alphonsefa

Cheerful is right, you are never going to get what you want out of a relationship, what you want out of life, with this woman. Think about how loose she is with her emotions with her husband and you. She has to know that this has been very hard on you and yet she continues it.

"You're the perfect guy for me. If this doesn't work out I'm just going to be by myself. I couldn't have asked for a more perfect man to be with." A year and a half later her sister sees me at a concert and comes up to say hello. Her sister and her husband were always great to me. I sarcastically ask, "is (Ex's name) still with that loser biker that abuses her"? She says, "that guy caused my family so much pain; no she's on about the 6th boyfriend after that". Then the sister said something to me that warmed my heart. I don't know if she realized what she did, but it was like a final release for me. It stopped me from asking myself the what ifs that had always haunted me since the breakup. The sister told me she had seen her the previous weekend at a birthday dinner that her Parent's had for my Ex. My Ex brought her latest victim, her current boyfriend. As her boyfriend was saying goodbye to the sister he said, "bye (sister's name), this may be the last time I see you". Then the sister says, "I don't think (my Ex's name) is ever going to be settled". YES!!!!!! As soon as I heard that I knew that this poor guy was on that same seesaw that I used to ride, that constant, "I need you so much, I want to be alone", cycle, that she is famous for. She would push me away, I'd stop bothering with her, and she'd come running back in a couple of weeks when she realized I wasn't about to chase after her. Evidently, "Miss I don't need anyone", can't be alone, in fact she's been spreading her legs for 7 different guys in a year and a half. What a skank!

Voley, so glad that it all worked out for the best for you! Don't abandon the "Nice Guy" thing. I know all of the BS about picking up women and acting cocky and confident, but there's a downside to all of that. First, you treat women good, because it's in your nature you are a good guy. But, there is a difference between being a nice guy and being a doormat for someone. I've told a few Ex's in the past to never mistake kindness for weakness as I've sent them on their way, which usually comes as a great shock to them. Seems they weren't as in control of everything as they thought, and it always leads to attempts on their part to reconcile. But by then I've already seen who they truly are, that they took for granted the love, affection, and caring I've showed to them. That's definitely not someone I want to spend a lifetime with! So don't sweat the nice guy thing, it's not a curse. Plus, acting like anyone but who you are, to be with someone, will always blow up in your face, because evetually both your personalities will surface in the relationship. I'd much rather lose someone who saw who I really was than to lose them by being someone I'm really not. Keep the niceness but just be firm. When someone steps out of line and is jerking you around with a story that you know is BS, like the Doctor you caught sleeping around, just call them on it and let them know that you have parameters and that if they want to be with you, they better respect those parameters. Good luck to you.

Bounder, I've been down this road with a woman that would run to me and then want to be alone, then run to me and want to be alone again. She actually sat in bed and cried Christmas night because I didn't get her a ring and propose to her, mind you the month before she dumped me to go back to a guy that abused her for 6 years and was part of 2 abortions with her, on top of ruining her relationship with her brothers and straining the one with her Parents. We were back together for all of 2 weeks, and she thought I was going to propose, something I had planned on doing before she started pulling her BS. It hurt to see her take what was a great relationship, and spoil it forever. This was a girl that will never be settled with herself, even her sister said that a few weeks ago when I ran into her at a concert. She told me she was at a brithday dinner with her and her now boyfriend. When the guy said goodbye to the sister he said, "this may be the last time we I see you". Man I knew that feeling well! That told me she was up to the same old BS with this guy. I laughed and said, "it's good to know that someone else is on that roller coaster now". This girl basically jumped in bed with another guy a week after you broke up with her. I'm sure she knows that you had trust issues with her, that is evident in her words when she said she would prove that she was in this thing for good. If you really care for someone, and even if they dump you, you don't jump in bed with someone else in a week, you usually cool off for a while and step back. One thing I've learned dealing with the psycho that I dated is that pay no attention to a person's words, when their actions don't back it up. It's so easy to tell someone you love them, it's quite another to have them prove it to you. This chick is a game player and I hate to tell you this but she doesn't love you. And though you can't see it now, you're better off, because this is someone that had no problem hurting you once and she would do it again if given the chance. Ask yourself this, could you have done to her the things she has done to you? I'm guess not, because you sound like you really care for her. So then why would she do these things to you? It was the hardest thing for me to realize that some people just aren't good people. I could kick myself when I look back on the BS my Ex pulled, and sadly I put the blinders on to most of it because I loved her and had glimpses of what she could really be. But like someone else told you here already, people do not change. When someone shows you who they truly are, BELIEVE IT, don't explain it away or sugar coat it. Don't let her bring you down because someone that really cared for you would never do that to you, they'd be doing their best to pick always pick you up.

