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ive thought of a way to continue the poem, or a sequel, or w/e. hopefully youll like this one a bit better. the power of deception... the script, oh the mighty script the grand and marvelous script what a cunning deception listing on and on the errors of his way how he hurt others and himself how he tied down an angel perhaps the most elaborate lie ever crafted this so called script of sins forever shall we slave away trying to chip them away forever shall we be bound to a deception we know not this poor poor man, like all the other men believe the script would lead to his salvation he believes so strongly, that he knows the way he doesn't realize that it isn't a script of sins it is a script of acceptance listing on and on, not the errors of his ways but the things that he must come to accept in order to be able to move on there lies the deception a deception we all fall prey to for it is the way of Lucifer the master of all deception

i apologize poetry is a form of expression, as you probably know. these poems, as dark and morbid as they are, are an expression of myself. im not trying to scare you, or anyone else, though I guess i should have probably just kept such thoughts in my head the last poem was unfinshed, i didn't know how to finish it. but after i read it again, an ending came to me, so i edited the post and finished it. Once again, I apologize if you find my poem(s) appalling. to tell the truth, I probably would find them appalling as well. You've read my other thread, so you know my girlfriend and I have recently broken up. Im crushed, to say the least, but it's not just that she broke up with me, though that is a major part of it. I've been doing a lot of thinking lately, and lately... the more I think, the more depressed I get; but its like an addiction, i simply cant stop thinking. on the inside, im really torn up and ive started hating myself and the life ive lived, but i should probably make another thread about this though, as it isnt poetry

The dream continues on and on, he is watching himself die, he is watching his body crumble, his mortal body cringes and convulses, a dream he is in and forever will remain He dreams a nicer dream he dreams he is what he wasnt a dream that cannot be He dreams of nicer things of a beauty so great that he cannot let it be As the dream comes to an end He watches himself die experiencing the pain and suffering all of his own creation When he awakes he finds himself on a path a path consumed in fire as he walks along this path he sees minions abound gleefully the path ends so too does his journey or so he thinks he finds a script with his name in it as he reads it, he sees its his life story every error hes made, every sin hes committed in this paradise, he must clean himself of the crimes that hes committed he must rid himself of the sins hes done the sin of tying down an angel out comes the shovel the shovel that will lead him to salvation the shovel he must use to fuel the furnaces of this cursed place oh the dream continues on oh the dream continues on in another place, a desolate place

Tick tock tick tock The world goes boom In a moment, he had everything In the next, he lost everything If he were alive he would ask himself how it came to this If he were alive he would say sorry to all those her hurt If he were alive he would take back all those bad things he did If he were alive he would try to stop all the suffering he had In a moment, he had everything in the next, he had nothing As the fickle had of time chimes out loudly A masked man wielding a scepter approaches It is time, time to leave it all behind Time to let it all go blindly In a moment, he saw a light of hope in the next, darkness engulfed him Tick tock tick tock The world goes boom

Darkness Approaches Tighter and tighter an invisible hand grips around my neck and at my fingertips black... Black BLACK is all I see! No time, not even for a sip of tea I might as well leave and relieve, so tell the ladies to weave a goodbye blanket for me. For I no longer can see life being worthwhile now, it's my time. Losing the will, the will to fight, for how can I fight, when I fight in vain? Darkness approaches, reaching out, seeking its prey, I lay victim to its cruel embrace.

Thank you

I sit awake throughout the night, Wondering how much longer until the time is right. When I am yours, and you are mine. When everything in life will be just fine. I love you more than words can say, As I sit here and wait for the day. The day when you become mine forever. When nothing can keep us apart, ever! I've never loved anyone like I love you... So this is all something very new. So, as I sit here all alone tonight, I wonder how long till I hold you tight.

ACTUALLY!! You wrote it... but I edited it and re-wrote it! So I claim all the credit for that statement! Oi, this discussion finished quite awhile ago... apparently someone doesnt like reading the last page But... for the sake of argument... The point of living is to find something or soemone that actually IS worth living for. You are 70 years old. You have not found anything or anyone that is "worth" living for. You have desperatly been clinging onto your feeble life in your search of that thing. In the end, you have lived your life as a failure. Morale? Don't worry about something grand and significant to live for. Go with the flow and seek happiness. If you can only find happiness in things that are considered "sinful", well... that sucks... but do those things anyways (unless if it infringes upon others). The point of living is to find soemthing that doesent bore you. Well now, that is quite absolute =). Yet... if everything bores you, then finding something that doesn't bore you would probably be boring as well... no? The point of living is the hope for things to get better, and if theyres no room for them getting any worse, theyre only room for them to get better. I actually like this response a bit =) Though, theres always room for things to get better and to get worse . The only extremes are heaven and hell... and I don't know about you, but I'm a good ways away from experiencing either =)

I JUST LOVE BLUEANGEL... You weirdOS!!

