Akua

Well I stil havent done anything. I kinda just dont want to deal with it. I am one of those people who keeps putttin gup with things until the fester and then Ill finally explode. I don't want to keep my feelings bottled up. I feel like i have been doing that already for a year and a half. But at a certain point, what good does it do to say how I feel to him. Will he listen? What would he do with that? How will I feel after that? I guess your replies do lead to my biggest question....why is he still contacting me? Does he not know how hurtful his behavior was? Does he really think a simple request on my friend list is ok after all the feelings ive went through? So then maybe he didnt get as hurt...well then how could he not have been hurt by this relationship? or the lack of it now? How could he not be sensitive to know that if someone asks you to not contact them again, that they probably dont respect you or are hurt by you. Why would he put himself in this situation. I keep thinking how mean it is of him to just not care or even think of my feelings everytime he contacts me. It very narcistic. So its mean if he just doesn't care. He is horrible if he just doesnt know and has some serious issues if he thinks everything is cool and just wants to chat. and again that just makes him mean. He's dumb if he thinks that he is taking a big step by making a simple friend request to view my webpage. I deserve more than that. i asked to him call me. i deserve to be told something important, not requested as a petty friend on a website. i guess then, he did email me and tell me something, but he sitll coudlnt do what i ask and call and there is nothing to come of it. so why did he contact me? why?

joyce1412: i completely agree! you don't know what you've got till it's gone, huh? and it sounds like he completely deserved those women, and i bet they deserved him, too. SOOOO TRUE! I read about those girls and i thought "boy that is what you did to me!!!" joyce1412 i am not sure i agree with lady bugg that his email is sincere. i mean, his EMOTIONS might be sincere--regret over repelling you, confusion about his place in life--but the email's end goal is to make him feel better about himself, because not only is he focusing on what a hard time HE'S having--he apologizes to you, yes, but look at the ratio of space spent talking about HIMSELF versus you. he's not really that sorry. the other end goal is that he wants you to respond and reassure him that you're still friends, that you're still there for him.[/i] I also agree with this bc he has been manipulative from the break up day. His break up letter essentially said that if i never talked to him again i would ruin any chance of us ever getting back together again. But then he proceeded to tell me that we were so different we needed to break up. And then he said that he loved me and doesnt want to lose. Mind games? Yeah imiagine the entire relationship. joyce1412: believe it was belle who told me, "my ex will learn from me when he never hears from me again." i think it's the most powerful message you can send. your ex just has to live with the consequences forever. too bad. I laughed out loud when i read this. i know this is what i need to do. you know there are some people you cannot get the point accross to unless you sacrifice yourself. but int his case, it is my pleasure.

yeah thats right. he stomped on me during his hard time when we were together too. interesting....i always saw myself as the vibrant energetic emotional one around him. sometimes he made me feel like emotion was bad. but in retrospect, i was always the emotional rock. his life was "weird and transient" because he made it that way and I was the emotional rock for him that told him it was ok and put up with him being all over the place. here he is again, getting deployed and scared and he knows i am that rock for him. i might have showed my feelings and laughed/cried/yelled but i still know who i am. he lied about everything and was as lost as he could be. why do i want to be that crutch again? that is what bothers me the most about his email. he knows he is going somewhere far away and dnagerous and is using that as ammo against me. (ok that is a little vicious, but you know he wants me to feel sorry for him...when he actually signed up for all this). ok guys, i am leaning toward not responding. i got what i wanted right? he apologized. that is what i wanted. so now, girl, walk the F away!

why am i still angry? i know he is bad for me. i dont want a relationship with him. the thought makes me ill bc i know it would be degrading. part of me still feels really rejected bc he never made me feel like he knew what he had. i know what he had,but if that was truly the case then why would i be wanting him to know it? so clearly i have security problems. ok. ill admit that...i mean, who doesn't,right? at this point though it is too late to make amends. deeeeeeep down in there i care. i said i loved this guy and that wont go away. but i have got to protect myself. you cant change his behavior but you can change yours and i know that i have to walk away. id be willing to tolerate an email once a year if i just had someone else i was in love with. (i am sure that sentence is going to get ripped apart soon ) but why do i feel like you all think that i want to get back together with him? i don't. i just dont like being angry and i am tired of hiding my anger from him. anger is a form of hurt. hurt happens when you care about someone. i do care about him, but not enough to be with him. am i just rambling now?

id be happy if the relationship never happened in the first place. but you never regret what you do iguess. so what do i want? i want him out of my life. i dont want to be reminded of him or my past. i dont want any kind of relationship. what do i do then? ignore his email?

Scout that is a good point. I just don't know what else to do. I tried everything to get him out of my life. And then he contacted me online. I see his page everyday and he would try to look at mine but it is locked. not responding to him was like ignoring the elephant in the room. i am tired of his games of not being honest. i am tired of the games. i feel like he is the bully who just wont leave you alone no matter what. I guess i should have just ignored him? I regret not doing that now. I just asked him to call me bc i didnt have his #. I really wanted to just call him and let him have it and tell him how i really feel since he has no clue about ANYTHING that went on in that relationship or after the break up. I just dropped off the face of the earth and walked away. I didn't even tell him all that he did to hurt me. I just wanted to get through the BS of saying "hi" and to see what he really wants and tell him how i really feel. then i want to be done with him and the past. i want to move on but i am having a hard time knowing that i have to hold my breath everytime he contacts me. it really does a number on me...I mean, bc of his stupid email i am here venting about him...WHY!?!? why did i respond to his first contact?!! if anyone reads this, dont ever respond. does anyone know how hard it is to take the upper hand for a year and a half and know he will never feel or understand what he did??