1. After the first breakup, which came as a shock given the fact she sat there at lunch five days earlier telling me how much she hates going to work because she misses me. I did the usual couple of phone calls and couple of emails. None of them nasty, just brutally honest. She emaild me back and it started with, "this is bordering on harrasment", which was total BS. So I let her go, made no contact at all with her, just cut her out of my life. Well she wound up coming back for a second time. One of the first things she said to me when we got back together was, "how come you never answered my last email"? What???!!! How could I compete with this type of logic? 2. Okay, same girl as before, I could write a book about this crazy B! After breaking up with me the second time, just after Christams. After making the obligatory one to two phone calls to try and save the relationship, I let her be. Three weeks later I'm checking my answering machine and she leaves me a message on there that said, "hey, it's me, just checking in". What???!!! Checking in?! Hmmm, thought you broke up with me?! 3. My absolute favorite: "You treated me better than anyone ever has and I know most girls would love that, but I didn't know how to deal with it. He keeps me in line". She was referring to the guy that she dated for 6 years, who pysically and mentally abused her, who her brothers beat up because they learned of the abuse and then the dirt ball boyfriend sued them and won $8,000. Totally ruined her relationship with her 2 brothers and strained her family. He was equally responsible for the 2 abortions she had while she was with him. And he used to stalk her and once broke in her Parent's house where she was staying and trashed the place. I guess I was just too much of a nice guy for her becuase I was unable to keep her in line and show my love for her using these disgusting tactics that filled her relationship with him.

OK here's one for the books! Same Ex that left me the answering machine message. This one blew my mind when she said it; I had to pick my jaw up off of the ground! After her first breaking up with me a few days before Thanksgiving, and coming back two weeks later. I bought her a beautiful 24" TV with a built in DVD palyer for Christmas, because hers was crap and all she ever did was watch TV when she got home from work. She bought me some nice gifts too that I could tell she put a lot of thought into. It was a really nice Christmas until, later that night we're laying in bed watching Christmas stories and she starts crying because she was expecting a ring and expecting me to propose to her that night. What???!!! You took off the month before to go back to a guy that abused you and we were only back together for 2 weeks! She definitely fell off that TURNIP truck and must've banged her head real hard because later she actually admitted this to me: We were talking on the phone after this twighlight zone night, and she said to me, "I just wanted a ring so bad. I was looking at them everyday in the mall. I didn't care who gave it to me", meaning me or the fat dirtball that abused her for six years. I said, "DAMN!!!, I can't believe you said that". Her response to me, "hey, at least I'm being honest". She was truly a woman without a soul!

I'll start it off: Had an Ex, who after breaking up with me, left me a message on my answering machine in hysterics because the guy she went back to (a guy that abused her for 6 years) had dumped all over her almost immediately after she got back together with him. She sounded totally distressed and I thought maybe he had beat her up or something and the call was a call for help. Plus, she had an 11 year old daughter who I had grown attached to and was worried about. The tearful call said, "(my name) this is (her name), you were right, you were so frigging right. Everything you said that would happen, happened. I just wanted you to know that you were right." I called back to make sure she wasn't laying in a pool of blood or something. Her excuse for calling me was, that she wanted me to know that she was in pain too, because she knew how much pain she caused me. What??? You leave me (someone that treated you and your daughter better than anyone ever has), for a fat, dead end, loser who has ruined your life for 6 years, who again dumps all over you (something I told her would happen), and you see it logical to call me up and share that with me?!

