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An unknown level of deception, first time for me


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I met this seemingly great woman four months ago, we just had this instant click, on all levels, and we started dating, and about two weeks in I noticed there was this guy on her myspace page, the first guy, and I went to his page I saw that she was sending I love you messages to him, so not angry, I confront her saying you know I really want to be with you, but I see this and i can't be with you if you've got this thing with someone else going on.


she gets scared and is telling me that he's her ex, they had a long troubled relationship, but he was abusive and cruel, and he's crazy. that it's over between them and she deletes him, and she makes me believe she wants to move on from him and be with me. so i believe her, and we continue dating, and then a about four days go by, and i get an email from her saying that I know this is out of the blue, but you're right my past is still my present and I want to do right by you, and I don't want to hurt you in the long run, but I can't keep seeing you when i have this lingering situation with my ex.


and I get upset, I tell her she should want something better for herself, not someone who's been abusive, that hits her, and that she tried to kill herself over. she anyway, she writes back and says you're right, you are so good to me and I want to move forward.


so I ask her to be my girlfriend and a few weeks go by and her ex is still writing her continuous nasty texts, the worst things you could say to someone, and I tell her she needs to just change her number so she won't know what he's writing, and she does. more times goes by, and she starts acting differently, not beig as affectionate, being depressed and crying saying she's homesick, she's bi polar and not to worry, she just gets sad (because she's planning on moving 45 minutes away to be close to me) little do I know that these are just code words for, "i miss him" and "I'm thinking about him"


she starts crying one night pretty badly, saying that if iknew about her past she's afraid I won't want to be with her, so she tells me all about her past, that she was a "dancer" since she was 18 and still does it on the side sometimes, that she's cheated on every boyfriend she's ever had, that the guy she was dating over the summer for three months, she was cheating on him with her ex,that she had an affair with the owner of her former club when she was still married, she's had a boob job, and she's tried to kill herself.....and my heart reaches out to her, you know? we've all had pasts, and I don't want to judge this girl for it, because it seems like she doesn't want that anymore, and I tell her that I'm not going to leave her, that it's about who she is now that matters.


anyway, she promises me she's not talking to him, and christmas comes around and we're both away, when we get back on new years eve, we're at her friends house at a party, and late in teh night when she's drunk she starts, out of the blue telling me, that she's not good to me, that I deserve better, that she's cheated on every boyfriend she's ever had, and that she's a good liar, as the night goes on I get frustrated, bcause obviously this is all signs that she's done something very wrong, we have a fight and it comes out, that she was sleeping with him right until I asked her to be my gf, not as she once told me, that the last time they did was 3 weeks before we met, (and obviously I don't believe for a sec that it stopped then.)


she does admit to going to lunch with him a few weeks ago, that it was a "goodbye" lunch for closer and that they kissed, (thats cheating to me) we go to bed, and the next day she's telling me she was crazy, that she loves me, that who is she kidding, she won't ever leave me, he's crazy and poison, and she's having sex with me all day, she's telling me we should just go get married, (she's been telling me this for a while, even sending me pictures of rings) that I'm her soulmate, that I'm the first guy she hasn't cheated on, the day goes by with her saying all this, and around 10 pm, she goes to the bathroom, and I get a gut feeling, and I check her phone, and I see a text sent to someone named "michelle" (she put his number back in her phone under girls name) that read, "hey babe, I still love you and he knows it, I think I want to spend some time with you, how about we go out friday on a date" I'm blown away, and when she comes out she can se it on my face, she asks me whats wrong, and i say, you're still talking to him aren't you, she denys it, I said you're setting up dates for friday night with him, and she says "how did you kno- NO I'm not!" i said, you're a liar, and she says maybe i shoudl take you home, and I say yes I'm done with you.


the whole way home she's crying, why am I'm dumping her, and she tries to kiss me but I don't let her, and the next day, she's calling me for forgiveness, all teh while talking to him too, and a day goes by and she's begging me to take her, back, that he doesn't want to be with her, (she cheated on him too) taht he wants her to be alone for a while, so like an idiot I take her back, and she's all lovey to me, and then she says, we just need to let this thing with him die down, he'll stopp calling and writing, and i tell her that it doesn't matter what he's doing, it's about what you're doing, and she says, i just need to be nice to him to mak him think he's giving me up. but I tell her you can't talk to him if you want to be with me, and she says she's not talking to him at all, so I break it off AGAIN, because i catch that he's still on her AIM, and I say, listen, you need to go figure out whatever it is you need to figure out, but I'm not going to be the pawn in this game you have going with him.


