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  1. Exactly : That is what I have found, Its all good and well them falling for your personality, which needs to happen for a relationship to last. But women will not give you a chance to show your personality if they dont find you good looking. Why dont women say it as it is !
  2. Thank you all for your replies. I hope I have not offended anyone in my previous posts. Of all the replies I think everyone including myself agree that personality and compatability of personality is needed for a relationship and the closeness of love. My point was that before you can establish the persons personality, each one of us will look at the persons appearance, yes this includes the full package of clothing, posture etc. Now based on this, A girl or a guy will only iniatate romantic conversation / ovetures/ flirting with a stranger if they are physically atractive to him. If an other person iniates conversation / romantic ovetures / flirting then if there is no physical atraction then the chances of the person being open to romantically connecting with this person is greatly reduced as oposed to if they were atracted to them. Of all the replies, I have not seen that men or women will be open to romantic ovetures or will initiate such actions with a stranger unless there is physical atraction. So based on this it appears that we all go initailly for looks. This affects how we respond to the person we are interacting with. (yes once conversation takes place and atractive personality trates are evident then, then attraction to the person can change... not disputing that). So women will reject a mans aproach or be more closed off to his approach becuase of her perception of his looks and whether she thinks he is atractive, all be it supconsiously. Same for a guy. So due to this perception of appearance which appears to be evident in us all, the only way that a guy (or girl in similar situaton of talking to a stranger they physicaly desire) can get the girl to like them is by demonstrating that they have an atractive personality. But my whole point was that if a girl does not find a guy atractive then she will not allow him the chance to show his personality. She will not talk to him and if he tries to talk to her she will be closed off, rude or other. (yes not all girls, a slight generalisation). But from what I have observed, the better looking, (generaly the girl who receives a lot of attention from the opposite sex) will dismiss a guy without giving him the chance. That can only be associated with looks, as she cannot gage his personality enought to know if she likes or dislikes him ! (Same observation for High attention received guy.. which I would deem, classed as the clasic good looking). So how does a guy or girl connect with a person if the other person has assessed their looks as negative and will not allow them the chance to demonstrate there personality. (if they try to connect they will be rejected). If they begin as friends to get to know the girl, then the girl will view them as friends (the friends zone). So she will not be open to the change to bf. And if the guy suggest this, makes attemps at this then end of the friendship. (works the other way as well). Also if the guy (or girl) fancies another and does not iniate romanctic connection, because the other person does not find him atractive, then the girl will not initate becuase of her lack of physical atraction. ! ((( The reason for the posts to try to understand this, is because this is the situation I find myself in. An average zoe, with good personality but judged on my appearance. The girls I like dont find me atractive so will not initaite. If I iniate connection, I will suffer rejection because of no physical atraction. If i am friendly then in the friendship zone ! ))) Now I go for the slimmer, younger appearance women ! ie the stero type good looking girl ! Not a case of conditioning, just my preference of atractiveness in a partner. Now I have lots of women who wish to go out with me but because I do not find them physically atractive then I view them as a friend ! It works both ways. Unlike others I have witnessed, and becuase I have been on the recieving end, if a woman who fancies me aproaches but I do not fancy her, I will tell her straight away, as opposed to being rude. Any idea how this can be overcome ! Both for me and others. Imagae of Shallow hall, but without the sleaze aspect of the charactor !