There's a lot of truth in what you both have written. In fact, she said on a couple of occasions, when we were separated, that she has screwed this thing up, meaning our relationship. It touches a lot on what FCTex wrote. It's like in her head, she knows she's put so much stress on the bond that we once had that it's scarred forever. Cute Band Rat, I never acted the jealous part when the issue ofher ex boyfriend would come up. mainly becasue I was never jealous of him, he was never on my level in my mind. The only time I would take shots at him around her, was to build her esteem back up, something he destroyed. She was intimidated and afraid of him, yet she clearly saw I wasn't. He would say horrible things to her that really stuck with her, and I would try to flip it around and tell her; why would you let such a loser define who you are. You are a good person, or at least I thought she was at the time, you have a beautiful house, a good job, and a great kid. Why would you let anyone like that, who is so clearly below you, effect you in any way. That's the only time I would talk him down around her, to attempt to rebuild her self esteem, which he so regularly shattered. You are both right, and in my heart I know that any attept at contact with her will fall on dead ears. She came back to me 3 times, and everytime it was initiated by her. Whever I would try to reconcile it would fall on deaf ears. I know it's not good, but everytime that phone rings, a little piece of hopes to hear her voice. She would call me from out of the blue when I least expected it, in the past. But now it seems different, like too much time has passed, and that even if she wanted to call, she would be afraid to, maybe even a little embarrassed to. The last thing she would want me to know is that life hasn't been to rosy for her since we broke up! Yet I don't care about that and am sick of foolish pride. The only time I've ever judged her is when we broke up the last time. She had told me that while we were apart she had been back with him. I wasn't going to make an issue of it but then she started the pulling away stuff again, and had me right back on the see saw, and I was getting stressed. She came over to pick up her laundry that she had left here and I knew she was going to disappear again for another month or two. I felt like I was the ex boyfriend, she'd constantly pick him up and put him down when she wanted to. They were always on again and off again, and suddenly it seemed like I was now another player in that game of hers. Now she would have two guys to toy with. So when she was leaving I told her that he was sick for the way he treated her, and that she was sick for always going back. It was the first time, that I judged her character and I think it tore her apart. She was certain that I had her on a pedistal and that she could do no wrong, she had even hinted as such in the past with things she had said. It was like I kicked that pedistal from under her and knocked her down a peg or two. I just felt used and wanted her to know that she wasn't as perfect as she thought she was in my eyes. Given the circumstances I was more than justified in saying what I said and stand by it to this day. Yet I often wonder what would have been had I let her leave without saying a word. I've never met anyone who has frustrated me as much as she did. I guess there's a part of me that wanted to save her, but in all honesty, I just loved her and knew that she would have a better life than she could've ever imagined with me. I just feel like I met the right girl at the wrong time, and that haunts me.

I have every reason to hate this woman, emotionally she's created nothing but pain for me. She was a girl that I knew from high school and then crossed paths with some 20 years later and fell madly in love with. She contacted me on yahoo personals and we just seemed to click. I knew she was coming out of an abusive 6 year relationship, yet she made it sound like she was long past it, and she wasn't! We had talked of marriage and having a child and then she would have these severe bouts of depression and push away. At first I resisted it and then would just let her be. She would then have a sudden change of heart and start calling and seeing me again. I guess I never understood the attraction to the dirt ball that she was with for 6 years. I've seen the guy, he's a real class act, covered with tattoos, dirty looking, lives in a dumpy apartment, is out of shape, and has a dead end job. They looked like one of those couples where your jaw drops when you see them together. She is a gorgeous woman and he is one of life's losers. During their sick and twisted relationship of 6+ years, which consisted of two abortions, and mental and physical abuse; two of her brothers found out that he had hit her. So, the Christmas before we met, they knocked on the door, drug him outside, and put him in the hospital. It seems the tattooed, tough guy biker, never even threw a punch. Instead he wound up suing and winning $8,000 from the two brothers. After we broke up the last time, I found out she actually went back with him for a while. I was stunned, especially after the act she put on for me about how much turmoil the lawsuit was causing her parents and her family. A few months back I found out that she moved, took another job, and changed her phone number to an unlisted number. She couldn't have changed the number because of me because I wasn't calling her. It almost looks like she was trying to get away and start fresh, and all I can wish is that I had a small part in her decicion to finally help herself. You see, during our relationship, she got in this pattern of leaving me and then going back to him, and then leaving him and coming back to me. It seemed like she started to resent me because I was everything that the dirt ball ex boyfriend wasn't. I had every quality that she so desperately wanted him to have and yet as hard as she tried she couldn't make him like me. During the one breakup I was used and she admitted as much but claimed it wasn't done on purpose. She basically wanted to let the dirt ball know that she had other options besides him and used her relationship with me as leverage to get him to do what she wanted, such as getting engaged, having a baby, and buying a house. But shortly after she left me, it blew up in her face and he again hurt her, the exact thing I told her that would happen. I told her, once a dirt ball always a dirt ball, you can't change someone who has no respect for anything or anyone. She again came back to me. So here comes July around again, her birthday soon approaching, and I find her constantly on my mind again. I've dated other women after her but it has all felt so hollow, like I'm hoping for the perfect repalcement that just doesn't exist. The shame is I think that by the time she met me the damage was done, the six years of abuse and the pain of the abortions had permanently scarred her and nothing or no one was ever going to fix it. She had been to numerous counselors but just seemed to get worse, not better. I now wonder if I ever even cross her mind. I'm happy that it looks like she's made such a drastic change to get away from him, but it's hurtful when you were part of that past and were nothing but great to her and her daughter (the daughter is not the dirt ball's kid). The only thing I know now of her is where her parent's live, she would routinely take me over there for dinner and different occasions, and I think her email address is still valid. I wish there was something I could say, something I could do, that wouldn't put me in a bad light and would make her think of me. I'm an attractive, successful, guy with other dating options, yet I'm hung up on her. I've thought of sending a simple card to her parent's house for her or sending her an email wishing her a happy birthday. I know, that probably sounds stupid to do after all of this time. I know I should totally let her go yet there is something inside that holds onto that small glimmer of hope that maybe she will make her way back to me, regardless of how much time has passed. I just wish I could find a way to reach out to her to let her know I still care for her, yet I'm lost.