My ex wasnt the best bf. I put up with a lot and let even more slide past. I gave him more and didn't get much back. The fights were never angry fights but more me explaining how hurt I was when he lied. So when he broke up with me I was even more hurt because i didn't do anything wrong....he did and couldn't even be honest about that. From the beginning he pursued me and lead the relationship to a strong intensity. It was so confusing bc for how strong he wanted the relationship to be he had no behavior to back up his beliefs. It shocked me that he wanted out when he kept talking about rings and babies and how much he loved me before. I decided once it was over that it was good for me bc he was really a bad bf and i deserved better. so i moved on, not dated anyone seriously bc i was afraid of being hurt again, but am happy and much happier than with him. Ihave ignored his texts, his calls, never responded to his 5 page excuse letter. He still called. Generally one call a month. 6 months later i decided he will cal until we talked. So we talked and i made it pretty clear i just didn't care about it anymore. He still called and again i stopped answering. Finally he sent me an email and I told him to not contact me anymore. That was pretty bold butyou think after all the other times he would have gotten it. Well about a month ago, he contacted me online. Just nonchalantly wanted to say "hi!" I don't get it!! I finally told him "if you have something important to say, i will listen, but you need to call me". Essentially, he has never apologized or given me any reason to his behavior, and i don't think he ever will. I was really hurt by him and the relationship, so having him contact me reminds me of bad times and makes me feel awful. its mean to just keep contacting me and reminding me of our relationship. i cant be friends wtih someone who treated me so poorly. And part of me still wonders what i did to deserve to be treated this way. So today i got another email: "I guess I just wanted to touch base with you and see how you were before I left. I know we havn't talked in a while but I'm about to leave for a year or more and just wanted to see how you were. I want to apologize for not always being the best boyfriend and wish I had been a better one. My life was then, and is especially now really weird and transient - not good for a real relationship - not good for an excuse either. I always appreciated the way you treated me and the way your family did. I've dated a couple girls since then and they ended up being completely phony, cokeheads, or just awful, or all of the above - all things you aren't. The longer I'm out of college and away from home I realize you only really have about four or five real friends. Yes, I know we're not really friends now but for a year and a half you were my best friend and because of that I still think about how you are and what you're doing. I didn't really understand why you wanted me to call instead of just making me a 'friend'? I guess you don't want me on your friends list, and that's fine if that's what you want. I don't want to bother you but I'd love to talk to you before I leave." What should I do now? Call him and tell him to leave me alone and why. Delete? Ignore? Reply and leave a one liner to leave me alone? Get closure? WHAT SHOULD I DO?! I don't want to deal with this anymore. Also WHAT HE IS TRYING TO DO?

Thank you for the advice. I needed that. Sometimes you just get in a rut. I have to remember how far I've come and love all the things I have learned. After a year of contemplation, I wouldn't say it was true love, but he was the first person I have let so closely in my life like that and gave myself entirely to him and I thought I loved him. In retrospect I will never do that again. I might have been selfless for him, but love begins with a little bit of loving yourself and self respect. I least I have learned that much. I don't know if I miss him but I do hurt. I have hurt since the day we broke up. It broke my heart so bad: fight or flight. I just ran away from dealing with it all. NOt sleeping and clots of crying. I have moved WAY passed that (and I think that is normal in the break up process). But everyday I think of him in some sort of way. Some time I try to email around to find out what he is doing. The thing is at the same time I wonder why I would do that because if we got back together no matter how hard I try it would still be the same. I have got to remember that. And I want those to know who just broke up with someone that NC is great and having a goal and plan and an idea of what your self worth is all you need to get yourself together. I am really proud of that. It's kinda like a game. You can sit around and be sad or you can use that energy and go do something new by yourself. I did it, there were days I cried and there were days I couldn't get over how great being single was/is. I feel not only happy but better than I did before I was with him and certainly better than when I was with him. I think healing is a proactive thing you have to work hard at. But I just feel like in the effort I have put in so far, you would think I would have moved mountains forward. Many parts of my life have changed to be dramatically better, because I did what was best for me. I know this is not about him. I know it is my being afraid. And I know if he popped in my life right now I would still walk away because past behavior is the best predictor of future behavior. AND I DESERVE AN APOLOGY AND BETTER THAN HIM! But some days, I am alone and I wonder why and why all my effort to do exactly what he wanted and completely be selfless was not good enough for someone not that great. NOw that I know this, I am just scared I am going to go to the extreme and be a jerk to a really great guy. What is it? "Can't Hurry Love". So times I have to quietly sing that to myself to remind myself I am young and there is more than just that. And I am just going to have a great time. I can't lose the great moments I could make having fun because I keep wondering about him. I've done the best I could do and acceptance is my new learning pahse I guess.