so she goes home and she's still trying to talk to me, apparently he doesn't want her back because he's afraid she'll run back to me. so days go by and I tell her, listen, this decision shouldn't be so hard for you, so I'm moving on, I'm gonna start dating, and she flips saying please don't I love you, and that she says he's terrible, she says she's making the decision to be with me, so again like an idiot, even though I want to believe, her I don't and against my intuition, I take her back, and we're together everyday and night, we're getting her apt packed for her move, with her moms help, I sell her computer for her so she can get a new one and put some cash in her pocket, I sell her stereo as well, I give her 60 bucks cause she's tight, I put food in her house, pay for her cleaning, and dog food. she's telling me the most amazing things, that she's madly in love with me, I'm so good looking, that she trusts me more than any one she's ever met, i push her to get a new job, she does and is happy, i reserve a truck and pay for it for the move (she's moving two blocks from me) and one night I tell her, when we're discussing it, that I'm just worried because it sounds like you're just with me because he wants you to be alone and prove to him you can be faithful, that I feel as soon as he says you don't have to wait, you're going jump ship, as soon as he says jump, you're gonna say, how high, and she tell me I have to stopp worrying about him, that even if we we're together she wouldn't go back to him, he's poison and makes her miserable, she even goes so far as to put a skull and cross bones by his name on her phone,......... and the day before the move, last friday, she goes to work early, and I get on her computer to talk to her on AIM, and her account auto signs in, and there he is, both his accounts that she promised was blocked and deleted, that SHE SHOWED ME was block and deleted a couple days earlier. and I confront her and she adamantly denies it, gets made at me for accusing her, "I swear to god I haven't been talking to him" she says this over and over again, even going so far as to say, "I swear on my grandfathers grave, that I haven't talked to him"


the whole day goes by and she' not talking to me, little do I know that she's planning to get him to move her the next day, working it all out with him, and when we get back to my house she says, I have to break up with you, it's not right for me to be thinking about him when I'm with you, it's not right to you, and I want to be with him, I'm just confused - no you just got your butt busted cheating and you're trying to justify it, so I'm pissed, and we have a big fight, and I tell her to get her things and get out of my life, she tries to hit me twice and then I get her out of my house, and the next day she's using the truck I paid for with him to help her move, and she sleeps with him that night when it was supposed to be our night we've been waiting for, she even call s me in the morning to help her find a uhual by me.


WOW, I really haven't encountered someone thats willing to go to the levels of deception and manipulation that she went through. and I don't know who I'm more mad at, her for using me, or myself, for ignoring my intuition, ignoring the waving red flags that were right in front of me.


I've lashed out at her and she says she hates me for calling her names, like a lying, cheating manipulating piece of filth (not my best moment but i was mad) and now all she's saying is that she's sorry that she hurt me, that she's just trying to do whats right, that she's following her heart, and the last thing i said to her was, following your heart does not mean lying and cheating and manipulating to get what you want.


and now she's 2 blocks away, and she just joined my gym, isn't this kind of behavior supposed to stopp when you hit 31?


I fel like such and idiot for giving this woman any of my time and love.

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this woman is high drama, high maintenance, messed up emotionally...


you just consider yourself lucky that you didn't marry her or get her pregnant. just walk away and have nothing to do with her. don't speak to her again. she'll probably be trying to worm her way back into your life again next time she has a fight with the other guy... this is NOT worth it at all.

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she starts crying one night pretty badly, saying that if iknew about her past she's afraid I won't want to be with her, so she tells me all about her past, that she was a "dancer" since she was 18 and still does it on the side sometimes, that she's cheated on every boyfriend she's ever had, that the guy she was dating over the summer for three months, she was cheating on him with her ex,that she had an affair with the owner of her former club when she was still married, she's had a boob job, and she's tried to kill herself.....and my heart reaches out to her, you know? we've all had pasts


Well speaking for myself, I've never had a boob job(!), I've never tried to kill myself, I've never had an affair while being married, I've not cheated on all (or indeed, any) of my previous partners, and I've not been a "dancer". So in that respect, no we don't all have a past. To be non-judgmental sounds all very nice and tolerant, but what it amounts to is having no discrimination. There are numerous red flags in the above list; if you choose not to see them at the time out of sympathy/tolerance, then unfortunately you're inviting a repeat of this with someone in the future.

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*Hugs* I'm really sorry to hear that you went through this. You must really have loved her to have stayed with her even though she treated you like that. I'm glad you've decided that enough is enough now, but it's going to take some time to get over all that, because it's not just about being mad at her, it's about being angry with yourself. She sounds very immature, self-destructive and deceitful. Definitely better off without. Whatever you do, don't EVER take her back.

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Yeah, I think the hardest issue is that, I know all this, lol, intellectually, I know this, that ultimately this is one messed up woman, that no matter how good I was to her, of faithful, or whatever, it wouldn't change who she is, but whats interesting to me, is that I have zero history dating women with such low moral fiber or character, she's the first.


