studbaker99

one word - co-dependent. I've been down that path and after a while it felt like i was walking on eggshells. Nothing I could do would please her, and she'd snap off on the littlest things. It may look hard now for you to see this, because you associate your love for her as the same thing as taking care of her, which , in normal relationships, it is the same thing, but when one partner is too needy, that's when you start losing yourself.

If I had a gf who didnt speak my native language, and I was chatting up with friends, I'd try to fill her in on the highlights between pauses, and or slow down the pace and include her. It's all freaking common sense and courtesy!!...isn't it?

Northalius: I guess I would have to disagree. I can adore my SO and yet be realistic enough to know if I told her she is "most beautiful woman in the world" (even as she's pretty attractive imho) she'd laugh at me and know I had to be fibbin and/or blind. "Hotness" doesn't speak for personality, compatibility or what this person is to you, and that is what dictates satisfaction "with the one you're with". It is purely a physical and superficial description. Women can also appreciate when another woman is hot, more so than men towards men. Would it be disrespectful for her to even voice out that a woman is "hot"? would it mean she has lesbian tendencies and she is disrespecting your manhood? food for thought.

btw, the reason I was 'okay' with just being fwb was that (and I told her this) I was going to move far away in 5 months time. I think that allowed her to accept our situation and let it carry on. fast forward a year, and we're still together in some limbo 'this is not serious' (but exclusive) relationship. heh. So if you have any intentions of it becomeing something more serious, well, the future might not be too bright down the line either.

On the other hand (just playing devils advocate): it's been 4 months!!!! It isnt the same as being next week. when you break up with someone, its always hard the first time you see them with someone else. Makes it even harder if you don't have anyone else in your life at the moment...

well I was in a FWB situation, and she didnt (and doesn't, hah)want to get too serious. We had one of those talks where she was telling me this (as a preempt to break off) and I told her that "hey I'm cool with it too (not getting serious), I think we really got a good physical connection and I'd love to keep that" to which she went something like "yah I really enjoy it too its fun" so that kinda got established and we still hung out but we were still kinda dating, so it wasn't like I could just call her out of the blue to do the nasty, or her. However, that's how I chose to pursue it (with me it was a bit of a trying to stay still in the pic with hopes of more), but I can see how we could just keep it friendly after that conversation,go our "separate ways" and I could call her up once in a while see what she was up to and if she wanted to "hang out".... the between the lines being of course, the benefits. And then its up to her. So I guess for you, just call her up and ask if she wants to "hang out" making it sound somewhat obviously that is benefit related. Maybe "wanna hang out and watch a movie at my place" . I think she could pick up on that if she's interested.

people: this is high school. I can imagine this being said in person to one another. "my boyfriends not hot but he's the sweetest ever". would be perfectly segued with "well my boyfriend's cat can beat your boyfriend's cat". having said that - I once glimpsed a chat conversation my gf was having with a girl friend of hers, and my gf said something like "yah the hot guys are good to look at, but for me its all about the personality". I kinda felt a bit butt hurt about that because it somehow implied that I was ugly....

"As far as being too nice - not wanting to that is - I can totally relate - and that's why I suggesting asking her out on a proper date - that is not "too nice" - it's normal behavior for a man interested in a lady and it's not overboard either (don't pick the fanciest most romantic restaurant in town but something nicer than casual - and no flowers, gifts, etc . .. yet.)" I'd say go for broke. In a gentle way. Right now you're risking falling into the 'nice guy' syndrome. Let your emotions come out and express to her your interest in more than just 'friends'. Asking her to go out outside of your formalized pattern of interactions would definitely be risky for you, but it would bring the issue of wether she thinks of you as a friend or something more to the forefront. It doesn't have to be anything too formal , something like 'hey there's a concert on saturday would u like to go' and see what she says. A yes will be a good start, a no might still be saved, depending on if she gives you an alternate option. The question is wether you can handle the answer, whichever way it ends up going. Or, you can do the 'nice guy' thing and keep going at it, slow and steady, hoping that each time you see her will be the time that she finally falls for you.

purely for discussion purposes, I get a tinge of jealousy if the girl I'm with says somehting like 'hes hot', since I immediately draw comparisons on what hes got that I don't. I try to chalk those comments up to the fact that she's comfortable with me and is sharing those thoughts with me. Its not as if us guys dont think the same thing when a hot girl passes by.