Chai, My Ex came back to me 2 times and tried for a third time, but I didn't quite play the chase game the way she expected, and she pulled away. Some 6 months later at Christmas time, having been what I thought was healed, I stopped to talk to her. She was a cold B! Amazing being this came from a girl that once called me the greatest guy in the world, and admitted that I treated her and her daughter better than anyone ever has. She always initiated the breakups and every single time that I attempted to re-establish contact, even months later, she would blow it up in my face and make me feel horrible again; even after I was convinced I was over her and could just talk to her un-emotionally. The only way I was ever able to get her attention was to act INDIFFERENT towards her. Let her be Chai, she knows how to contact you if she changes her mind. She's going to just keep hurting you the more you pursue her. Forget about the BS about the NC being about healing yourself. I never bought into that bunk myself and took a different view of it. In fact, if it's someone you truly loved, you'll never really get over them, even though you may find yourself happy in a new relationship. Those feelings can be rekindled in the snap of a finger, eve 20 years later with no contact at all with someone). The 20 year thing happened to me and it was like that time never exosted. NC is the only possible way to make things work again. If she doesn't have it in her to make her way back to you then believe me,you don't want her! Someone like that will continue to hurt you because they really don't want to be in the relationship. NC is the only way to get her back, negotiations and planned encounters don't work.

1. Did you get back with your ex after a break-up? Yeah, she kept dumping me to go back to an abusive, fat, dead end job having, loser. The first time I knew she went abck to him, the second time I had no idea until she told me one day, which sort of led into the 3rd breakup. 2. Until then, did you move on? Did the ex move on?(I mean seriously; assuming the ex would never come back) No, I don't think I ever really moved on from her, even though I've been in two other relationships. I still miss her, but she'll never hear from me again. I won't call or write, or stop to see her. No, I thought she was gone for good each time she left. 3. Did the desire to get back together come from the dumpee or the dumper? Or did you just run into each other one day 6 months later and felt "that way" again? At first it came from me, but it was always coldly rejected from her. I was never able to initiate getting back together with her, it always had to come from her. She is the type of person who won't talk to you if she's not the initiater. The pattern was that we'd have no contact for a little over a month and then the phone would ring and it would be her. At the third breakup I told her to go the F away and never call me again. She looked at me with hate and said, "I'll never call you again"! Three months later after total no contact, she called again to "just see how the new jon was going"; obviously and excuse to contact me. I didn't want to give her the feeling of being able to pick me upm and put me down whenever she wanted me, so I let it go about a month and then called her. She was extremely cold! I turned her off for another 3 months and then got week at Christams time and stopped to see her at the mall where she works. She was again totally cold! I've now thrown in the towel, and just recently found her on my mind less and less. I found out she is again back with the abusive loser boyfriend, and that pretty much drained any feelings I had left for her. 4. How long did it last when you got back together after breaking up? Not long! It rarely does! Basically you've dealing with someone who has quit on you once and will in time do it again. It lasted another month each time we got back together. [edit] 5. When you got back together again, after breaking up, did it feel better than before? Or after a while things became the same? At first it does, and then the novelty soon wears off and you have the same problems that were there before, namely her bouts of depression and total bi-polar behavior. [Another edit]6. Did you remain "friends" while you were broken up. If yes, do you think that helped in getting back together or would it have been better to disappear from their lives completely to give them space? NO!!! A very bad move IMO. You are just asking for more hurt when you do that. It's much better to disappear, and I mean totally! It's the only think that brought her back twice and made her attempt a third time. Why she didn't stay? She's a girl that was abused physically and mentally by that dirt ball and he pretty much controls her. There's nothing he could do that would make her break it off for good with him. Her 2 brothers beat the S out of him when they found out about the abuse. It ruined the relationship with her brothers and strained the one with her parents. After 2 abortions with him, getting knocked around, getting mentally abused, and having her brothers lose the lawsuit for $8000, she again went back to him. How do you deal with a woman that with that type of sick mentality?!

