southerngirl Posted December 12, 2007 Posted December 12, 2007 Okay my darling 10 year old 4th grader has been stealing. Every Monday, I send 10 dollars with him to pay for his breakfast and lunch at the school. I just got a call from the school. He owes 78 dollars to the lunch room for unpaid food fees. This means for 8 weeks he has been stealing that money! I do not know yet what he is doing with it, he will be home in one hour. Either he is saving it up and hiding it....... Spending it in the 'school store' ...... Or something. I am so mad! Everytime he gets food and doesn't pay for it he is stealing from the lunch room. Everytime he takes my money and doesn't give it to his teacher like he's supposed to he is stealing from me. Everytime he buys something in the office or wherever he is buying it with stolen money... I know this is a normal life lesson for kids his age to have to learn that stealing is wrong but this is MY KID... IM mad! I am also mad that the school let it go 8 weeks before calling me! What did they think? Did they think we were neglecting our son? Good Grief! 8 WEEKS!!!!! So here is what I am thinking after I strip search him when he comes in the door today. He will write 100 sentences..... I WILL NOT STEAL.... He's also so grounded its not even funny! I also need to figure out how he can pay us back this money. I will pay 10 dollars a week like always PAYING BACK WHAT HE OWES..... And for the 8 weeks it takes he will be taking a brown bag lunch to school and I will make sure there is nothing delicious in it. Sandwhiches... Apples.... You get the idea.. Crime does not pay. What would you do if this were your son?
EQD Posted December 12, 2007 Posted December 12, 2007 that sounds like a damn good punishment on the kid actually, i can't think of anything you left out.. It should teach him a lesson. *thumbs up* for being a good mom! I believe you took the words out of my mouth, just make sure he doesnt ditch the sack lunch and "charge" a regular lunch to you. Let the teachers and lunch people know that he cannot have cafeteria lunches until futher notice. Once again *thumbs up*
southerngirl Posted December 12, 2007 Author Posted December 12, 2007 Sigh.... Yeah I did think of that also. I am also going to ask him calmly just why he has done this and what has he done with the money. I hope his answer isnt that he has been bullied and some other kid has the money. Me and husband have been getting along great though here lately.... Before our recent 'problem' we dont really fight alot either. I really would hope thats not the reason.
amtjrtcet Posted December 12, 2007 Posted December 12, 2007 sounds like you've got a pretty good plan girl. Stick it to his little butt.
melrich Posted December 12, 2007 Posted December 12, 2007 I am also going to ask him calmly just why he has done this and what has he done with the money. I hope his answer isnt that he has been bullied and some other kid has the money. Yes I would definitely calm down before speaking to him and make sure that there is not some good reason (in his mind) as to why he is taking this money. If it turns out that he has just taken it for his own use then your punishments seem reasonable, he does need to learn a lesson from this. Personally I would not do the strip search though.
southerngirl Posted December 12, 2007 Author Posted December 12, 2007 I did search him when he got home... No i didnt strip him but I found no money either. He says that he has been spending the money at the office. He did fess up that he has been buying stuff for kids in class... Not just one kid but a list. He also did say right away when i asked was anyone bullying him that 'Jacob' was bullying him. I said like how tell me... He said that he will push him down and tackle him during PE class. (physical ed) Aparently the teachers arent watching if this is happening! He also denies giving that kid any money. I have a call into the school. The more I think about it the more mad I am at the school for not letting me know sooner that there was a problem. We are talking about a 4th grader here. It is THEIR fault for aparently letting it go on this long. Story to be continued,,, no, I didnt yell but I have sent him to his room. I told him that we arent done talking and that I want him to think about it. He's been in there now about 10 minutes and I plan to go bring him out again in another 5.