Avman. Please read bluegirl's post. Some of the best advise I have gotten through this thread, thus far, has been through the nit-picking at one another. If someone offers advise and it is scorned, cast away as if without a glance, and they counter. They counter with not only their logic but their pride, their emotion, then it lets you feel the full depth of their reasoning. I have often been called a debater, because that is one thing I am at ease with - debate. It is almost as if it is a natural field for me. I have debated several times, and in the past, I cursed myself for this, but as time moved on, I appreciated it within me. The reason is simple. I began to not only debate to throw "hot coal" into someone's palm, but to learn. It is often through debate, arguments, and outbursts that you will attain a person's true motives, what is really going through their mind, and why they so strongly believe in their logic. Bluegirl, your incredibly smart, and very flexible. I like the way that you illustrate your posts, it is almost as if it were a performance. The first post was as if it were a poem, while the second post commanded fierce authority and steady logic and reasoning. I hope you will continue and use your gifts well, for not many have them, and even fewer appreciate them. If I do not reply to your post, do not think I have forgotten about it, or disregarded it. If you wish to hear my reply to it, simply PM me and refer me to the post, saying you would like to know what I think about it and what my reply is to it. I will give it to you, trust me, I will.

Hello Jaffa. Nice name, reminds me of Stargate - great show =D. Probably got it from there, eh? Maybe not. Anyways, I like that you have an open mind - that you do understand that there are different things in life and different qualities other than what the media and the societies forces into our brains. I will probably contact you via PM sometime soon as I seem to have developed a habit of doing that when I find someone that seems to be approachable from a diffrent "plane" , if you will. Hm, You seem quite contradictory there, now don't you? You see - you don't admonish someone from suiciding due to physical pain, but emotional and mental pain are completely admonishable - no? Well, you may be "older and more experienced" than me, but Age is something I've had a trifle with since I was younger than 10. "No, your not old enough, you don't understand." Ever give in, and think that maybe, someone younger than you Might actually understand, you believe in life don't you - understanding is supposed to be one of the great things about life, like talent, some get it and some don't. Now, what I am saying is that "me in my infinite youth" has some piece of wisdom that the "elderly sage of all knowingness" may not yet fully comprehend. Life has three aspects - physical, emotional, and mental. There is no aspect of life that can be more painful than the other, each aspect of life can easily lead to death, or disability in some form. While it is easier to wound a person physically, an emotional "blow" generally will hurt a person a lot more. While you cannot die from emotions, you can become essentially disabled, possibly even die from another reason (very graphic, and I don;t want to get into it, at the moment). Similarly, physical pain sucks, but mental pain does as well. In fact, theres tons of people that can withstand enormous amounts of physical pain, but the smallest amounts of mental pain can ruin the person over for a long time. If suicide is permissible due to of a physical pain, then it permissible due to any, extreme, form of pain.