I knew he wasn't good for me, and I was more unhappy in the relationship than him. But I put tons of effort in the relationship bc I thought I wasn't doing enough. Truth is, I never got anything out of the relationship. But one day he wanted out which was a thought that never crossed my mind even dururing all the times he messed up. It kinda opened my mind and I let him go. Actually, once we decided it was over, I realized how badly he treated me and did NC immediately. He contacted me at least monthly for the first 6 months and I didn't respond. Finally I picked up the phone. We talked, but I didn't hear what I needed to, not even enough to want to be friends with him. Still tried to contact me monthly after that. The day after valentines day I receive and email with pictures of him on trip sent to his small group of friends. It hurt. It hurt a lot. I sent him an email to not contact me anymore because, again, it's just never right the way he contacts me. He never says "i'm sorry for what happened" or "I want to talk about it all" or "why I am still trying to contact you". It's more like "do you have a bf" or "i want to see you" or a random email sent to a group of people to remind me he exists. It's like he wants to play with my head. Now you see why I needded this breakup. Maybe him contacting me but not saying anything substantial is his way of trying to make amends? Or does he just want to use me? So I haven't heard from him since I told him not to contact me. Maybe I have gotten over my anger, but for the first time I miss him. It's not like I miss him in the sense that I am mourning our break up, but I miss his smell, or the things we joked about. I wonder what he is doing. If he thinks about me, if I made a mistake a letting him just walk out. A year later, and I have been on casual dates. Guys like me and ask me out, but I am not interested or maybe more afraid. Perhaps I am just lonely and will get over this if I fall in love with someone else? My friends say that I miss being with someone and it's not that I miss my ex, and that I am forgetting how upset he made me feel and how badly I was treated. Why do I miss him now? Why am I forgiving him for stringing me along and treatingme the way he did? Why can't I just trust someone to date? Maybe I just don't trust myself or I am afraid of finding out I am the cause of how badly I was treated. Will I reallly be over him if I fall in love again? Maybe it is just really bothering because I realize I told him to not contact me, and this time he is listening to me (before he kept contacting me once a month). Is it because I am getting to the year mark of it all? I feel like the weather/summer reminds me of last summer when I was heart broken. Most people are reminded of their relationship when they walk by their favorite restaurant. I am reminded by the summertime of how heart broken I felt, and for whatever sick reason that makes me think I miss my ex. I get along and I am happy and I go to parties with guys making me feel great, but I am still alone and I have him stuck in my head. How do I make it go away? I am happy I am not angry anymore, but with the anger gone it emphasizes how much I still love him. ugh, please tell me this will go away soon. I have made such progress and learned so much. I don't want to feel this way. not now. I want to move on and know that when I am with someone else I won't be thinking of him. Please tell me that will happen.

yes beanpaper, it was a good idea not to make a move on me but i don't htink it takes an intelligent person to know that...it's just common sense. quite frankly, that is it. He just wants a move, it's not htat he cares for me as a person. there is the difference. conatcting somone who just wants to be cared for with the intentions on just getting some is really mean. i think you really made a good point whether you were trying to or not. but he jsut wants a move, nothing more. thanks.

beanpaper...i appreciate your perspective. but how could I respect someone who tried to do me up the butt when i was drunk and repeatedly said I adamently do NOT want any sort of that behavior after several different attempts. or how could a respect someone who asked to hook up with my roomate and then say it was a joke. how can i respect someone who visit his crushes from school who happen to be strippers while he is my boyfriend. how could i respect someone who mounted me while i was lying in bed sick with the stomach flu coming out both ways. how could i respect someone who expected me to pay for everything when i was making $20k less than him and live in a more expensive place. how could i respect someone who "said" he doens't drink, yet started drinking until he blacked out with me. what type of person hides from his girlfriend that he did cocain at a party. what type of person still tries to contact me after months of not hearing from me? why doesn't he get it? I think beanpaper you missed the point, he doesn't repsect anyone, especially himself

Fivek, I appreciate your honesty. I am not going ot lie, I enjoy having him call me and to a little extent enjoy the game, but in the long run it just sets my progress back. You are right, if he really cared for me and didn't just see me a s a convenience that lives closer to him and is an outlet for the bad situation he put himself in, he woudl come out right and say what he wants from me. Frankly, he should have done that a long time ago, so even if he is considering it, I feel like it is too late. Woudl I really want to wait around for someone who is not oging ot take initiative? I feel stupid now for answering the phone. I wonder what he would have said on the message. This just proves a leopard doesn't change its spots. Granted he doens't even know what I am expecting from him. And really, if he did what I would have expected from him, it's too late now. I am already frustrated with him. This just shows that I want something else and he wil never get it. ARGH this is so frustrating, I just feel so stupid. Everyone says I handled it well and it wasn't like I Was nervous or crying or upset...I just talked about myself and pretty much didn't respond to questions about "us" yet he is the one sniffling and his voice is cracking and prying into if I have boyfriend and who I hang out with. I am so done with games. I feel like I amk dealing with a little boy. I couple of weeks beofre he called this time I realized that i could talk tohim bc I knew I didn't anything with him and he cant offer me anything, but for whatever reason I jsut want him to hear all my thoughts abou the break up and why I don't want him anymore. It's like now it is my turn to break up with him. That's why i answered the phone: I wanted to first know what it all panned out to be and I wanted to also have the opportunity to tell him everything that I have been thinking and how he did me wrong and I want to tell him these things in a mature rational manner. I don't care if it doens't touch him, it just will no longer be weighing on my chest . He is very predictable so I bet he will call this weekend, drunk dial or in the next two weeks call again. Either that or he will show up at my front door. And again, it will be all this confusion again. If he calls really soon, I won't answer bc I don't want to get in the habit of talking to him...I've got my dose and I've heard enough. But if he does happen to come into town I think that woudl be an appropriate time to initiate closure. He broke up with me over the phone and hasn't communicated his feelings at all. So I will do exactly what he should have. I will see him and I will tlak tohis face and I will tell him everything that I have felt during our reltaionship and after (I have been so angry with him and I just need to tell him how hurt and wrong he was). Whether he listens to it or not, it's not important...I just want thtat opportunity to assert myself and end alll of this. If by some random moment of glory he realizes how horrible he was and can communicate with me I'll pretty much settle for a friendship that involves us sporadically emailing every couple of years. Like I said above...I am just glad that after all these months, I knew that he would be exactly where I predicted and it proves that he doens't have anything to offer me. I can now walk away knowing 1) I gave him everything and can never say I didn't try and 2) it all panned out as I expected and that is disapointing. Seriously people, if you want to ensure that your ex will always wonder about the "what if", don't tell them anything about yourself. If I never found out what happened to my ex and where he ended up I woudl have imagined something far greater than what happened and I think it would have eaten me alive knowing that he is happier without me. He tried to put everything on me and I had no reasons so I just searched for faults in myself to give me a reason for it to end. Now I know that he really just isn't a solid person who could ever offer me anything.