FarthestEdge Posted December 12, 2007 Posted December 12, 2007 I got caught stealing when I was 13. Only it wasn't from my parents- worse, it was from a store. Here's what my folks did: 1) I was forbidden to hang out with the girl I got arrested with. (That only made her and I "best friends" for the next 3 years), BUT..... 2) Everthing that was important to me (boy-band posters, records (yes- I'm THAT old!) the phone in my room, the privelege of going out, of having friends in etc.) had a value placed on it and I had to "earn" it back at $3.00 per hour doing chores at home & at my dad's work. And these things weren't cheap...My phone privelege alone was like $80.00. I spent most of the summer earning my stuff back. I tried to get off by saying I was upset about something that was going on at the time- That just made it worse. My parents reminded me that no matter WHAT is going on in my life, it isn't an excuse to take things I haven't earned. Whatever is going on at home or school, he needs to learn to deal with it. He should come to you for help if he's lost as to how to deal. It doesn't excuse stealing, even if it was for attention...they are separate issues. Life will always throw stuff at you that you don't deserve, can't control and isn't fair- it doesn't justify taking things from other people that isn't yours.... My advice would be to show compassion for his issues, but in NO WAY allow that to mitigate your punishment for stealing the money- because then you are allowing that there are moral "loopholes" Be glad he stole from you and not the local Wal-Mart. You have a chance to teach him BEFORE it escalates into something bigger.. And don't beat yourself up about it. It's not unusual for a 10 year old to have an overly flexible moral compass...this is an opportunity to reinforce to him what's right and what's wrong... Good luck!
melrich Posted December 12, 2007 Posted December 12, 2007 2) Everthing that was important to me (boy-band posters, records (yes- I'm THAT old!) the phone in my room, the privelege of going out, of having friends in etc.) had a value placed on it and I had to "earn" it back at $3.00 per hour doing chores at home & at my dad's work. And these things weren't cheap...My phone privelege alone was like $80.00. I spent most of the summer earning my stuff back. Good idea....and you have remembered it.
southerngirl Posted December 12, 2007 Author Posted December 12, 2007 Right now he is sat down at the kitchen table writing 100 times... I will not steal. I plan to also buy a posterboard at the store tonight and write out exactly how much he hes to pay back and he will earn it. A dollar here and a dollar there for chores he can do here at home and next door with family. He's also going to brown bag his lunch too. I am sure he will get sick of ham and cheese sandwhiches. This is very frustrating. He didn't say anyone was bullying him out of the money. I told him if that is what happened then he needs to tell me. Oh , he also has lost his tv, playstation and I told him he wont be getting those back for a good while.
FarthestEdge Posted December 12, 2007 Posted December 12, 2007 Yep- I especially remember sitting on the cottage roof scraping moss off for hours...A lot of time to contemplate if those $50 sunglasses were really worth it...
southerngirl Posted December 13, 2007 Author Posted December 13, 2007 I took my son to the jail and had a police officer talk to him for a bit. I think he was really scared when they came and got him out of the car. The police man told him all about kid jail, and going before a judge and about stealing...... I could tell that it made quite an impression. I am hoping that combined with 8 weeks of brown bagging it to school (equal to the amount of weeks he didn't pay but instead spent the money) and chores to equal 80 dollars will leave an impression too. Least this is my hope. 80 Squares on this poster board hanging here. He will have opportunity to earn 10 squares a week doing chores. If he does this, then it will be over in 8 weeks. If it takes him 3 months, thats his choice... This is my restitution for him. The policeman also said it was fair and told my son that if he thinks mom is bad he should meet the judge, and to consider himself in jail and I am the warden.. Thanks everyone for the advice. Thanks for letting me vent.
EQD Posted December 13, 2007 Posted December 13, 2007 FarthestEdge, that was a great story, your parents were very smart people, and i took a few notes from that actually! And i can't stress enough how i admire you SouthernGirl! I am damn sure being a parent is hard work, its so good to see people doing it right! I know some mothers who would have just said "Oh well" Or "attempted" to punish their child, when it only lasted less than a day because the parent can't hold their ground.. those kids dont go many places in life when they grow up, thats for sure.