My ex thought it was a turn on to see two guys kiss. I thought it was kinda of weird. Maybe it's because obviously I can't share that fantasy with her. However, on a more general sense, I can relate to when something about your SO makes you suddenly her feel less desirable for you. If I knew my gf had been with a ton of guys (whatever that number may be for you - usually 2-3x more than your own count) I'd be slightly turned off.

I think the whole stress point is that she keeps repeating it over and over. C'mon, is our original poster deaf of hearing or something? I'd second the idea that perhaps she's trying to convince herself more than you. But I'd be curious to hear how you react to when she says those words.

Does anyone find that people here in the US are too stuck in their cliques? maybe I am biased, but when I was in Europe I had a grand time meeting people, their friends, and friends of their friends, and best of all, becoming friends with them. Granted this was during tourist season, and other travellers, but I was able to still keep in touch with a handful of those, and it's a precious thing. I live in San Jose, CA, and it's the worst city ever for breaking through new social circles, especially if you're socially inept like I am I'm amazed I even have a relationship.

"Hmm...well this is a red flag to me. I think most of the time when someone expresses fear of marriage and children, or other forms of committment, they are really expressing a fear of settling down with the particular person they are with at the moment. That is just my opinion though. Anytime a guy has asked me for space or time to think about committment, it has meant for me that their gut is saying that they do not want to be committed to me. " That is so true. My ex (whom I'm still best friends with) kept saying she doesn't want to get married or kids (and I stuck by hoping she'd change her mind, but also at the time we were younger so it wasn't a factor as much as it would be today). Now she's with someone else , and she says she wouldn't mind it, nor would she mind having little "johnnies" running around. Granted she's changed and matured a bit in the meantime (3 years have passed), but my conclusion from this would be the same - "I dont want to get married" ...(to you).

"That always seemed kinda weird to me and it eventually led to the second reason dealing with a non communicative person is annoying. Whenever we got into arguments many of the things I had told her, (that she liked to listen to) or she had heard me talk about with my friends, were constantly brought up and used to make points because she eventually knew all this personal stuff about me, but I knew so little about her. I eventually began to suspect that her liking to listen to people had nothing to do with being a good listener- it was just a passive aggressive way she used to feel superior to other people, because she could believe that she had more information about them than they had on her- which she could then use to judge them and their actions, but nobody could ever do the same to her- which I came to realize is a very powerful but dysfunctional weapon. Im not saying that is the case with you at all, but when you share a lot of yourself with somebody else, and they dont do the same back to you, then things can get a little lopsided and suspicions begin to abound." HAHAH.This hit the nail in the head. I am to a T this person. (and is your ex gf single? ) I've always considered myself the 'good listener' and I prefer much more to ask questions and let other people talk than to have me talk. I don't really have much in terms of opinions, mostly because there's always more than one side to any one subject and I tend to view both sides of the equation. But the reality is also, it makes me for a boring person. I know of myself I lack that 'passion' that drives interesting people. I've tried to balance this out by volunteering information on my own, but it still feels weird. Mostly because I WANT people to know who I am, but somehow I often fail at that, through some mysterious way I come off or communicate, people just aren't naturally inclined to be asking me questions. I'm cursed with wanting what I cannot have, and having what I do not want. Anyway, KimNYC, I don't think he's totally off, as I am proof of it. Ultimately, I think maybe a no-small-talk person would probably match better with someone with equal tendencies.