So here is the past: link removed I answered his call and that was the first sign that i was over the relationship...or at least strong enough to handle what he was going to throw at me. He broke up with me. I stopped talking to him immediately. The more he said and did the less sense he made and the more he hurt me. In a nutshell, we were going to get out of a long distance relationship by me moving with him to Cali bc he was in the military. The catch, he didn't even know if he was going to cali. GOt his orders to go to school for 6 months and then where he will be sent is then deicded. Before going to schooll, He broke up with me saying I shouldn't give up everything to follow him and i would be miserable. Made no sense to me...just say you are not into me, don't give me bs answers like that. I told my mom that he will get orders to be near me and he will be miserable at school especially without me, and then he will come after me and realize I am done with him. It all happened as I suspected. He is way too predictable. Don't play games if you can't play them right. So he calls as my birthday was this past weekend and i thought I deserved a "happy birthday" from him especially after a year and half relationship, whether I was talking to him or not. So I answered the phone. I was finally ready to face him and realize that I am not going to jump into his arms. I was curious...and my curiosity proved my prediction right. He kept asking if I had a bf and told me he doesn't have a gf. He wants me to meet his new friends and he will be up in my area. He kept asking if he could talk call me more. With all of it I was very vague saying "We'll See." THere is a lot to catch up with in 5 months especially with 2 very busy people, so it wasn't the appropriate time for me to go into everything I have been thinking and him in the last five months. I regret that i didn't tell him all the things his done to make me so angry, but I think I took the high road by just listening and catching up. It was a pleasant conversation as it should be, our reltionship was based on talking on the phone. But my problem is never came out and said "I MISS YOU." "I have been thinking baout everything." Instead he asked if I got his *beep* letters and what i thought about them. I just said "nothing". He asked if I hated him and i said "i didn't feel one way or another about him." WHAT IS HE DOING? Is he worried about me as a paartner or just making sure he is liked? Does he want to get back together? Was he feeling me out? Is he just trying ot make an opportunity to get since he is lonely and unhappy? It sounded liek he was choking up. I don'ot think he expected me to answer the phone. But my thing is why doesn't he just come out and say what he wants from me??!? I feel like he is trying ot mental games. If I give him an inch, he will give me more and then take it away. THis morning after our conversation he sent an email, "last night was bound to be awkward and I am sorry for that. but I am not sorry for calling you, I just wanted to talk. i hope we can talk in the future. And if you want to call me, do" WHAT IS THAT? WHAT IS HE DOING?? That sounds liek he was just checking up on me. BUt then the way our conversation was, I felt like it was him trying to figure out if I was in a relationship or not and what I was doing with my life. Is that all he was DOING? This kid is so confusing. I kinda wish I didn't pick up the phone, but hten I would have never had the satisfaction of knowing that I was always right and I know him better than he knows himself and that I finally can realize I can stop blaming myself for everything. Any thoguths anyone?

Why did we break up? I tell people I don't know bc I never got astraight answer from him. But we were long distance. The plan was for me to move to where his next job would take him and well he found out he got a temporary assignment somewhere else. I just htought I would do my own thing until there was a permanent move. He thought something different. He said I am too ambitious of a woman to follow hi m around. (wanna translate that? I thought I made my own deicisions in my life?)The truth was I was hesitant about moving in the first place bc I woudl sacrifice everything for someone who I didn't think was being honest with me. And lots of other stupid boy (that was always his excuse) stuff. So that was my reason. His reason...I still don't know and I am not going ot talk with someone who still cannot give me an upfront honest answer. But when we broke up, I told him he was breaking up with me. I was willing to go the extra step to make sure that we would work out. There is a whole post on it if you want to read more. We were together for a year and half and we were eachother's first love...or so I thought. HA! Now I know exactly what I want and I am thankful everyday that he broke up with me. I am just angry with myself that I didn't end it sooner or even put up with all the stupid stuff that I wouldn't even tolerate my friends' bfs doing. So I see the brigh side of it, i guess.

NightsEcho, from a female perspective, if I talked to my ex, I woudl say I am doing great and am happy. And in everypart of my life, except for my relationship/social life, that is true. HOwever, I would never let my ex know that i haven't had a good date or feel that my life is back on track. I'm starting my 5th month since we broke up and it's been over 4 months since I have communicated with him (I am NCing but he has tried contacted 4 or 5 times). I haven't started dating anyone and have had a few people interested in me, but nothing has panned out. Part of it is me making excuses to not hang out with people, but for whatever reason I just don't have it in me. I will agree that I am just exhausted. People say keep busy and you will one day wake up and be tired of dealing with it and it will be over. Yeah, it's over between him and me, but there is still this BLAH feeling in me. I just don't have that desire to go out and try. I rather be in my PJs and dream of what something could be with someone else. That's a lot easier I guess. Part of me worries that I am just waiting for life to happen. I do wonder about him...and I know he is miserable. I feel sorry for him, but regardless I will never let him see me weak. So that is my perspective. I just wanna know how much longer, like you said, will it be until I am me again....