FarthestEdge Posted December 13, 2007 Posted December 13, 2007 Hey SG, Sounds like you handled that really, really well. I like the extra step of going to the police station. I can tell you, I will NEVER forget having my rights read & being handcuffed in the back seat of a cruiser (which in retrospect, I think they just did to scare me straight) I'm sure he'll learn a valuable lesson....Good for you for being firm and taking the opportunity to scare the crap out of him.. More parents need to do that. Equestriandynamo: You know, my parents were always very good at making the punishment "fit" the crime. I know that was a creative solution and I absolutely learned a very valuable lesson. By contrast, the girl who got arrested with me; her parents figured they must not have been giving her enough money if she was stealing, so they raised her allowance!!!!!!!!! What I always admired about my parents is that they were SO young (my mom was 18 when my sister was born, and barely 20 when I was born), yet they had good instincts and were really good parents. But yeah, it's a good story, so I was glad to share...
Sweet Buttabean Jellayroll Posted December 13, 2007 Posted December 13, 2007 ? sammich and apples? sounds like what they served us in high school.... i say send him to school w/o lunch........ last time i stole i got the ass whupping of a lifetime.....and i didnt even steal it, i just put it in my pocket until we got to the counter
southerngirl Posted December 13, 2007 Author Posted December 13, 2007 FarthestEdge - You helped give me the idea about talking to the cops. Your experience made me think of it. I hope it made quite an impression on my son. The cop seemed very happy and excited to talk to my son. If he can reach him today he wont be arresting him tomorrow. I can wish. EQUESTRIANDYNAMO - Thank you! I am trying my best to raise strong people that have honor. Ive also told my son for years now that being honorable means to do the right thing even when no one sees it. I just hope that it stops here and he learns his lesson. SBJ - Yeah, I know what you mean however, they could say I was neglecting my son if I didn't feed him one way or the other. Today his lunch was a peanut butter and jelly sandwhich, some gold fish crackers and a banana... all inside a brown paper bag. He's going to feel like a 'dork' because all the cool kids buy lunch. Their lunches are pretty good compared to what I was served as a kid so I'm sure he isn't happy about that. Also no, I didn't hit him... I didn't even scream at him. At his age of 10 I felt he needed a more well thought out punishment for his crimes.
Dazednconfused50 Posted December 13, 2007 Posted December 13, 2007 To start , I am a father of a 21 yr old son. First off, Never send your Kid to school with cash! Check to the school only! So part of this is kinda your fault! they are young and are easily diswayed or led astray! Second and not knowing your son, for all you know he has someone AKA a bully taking that money! First when he comes home, ask him to come into where you are and tell him you need to talk! Son the school called and said I owe such and such amount to them for lunches! Then remind him you love him! Then tell him you want to know why the money you give and intrust to him is not going where it is supposed to go! Then ask if there is something going on at school ( do not give him ideas) ie the bully senario! And listen to what he says! You will know if he is not being honest! If that afore mentioned is the case, you have your answere and the school needs to get involved because he is not the only victim! If You get the I don't know! You are going to get mad! really mad if there is no explanation! Send him to his room with this sentence! I am so disappointed in you right now and so very angry! I want you to go to your room and sit there and think about what is happeneng and why! ( no t.v./ videos ! nothin! Til I can calm down and and can figure out what I want to do rationaly! Give him time to think and a chance to fess up! Children really hate the thought of disapointing thier parents ! And doing things while you are angry will only push him away and when he needs you down the road he will be fearful to do so! Let some time pass! get on the phone to the school and talk to them loudly so he can hear! So he can hear you are just as angry at them for this going this far, and you are as dissapoointed with there behavior! This way he sees that he is not the only one you are disappointed in! When you have calmed and if he has not come to you! have him come back to you and tell him again that you are extremely disappointed and want to give him one more chance to explain or give reason or say what he is using the money for! You are here for him, if there is a problem you are here! whatever the problem! If no explanation and or it is something that Is way out of line, And I am not saying this lightly but have seen this in kids this young (drugs) and am not saying this is the case, you are going to need to know! Then after all is said send him back to room forr a lil bit if there is still disgust in you or anger! Bring him back when you are calm! then you can punish! Lunch in a sack is not a punishment, it is really better for him than the crap at the schools, but is a start! take away all priveleges/ no friends, no video games, and no weekends! and no sports if he is involved! but no more than 2 weeks! limit t.v. to family time only! the rest is school work or reading a book! and the let him know that the sac lunches will continue till the debt is payed a letter of apology to the lunch room for lieing would also not be inapropriate! and the sac lunches may very well continue until he can show that he can be trusted by you again to do what he knows in his heart is the right thing! You may even want to say what I said to my son very very early on! if you are going to do something or some one asks you to do something! And you are not sure if it is wrong? and you have to think about wheather it is or not or wheather it will disappoint your me ? then it is more than likely wrong! Then let him know that all the choices that he makes as a young man right or wrong have a huge impact on how his life will be! how others percieve him! and what his future will entail! One wrong move from young people in this day and age, can ruin thier life, tag you in a bad light with others and or the law! And can effect thier whole future! Not like when I was a child and you could get away with just about anything and it have little or no impact on th e outside world! And they just don't know these things! Thier life is and will be determined by thier youth and thier actions in thier youth will determine where the world will let them go and what they will be allowed to be or become! This is just one fathers opinion! thanks for listening and hope at least some of this mat help!