I feel I have no "control" because I'm not a leader so I rarely initiate things. On the other hand she's the assertive type so she's always initiate things. I'm also the quiet somewhat shy guy, and she is the gregarious type that always has something to do. So the end result is I end up going with whatever she wants to do or been invited to. That unbalance is starting to get to me, but, I don't see a light at the end of the tunnel since it just seems the combination of passive/aggressive in the relationship is hard to turn around from both sides. My previous relationship was also with someone that's pretty independent and fairly strong. I can almost see in myself that I seek and I am attracted to those kind of women (Freud would have a field day since these women tend to emulate my mom in some way or form, as well as the relationship between her and my dad). I mean who wouldn't like a strong confident assertive woman that's open minded and ready for adventure? my brother, who inherited the passiveness of my dad, happened to marry a woman that's passive as he is, and they've been together for 7 years (+ 1 married). In one of those days where I was questioning myself where this is going to, I talked to both him and his wife if they get 'bored' in their relationship. They have literally no friends and most weekends are spent watching movies or reading books. They seem to be happy in their own world tho, with the occasional adventure once or twice a year. Is that really the type that would work best with my own personality? My last year with my relationship has been pretty amazing in terms of life experiences, but not too great as far as the relationship side of it. Me and my girl we're not meant to be together forever, so maybe I'm wasting my breath and time. But as we all know it's difficult to accept that reality.

I'm feeling like I am at her beck and call and we'll do things according to her mood. I've always been a pretty laid back guy (or, passive if you want to be nitpicky) and as such I go with the flow with whatever most of the time. I'll shamefully admit I am not born to be a leader, I'm much more comfortable being in a group (I should have been born Japanese in Japan). How can I regain control?! She's the independent outgoing type. If I say 'no' she'll just say 'ok' and make up alternate plans. I can't seem to win? please show me the light.

Hah this was exactly waht I went through for close to 3 years with my ex. The first year was good, the second was comfortable but the third was pure hell. Walking on eggshells perfectly describes it, and I never knew what was gonna set her off and then I'd spend the next day with a sullen person which I personally can't stand (just my own trait I guess) so I'd try and make things better. Like any relationships, it takes two to tango and I think its our personalities that promote that eggshell behavior. They demand for something, they dont get it, they get skulk, we try to make better, they learn to react like that and it becomes a set behavior on a downward spiral. I personally don't know how to stop it. The reason I'm here is that my current relationship I'm starting to feel that same anxiety all the time waiting to see what her mood of the moment is and tiptoe around that. I hate it.

That is the first time I've seen someone write every single word with the first letter uppercased. I was reading it in stacatto mode. Like.A.Robot.

Is she Vietnamese or Korean? I heard they can be quite *itchy... I am in the process of figuring out if the current relationship I am in has any more value to me, and I might need to break up. But it would be because of a lack of commitment, rather than being stifled. I do wonder what to do...

Thank you guys. In light of her constant recent metaphorical wandering eyes, it seems a pretty straight forward shot that if given an ultimatum she would choose the 'lets end this'. Part of me yes, has hoped that perhaps a reason why she never considering going serious with me was because I did "not know what I want in life" as per her words, and that I was 'unmotivated and lazy', which was a slap on the face but totally true(I've been unemployed for the past 8 months). That conversation was a catalyst in me seeing that 'wow, I do need to move my * * *, if not her, then the next girl I meet would be thinking the same thing', ever since then, and I'm doing this totally 'for myself', I have started looking for a job that I really can make a career from and would be excited about. So yes I have been getting interviews in companies I'd love to work for (we'll see how that turns out) and I've been letting her know that this is really something I'm gonna build on. I'm afraid tho that my personality/lifestyle is also a negative on my behalf. I'm always the chill quiet guy so most of the time I go along with whoever whatever people are doing. I think this is fun and cool for the first few months but then wears thin in the women's books. The whole alpha male selection and etc. I confess it would be very hard for me to break it off from my own initiative. Even tho last year, I went travelling in Europe and had more success with women than I've had ever (tho, these were quick summer flings), relationship wise (this would be my third, and I'm 30) I've always ended up broken hearted. I don't like how I am in relationships. I just got an interview in San Francisco (I live in San Jose, 40 miles away) if I get offered the job, it would be a hard commute, I might relocate, and thus move away from the temtaption. I was supposed to have gone travelling in May, but due to meeting her, I decided to stay and its October already. I told myself, if something happens, and she breaks up, I can just continue travelling like my original plan - i.e. move away, run from everything that reminds me, the routine that we had. That's how I can deal with pain, otherwise I know I just will get miserable for the next month or so. I dont know how to break up!!!...I don't think I have the courage!