  3. Thank you for the replies, the point is, is that if a person views another as unatractive they are less open emotionaly to form a connection / attachement / relationship. If they view the person as attractive then they are more open to a connection. Remember I said this was on an instinctual emotional level, not a consious level . It is said it takes seconds for a person to know if they find a person atractive or not, it is not a consious decision ! I believe the same aplies in the sense that we respond differently to a person we instinctivly find atractive as oposed to unatractive. Your more open to a relationship with someone you fancy than with someone you dont. Yes once you get to know someones personality this may change, but initally on someone aproaching someone else this takes place, instinctivly and in second. Without consious knowledge. Good looking guys turn womens heads and they will more consider a relationship with him than a beer bellied man. Evan though the beer bellied man may be so much a nicer person. (V good looking girls in general will not give him the chance). Good looking girls turn guys head and they will more condisder a relationship with her than an ugly woman. Evan though the ugly woman may be so much a nicer person. (Very good looking men in general will not give her the chance). I also mentioned that this differs with age ! Please think back to your dating times of youth, did this apply. If so then perhaps its a selection process in action (( Again no offence is intended to anyone, or their views. I am mearly trying to establish the truth of the matter, in regards to the nature of human attraction)).
  4. In the following I will use the term person to indicate men and women. Guys as on observation I have noticed that people always want something that is of value. If it is not of value then it is not wanted. Now in the arena of attraction (subconsious emotional, instintual reactions) Contorversial bit ! For discussion. Everyone of us is attracted to the Very good looking people. Men to supermodels and women to hunks. Now there have been countless studies done that verify that poeple responce totally different to attractive people as opposed to unatractive poeple. (harsh but true) Each one of us would if we had the chance date a supermodel or hunk ! (if you think of your ideal person, who you really fancy it will not be an unatractive person... that proves that point). So I would say from observation and discussions that starting from the bottom up, so to speak. A bad looking person will be very responcive to the emotional interest of a very good looking person. Good looking man gets bad looking girl to bed easily. Good looking girl get bad looking man running after her. Same applies for a medium looking person and a good looking person. Now in reality a bad looking person appears to be of no value to a very good looking person, or to a good looking person, or a medium looking person. But these people are of value to a bad looking person. A medium looking person has no value for a bad looking person but has value for a good looking person and greater value for a very good looking person. And so on for a good looking person. ====== Now since we alwasy want something that is of value to us, a bad looking person is looking for a medium looking person, a medium looking person is looking for a good looking person and a good looking person is looking for a very good looking person. Another convtoversial bit for discussion. Now women will always be of slightly higher value than men because they have what men want sexually and dont need it as much as men. (they obviously want it as much as men). So take a bad looking guy, trying to connect with a very good looking girl. He is of no value to her and because he is very far down her acceptable value scale she will reject him in a harsh way ! as will a good looking girl and a medium girl, but they will not reject him in such a cold or harsh way as they will appreciate the interest as shown. Simaraly take a bad looking girl, trying to connec witha very good looking guy. She is of no value to her and because she is very far down his acceptable value scale he will reject her in a harsh way ! as will a good looking guy and a medium guy, but they again will not be as harsh as they will appreciate the interest shown. (Note also that the guys may use the interest of the girl for sex. It is still rejection just a harsher way). This is why Very good looking people are total * * * * *es / bas....d to less good looking people (opposet sex or not, as the same principle aplies to social conections as well as emotional, romantic connection) ==== Now if a medium guy tries to connect with a bad looking girl, he will quite often be able to sleep with her (hense the view unatractive girl are easier to bed). Because he is of value to her, as he is higher on her value scale. But if he tries to connect with a medium attractive girl, she will instictivly be looking for good looking guy. But will not disreacard the medium guy totally because he is near her value scale. So for him to connect with her, he then has to demonstrate personality and value that will raise his value and his atractfullness to her to a point where she sees him as good looking. Now if a medium girl tries to connect with a bad looking guy, she will quite easily get of with him because she is of value to him, she is higher up his value scale. But if she tries to connect with medium looking guy, he will be instinctivly looking for a good looking girl. But he will not disreagard the medium girl