I don't know why I was expecting more from your post, Spugly. I guess it was because you said you read through all my posts in this thread and from previous posts that you have made - you seem like a rather intelligent person that can understand things on a deeper sense than others. But, I guess you didn't really read all my posts on this thread - either that or I kept the primary posts (about 4) in PMs, I cant remember. The thing is, this girl I love and am going out with, Jessica. She is not the reason, at all. I am the reason, and nobody else. I was going to commit suicide before I met her, she only stood in my way and stopped me for awhile. I Do believe I posted that on this thread, though it could be in one of my posts with my dear friend Caro33 or my other dear friend dogheadma. Anyways, you can continue to think whatever it is that you wish, but the problem is much more intricate. While a love is a cure or a solution, it is not the cause. Sometimes you cure things by using the same exact thing as a cure (ex: poison), but often times that will not work (ex: cancer, diabetes, AIDS, etc). The second thing you focused on was my intelligence, and my ability to stand out in school. Well, yes, I am intelligent, especially in comparison with the bulk of my peers. However, I do not use or abuse my intelligence in a public setting in general. For 3 years I have barely been getting by in my classes - publicly I would just say its because my courses were the highest level and it was hard to keep up, but that was bull$***. I've always hidden my level of intelligence, and while one of my friends senses that there is much more behind what I allow others to see - even he has no clue of what I cover up. So you see, it is not about standing out, for when I am out of school - if god permits it, then I will stand out - a lot, in the corporate world. I am sorry. You told me that you are 'high up' in the corporate world. Typically, thats not the easiest thing to do, unless if it is provided to you by your family or heritage. Typically, it requires a great deal of education. Most educated people are very well at composing essays or discussions that are highly persuasive. While I am not trying to attack you, I am merely stating a point since it was rather hard to read and fully comprehend your reply as it was rather scattered. Well, onto it. I do not have a tainted vision of the corporate world. I recognize it for what it is. Sure, its not something like the military or a prostitution agency, but it is no different. While those agencies use a persons body, the corporate world uses peoples brains, or at least the physical workforce they can exert. Now. You say I cannot hope to obtain any position of high status while maintaining my "tainted" views. I wish I could agree with you, but being that I had an offer to come work for a company immediately after school - and they would pay for my college education and initial living costs - I find it rather hard to believe that, sorry. So many people like me? Really? I don't see that many, but I guess if you dwell in these forums you will become disillusioned that these people make up the bulk of the world. But for the few that are like me, I really have to say that it is shameful of you to patronize someone that actually stops and thinks - what is the meaning? Survival? But those are just basic animal instincts right? We humans, are vastly superior to those primitive animals, or atleast we claim to be. So - beyond reproducing (or ****ing one anothers brains out), what is the point? "in my opinion it is totally pathetic to commit suicide, i dont care whats wrong, just do something, anything that stops u thnking. just get on with life like everyone else does." - Yeah? Well in my opinion, anyone that hasn't stopped and thought about it really isn't living the great life. They are just machines, tools to be used that are completely disposable as they are all identical. People, without the ability to stop and think, without the ability to rationalize, without the ability to understand a scenario from a perspective other than their own - thats what is truly pathetic. By the way, the above line that I quoted from you - great inspirational tool, sounds just like what someone that wants to create "mindless robots" would say . Hey Scout. One thing I learned is that while one person may be a genius in one field - that does not make them a genius all around. Sddeaston is a smart man, no doubt, as are many of us that post in these forums. He has his views, we have ours. Sometimes, it is best to simply "agree to disagree". I don't agree with or like his views on corporations, but I won't try to change them - he is free to have them as he pleases, that is one of the freedoms that this corporate world has left - so why should we, the people take it away? Anyways, thank you for your support however, I will be going on with the path of least resistance - to the corporate world, in the profession of business administration. While I may not allow them to control me, to use to me, to run my life, I will be a part of them - whatever that may mean to some. I truly don't mind all too much, I will simply be in the business world for a short duration before I am capable of obtaining the assets required for early retirement Then, I will be "as free as you can be in this world" to do what I wish to - initially, lots of travel.

Hope, please read my above post. I know I'm not Caro, but I think me and Caro are very much alike, even though we are opposite sex's. Read what I said and maul it over. You have every right to go on a vacation with your boyfriend if the scene is provocative. Heck, personally, I would Beg my girlfriend to come if I was into that kind of stuff (bikes). Edit Caro just left, she had to catch a train. I hope my reply will do until she gets back. Stay happy. There is no reason to worry, not yet atleast. So, please just be happy ^_^. As for myself, I think I'm about to goto bed ^_^;; 2:20am here, hehe.

Hey hope. I'm a guy, and I don't like that biker stuff. I hate shallowness all together. Anyways. You want to be very calm and relaxed. It is a big deal to you, but you don't want that to be Overly apparent. What I think you should do is meet him in person, ask him if he would mind you booking a flight and tagging along. (NO ANGER, NO VENTING) If he says no, then, simply say something along the following lines, in a very subttle voice. (Women have a way with subtlety! Use it!!) 'Hun, I know this is one of your "big events", but I want to be there with you. I want to see what it is about this event that makes you so excited that you have to leave me for an entire week. Also, I've been feeling kind of insecure about that place because it doesn't have the best of reputations - I did some research and here's what I found.' Then, (GENTLY) hand him some precut pictures of what you found online. Continue the dialong. 'I know your probably thinking "So I think You would cheat on me?", well its not that. The thing is that this is a very provocative environment and I am deeply in love with you, it hurts me to even think of you, alone, in such a place. Please understand, think of it from My side. I only want whats best for Us.' Dunno if you like it or not. I tried ^_^.