Well, no. For several reasons: I am never doing long distance again. For the next6 months, it would be long distance. After that he will be out of the country for another 6 months...where I know he is going to be stuck on a boat and miserable...poor guy. If he could only had seen what he was setting himself up for. To be alone and stuck on a boat. Bad planning on his part. Two, I don't think that he has that personality I want. I mean besides all the stuff he did to me...he'll learn and change that (or not) and I have accepted that is part of his process of growing. But in general, I know that I just don't want some of those things that are very dear to him Without him ever saying those things I was perceptive to waht was really shining through and I didn't want that. You can take the boy out of the country but you can't take the country out of the boy...you know? Again While looking at my reflection when looking at him, I could see him without him saying it and I knew just as much as did that we were different. It's amazing how 2 different people can love each other so much but come from 2 different upbringing and values. Both good, but so different. And if he does start moving heaven and earth I woudl have to be skeptical just as I was skepitcal when he told me he loved me after 3 months...(how do know someone in that amount of time? BUt again I am SUPER cautious). He doesn't know that I feel upset about a lot that he has done in our relationship. He doesn't know. His reasoning for it all was that it was long distance and then all thezse other random contradicting commetns ehre and there with no substantial conversation about them. So he would end up moving mars thinking that was heaven and earth and I am just looking at him like he is crazy and he has missed the boat. Finally, I know there are others out there. I have passed up a lot of opportunities bc I didn't want boys getting in my way and goals. And I was soooo afriad to get close to somone. Now I know what it's like, felt it all and can go after those gems that caught my eye. you see, my ex asked me out 5 times before I would say yes. I thought if someone would move heaven and earth for me then they were worth it. I realized those types like the game and I don't want someone breaking my walls down. I wanna take them down myself bc I like that person. I know I've said that before, but that is where my fault was. I let him lead the way bc I was afraid and fueled the game. And we both got hurt. Now I just wanna love. My sister said when I started freaking out about if I should say I love him or not that she hopes he breaks my heart. that sounds mean, but I get what she meant. I understand it now. and on the flip side, that could also be a sister saying "this guy sucks." But I know she said that for my best intentions and I get it now.

You said, "The sad thing is that is was my ideal of love not the reality of love. " I disagree. My experience has made me aware of what I want love to be. thereforeeee I will go out and make it that way and the person that is willing to be on my page or has the same page of "the reality of love" is right for me. But I now know I can't wait for that to happen to fit whatever reality is. I am going to go after what I want. I am not giving up on that and what I deserve. Love shouldn't hurt and I will not longer see love as someone who needs to break down my walls, but rather someone who makes me want to take them down. I cut off all my hair tonight. It's naturally curly and after a while dating my ex he kept telling me to grow it out and keep it straight and long. It was 5 inches below my shoulder....I can't keep it in a ponytail now. I love my curls and I would rather have a big ol' fro than change who I am for another person again. The reality of love is that no matter what, he will love me for who I am bc that is who I love. and my curls (boing boing).

Ripples I was reading your posts as you mentioned and it seems that your ex did have some issues. that doe ssuck, but i am just sensitive to disorder labeling as my paretns did it through out much of their 25 year hateful marriage and it ended up carrying over to my sister who they decide had ADD at age 17 after so many bad experiences that were an obvious sign of a child needing positive attention away from a disrupted household. That just messed her up even more and my parents finally got divorced. What I am saying and what i have learned is.....these behaviors and your ex's are all some kind of insecurity. My sis has no self-confidence. bulimia is no self confidence. my ex lying to me about who he was jsut like your ex and is a result of no self confidence. just as me willing to put up with it is my no self confidence. That is how I see it. And I jsut fight oh so hard to keep away from "name calling" bc it caused a lot of disaster for those close to me. After reading your stuff though, I feel like I have gone through a lot of what you were feeling. Some of the things you were questioning are right on the spot where I am now. I haven't contacted my ex bc I am afriad it will be empty promises just like you found out. I like how you handled yourself with her and I wish I did pick up all those times with him but I was definitely afraid I woudl be gullable into his manipulative ways. At one point in your post you said something that cought my eye...you didn't know you were being manipulated and she didn't know it either. That is a very good point. very good. I see it that way with my ex. I saw what he was doing, but I just hoped, and he reflected that, that he woudl cahnge to what he said he would. So my question to you would be, if you could do it all over again...would you answer her calls and act very simple as you did waiting for her to come through? I mean, did you need that to see waht you really wanted? I mean, could you have moved on without doing that? I have no clue what my ex wants. He wants me in 2 years when he is done with everything. He ahasn't said he wants me back, but he is calling. I am pretty sure I can walk away, but I just thouht that looked so dignified that you talked maturely and let her lead the way...even if she failed. It was long distance for you too? That just makes everything even more complicated.