"Sorry, but I disagree the one-size-fits-all approach to advice." The line above was posted by Dako in response to a Super Dave post, and touched upon a subject that has irked me when I come accross posts that state emphatically that both people were responsible for the breakup. While this may be true in many circumstances, there are times when a breakup is beyond your control, due to circumstances in the other person's life that not only do you have no control over, they have no control over! In fact it's a little insulting to hear people make blanket statements about both people being responsible for a breakup. I was in a relationship with a woman who had come out of a 6 year abusive relationship, with a guy that physically abused her and mentally abused her. On top of it, she had 2 abortions while they were together, something that eats at her every day of her life, even though she'd never admit it. She cycles in and out of severe bouts of depression (which she treats with medication) and yet no therapist has helped her feel any better about herself; and there have been many she has gone to. By the time she came to me at this point of her life, she was done, ruined! Try as I did to re-build the confidence that he beat away at for 6 years, it was futile. There was so much emotional damage done that she is unable to keep it together for anything more than a month. To see an absolutely drop dead gorgeous woman loathe herself and her life, was a very hard thing to witness, especially when it came at the hands of a fat, un-attractive, dead end, loser. How sick is she? When I say sick, I mean emotionally sick and broken. A couple of years back, 2 of her brothers found out about the abuse. So one Christmas day, they went to her house, knocked on the door, drug the loser down the steps, and rightfully put him in the hospital. It's a shame they didn't kill him! So the dead end loser decides to sue the brothers for $8,000, which creates a strain on her relationship with her parents. And in the end, after we parted ways due to her absolutely, erratic, bi-polar beahavior. Guess where she wound up? She went back to that loser. Now if I had some responsibility for our breakup, I'd love to have someone explain what it could possibly be. When someone is self destructive, hates themself, lives with severe depression, and allows a dirt ball to dump all over her for 6 years; there is absolutely nothing you can do to save them or to save your relationship. That advice about both people being responsible may apply to a normal relationship, it doesn't apply to people that have been in these type of situations.