I guess when she was telling me about her past she seemed SO genuinely heartfelt and hurt by the things that she's done, you know, an she probably was, and I've felt like getting revenge, but I won't because I think her worst punishment is to have to live with herself, because maybe not today or tomorrow, but someday, the damage she's done to others is going to build inside her heart and ultimately destroy her. she was cursing me out and all i could say to her was that i didn't matter how many guys want you or how many times you go back and forth, you can be with him or me everyday, but you'll always be alone inside.


you're right mostly I'm mad at myself for ignoring the signs, for letting her string me along for her own game.


heres what scares me, that she will be back, when she's now back with this abusive guy, and he realizes what she's done.


but I learned that after my last long term last year I've been going after the wrong things in women, so I've got some things to work on in myself, she was not beautiful or gorgeous, she was HOTT, if you know what I mean, she had that "strippers body" and when we'd go out, I could see that everyone in the room wanted to have her, and I guess that made me feel good, and there is something deeply wrong with me for that, lol.


what my buddy said to me when I told her about her past was, look, I know you've gotta a good heart and you probably just wanted to help her, but the problem when she told you all that was, you convinced yourself, that you could pick up a piece of crap off the ground, and dust it off, and that it wouldn't be a piece of crap anymore, but unfortunately if by 31 she's still this person, it ain't gonna change.

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whats also interesting is that ALL of her friends loved me, so did her mother, who apparently hated all her bf's, her friends would tell me, we are so happy she's with you, she's had terrible bf's especially her last one (the guy she was cheating on me with and is now back to) and the most showing thing, is that her best gf pulled me aside and said, listen, i like you, you seem to be a really great guy, but she won't stop talking to him, you need to dump her, because this is what she does.


now that was something to have her best friend of 10 years tell me that.


but now I have to deal with her 2 blocks from me and at my gym.

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Oh boy. I've quoted the part that stuck out to me, although ALL of it is just one big, waving-in-the-wind RED FLAG. My X wife admitted to me early on that she had cheated on every boyfriend she ever had and I stupidly thought "It'll be different with me because she is a changed person."


And I've read that women who dance (strip) typically have been abused and are pretty emotionally messed up. Daddy issues!


So I know you want to give her the benefit of the doubt, and you're right that everyone has pasts and deserve chances. BUT... this woman sounds very unstable and hasn't proven (to me, by what you've written) that she has moved on or healed from anything.


Run, Forrest.... RUN!

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move gyms really i know secretely your happy that u might see her despite knowing you shouldn't. You ex doesn't sound like a woman who can accept love as she doesn't love herself. She craves inner attention that you cud never provide. This is a time for positive change and see it as a time to look to yourself to see what you want from a girlfriend and what behaviours will you accept or put up wit. Love doesn't always have to be rooted in drama.

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Whats I can't understand, (and it's probably silly to even try to make sense of someone who doesn't) is that this weekend I went to a friends house for the super bowl, who happens to be a former gf, who I'm friends with, she also happens to be a model, and when my recent ex found out, she flipped and was angry, but I didn't even do anything physical, I couldn't i'd still feel bad because it's too soon, she was mad at me, even though from one day to the next she traded me in for someone and was sleeping with him the next day.


you're probably right, maybe somewhere inside I do want to see her, but 've been taking precautions, getting off work early yesterday to go to the gym, an getting up a bit later to get to work (she goes to work earlier),....but what of course happens, when i get to the train, she's right there, and smiling, and I move away and she comes up to me and says so you're just going to ignore me now? and I hug her because i really don't want a confrontation, and she sits next to me on the train and tries to be close to me, and kiss me, and telling me she was missing me last night. and I don't know (and shouldn't care), if she's just manipulating me, simply because she feels bad that she hurt me, or what, the idea that she's now two block away is no good

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She is clearly manipulating you. It sounds like she does this chronically and there is no reason to believe it will stop. You cannot control this behavior as it is up to her.


You can control your response. It takes two to tango. I understand it is a tough situation because of your proximity to the woman, but she obviously has a lot of issues. Unless you want to be part of her neurosis, I'd stay away.


Have you ever suggested, or has she ever had any inclination to get help for her problems? Living with a cheating, manipulating "piece of filth" is one thing - being one is another. She could benefit greatly (not for you, for her) if she could see a way to get help for her problems.

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As a matter of fact she's been diagnosed with bi-polar and anxiety disorder (big surprise I know) everything was pretty amazing for the first couple months, and then she couldn't afford her normal meds, and switched to another, that is less effective, and as well started taking birth control pills, which as my research has found can greatly increase, in combination with changing meds, emotional and hormonal swings, thats when the bulk of the problems started.


I feel kinda like my brain and heart are having a throw down right now, I know everything intellectually, but it's really tough to take my own advice.


she wants her cake and eat it too, she likes having two guys wanting her, he's telling her she loves her, that he wants to marry her, and take care of her, that he'll take care of her, (he'd give her an allowance), and I've told her I love her, but that I won't accept anything less from her than she'd want from me.


why do some women want to be with terribly abusive men who give them nothing emotionally they need or want? all I can think of is that she doesn't like herself very much

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