Hey buddy, if you've been heartbroken/dumped before, time to put things into perspective. You will go through emotional hell, unable to eat, work or enjoy things in life, but this too, shall pass... So sorry to hear. I might be going thru that soon too.

Ok, this is the third 'installment' of my predicament. Some of you who prowl this board will probably have read my other posts. In any case, a quick summary would be in order: dating a girl who started as friends with benefits, then we hung out all the time, became more, so we're 'official' even tho (apparently) the word 'gf or bf' doesn't quite come easy from the lips. We have this standing 'rule' that if 'any of us finds someone better, that we should go for it'. We're basically mr/ms 'Right now'. Apparently, she is going for it, as she danced with someone over the weekend and now would like to reconnect with him (but they didnt exchnge phone numbers, so she posted a 'missed encounters' ad on Craigslist wondering if he'd read it). This was only found cuz I gained access to her email account and I've been snooping (shame on me!) It is possible she has engaged in other potential contacts with other people in the 8 months that we have known each other - some of it has been recorded (no direct evidence) in her email, but a lot/the rest could have been conducted over the phone/text messages. For those who read my other posts, I feel I need to say that DESPITE these episodes, she has always been 90% of the time THERE WITH ME, together, and we have DONE and SHARED many things together and common friends. I want it to be clear that with her extra curricular thoughts aside, I cannot have any complaints about her not having time for me, or not engaging, etc. So if I never had spied on her email account, I would be completely oblivious to her other suspected activities. Given the rule we went into this relationship with, I believe she's in her right to do so. Still HURTS like a dITCH tho to find out that as we hang out, her mind's/heart isnt entirely there To be honest (before I hooked up with her) I had a membership in one of those dating sites. I still receive 'matches' from and I have contacted a few women through the contact form (mostly its about clickin on a button and it sends the prechosen questions). But never followed up besides the automated forms. I think it was mostly an exercise in fooling me into thinking I had options. From the beginning, this relationship has meant more to me than to her. Of course, the sex is great, and I didn't want to lose that, plus she's genuinely a fun girl to be with, and a lot of people enjoy her company. Maybe I'm overanalyzing things that may come from this recent turn of events - like perhaps she's ready/wanting to be more independent and enjoy more of single life - afterall, it was this bachelorette party that allowed her to go clubbing wihtout me, and that's how she met this apparently attractive guy she would like to reconnect with... Maybe this will die down, just as perhaps many other peaks of interest sparked before, and they too died, and I may not even have noticed. Remember this is NOT a full blown relationship, but she has been a good partner in crime, and she has been a good one at that, if not for the evidence in the emails that she's not quite there in spirit. I have enjoyed it very much. But from where it started ('friends' with benefits) to where it is now, it has gone pretty far. My hope would be perhaps that it could go farther. But again, this last week (peaking with her club night) I have noticed a very slight drop on the interest level. Tonight, we chatted online and we webcammed, just being stupid with each other, and I thought the interest level was back up. To my surprise after I logged off she probably went to craigslist surfing randomly, and she thought to use the 'missed connections' forum and take a chance to contact that guy. That brought me down, made my heart heavy. Yes, I have grown WAY too attached to her. So, while the good is still going good, at least in appearances, how can I start closing my heart down, so that it won't be her that will call the shots, leaving a poor devastated me behind, crying and in pain and in a void for a period of weeks or months? How do I protect myself while I still can have the benefit of not being in pain? Is there a way? (added: btw, this is doubly hard, because I just recently got back in Dec last year from living for 9 months away, and previous to that I had been with a gf that literally took my (small) social life away by demanding that we hang out 24/7 - the couple of friends I have made in the meantime are all also her friends. My roomate is also her friend , and we're part of the same college organization, so there's a lot of life mixed in together, taht woudl create a lot of contact points if/when we were to try and go our separate lives) HELP before I NEED SERIOUS HELP!!