I... I don't know. She didn't highly appeal to me, physically, until after I fell in love with her. Then her image was replaced with that of a goddess in my mind. I guess... Maybe because I was desperate? I wanted someone that cared, someone that was like my in some way, someone that could love me and be with me. I saw that in her, but I guess that glow that I saw so bright and radiant in her is waning I knew she was sort of an outcast to society (our school), similar to me in that respect. She has friends and has had friends that "loyally stand by her side" but I'm afraid that there was a lot of manipulation involved in that friendship - she always seems so ready to follow their lead... always following. She and her friends were what the school termed "anime nerds". I didn't like the others and they didn't like me. They still don't like me, save one, that is rather a nice girl. I was rejected by everyone and everything I knew. My father - we had our differences. My mother - the bond that never formed. My brother - the distant and nonexistent (mine as well have been). Society - That big group of shallow puppet figures. Even my grades suck because of my family life. I could never concentrate, I couldn't think clearly. They were driving me insane. So, maybe it was that I was desperate, for someone that was similar to me - that I could love and could love me back, that I thought I would be able to share a future with. --- Yes, we do have two (rather large, each one is by now) topics going, don't we =P. Well, we can stick with the PM one then - just bring anything from here over there that you want Its great talking to you again caro33.

(Edited this post a lot ^_^; Love... Since I remember, since the age of 10, I haven't known happiness outside of love. It's as if the two are intertwined for me. Of course, some things, unpredictable typically will cause me to be happy for a few moments here and there, but nothing is as stable or long lasting as love. Nothing that I know of at least. I used to play soccer, and basketball, and football (not on a team), and several other sports, they were fun. But then, I don't know what happened. But it was something major happened, I know because I can't remember it or hardly anything before it. I attempted to continue to do what I remembered as fun, but then everything bored me. I didn't realize until a few years ago, slightly before I met Jessica. I began asking questions like "what is the meaning of life" and some other questions, some that were very deep, very dark, and very twisted. My doctor recommended me to see a psychologists, actively - he gave my dad a list of 12 or so local psychologists that had a good reputation.... but he trashed it. He never was the one to believe in outside help, especially on psychological issues/problems. Shortly afterwards, I became suicidal - very very suicidal. I no longer wanted to live. All my dreams were nightmares. I had nothing left here, nothing to hold me down, no firm ground for me feet to step on to - just a gaping void in which I must walk. I was in the middle of planning how I would suicide... a foolproof plan, of course. It had taken me awhile but it was almost complete. I didn't really want to die, not if I could find something that bound me to this Earth. Then it happened. Jessica told me she liked me, but it was implied to be a liking much beyond that of a friendship. I immediately halted my plans. After speaking to her for a few months, I asked her out - at which time all plans of suicide and death went out the window, I destroyed my previous plans.

Happiness and love You nailed them in your hypothetical situation. There's really nothing else I care for.

I think your in a very sticky situation, for yourself and your insecurity. I have never been to nor personally seen a bike rally event, but I know alot about them from my bigger brother and I've seen a car rally - and the bike rallies are generally supposed to be just a lot "hotter" so to say. If I were you, I would feel insecure, possibly jealous. Maybe you should consider putting your foot down? He says he will goto it every year no matter what - no matter how you feel... You sound like a great and nice person, I don't see why you should stand for that. Would he choose his bikes over you? If so... I'm not so sure you should be with him if your looking for companionship in your relationship Sorry

Yes, in that situation - yes.

The reason is politics. Everything we make, has to have another use. If we view the stars, it is only a time before we being sectioning off a division of men to develop a way to live on them. Look at Mars - thats happening today! Anyways. What I was driving was that no matter how much you invent, if you give it to others - it wont be used as you intended, and you cant change that. My friend, you are correct I believe. I used to ask myself what the point to life was, and came short when nobody could answer that simple, basic question. It infuriated me! I was enraged "Why the hell do you have a PHD when you can't even answer a simple question!" I would ask doctors, councilors, and my father. I wasn't saying that high intelligence negates joy. I was saying that in me, my personality is Analytical. It has nothing to do with my intelligence, but that only adds to it here and there. The problem with me finding joy and or fun is that I analyze everything, automatically, without even realizing it and by the time I notice it, it is already a bore. Just another guy to badger on my use of a common phrase? I guess, common sense, isn't one of the requirements to harp on someone. Obviously you read through enough of my posts to read up to where I had said "infinite wisdom", either that or you saw it in quotes and it struck you as a good thing to harp on? Look. If your going to attempt to post advise, begin by advising through wisdom, experience, responsibility, knowledge, or authority. I'm not telling you who to be or how to be that person, but if you wish to give somebody your advise, it would be great to give the advise, without cirtisizing someone. A more emotional person could easily by hurt by your savage critique and then your efforts of advising would be a floundered attempt that made the situation worse than it was beforehand. Onto what you said that Was of value. I made comments about the political machine, correct. I did not focus on them. I primarily covered my views on them in one post and only replied with a post containing views on the politics of the nations that we live in when directly asked or questioned about them. As far as responsibility goes, I have had a great deal of responsibility in my life - ranging from taking care of little pets to taking care of my younger brother. I've also had responsibility in the authoritative form, though, I'm sure none of that counts, right? As far as selfishness goes - I will ask you one question. Will you state, in one post that I personally made, that said I am not selfish? I'm sure that task will be rather difficult, however, fear not for I do not expect you to look in all honesty as it would be a waste of time. What I am saying is, yes, I realize that worrying about myself is "selfish", but then again... I guess you should realize that eating that dinner you eat every night instead of giving it to a poor and dieing sickly kid is highly selfish as well. Now, what my "wisdom" does tell me about selfishness is that without it - we will die. We must look after ourselves, before we can possibly help others. Now, I apologize for the aggressive nature of this post, however, I felt that maybe it would get through to you.

