anydaynow

I know lots of people come to these forums and look for advice on similar situations to their own. I did this myself before finally starting a thread about my situation. I just wanted to add one last post for anyone that finds this thread and wonders what happened. I posted the outcome in a separate thread on the LTR/Marriage board shortly after the proposal. Then today I realized that someone reading my old thread (this thread) for advice wouldn't see the outcome. Anyway, the outcome is that we are engaged, it was a huge surprise, and we have set a date and we are getting married in the near future! Planning for our little ceremony is in full swing, and we are working through some pre-marriage homework together to ensure that the wonderful relationship we have had continues and grows through our years of marriage. How it finally got to this point, I don't really know. I've asked him what he was thinking; what finally led him to pop the questions. He can't tell me much other than it suddenly felt like the right time. He admitted that he had this feeling before, that the timing suddenly felt right, but something in his life changed and it threw his plans off. He was thinking about going back to school the last time it felt right, about a year before the proposal finally happened. Like I said many times before, we had many conversations about it, and we were in agreement that marriage and family were things we wanted with one another. It was just the timing that we had to synchronize. Of course, other than my gut feelings, there was no sure way for me (or anyone in my situation) to know what was really going to happen. I can say that I must have felt sure that it was going to happen, felt that he was being sincere in his words and promises, especially since the feelings were so strong, even after people opened my eyes to the possibility of a less than perfect outcome. People can say all day that they know that their relationship is headed for xyz, but nothing is for sure until the moment it happens.

I think engagement is a promise to marry with definite plans for a wedding. Ring or no ring. My boyfriend and I talked about getting married and future plans, where to live, and children for years. I did not consider myself engaged until he recently formally proposed. For someone my age (mid-to-late twenties), I think a 1 year engagement is normal, 6 months is short, and anything over a year is long. For someone who is still in school, I think an engagement of a couple years is normal.

It should feel right. Take some time to talk to her about how you are feeling, and try to correct it. If it doesn't seem to be fixable, or requires more work than it should, than get out of the relationships. I think healthy relationships require routine maintenance, the occasional repair if routine maintenance is not kept up, but never a major overhaul.

I think it is okay to talk to her about this kind of stuff, but don't take off and elope just yet! People really do grow and change in their early twenties, and you are both still in your late teens. You are teenagers! Not to say that it has no chance of working out just because you are young. A long engagement starting in a couple years might be appropriate. Hopefully by then she will be thinking about what marriage really is, and not "what songs she is going to play at it." She is talking about a wedding reception, not marriage! Since you are both young and probably more prone to personality changes than your average 30 year old, a couple of years might be enough to tell if you will be able to grow together, or if your growing will lead you apart. I met my boyfriend at 19. We were both in college, and he was a couple years ahead of me. I was so sure he was the one, that it was mere months before we started talking marriage. But I was young, and our relationship was young, and maybe a little immature, and we had a brief 1 month separation at the one year mark. Got back together and 7 years later, we have grown and matured individually and as a couple and we are now engaged. We are looking at getting married within a year. We are both so happy and excited about marrying one another. It feels so perfect and so right! If you think you know she is the one, you can talk to her about it. But let your relationship grow and see what direction it takes before making any big moves. Good luck!

Neither would I, but I don't think that not considering divorce an option would ever make me unhappy.

regarding rushers- Well, for my friends' sake, I hope that will not hold true in their case. I think you are right about people thinking that marriage is something that is easily divorced out of. My guy and I both feel that if you love someone enough to marry them, and you know them well enough that deal breakers (abuse, etc) are not a problem, than you should be able to work through nearly anything. For me, and the culture of my extended family, divorce is not an option.

Thanks so much! Also, regarding the topic, most of the people I know dated for several years before getting engaged. Also, most of my friends are the type that want to "get all their ducks in a row" before embarking upon marriage. I do know one couple that got engaged within months, but it was a unique military situation that they felt required a rush to the altar.

That's a good solution! I think a winter wedding in PA will be fine. In fact, my parents had a December wedding in PA. I feel like we don't usually have major snowstorms in Dec, usually in Jan and Feb.

nylady- do you want a ring? It's okay if you do. I don't think that being together for 8 years means you should not make a ring part of the equation. If it is important to you, that is okay. Problems start to happen when it is overly important to you to have a ring that is beyond your means as a couple. I told my boyfriend of 8 years that I did not need a ring. He wanted to get me one. He wanted to get me a really nice one that I would love to wear for the rest of my life. So he did, and I love it. If I really had my heart set on a ring, and someone said, "oh, you've been together 8 years, it doesn't matter anymore," I would be upset. It matters if it matters to you. Why should it matter less or more if you've been together for 6 months or 8 years? Besides, rings can be a few hundred or a few thousand. Not everyone that wants a ring is a superficial gold-digger.