This is about a woman that is stuck in what is now a 7 year abusive relationship, with an absolute, dead end, creep, who has done things to her that you couldn't imagine! We had started making plans to get married, buy a house and have a family, when she began acting totally eratic and running back and forth between the both of us. Based on what transpited at Christmas, I guess she doesn't care for me anymore and that I was never going to get a fair shake with her. Seems I am held to a double standard. The guy that abused her can do anything to her and yet I make one comment and am cast off. She has been back with him as recently as Thanksgiving, yet I suspect that she isn't with him now. They never could stay together long and she followed a back and forth pattern with him from the start. Well around December 3rd I sent her a simple one line e-mail that said, "I miss you (her name)...(my name). As was expected she gave no response back and given how she is, I knew she wouldn't. She is a Manager at a local mall store, and when I was out and about shopping for Christmas, I stopped in to talk with her. We had broken up at the end of February when she started acting up again. This was the 3rd time she had come back to me, things would start of great, we'd be sailing along, and then she'd fall into depression spiral, and turn everyone around her off. After she had returned the third time, I had come to find out that when we broke off the 2nd time, the day after Christmas, only 7 days later on New Year's Day, she had gone back to the abusive Ex-boyfriend who has treated her like dirt for 6 1/2 years. The combination of finding that out, and her utter and total coldness she was duplaying again, brought things to a head. At the breakup, I didn't even raise my voice to her, but I was very blunt with her. I told her she was a sick (4 letter word) for laying in bed on Christams and crying becasue she wanted an engagement ring from me, and then 7 days later, jumping back in bed with him. Something she would of had but a month earlier, on Thanksgiving, she had broken up with me the first time and gone back to the abusive Ex boyfriend. We had only been together again for 4 weeks, and it blew me away that she thought things could get put back in track that quickly. She herself admitted a month later, while we were broke up, that she was totally out of line for acting like that. So after the breakup, we had 2 communucations. She had called me 3 months later to see how the new job was going. We talked nothing about us, just about careers. I let 3 more weeks pass and then stop at the mall to see her and again we talk and she is warm and friendly. Cut to the week before Christmas when I stop to see her again, "I walked up to her and said hi. She said hi back. I said, "can we talk"? And in that cold, heartless, fashion of hers, she looked at me and spit back, "no"! Then proceeded to walk away from me and stopped at another display. So I approached her again and said, "why won't you talk to me"? She said, "I'm not interested. I think your last comment to me was that I was a sick (4 letter word), and I lost interest after that". So I said, "well then why did you call me up 3 months after that to see how I was doing"? She said, "well I was wondering how the new job was going, I know you worked hard for it". Then before I got a chance to ask another question, she said she was busy and walked away and went behind the counter. I stood there for a few seconds and then walked out. So let me get this straight, someone that she had no interest in because he called her a name, she decides to call 3 months later to see how his new job was going? Does that make any sense to you or does it sound like a lame excuse as to why she really called? I guess she forgor about the 2 times we talked after the Feb. breakup?! So to add further insult to injury, and to blow up "the bridge" for good. I called her answering machine when I got home and left the following message: "(Her name), why am I held to such a double standard? What I said to you was said out of frustration and hurt. You always somehow find a way to forgive him (the Abuser). Do you mean to tell me that one comment is on the level of the B.S. that (his name) has done to you and to your family the last seven years?! I guess how well I treated you has been totally wiped out with that one comment. I don't get it (her name), why do you always forgive him, and because of one comment you no longer have any interest in me. Why do I get held to such a double standard?! I care for you, I've always card for you"! Then I just hung up, and of course she didn't call back and she won't. I'll never hear from her again. By going there I never expected to get her back any way. In fact, I got pretty much the response I expected. But, I wanted her to know that I still cared for her. And if that comment is the real reason why she lost interest in me, then I must not have been that important to her. I said that because a week after she laid in bed crying about not getting an engagement ring, she was off messing around with that scum bag. Was I out of line saying that to her? This guy has been a part of 2 abortions with her, has physically abused her, mentally abused her, broke into her parents house and casued damage, and sued her brothers for $8,000. I just wanted her to know that I still cared for her. And if she can't forgive me for a comment, yet continuosly frogive him for the horror he's done to her, well then like I said, I must not be that important to her. I tried to offer out a hand and she slapped it away. That scum bag would continue to hound her if he was in my position, but that's not my style. She said she has no interest, so I'll fold my hand and stop investing emotions on her, though it is a very hard thing to do!