Ok, I have alittle bit to say here regarding a whole bunch of thigns brought up in your replies. I do think that it makes such wild crazy things as emotions tamable by understanding them through behavior types, but going so far as saying they have a personality disorder is going a little far. I thik it is just as extreme as just breaking up with someone and not giving them a reason why. Of course they wouldn't say anything bc you are quick to judge them and say they have a disorder. My feeling is that people have PERSONALITIES, but they don't have disorders. People are raised with different behaviors in dealing with things and these behaviors can clash as Ripple suggested. The thing about relationships and poeplein general is that we are growing thinking changing human beings. With everyone on this site and all the people in the world, i think that is the common characterisitic...they people grow and there are times you just don't know what to do or what is right and it sounds like me and everyone else from the dumpers to the dumpees are all jus tnot knowing what to do and this whole process is about growing and learning about ourselves....not catagorizing one another in disorder boxes that you are stuck in until you become the "right" person. There is no "right" there is however what is right for you. Finally, I think the biggest problem in relationships is communication adn that is why it hurts so much. If we aren't communicating the human imaginative mind is left to wonder all the possibilities from evil to wonderful of waht was going on in that other person's mind. There are different levels of maturity that allow for different levels of communication and just bc someone isn't there yet or may never be does not mean that they or you have a disorder. THey are human and that is the only disorder we all have. I certainly don't think I was "codependent" I jsut wanted tocommunicate and understand and I was ready for that. Ripple explains a lot of that very well. But I certainly don't think I am a copdependent personality disorder when the man I love breaks up with me with many of these random reasons: "I feel like you will just keep being fed up with me until I do something about it" or "I am just afraid you are gonig ot leave me" or "I worked so hard to break you walls down." You see? It's all about perspective and communication. Otherwise you are left going to these existential thougths about human and what is right and wrong. Just know what is right or wrong for you. My posts have been me thinking baout hwat I really want. Misery12. Think about what you want. Do you want to be treated those ways? Do you? Then don't contact. Don't do it. You are done. She is just as miserable as you are right now. She is human, not a disorder. Remember that, adn take the strength that you put into you relationship with her back into you. Move on. Life is short and play hard. as long as you like and KNOW yourself and what makes you feel good, then you are doing what's best for you. But remember you can't be happy with anyone and they can't be happy with you, if you aren't happy with yourself. DO NOT TALK TO HER ANY MORE. One day we will all be strong enough to realize there are other thigns that are good for us and we will be able to see this perosn as another hopping stone in our lives. Just feel it now. What do I know, right? But I think you all have just made me understand it all. I'm done and moving on.

Ripples... All I can say is...word. I agree. I know he is not good for me. I know especially in the next six months it would be long distance and there is no point for me to even consider something with him. I know that after six months he will be out of the country for another six months and i woudl have been in this sort of situation eventually. I know that I woudl be suffering much more if he was in the same city as me and probably trying to get in contact with me all the time. And I thank god that he is not here. And I think my biggest emotion is the feeling that I am not good enough...not that i miss him. I am very angry with how he treated me and I know he is not good for me and it's not me. And I know that the day we talk, I coudl have the opportunity to say all those things, but I have taken the high road from the beginning and I will continue to and some things are better left unsaid. It's about me now. I know in a few months I am going ot be great and I am alreay half way there. I feel no worse than I did in the relationship when he wasn't there and I would analyze all the things that he's done that upsets me. For me it was just a year and half long break up that is finally official. There really wasn't ever a relationship bc that takes 2 people.

I don't have much to say today. I almost started crying at work...man I haven't been this bad in a month and half. then I realized I didn't have my coffee today! HA! The good thing though is that as much as I hate the management at my work, I realized that as long as I keep busy I am ok. It's when I have absolutely nothing to do, be it at work or at home, then i start feeling horrible. People keep saying that at a certain point I will just wake up one day and be sick an dtired of feelingsad and be done with it. That is why i just have to let myself feel it all right now. Get it all out of my system and stop trying ot be tough and in control. BC then I will finally be ready to move on. It's like the army, the break you down to build you back up stronger. I just need to break the self I became for him down and build the self I want me to be up. And also, people say that as soon as you feel like everything has gone wrong and there is no hope, something in another part of your life starts to shine. I'm at the bottom people. I hate work, I don't know any people here, and I have been dumped. But I know, soemthing is going ot happen. I smell it. I was reading regret1's post and it made me feel bad. She was stringing him along with her NC. I don't want to play those games. But i also don't know what I want. ANd I also was sooooo good to my ex. I mean, part of me thinks that he knew how bad he treated me and was doing me a favor or reading my subconscience. I guess that shows how good of friends we became and maybe that is all we should have been. But i find it so intereting that when it really comes down to it, he can be that great friend, but just on a daily basis he could have given a damn about being good to me. IT was all just about maturity. He loves me so much. But he really just doens't have a clue on what that really means. Part of me thinks that he's never really had a true friend before. So he got that from me, but he never learned how to be one in return. I never asked for it either. It makes me sick to know that after all of this he will know with his next gf how to be what he wasn't with me. When my mom and dad divorced my mother always said, the first wife spends her whole life trying to make him the man he should be and the second wife gets to enjoy that man he became. That's how I feel in a nutshell. And the thing that sucks even more is his reason for breaking up with me was that I am too ambitious of a woman to follow him and and wait for him while he is traveling all the time that i will be miserable. Well, as far as I see it, ambitious people are miserable when they don't succeed. I didn't succeed at getting him to love me and be his best friend and that makes me feel miserable. He is wrong about me--an ambitious woman isn't miserable because she is in some little town in the middle of nowhere and can't live her dreams bc she is waiting for him. An ambitious woman makes her dreams wherever she is and does it well. Well I've learned the hardest thing for an ambitious woman is to accept defeat. But I will get the love i deserve and the best friend I want whether it is him or not. All I know is I've followed my mother's footsteps and fell in love with a man just like my father and taught him everything he needs to know. I'm glad this happened now instead of in my marriage, but I sure as hell am afriad to do it again. I can't worry anymore about why he didn't want me anymore. It wasn't about me...clearly. And now it's no longer about him. I just need to finish up this healing and continue being ambitious. The good thing is if I had not had this experience I wouldn't know what to be ambitious for in my love life. Before him, I was so scared of being close with someone. I mean, geez, what if i ended up lik emy mother. well, i did. so what else can go wrong? nothing. I'm glad I did bc now I can even take my ambition into my love life. How can you get what you want if you don't go after it, right? I was always sitting and waiting for someone to break down my walls, and well, he did and he broke all of me with it too. So I gotta keep busy and, I know, each day I will get stronger and better. I just pray that one day he understands what he did and how it made me feel so bad about myself. I also just pray that he doesn't feel sorry for me and think i am feeling pathetic. Sometimes that's why i htink he tries to contact me...to make sure I am ok. I hate feeling other people's pity. If i am such an ambitious woman, give me enough respect to know that i am just fine whether i am crying or not. I know myself better than he will ever knwo himself and I KNOW i am doing exactly what I should be and I am damn proud of it.