totally because she is near his value scale. So for him to connect to her, she then has to demonstrate perosnality and value (sexual or not) so that will raise her value and her atractfullnes to the point where she sees him as good looking. -=-=-=- So a woman will only instinctivly iniate an emotional connection (relationship) with someone who is of value to her. She will only respond emotionaly and be receptive to the emotional interest of someone who is of value to her. Better looking on her value scale, or equal in looks, but high degree of personality demonstrated. The same applieas to a guy. -=-=---=-= So if a guy aproaches a girl and she does not consider him of value. Ie up her emotional value scale then she will not entertain his emotional interest in him. The greater the gap the harsher the rejection. A very good looking girl will fain disgust at a medium looking guys aroach, but not at a good looking guys aproach. But a medium looking girl will not fain disgust at a medium guys aproach. A bad looking girl will be open to a medium guys aproach. Hense good looking people, whilst not necisarily better in relationship, have more opertunities for partners than do less atractive people. -=-= Summ: I hope I have not offended anyone with these obeservations, or my spelling..lol. I believe that the process of attraction is an instinctual emotional responce and that women and men both go for looks, even thought they may not think it, simply because they have not stopped to think about it. Now of course other factors do matter ! status, personality, abuse, weath etc. the list goes on. But if all other factors were excluded and a guy aproaches a girl or a girl aproaches a guy then the value of appearance is the overiding factor. -=-=- Questions: What makes a husband run of with a younger model ... Looks. What makes a girl humiliate a geek but go for a hunk who will sleep with her friends.... Looks. What makes a guy think ugler girls are an easy lay.... Looks. Why are good looking people used to sell products !! A product is a product, your being asked to buy the product not the good looking person, so why is a good looking person used. Why as phycologal epxeriments have show do we offer aid to good looking people but not to bad looking people. -=-=-= So I put it to all of you, that we all instinctivly go for looks above personality and we are only open to personality once the looks are acceptable. *** Point to note: this changes as people get older and their own looks naturaly deteriate, so they view others on personality rather than looks. But we all should view others on perosnality not looks. Perhaps this is natural selection in progress ! But for a person to say looks are not considered or are not more important than personality in selecting a mate, i believe they are lying to themselves. ( From my own personal experience, I would say I am medium looking, good looking women snub me, meduim looking women will fall for me, but with an effort from me and bad looking women will hit on me ). If looks do not play apart then all these women should view me near enough the same, I should be able to aproach a supermodel or an unatractive girl and get near enough simialar responces, since we are all human ! But none of us do ....Why..Looks matter !
  5. Hi Batya33. (firstly I am not having a personal go at you, this is just general observation of women and a person seeking clarification). In this post and others women say they go for a complete package of atractfullness. Physical looks, how the person carries himself and others have said how the person makes them feel. But (there is always a but) This is all good and well if a guy goes up to the woman and she has accessed his looks as ok, then his mannerism as ok and then the way he makes her feel due to the way he is showing an interest in her. (all this happens in a micro second and is generaly sub consious). But what if : A: the guy passes this subconsious tick list - the girl will be open to having a conversation with him, open herself up to accessing his personality and letting him show an interest in her. Or B: the guy failes this subconsious tick list - the girl will be closed to having a conversation with him, and will not open herself up to accesing his personality. Now I have seen this happen loads, a guy aproaches a girl and she shoots him down without the guy being able to even talk to her. Can you girls really tell me that this is girls judging someone on personality ! Or is it not as appears to be the case : I dont like his physical appearance, looks so I will not give him the time of day. If i dont fancy him why waist time talking to him and getting to know him. That is judging someone on their looks ! If passed then conversation stage. If failed then shot down stage.
  6. I know girls that I like, I am friendly with them, but look for indications that they like me in more than just a friend way. trouble is i do not apear to get these vibes, so I am reluctant to ask them out. Nobody likes to be rejected, not liked or their feelings not returned. It is showing another that they are of more value to you than you are to them. To my mind it should be 50 50. Any suggestions guys ? (I guess i do not like the feeling of not being wanted, especially if I want the person a lot). What makes this harder is that I do not just wish to go out with anyone, but look for someone who I am very attracted to and who's personality I like. Guess I have very high standards. The girls I go for, receive a lot of emotional interest from guys but you cant help who you like, can you ! ).