I think that you should stay at home, and deal with changing jobs. I don't think any employer will fault you for leaving because you are getting married. After all, most people would not live apart because of jobs after they are married. I'm so in agreement with how you feel about living together before marriage. It will be so special and much more of a change when you get married and get to live together because of it. And it is so practical, to boot, economically speaking!

Thank you everyone! I'm still on cloud nine and so excited about this! I wake up some mornings thinking it is a dream and I have to check my hand to make sure it really happened! Missy- Follow your heart and don't forget that you deserve to be happy, too!

I think if you are just as happy not to live with him, why not stay at home with your mom until then? You'll make your mom happy, for one thing. Plus, when you are officially married, she might feel like she is losing you a little to your new family- your husband. Give her this time before the wedding. It's easy for you to respect her viewpoint since you aren't dying to live with your partner right away. If you stay at home- he doesn't mind, you don't mind, and your mother is happy. If you move in with him- he doesn't mind, you don't mind, and your mother thinks it is a disgrace that you are living in sin. On the non-mom side of things, I think that if you love someone enough to marry them, you will love them enough to work living-together-issues out. This might mean you have a fight about the right way to fold the towels or some other silly issue. But that I think is normal, and easy enough to get over if your relationship is strong. Plus, I think it will make your marriage seem more exciting if living together for the first time is tied in with it. Otherwise, you get married, and go back to exactly how you were before the ceremony.

It just happened on Saturday! About 8 years, and the wait was worth every minute!

...but I don't need to anymore! I posted last summer in "relationship commitment." I was asking for advice on what to do because my boyfriend of about 8 years had yet to propose and seemed to always have a good reason why he hadn't yet. Everyone insisted I was being strung along and stupid to stay. I can see why they might have thought that. I know others have posted here with the same type of situation, and the advice is always the same. Tell him it's time to **** or get off the pot. Hearing that kind of advice made me doubt my man's intentions. But the truth is someone with a relationship spanning 5, 6, 7, or 8 years should know their partner and whether he is sincere or not in his reasons. I'm not saying that the advice here is not valuable. I'm just saying that you should take it with a grain of salt. Proceed with caution. Many people were encouraging me to leave right away. Some people said give him a deadline, like 6 months. Everyone said don't dare give him another year. So I only halfway listened. I told myself that if he didn't propose within 14 months, I'd be out of the relationship. 8 months into my timeline, and he finally proposed!!! It was romantic and private and the ring is gorgeous. He wants a short engagement and we cannot wait to marry!

I don't think there is such thing as a good stereotype. Generalizations are pretty bad, in general (ha ha!). Assuming that someone does martial arts because they are asian is totally stupid. Although I guess I do ask nearly every white guy that I meet if they are totally into baseball and apple pie. (No, of course I really don't.) Seriously, I can't believe some of the crap people are writing: "Japanese are short and nerdy... Hawaiians are tall and tan?" You've got to be kidding me. What about fricking sumo wrestlers? Are they short and nerdy? "Asian men are popular for the right reasons, like being good at martial arts?!?" F's sake, I hope you guys are joking. I'm an Asian female, and living among stupid people with stupid assumptions is so irritating. Guys see me and think I'm some sweet little submissive China doll. I'm the total opposite, with strong opinions and big mouth. I'm contentious and can be downright aggressive at times. Come to think of it, I don't know a single Asian female that fits the doormat stereotype that some guys assume to be true. Before I realized this was a stereotype, I used to get excited when I discovered that a guy I was interested in was into Asian girls. I felt like I was a shoe-in for the girlfriend position. Now I know better. I'm really wary of guys that are specifically into Asian girls. They must have some generalization about them to single them out like that. I don't know if this stereotype is still widespread, or if it has decreased in recent years. Probably still widespread. It takes a long time for things to change. Anyway, onto the topic at hand. Asian guys. Same with guys. I know very few Asian guys that are smarmy nerd types; guys that fit the stereotype people are talking about. Anyway, I'm finding more and more these days that Asian men are being portrayed a little better in the media. I haven't seen a Long Duk Dong (from Sixteen Candles) character in quite a while. In my opinion, it is getting better and will continue to get better. But not fast enough, IMO. I love it when I see Asian men portrayed differently. Even if it is in a negative light. LIke, there was some movie where kids were trying to steal the SAT answers. The Asian kid was a goof-off-stoner. Awesome! That Korean guy in Lost is a pretty beefy tough Asian dude. And did anyone watch the last season of Survivor? Yul was a total hottie with serious brains to boot!! So, bottom line is it sucks to live in a world full of generalizations, but you can't do much about it except spread the word that the stereotypes are wrong. Even if they are "positive" stereotypes. That is just stupid. I've been told, "Oh, you Asians are so smart." That is lame. I know some pretty stupid Asians. Ever heard of the model minority myth? Also stupid, IMO. Just remember that the girls that have those stereotypes in their minds are not the ones you want to be dating, anyway.