I realized I don't want HIM back...I want the idea of love back. I don't want him back...he made me feel so bad about myself. I was reading gradle's post of her break up and somewhere her ex mentioned he missed her indepedent and strong side. I wonder if that is how my ex felt. He treated me like that. I got soo weak each month I was with him. I was such a strong indepedent woman. Seriously...with him though, I felt never good enough. Why would I want him back? And with the break up even...he made me feel like i was begging for him. I admit, the first night, literally when he first said i think it should end, I said one time and immediately regretted it that i would try harder, but I didn't even know what I would try harder at...we never said what the problem was. How stupid I feel about that. Stupid. That is so below me. Anyone who brings me to that state is not good for me. But there was none of me begging, but him asking during the breakup conversation over the PHONE if I will periodically visit him (ie 2 hour plane flight) and sleep with him. I said i wouldn't disrespect myself llike that. And frankly I am shocked that he had the nerve to ask me that. And you know what? He got mad at me for being shocked!!!! I like to be really logical when I get hyper emotional which seems like an oxymoron. But there has got to be a solution to my emotions!!! So I started really seeing this break up like a death. And there are the 4 stages of grieving that I can relate my emotions to. I went through the whole denial the first 2 weeks. I seriously thought he was off his rocker and would come back (technically I still do feel that way, but not bc I am dying for him, but i just know him and I pity him for what he will end up doing to see me again. Clearly he is already on that path). Then I went through the anger process. Man that felt GREAT. I got so angry with him. I sitll am but more under control. I ripped up his pictures and put what i oculd in a box. Wen t out and had FUN! Now that is taming down. Now that he called me and emailed me I have actually been able to see thorugh my anger and actually contemplate having a conversation with this man. But then that just depressed me. I was facing reality. Depression is the worst and I am struggling with it now. Well, returning to my "you can fix everything" attitude, I remembered the next stage of grieving is being sad and idolizing the good times in your relationship. Granted I go through all the stages back and forth, but they primarily have followed this course thus far. So my hope of getting out of the depression is to know the next and final stage is acceptance. I am getting there people. I am getting there. I feel the wind and smell the fresh air that is coming form the end of the tunnel. I can almost see the light...and no it is not another train. So that is keeping me on track. Depression in this sense is accepting reality at its rawist point. Finally answering all my questions above, when I have completely accepted this sitauation, then I am ready to talk with him and answer his communication and accept what is said. I have resolved myself to be at that point by the next random call I get from him. I WILL answer it. However, he may not call again...having understood my subtle hints that i am done with him, but if that is the case, then I don't need him in my life. That is acceptance. And I will be there soon. I also have a set a date for myself. So if he doesn't call by then, then that day (the day which I am volunteering for this totally awesome project on conflict and negotiation in africa) I will be on my way. So long buddy! Now is my turn to blow in the wind.