Caro33, I guess you haven't understood yet. I do not want this. I don't like my intelligence. I hate all the "wisdom" and "intelligence" that I have. In all honesty, there is little diffrence whether or not someone makes a brilliant invention. It all leads to the same place. Making the rest of our lives a living hell. Look at what our life has become! The internet and computer were developed to make life more manageable, to make work easier. But, NO! The corporations couldn't see it that way. Instead, they exploited it to no end. Now we stand in a generation of people that are as clueless about traditional values as a rock is, not only that but that since of making a change has lead to a rise in cheating because people want to get the good jobs and get a recognized title - so sure they cheat their way through school, but the end justifies the means, RIGHT? No! I don't think so. I am rare in my generation, because I do have a Lot of traditional values. There is no invention that has Ever been invented in the length of mankind's existence that has truly made life better.

If you could transport yourself into a time when you felt very happy - any time - you would not be thinking of these things or you would be thinking of them in a different manner. Then I would be remembering the same memory, the same 6 months, over and over and over again repeatedly until even the happiness became dull and weary. I've felt happiness, it felt good, until it burned. Actually, in my self proclaimed wisdom, I have noticed that life goes through a vast circle where everything is bleak and repetitive in which we try to disillusion ourselves into thinking that it isn't the same thing everyday, when really, it is. Life is like a great circle, with several individual circles inside of it. The great circle represents your entire life, the pattern that it assumes. The individual circles represent the different aspects of life that you will experience, primarily there are 4 smaller circles, with even smaller circles inside of them. The four are babyhood, childhood, adulthood, and old age. In this ive grouped teenager and children together as they are essentially the same. Now, each of those four phases, or circles, has its own set of circles, that may be set slightly differently for each person, but in the end, they all are nearly the same. Granted, there are different combinations that lead to different results in the circles, so then there are different sets of general combinations formed, but unfortunately, this number is less than 10. I first noticed repetitiveness while playing a child's game. Then again later when I played a game that was supposed to be a "virtual" life game so to say. Then it dawned on me how repetitive our very own existence is.

Mk. You two can badger on my use of a common phrase all you want. It hardly helps to prove your point, if you have one. "Infinite wisdom" is a common saying or phrase that is used to describe that you have been through a lot and have had a lot of experience. So, if you wish to continue your negative attacks on my use of common phrases that are used on a daily basis amongst several people, then do so - but keep it in your head. And yes, Master Carro, I agree. There are other people that are smarter than me. Not many in the fields that I apply myself to generally, and at my age level or near it, but yet they do exist - miracle isn't it? No, not really. I'm not saying I am superman or some all knowing sage - theres 5 billion friggen people out there. I don't expect to have the highest IQ or whatever else for a person my age. I don't want to have it. As for what a shame it would be to "waste my skills", well sorry, but I could give a rats * * * whether or not a corporation betters itself and becomes rich off of the hard work that I do, while I earn a fraction of the income as a lowly CEO or something. No, whats a real shame, is what the world has degenerated into.

You talk about free will... as if it still existed. Free will has become an illusion. Free will is masked by the media, the society, and the politics. No matter how much my "free will" wishes to goto a small strip of land, and have it as my own - no rules, no boundries, no "protection", nothing of that sort - it will Never happen. Currently, the only places I can go for something like that are practically uninhabited. I don't wish to rule anyone, no I don't want that much land. What about food? Well... let see... that would Be my job, surviving, so it Really wouldn't be that hard to get if I have all day to spend getting food. But no, thats just a small vision of what used to be. Free will, is only as free as the political machine and its watchdog will allow it to be. A) Already said the problem with that. B) Same to this one - but in short, the one thing I found destroyed any will left in me. C) There are failures. When you feel like you have failed yourself, regardless of society, thats when failures truly exist. I know that most people work as a part of the workmachine and mindlessly push away their life without realizing it. But... I've never been the person that can do something like that.

Who? Me? If so - then about what?