I've seen this technique on a TV show called Supernanny. It's a good show, and Jo Frost seems to have solid techniques and tips. She does the exact same thing. No bargaining or negotiating (I need water/milk/etc)- Nothing but "bedtime" the first time the kid gets out of bed. She even tells the parents not to make eye contact, let alone say anything to the kid after the 2nd time out of bed! Again, I'm not a parent, and it is TV, but it seems like it should work. On the show, I've seen this technique take over 2 hours (of the kid getting up and the parent putting them back in bed) the first time around, but the next night is 45 minutes and the next is 20.

How is your relationship otherwise? How is he feeling about the relationship? Does he know that something is amiss with you? I assume when you say you need the night, you mean nighttime, like, when people typically sleep, so you and your husband can be alone and intimate together, not just an evening out. A date night, like friscodj suggested, is also a good idea, but you've got to get your son out of your bed, I think. I think you should go cold turkey with getting your 21 month old in his own bed. I'm not a parent, but from what I've seen, you'll have about a week of really hard nights. But one week or even two weeks of hard nights for your son is nothing compared to what years of him in your bed will do to your relationship with your fiance. And if you don't stop now, when will it stop? I know a couple couples that had their kids in bed with them as babies and toddlers, and now the kids are 5 and it hasn't stopped. It's easier to do it now than in two or three years, I'd guess. Getting a babysitter at night, like his mom, might help temporarily, but it won't solve the problem. Plus, you have already thought of that, and he hasn't bothered getting his mom over to help. Getting a babysitter to give yourself private time overnight is only a temporary fix, not a real solution. It is like taking medicine to stop a symptom, but not cure the reason for the symptom. By posting here, you are facing the issue, and that is a good thing. Since you aren't really up for counseling at this point, I think it would be okay to admit to your fiance that you'd like more private time together. It isn't saying anything is wrong, it's just saying that you'd like more. Don't think of it as losing love, think of it as regaining intimacy. There's nothing wrong with expressing your needs in a relationship. He will probably wholeheartedly agree, assuming he is feeling okay about the relationship. It's just the same as a couple who have too much time in bed, and one person saying, "we should do different activities, I don't want our relationship to be based purely on sex." For you, it's "I don't want our relationship to be based solely on our son." Think about it, when you exchange vows, you will promising yourself to him, not each other to your son. Not to make it sound like your son isn't important, he is. But ensuring that your relationship with your husband-to-be is strong and healthy will really benefit your son. Multiple studies have shown that children coming from happy marriages fare better than those who do not. Some other posts at ENA have prompted me to pick up some reading on healthy marriages as, uh, pre-marital homework. I'm reading a really good book right now by John Gottman, Seven Principles for Making Marriage work. My boyfriend (no, we are not engaged yet, but this is your thread, so we won't get into it...) and I are reading it together, and I think it will help us build a strong foundation for a lasting, loving marriage. We both think we have a really good relationship as it is, but we want to be able to take anything that comes at us as a couple and come out on the other side together. We figure, if we can be stronger as a couple, why not? Anyway, I highly recommend the book so far. Okay, so in summary, I think you should: 1) Tell your fiance you'd like things to change a little for the better, and do this by 2) Getting your son in his own bed ASAP. and if 1 & 2 don't fix things, or if you have time or he is willing to anyway: 3) Read the book I suggested, or one of your own choosing, to help strengthen your relationship. If he isn't willing to, you can also do this on your own. Good luck, and let us know how it works!

I can say for me that it is most definitely NOT their certainty. It sounds like it might be the same case for OP, since she comments that they (the other couples) kind of jump into it. I agree though, it's a big commitment or it's nothing. I also want to add this about pre-marital books- I read the book "Blink" by Malcolm Gladwell. It has nothing to do with engagement or marriage. It's about first impressions and snap judgements. But Gladwell does reference Dr. John Gottman, who is a master at snap judgements in determining with 95% accuracy whether or not a couple will be married in 10 years after talking with them for a mere 5 minutes. Seriously! I just looked up John Gottman, and he has a few books out that might be good pre-marital reading. Some of what he says is a bit unconventional, and maybe even opposite of what you've heard works in relationships. But a big plus is that what he says is backed with scientific evidence, and I do believe that the religious slant is absolutely zero.

