that. But I care about him a lot (my "mothering" instinct in me) and I try to be there for him because his bf is not there for him in "emotional" ways. I do know there is some thread of jealousy, but his bf and I are guarded with each other, but ok.

 

I know my views may not be acceptable or popular, but I am being honest on here.

 

BEG, I don't think you did anything wrong. You just listened to him as a caring friend. Let me ask you this question, who as a caring and concerned person would be cruel enough to cut off someone they cared about, esp when they are suffering and sometimes need someone to listen to them, provide some advice, etc.? Compassion, sometimes, can do a lot of good and go a long way.

[JadedStar]

This is where we disagree. An ex who is carrying the torch should be the last person consoling the ex with relationship issues. I find it to be very disrespectful and there is likely not a person alive who would appreciate an ex doing this sort of thing when she or he is having relationship troubles. Would you yourself appreciate an ex hanging on waiting in the wings for every dispute you had if you were dating a man right now? Them waiting to lunge at the oppty to sieze your guy back? Knowing you the way i do and how you stress I dare say you'd be creating threads about how you'd like for her to back off and be respectful of your relationship.

 

 

Your views might or might not be "popular", that isn't my point in responding. Whether it is popular or not the fact is the view is selfish in my opinion. You are thinking of yourself really, and you might believe it is only to lend a shoulder but that ulterior motive is alive and well, if not, you would tell the ex that in his best interests you feel you should pull back so that he can work in his current relationship wihtout your interference. What you are saying is cruel cutting someone off, is in fact the kindest thing you can do for them. It is cruel in your mind because you want to be in that person's life at all costs.

 

I would hate to date someone with an ex who is clinging on and being needy the way you are Ren. I guess I am just being honest too.

 

This isn't compassion you speak of. It is actions that IMO are after self gain. There is little compassion in hanging onto someone who is in another relationship and being there to give him a shoulder to cry on. Your advice is NEVER going to be impartial, thus rendering it practically useless. If he needs advice it should come from a very NEUTRAL third party. You are not the only one who exists to provide him advice. In a way this is some type of martyr complex, perhaps, that you are believing you are the only person around who could possibly offer him comfort and advice.

 

LIke i said we agree to disagree because you have convinced yourself that these actions are compassionate. I believe they are selfish acts for self gain cloaked under the guise of compassion.

[browneyedgirl36]

I agree with you about compassion. It is hard to turn my back on someone who is hurting, especially someone I care so much for. I admit I struggle with this. I HATE to see my ex hurting. In fact, a few times, I've gone home and cried because of something he said or because I knew he was in pain. Obviously, I'd never let him see me do that.

 

I also see Jaded's point, though: I DO harbor hope that he will break up with her and want to be with me, so talking with him about his problems with her and "counselling" him is not a good idea - it's not respectful to their relationship, and it isn't really fair to me, either, because I'm setting myself up for further heartbreak. And, as Jaded pointed out, I have to ask myself what I would want another woman to do if my boyfriend or husband was unhappy in our relationship and talking to her about it, especially if she was an ex. I wouldn't like it, and I would hope she would back off.

 

In fairness to me, I haven't responded much to my ex's commentary on his relationship; he has made a few passing comments about it at work, to which I've simply replied, "I'm sorry that you're having a hard time." Otherwise, I haven't really responded at all, other than listening. He even wrote me an e-mail in which he talked about it a bit, and while I did respond, I ignored those parts in my response. I just don't want to get in a position where I am talking to him in depth about his relationship issues. It makes me uncomfortable, AND it's not respectful of his relationship, in my opinion.

 

I totally understand your points, Ren, but I understand Jaded's too, and being in this situation right now, I have to say that I have come to the conclusion that it's best for me to back off and let him figure things out on his own. Plus, as Jaded said, he does have other friends he can talk to, and perhaps talking to a more impartial third party would be best.

[renaissancewoman101]

BEG thanks for your post. I can see how much you struggle with not trying to be friends with your ex and also wanting good for him.

 

JS, personally, I think you're a bit harsh with me. If you knew me personally, you would see that I am a caring and understanding person and I don't try to interefere or take my ex away from his bf. For example, this weekend we spent one day together (the three of us). We went shopping and such and I took my ex and his bf out to dinner (to celebrate his bf getting a new job). I didn't have to do that, but I did it because I cared and because I like to promote a non-hostile friendship when we all hang out (and we all hang out usually on the weekends). I don't see my ex alone a lot because his bf gets "weird" about that, but we talk most mornings for a bit, as he is driving to work.

 

JS, I know it may seem selfish to you, but it isn't as though his bf is telling me to leave them.

 

I know I am beating a dead horse so I will stop now. The more I post about this, the bigger the hole I seem to be digging.

[JadedStar]

Ren i didn't say you were not a compassionate person, i am saying the reasons for retaining these friendships does not seem entirely compassionate and some of it seems to almost have a martyr air to it. I am only talking about this issue in general, not you as a whole person. I do believe you are kind and caring, i can tell that from reading your posts. I just think when it comes to clinging onto the ex's that the reasons for doing so are not entirely altruistic, even tho you might have convinced yourself of that.

[veneratio]

Recently I read a few threads where people posted about being friends with the ex (because they worried about them or cared about their well-being, etc), and a lot of the responders got up in arms about how it was NOT a good thing to be friends with the ex and why should they care how the ex is doing.

 

I could see why it could be bad to be friends with an ex, esp with new SO's but I don't see it as being wrong to become friends with ex's. To me, it is a sign of maturity that people can look beyond the breakup to the friendship that once was there.

 

I dunno, maybe I have such an optimistic view about ex friendships.

 

I also believe it's a sign of maturity. I think once you get past all of the negatives of the relationship and you're healed, why not be friends? I know in some situations that can't always be, but just because we've had our differences and came to the conclusion that we weren't right for each other doesn't make one or the other "bad". Most of my friends have the mindset that I should hate my ex or have nothing to do with her. She's human, she's not perfect, she makes mistakes just like the rest of us mere mortals. Doesn't mean we can't have the friendship we had prior to our relationship.

 

Maybe you do have an optimistic view on ex friendships, but you aren't alone.