I'll share my pearls of wisdom with you, gained through much heartache. But I know the mindset you are in, because I was there too, and you are going to wind up doing what you want, regardless of what anyone tells you. This is long, but maybe you can see what a narcasisstic, selfish, b*tch I dealt with too. I was with a girl that is in a 7 year abusive relationship. She had left the abuser to be with me, we hit it off, both had the same dreams and hopes, and had a slam dunk happy life planned out. Then out of nowhere she breaks it off and winds up back with the abuser. I call her a couple times and email her a couple of times, basically telling her what a mistake she just made and that she's going to ruin the rest of her life. But it's like communicating with a brick wall and she wants no part of me, so I go total NC on her. Two weeks pass and I get this hysterical message left on my machine about how miserable she was and how sorry she was. Like you, being in love with her, I take her back. Christmas of last year rolls around, we have a great day together. That night she starts crying in bed because she thought I was going to get her an engagement ring. I would've but the first incident of her taking off happened just a month earlier, right before Thanksgiving. We had only been back together for 4 weeks, how could she expect a ring after what just went down?! So, the day after Christmas, she's in a mood, and I couldn't have scratched my A** without her having a comment about it. I wound up telling her off, she had been acting badly the entire 2 weeks leading into Christmas too. Call her a couple of days later and she breaks it off again! Again, I call and try to work things out, but she wants to hear none of it. She was cold as ice on the last phone call to me and I said to her, "thank God, you did me such a favor, you b*tch". Referring to thank God I seen it now before I wound up married to her. After we hang up, an hour later my phone rings and I let the machine pick it up. She rips my heart out with lines like, "unfortunately I fell for the dream quicker than I fell for you", "you need to keep going out until you find someone", "I didn't like who I was when I was with you", and the killer, "it just wasn't there". So with that message of hers I again went NC. End of January comes and I get a call from her, telling me that she's filed for her taxes electronically. She owed me $700 that I had lent her for bills and my last comment to her was, "call me when you have the money"; I didn't need any details about the process of how she's getting it. Obviously it was an excuse for her to call me. The next day she emails me, "should we try again"? I tell her to call me, and she does that afternoon. She thanks me for not hating her but doesn't want to talk about any issues. A couple of days pass and I invite her for dinner the following week. She is as excited as a little school girl to get the invitation. Then 2 days before dinner she calls to reschedule, claiming she's too busy with work (total BS story, she was in a depression spiral and was in that "I want to be alone" frame of mine again). I call back and tell her to forget it all together. She admits she's depressed and doesn't want anyone in her life at this time. I say, "fine, good luck with that depression thing", and then hang up. Two weeks later she calls to tell me she wants to drop off the money. When she comes over she hands me the money and thanks me. She says, "it's not my fault", referring to the depression spirals she falls into. I say to her, "you know, maybe it's me but I could've swore you were pretty damn happy when you were with me, in fact even your family and co-workers commented about it. She says, "yeah I've been thinking about that a alot". I try to escort her to the door, yet she doesn't look like she wants to leave. She asks for a hug. One thing leads to another and we end up having sex. She calls me that night telling me how incredible it felt and that she can't get the feeling out of her mind. I play aloof from that point on and she starts calling me, wanting to come over and hang out. So for the 3rd time we hook up again. All is well for a couple of weeks, and then here comes that mean, nasty, streak of hers coming out again. When we were back this 3rd time she had told me that she went back with the abusive Ex on New Years Day. I had no idea of this and it pissed me off to no end. She cried in bed about not getting a ring from me yet, and then a week later she jumps back in bed with a guy that crapped all over her for 7 years. I tell her she's a sick (4 letter word begins with F) for doing that. And that he was a sick F for treating her the way he does and she is a sick F for always going back. Then I tell her, "next time you get depressed, "don't call me"! She looks at me with hate and says, "I'll never call you again"! Three months pass and she calls, "to see how my new job was going"? Yeah right! We keep the conversation strictly to careers and don't touch the subject of us at all. I let 3 weeks pass and stop at the mall where she Manages a store. She is warm and friendly, we talk for about 10 minutes and end on good terms. Again, I let 3 weeks pass and then call her to see if she had gotten the promotion she interviewed for. I get one word answers, and the conversation ends in about 1 minute. Five months pass and brings us to this December. I decide to stop at the mall again and feel her out, see if she had changed at all. Nope! She was back and forth with the abusive boyfriend again and all she remembered of me was my last comment that she was a sick F. What?! We talked 2 times after that and were on good terms, did she forget about that?! So she tells me she lost interest from the time I made that comment and then she walked away and went behind the counter. Being irked from her rudeness, I leave one last message on her machine asking, "why do I get treated with such a double standard"? The abusive Ex, mentally abused her, physically abused her, sued her brothers when they put him in the hospital after finding out about the abuse and won $8000 from them. He gets forgivienm and she goes back with him, yet my comment which was totally justified, is what she remembers. She totally discounts how well I treated her and her daughter, and I did, I treated them great. In fact, after the one breakup she called me to tell me that she was pathetic and that I was the greatest guy in the world and treated her better than anyone ever has. So what you are dealing with is an emotionally unsatable woman, and guess what, it doesn't get any better, it just gets a lot worse! My advice to you, learn from my mistakes, and cut your losses. Ignore her, she's greedy and cares only about her needs. She is uncapable of true love, in fact the word is foreign to her. This woman will continue this yo yo routine with you for as long as you allow it. You are like a toy to her that she picks up when she's bored, then when she's had her fill, she dumps you again until the next cycle comes along. Get out my man, it is not a healthy relationship you are in and she's going to hurt you a lot more if you stay around. Good luck!