So after reading many of other people's threads, I realized I shouldn't do anything until he specifically says "XYZ". I feel like everytime he contacts me it sets me back so far. I had a month without him in my life. It was hard, but I was chugging along. and the best part was his communiaction completely threw the ball in my court and was very matter of fact and it was nice and tidy to forget. So why is a random call followed up by a forwarded email so much different? At first it seemed great, even everyone's saying how great the NC is that I am doing (see above). Then I realized, just bc he is communicating with me doesn't mean he wants me in his life. After having a serious relapse of feeling the break up all over again this weekend and getting no sleep, not eating, and really not doing well, I woke up today in a pursuit to block his number form my cell. Not bc I am worried i will call him, I'm too stubborn, but bc as long as I know he can get to me, I'll wait for him, just like he asked me to. Well, shortly after arriving ot work I found out it virtually impossible to block individual numbers on your phone unless you change your number...and he's not worth that. But the fact that I am ready to accept that sort of change is HUGE improvement. THe sick thing is though, I have also for the first time really wanted him back. YIKES! What is happening. what am I going through? Is this the last great hurl, and then I let go. PLease god let that be it. All I know is that there wasn't any closure. We had a 10 minute fight the night before we broke up. Didn't talk all day. The next evening we had 2 hour break up conversation on the phone. BUt we did not tlak about any substantial reason why we broke up, just being like "what do you wan?" "It's fo rthe best" "when we canbe together..." But no "You do XYZ" or "I want ABC" Or not even an "I just want to explore." NONE OF THAT. NOw I have some thigns to say, maybe that's the difference? Maybe he has something too? But regardless if anyone wants to read the last thing he communicated to me I will post it below. Keep in mind it's one of those forwarded emails and i used to get hose every couple of months from him. He always called himself a "stupid guy" when he messed up saying that he didn't know any better. Part of me wants to think the stupid guy in him sent me this not knowing that I would read into every detail, while he is actually just trying ot say "i care about you." Either way, I got back up to my first post--how mean, really mean. Let me know what you think. He emails: My mom sent me this.... 'I Hope You Dance... ' This was written by an 83-year-old woman to her friend. Dear Bertha, I'm reading more and dusting less. I'm sitting in the yard and admiring the view without fussing about the weeds in the garden. I'm spending more time with my family and friends and less time working. Whenever possible, life should be a pattern of experiences to savor, not to endure. I'm trying to recognize these moments now and cherish them. I'm not "saving" anything; we use our good china and crystal for every special event such as losing a pound, getting the sink unstopped, or the first Amaryllis blossom. I wear my good blazer to the market. My theory is if I look prosperous, I can shell out $28.49 for one small bag of groceries. I'm not saving my good perfume for special parties, but wearing it for clerks in the hardware store and tellers at the bank. "Someday" and "one of these days" are losing their grip on my vocabulary. If it's worth seeing or hearing or doing, I want to see and hear and do it now. I'm not sure what others would've done had they known they wouldn't be here for the tomorrow that we all take for granted. I think they would have called family members and a few close friends. They might have called a few former friends to apologize and mend fences for past squabbles. I liketo think they would have gone out for a Chinese dinner or for whatevertheir favorite food was. I'm guessing; I'll never know. It's those little things left undone that would make me angry if I knew my hours were limited. Angry because I hadn't written certain letters that I intended to write one of these days. Angry and sorry that I didn't tell my husband and parents often enough how much I truly love them. I'm tryingvery hard not to put off, hold back, or save anything that would add laughterand luster to our lives. And every morning when I open my eyes, tell myselfthat it is special. Every day, every minute, every breath truly is a gift from God. If you received this, it is because someone cares for you. If you're too busy to take the few minutes that it takes right now to forward this, would it be the first time you didn't do the little thing that would make a difference in your relationships? I can tell you it certainly won't be the last. Take a few minutes to send this to a few people you care about, just to let them know that you're thinking of them. "People say true friends must always hold hands, but true friends don't need to hold hands because they know the other hand will always be there." Life may not be the party we hoped for, but while we are here we might as well dance

Bridget74 Before you 2 broke up, did he ever suspect anything or ever ask you if something was going on? If so, what did you say? You initiated the break up, right? When did you, or did you, tell him you cheated? I mean, what did you say? When you broke up you mentioned something like "you deserve better." Is that how you ended it, giving him some group of other excuses? And later telling him about it? I'm just curious bc I don't know why my ex broke up and his behavior seemed simliar to yours. My only idea is that a couple of weeks before I caught him saying some tiny, but contradicting things and always had a suspicion that he wasn't being honest about something, again, the instinct thing. And gave him examples of HUGE things (non cheating related) that he lied about thereforeeee instgating my not trusting him. He got really angry and hung up on me when I called him on these things and said I am fishing for something. he said that I didn't trust him made him feel like sh!t. I dunno if that was guilt or honesty. Would you have responded that way if your then-bf asked you? Then when we broke up with me 3 weeks later he said I deserved better and he has hurt me. Now after no talking for awhile, he is calling but not really telling me what for but it's clear he realizes something. I haven't talked but i just want ot know if he cheated. I don't know if I ask if he wiull tell me or not, and i don't know if it matters now, but..if he did and wants to get back together, at least I now know why he broke it off and I think his conscious would prevent him from doing it again..but I am not even at that stage yet to consider a relationship. Does that sound similar to what you went through? I'm curious to hear the other side. If that is how you would have or will respond? As someone from your other side, it really is an uphill battle for you. Trust is soo important after that. I mean, shame on you the first time. Shame on him the second time. A leopard doesn't change its spots. But those are my opinions and if a relationship between the 2 of you were to start again I don't think I (the cheated on) could go in honestly starting over fresh. I would feel that I then have the right if I wanted to screw around if there was ever a moment. It's like the love wouldn't ever be the same as it was before. Then again, was it really that good if you ended up cheating?

Your story, up to the 2 months and thinking he might have cheated but you weren't "official" yet, sounds just like mine. I was the exact same way. the only difference was it was long distance. But he broke up with me and never gave me a real answer. One day it was I deserved better. Another day it was me and my walls. He was sneaky and woudl talk me out of my suspicions. I'll never know. Here's the thing. Do NC. I have for 1 month and 3 weeks. He was all wishy washy wanting me to be friends and still fly to see him and sleep with him. That was my last straw and cut it off. Now he has called four times. Has sent me a letter. And emailed me. Stay strong though, bc he still has not said he wants back together. At first it was he misses me. THen it the letter was why he did it. Then the email was how dear I am to him. When he comes back, you really have to think about what wasn't discussed in your relationship. It shouldn't be that hard ot communicate with him. I know I communicate but I couldn't with that guy. DO you want that in your life? Trust your gut and instinct. Those are a woman's best friend. Even if nothing ever happened, omittion is just as bad as lying. Relationships are about communicating. When you start getting angry with him and NCing, he might get angry. it is all about control and as your land lord, he cannot be trusted. Move. it will save you a lot in the long run. Plus you cannot get him out of your life if you are still connected to him some way or another. If you ever find that you can have a relationship with him again, let me know. Right now I am in the position where he wants to communicate with me, but I just don't know if it si for the control or bc he wants me. How can you trust someone who is sneaky, right? Good luck!