Dazednconfused50 Posted December 13, 2007 Posted December 13, 2007 You and the police are your sons only safe havin! If they fear either they will be to afraid to come to either of you even if they are unsure if what they did is wrong! And beating a child is truly a last resort and only teaches that ( And I am not apposed to spankig) but is truly a last resort showing there is consequences for not heeding warnings and or not listening or respecting elders! I have had to raise my voice to my son probably twice his entire life! To reasons! my tone is strait and direct and exremely serious! The right tone of voice conveys disappointment and seriosness! And Have never had to raise my hand ever! Scaring your child will make him do his utmost to hide any wrong doing/ fear of you will make him not come to you if he is unsure he has done the wrong thing! And over kill of any punishment will only make him resent you and make him not want to come to you in those times! remember this is partly your fault as well! you did put the cash in his hands! And children will do strange things at times to be excepted by others! which by what you said he was doing with the money is exactly what he was doing! You have to talk to him about what he was doing and help him understand that you cannot buy freinship or people liking you! they have to like you for you! and if they do not! then they are not worth having as friends! Is a hard thing for children to learn sometimes unless that is explained! So he was taking your money and buying things for others! He really was looking for acceptance more than deception! although wrong try to understand that he maynot be having the easiest of times at school with having friends! he needs to know that true friends will come to him for him and who he is and not for what they can get, or from fear of him as the bully surely does! So don't go to hard on the boy! he is young and allowed to make these mistakes in judgement! this is when good dialog and understanding and your love come into play! trust me if they do not resent you or fear you ! they will hear and listen to you!
southerngirl Posted December 13, 2007 Author Posted December 13, 2007 Dazed - That is more or less exactly what I did. I was very calm. I did not yell, I havent yelled. I calmly asked him what was going on. I also asked him was anyone bullying him. We talked for a bit... I sent him to his room, after another 15 minutes of him having time to 'think' I asked him was there anything else he wanted to tell me about it. I think if he were being bullied he would have fessed up given the consequences he is going to be paying. He said he had spent the money at the school store and santa's workshop and the book fair... All things at the school. Ive also called the school and gave them a piece of my mind. Had they caught this the very first time it wasn't paid it wouldn't be this situation. As for trusting him with cash, I am disappointed. I feel at 10 years old he should be able to be trusted to pay his lunch fees. He knows I am disappointed. As for bringing a sack lunch not being punishment? For him it is.. I always have provided money for the school lunch/breakfast and snacks. This is what he wanted. He seems to like the school food. In fact he told me if I make him bring his lunch he will look like a dork. I told him that was his problem but I had to repay the school the 80 dollars so he wasn't going to get school lunch for 8 weeks. (will actually be about six because you have to minus the Christmas break coming up) As for drugs, absolutely not. He is not doing drugs period. The school bus drops him off and picks him up from outside of my house. I am watching from the window (not outside he is not a baby) and see him coming and going. He isn't allowed to run the streets either.... He does play sports but the soccer season is over. As for it lasting only 'two weeks' ... nah... I think that it calls for more serious measures. For what its worth, the police man, the school counselor, my family that I have discussed this with and others agreed. Stealing is such a serious issue that it needs to be dealt with in a serious manner... I only can hope that the lesson is learned.