Tomato soup! I understand your jealousy, because I feel it too! It sucks, and I don't think there is anything you can do about it. At the very least, let me vent with you. I agree that it is totally irritating when people that seem (key word, since nobody really knows how a relationship is except the people in it) to not have the healthiest relationship end up engaged, because they think that engagement is some higher, better form of dating. You and I both know that it is not "dating plus" as you elegantly put it. It means you are getting married! It means you have both promised to marry one another! Still, the people I know are mostly in the really, truly, time to get engaged part of their relationship, so I can't even reduce the irritation to the state of their relationships. It is drives me absolutely nuts that this kind of stuff bothers me, and you are right, it is totally embarrasing that it does, to boot! I'm in a similar situation, except that my bf and I are a little older. It wasn't until a couple years ago that the engagement train started coming along to take all my single (in the unmarried sense) friends away. We both also have decided not to live together (until marriage, for us) for non-religious reasons. I have to commend you on your attitude towards marriage, engagement, and what is important. I disagree with the poster that said engagement is a "trial period" to figure stuff out. Engagement is a promise to get married! So I think you are right on in figuring out now. I just ordered a ton of radio broadcasts that focus on pre-marital issues. They probably have a religious tone to them since they are put out by a very Christian company (focus on the family). I'm very liberal and will have to laugh off any times they prescribe gender based roles in marriage, but I think they will still be useful in getting the important issues out. Can you share the title and source of the e-book you have? Other tips. You just have to try your best not to let it get to you, the other engagements that are happening. Just be glad that your heart and head are on the right path to a successful marriage. Look forward to the day that it finally does happen, the day you'll be able to say "...and I wouldn't want it any other way." I hate to wish an unfavorable situation on anyone, but your friends getting engaged so early may very well end up broken up before their 2009 wedding. Good luck on keeping the jealousy to a minimum...

I don't think 1 hr is an LDR. I don't think talking once a day is unreasonable, if schedules permit this. I also don't think that talking once a day a necessary. I would rather phone than message, because if you have time to sit at the computer, I think you should have time to pick up the phone. Unless you are being sneaky at work and messaging at your desk. Which I don't do.

I agree with Keefy in that leaving him is not some sort of ploy. I know I call it "the bluff" in reference to a book I read about the topic, but you really are leaving the relationship, and this would be best to do without the expectation that he will come back with a ring. He might. But he might not. And I think if he comes back with a ring, it is okay to resume the relationship. But if he just "stops by" and is indifferent about seeing you, or comes back with anything less than a proposal, stand your ground!

Uh, I really think this is apples and oranges here...

I've been in an LDR for about 4 years now, but it is only a 3 hour drive and we see each other every weekend. I think if it was longer, like not a weekend drive away, I could not have dealt with it as long as I have. I'm okay for about another year, I think. Oh- it's been about 8 years total, 4 LDR, 4 non-LDR. Except the first 4 non-LDR were LDR during the summers, but only a 1-2 hour drive. Oh, the many phases of LDR we've been through... Thank goodness they are all pretty 'light,' as far as all LDRs go.

Has she always been like this with the immature finger pointing? I'm wondering now if maybe she has some type of postpartum depression issues. I'm not trying to make excuses for her behavior; it's just a thought. I think you are right in being open and honest about your feelings, and I think your wife is in the wrong for making every issue into a blame-game. A guy once told me that if he was arguing with his girlfriend, he was never sure who was right or wrong until she got hysterical- at which point, he knew HE was right. Okay, I found this to be funny, and often, true. It isn't always true, but I know women who will turn something little into something big, and become irrational and hysterical after they blow it out of proportion! It could be that your wife is just really sensitive. If this is the case, maybe you should practice sugar coating things a little. Maybe counseling is the route to take. Everyone always says that here, but I wonder how much something like that costs. It's probably hard to establish a relationship with a counselor, too. They wouldn't have all the backstory, ever, because they'd have to have been standing over the two of you over the life of the relationship to ever understand what was going on... But I guess that is another topic of discussion. Anyway, back to the issue. Do you think she might be having some postpartum depression problems?

It sounds like these things are happening, and clearly you have strong feelings about it, but you are keeping them bottled up. She might not know the extent to which this stuff bothers you, in which case she probably thinks you are coming home from work being a jerk because you had a bad day or something. You've got to sit down and talk to her. Don't make it about "you don't do this and I have to," or "because you do this, I can't do that." Tell her you know that her home life with the baby is demanding, as is your work outside of the house. Tell her you feel the day to day is causing you to grow apart and you'd like to spend more time with her and work on your relationship. Suggest some sort of schedule where you guys can treat one another by taking turns cooking a meal, or have fun together in the kitchen making a meal together while the little one looks on from the bouncy seat at the table. Tell her you want to make time for one another, and while you are happy to help with the cooking, cleaning, etc, it is so important that you get to spend quality time with her. It sort of puts a spin on the entire problem, but it might be a way to solve the problem without making her upset by accusing her of not helping out enough. If you do that, she'll probably just get defensive, saying that she "helps out" all day long while you are at work, and she is only asking for a little help in the evenings. If you can't work it out on your own, counselling, as somebody suggested, is a good idea. Good luck.