Holy frijoles. This is exactly how I describe my situation with my ex. Everything could set her off, and then I'd end up being the bad guy, and try to make HER feel better. I lost a lot of self respect back there, and I don't want to believe that this girl is like that (and I don't think she is), nor do I want to go revisit that situation back there (even tho I am still great friends with my ex, without the romantic connection, it's more like 'dude, shut up, you're being an idiot'). There's definitely something whimsical about her behavior there tho - for instance, I will try to kiss her, she'll pull away, leaving me hanging, without trying to make me feel better or whatnots, or coming back and reconnect. I wonder if she's checking off some sort of list as far as how far she can go with these 'odd' behaviors. And the more she can get away with, the fartherst it will go - perhaps unconsciously. On the surface, she seems very much a rational, fun filled, outgoing person, with her head on her shoulders. Yes, this relationship has meant a lot more for me than for her. It seems this is ALWAYS the case with me. She does. But I really can't help it - I currently do not work, while she has a full time job, plus full time college classes, so I don't mind doing some favors for her - and honestly, can someone tell me how can I possibly say NO, when they know most of my day is spent at home watching movies on my computer? This has been always problem for me, again, my ex-gf was one of those 'busy all the time' full of little things to do or take care of and be involved in, while my schedule, was 'go to the bank and deposit money' and that would be it for my day, so of course, if the gf needed some help doing some errands I cannot come up with a decently valid excuse that doesnt make me look like a jerk. Yes, I believe I should do that. She's definitely competitive, even as she can be laid back. Yes I think it stems from her mom. BTW, I just wanted to add - she bought me toothpaste today, and texted me about it, totally unexpected, and most definitely appreciated. So, some nice gestures.

Thanks. You're right. Snooping is a double edged sword. She went to a bachelorette party this past friday, and as single girls go, some dude ended up dancing with her all night long, afterwards she expressed to me that yah she had a really good time, and this guy danced with her and didn't even ask for her phone number. She was honest and forward about it, and I didn't press too much into it because I didn't really want to know what went on (did she make out? how was this guy 'all over her'?) We spent saturday at a club, where after hearing her blab about her experience, I left like I was cockblocking her, and sunday we did some more activities together. Today, monday, I was feeling pretty good cuz we were chatting online and webcamming, and generally laughin and connecting, and then I left to do some late night errands, and I came back home, she had already gone sleeping, checked her email account (ok, yah I know that's BAD) and I found out she posted an ad on missed connections on craigslist asking for this guy, at this club, and how she 'had a great night of dancing, and she was sorry she didn't have the foresight of asking for his phone number'. I have to say tho, that this has been our thing - as she puts it "should any of us find something better, then by all means go ahead and pursue it". I just accepted it back then and now because to demand anything more of her, would be to drive her away by making too many demands, and I thought that if she's busy and enjoying my company she wouldn't want to be looking. The problem is that with girls, they never have to do the active looking - guys approach them. With us guys, if I'm not actively looking, then nothing comes to me, so in order ot be in the same playing field, I have to make the first move, which I am not inclined to do so. Early in the relationship she said she was being bad for being with me, because she knew down the line she would break my heart. Well, at this point, it seems very much so. I guess I have to detach myself, cuz I'm just setting myself up to get majorly hurt. And yes, snooping other people's emails is a recipe for getting hurt.

I just had to clear up this image you have of 'using people' - please bear in mind that she's replying to people who are posting (and looking) for someone to join them for a concert, using a ticket that otherwise might have just gone to waste. Sometimes it is hard to find a willing partner for a concert, and not everyone in your gaggle of friends enjoy the same musical tastes as yourself. If you go to craigslist you can see for yourself that absolutely nothing is expected out of these encounters. It's just a matter of finding another person who enjoys the singer/band , last minute, and go together. As far as the suggestive nature of that ad, it merely said "I got a free ticket. Looking for a lady to accompany me. Not closed to the idea of enjoying the night if there's chemistry". Sure the guy might want some action, but I think the only fault he has is that he's upfront about it on the ad. Yes, it does bother me a bit that she'll go ahead and reply to these ads, but I can understand it as well. Yes, these guys are a differnt kind of guys. I know that. Before me, she was single for about a year, and before that she had been in a relationship for about 4-5. In that singlehood year, she may have gone a bit wild sowing her seeds. And now these old boy toys are wanting to come back for more.... (this was just a realization I had now as I write this..catharactic experience, sharing in these forums.. BTW, I am really insecure, maybe not as much as I used to be, but heck. My middle name is Insecure.