  7. You see, as a guy we do. If we find a girl hot physically then we have the emotional interest to go and talk to her. If we do not find her attractive physically then we will not have the emotional interest to go over and talk to her ? So if girls do not have the interest to talk to a guy even if she finds him physically atractive. What makes her have the interest in going to talk to him, to get to know him ? Or does this just not happen ?
  8. No body likes rejection, even if it is done in a nice way. It makes you feel unatractive, undesirable and unwanted. Evan if only for a short time. So you see a girl you like, friendly to them, talk to them and get to know them. Problem is if you dont let her know you like her,she may see you as a friend, but if you do let her know you like her she may reject you. What do people think the signs are that she likes you in a b/f sense, so that you can gage this before you ask her out ? Any ideas ?
  9. If I am interested. Ie, if I find him atractive ? is that right?
  10. How about complimenting her as you would anyone one else.. Ie about something you find attractive or nice about her. That is a compliment. Because its true, its sincere. Anything else is picked up as contrived. Another poster mentioned basket ball. Excellent to get her laughing, shows your a fun guy.... Thats not what a compliment is for. Make her laugh, shows your fun to be around... V good pluss point. Compliment her positive atributes. ... Shows you have noticed her !!! Extreamly good pluss points. In others words, everything about you should be positive, she will notice this...and that equates to noticing you...
  11. I have noticed that a lot of guys for fear of rejection do not aproach girls. There is nothing wrong with these guys and these guys would treat the girls well. But it is the guys who just see girls as sex objects who will go out and hit on loads of different women a night that aproach the girls. Because the girls are waiting for a guy to aproach them, then they will go with these guys. Then this guy will just use her or cheat on her, because he always looking for another lay. My point is that because the girl will only go for the guy who aproaches her as opposed to the guy who perhaps really likes her, but does not aproach her because he is not recieving any signs from her that she is interested (because she does not aproach ) then she will be seeing a jerk who mistreats her and cheats on her. !!!! This happens loads and does not make sense ! Surly you would think that if a girl sees a guy hitting on loads of other girls it would put her off, but the opposite seems to apply !!
  12. "women do like looks, don't let anybody tell you different. they have to be attracted to their man. i've heard all the bs from women. they don't approach ugly guys thinking they are 'nice". I agree with this. It appears if they do not see you as atractive then they will disregard you and not even give you a chance. Not even give themselves a chance to get to know you.
  13. The Answer is YES. Guys do like a woman to aproach them first. It is flattering to a girl to be asked out and the same holds true for a guy. But when you do this you face the same possibility of rejection that a guy faces, so just talk to him and let him know you like him. He will give you indications that he does or does not like you.
  14. Hi guys. I read somewhere that unlike guys who are very visual and go for looks, then personality. Women on the other hand are more atracted to a guys personality than his looks ? So a question for the femails out there, is this true ? Also we all like to be found atractive by the opposite sex, it makes us feel good. But we want to be desired / attactive to someone who is of value to us. In the case of guys a good looking girl with a good friendly nice personality. But in the case of women, what traits are considered to be of value to a girl, so that she will want the guy to find her attractive and see him as a boyfriend prospect. As opposed to just a nice guy ? What makes him more of value to her than anyone else ?
  15. Hi guys, I am moving on from a bad relationship breakup. I have been talking to some girls and asked them out. But I get a reply like not this week or ask me out in a couple of weeks. This feels like I am being played and that there is someone else in the wings who they really want ! Whats your take on this. I dont want to be made a fool of. I mean when a guy askes a girl out he is esentialy putting himself on the line and showing her she is of value to him, this gives her a lot of power over him and no one likes rejection. Is there a way to do this without being in that possible lower value position? Or is it best to be friendly and see if she initiates first ????
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