FarthestEdge Posted December 13, 2007 Posted December 13, 2007 Dazed, I have to respectfully disagree with you. While I am sure your actions would be driven by your understanding of your child, my experience would send me in the same direction as SG. As someone who got caught stealing at 13 yrs old, I have to tell you that there's nothing wrong with having a healthy fear of the consequences of breaking the law. Yes the police are their to protect us- from people who break the law! If you are breaking the law, well then you SHOULD fear the legal consequences - police, juvenile detention etc. Children of 10 are sophisticated enought thinkers to be moulded by positive reinforcement coupled with negative reinforcement when warranted. I think in the case of stealing- it is warranted. My parents NEVER told me I was a BAD person, only that I had made BAD choices, and they KNEW I was capable of better. My punishment was an opportunity for me to learn that you EARN the things that you need and want in this life- you don't just take them. 2 weeks of grounding would've been forgotten weeks later. Here I am 25 years later and I remember that lesson as clear as a bell. As for WHY he stole the money- it is irrelevant. If he used it to buy friends, stave off bullies, or indulge himself doesn't change the fact that he took money that wasn't his and decided to use it for something else. If he wants to make friends- find another way. If he has a bully situation- then get help and learn how to deal with it. If he wants other things, or more money, then ask his parents how to increase his spending money- get a paper route or extra chores...You don't want to teach them that stealing is wrong UNLESS you can come up with a good excuse.... Sorry. been there, done that, got the t-shirt. She's doing the right thing IMO. Luckily, as parents, we all get to raise our children the way we see fit and we get to enjoy the rewards of a job well done and suffer the consequences of our poor decisions.
onewithbooks Posted December 14, 2007 Posted December 14, 2007 Bravo SG I think you handled the situation brilliantly!!
EQD Posted December 14, 2007 Posted December 14, 2007 I also disagree with Dazed,, I think that eventually her son should be allowed to take money to school so he can learn responsibility, Dazed idea is to keep him from even having that opportunity to learn that very valuable lesson. I also disagree with the "talk on the phone with the school as loudly as possible so he can hear." I think that is hateful and if i were that kid i would just hate my parents more for trying to rub it in my face and be childish about the whole situation,. When i was suspended for one day for stealing glitter markers my dad took me to the county jail and they gave me a tour like they did with her child. I can't say that it scared me straight, but my dad's dissappointment did! That is why i have always strived to be good and do whats right, thats why i am not pregnant or doing drugs, thats why i have never stole since, its because i learned that my dad is caring enough to try to teach me these valuable lessons and that i need to listen up! And my dad and family all remark about how proud they are of me. Because he wasnt afraid to give me responsibility, he has never paid one of my bills and here i am 100% financially independent and only 20 years old. I am also saving 24k for my college tuition that i plan to pay in full. My dad taught me the value of a dollar thats for sure! And i had friends who work at Wal-mart and fast food who are raised away from their responsibility, where their parents pay for this that or the other, all that makes for is a confused and dependent child. Southerngirl is teaching her son to be responsible with money and that mommy isnt an ATM machine... you call that bad parenting? huh
southerngirl Posted December 14, 2007 Author Posted December 14, 2007 This made me question if I should be giving him cash to pay for his lunch so I went and questioned my mother in law. She raised 3 children, and had another 4 in and out of her house as they were raised.... My youngest makes her 10th grandchild between her kids and step kids... Being that my mom is no longer in this world shes the closest one to ask. Well anyway... She said absolutely I should be giving him cash. At 10 years old he should be trusted to do the right thing with it. I shouldnt have to go to the school to pay it with a check, he should be responsible. How else can I instill responsibility in him if I do not let him grow up? So while during the next 8 weeks I will be sending checks, when this is over again I plan to give him some cash AGAIN... Yes, and I am going to try to bite my tongue and let him fly. This time though, I think with some communication with the school I will know if he's messed up. I plan to call them myself at least every few weeks. Little five minute phone call on my part and my son will never know.
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