Hey Pete, I'm there with you man, and it doesn't get any better. I'm so sick of hearing that line! It's been 10 months since my breakup. I dated a drop dead gorgeous woman who could be sweet as sugar one moment and the devil himself the next. She had come out of a 6 year abusive relationship, with an overweight, dead end job having, white trash, loser! He mentally abused her and physically abused her the one time I know of. Two of her brothers found out about the abuse from her 12 year old daughter that heard the whole thing going on from her bedroom. So 2 Christmas's ago, they knocked on her door, he answered, and they drug him down the steps, beat the tar out of him and put him in the hospital. He later sued them for $8,000 and won the lawsuit. It ruined her relationship with the 2 brothers and severly strained her relationship with her Parents and her other siblings. The suing thing is only the tip of the iceberg of the things that this scum bag has done to her. I was good to her and her daughter, and got the same family charade that you got from your girl. She'd take me over her Parent's house and have me over at family get togethers. Her Parent's, sister, and other brother, loved me, because they knew I was good for her and good to her, and her daughter. I loved the kid like she was my own! But what I came to learn is that this girl battled bouts of depression and low self esteem and had a history of sabotaging all that was good in her life. Anyone that was destructive for her, she drew closer, and anyone who was good for her, she pushed away. As time passed, we had broken up 3 times. She would run back to him, then break thing off with him and then a month later, come running back to me. The 3rd time I'd had enough of it, especially when I learned that afer the 2nd breakup on Christmas day, a week later on New Year's she went back to that fat, dirtball, loser. So when she started her garbage agiain leading up to the 3rd time, I let it all out. Told her that it was sick for her to lay in bed crying because she didn't get an engagement ring from me on Christmas, and then a week later she jumped back in bed with him. She would've gotten the damn ring but she flaked out the first time (ran back to him for 2 days) right before Thanksgiving and I had pushed the time table back a little. Then told her that he was a sick (4 letter word begins with F) for treating her the way he did, and she was a sick (4 letter word begins with F) for continually going back. Might seem harsh to some people but I ahd enough of being toyed with and used by this time. Also told her never to call again, and she angrily said she'd never call me again. She did 3 months later just to see how I was doing, if that makes any damn sense?! This 3rd breakup went down on Februaury, and being Christmas and all, i get stupid again and figure I'll stop by the mall where she works to feel her out and see of she had changed any. I should've known better because even after the Abusive Ex won his lawsuit, she went back out with him!!! He tool $8,000 of her brothers money, and she goes back out with him! So when I stop in the store to see her she is very stand-offish and dismissive. I ask her, "why won't you talk to me"? She says, "because your last comment to me was that, "I was a sick ****". So I said, well then why did you call me 3 months later, just to see how I was doing? Her answer, "well I was wondering how your new job was going". Then before I got the chance to say anything else she said, "I'm busy I don't have time for this", and she went behind the counter. So I left the mall and left her a parting message on her answering machine, basically asking, "why the double standard"? I said, "you mean to tell me that my comment is on the lever of the BS that he put your family through for the past 7 years? Yet you somehow always forgive him, someone that's done things to you that I could never imagine doing to someone I cared for"! I was pissed too, pissed being held to a ridiculous double standard. He could hit her, sure her, hold her against her will, and destroy her family life; yet my comment she couldn't get past. What a whacked out, self destructive, psycho (you know what)!!!

Hey Nova, I got that same kind of call from a girl that broke it off with me 3 times! At the last break up, the 3rd one, I called her a sick (4 letter word that starts with F) for going back to an abusive boyfriend, which she did everytime she would leave me. And I also told her at the break, "next time you get depressed, don't call me"! Three months later she calls, just to see how I was doing...lol. Yeah Right! So you are mad at me for what I called you, and have no interest in us anymore, yet you call to see how I'm doing??? Did she think I'd buy that? I hate her for doing that to me because it set me back just when I had stopped thinking about her. When they do this to you it's just their way of testing the water to see if you're still on the hook for them. I should of told her to go pound sand instead of being friendly to her.

I know exactly how you are feeling, was in the same kind of relationship with a girl that I went to high school with. Our paths crossed, we hit it off, and in the end she sabotaged the relationship and went back to an abusive boyfriend who is not only a failure as a person, but it fat, has a dead end job, and pretty much the poster boy for white trash. Go read some of my early posts, I think you'll find them very similar to what you were going through. What made the breakup even harder is that she came back to me twice and then tried to crack the door open to come back a third time. I loved her to death, and still do, but I tried everything I could do to get her out of a real bad situation and frame of mind. It didn't work and won't with your girl. I know it's hard not to take it personally, I know I did and I was crushed. Here I am, an attractive, successful, intelligent, guy with everything going for me, and she wound up back with a guy that has made her life a living hell. It can really play with your head and shake you to the core. But please understand, nothing you've done, or nothing you do, would have changed anything. She would've done the same thing regardless of what you did or didn't do. It's hard to see someone you love self destruct, and it's even harder to know that you are absolutely helpless to stop it. But worse yet, it would've been tragic for you to be stuck with a life of that. It will tear you up, believe me! I know exactly what you are talking about with the mood swings!!! It starts to take its till on you and soon you find yourself censoring what you were going to say because of how it will be taken, and eventually all of the communicatiuon just breaks down. Maybe this will help you understand her frame of mind a little better: She does not like herself at all, does not like what she has become, and does not like her life. So in her way of thinking, there must be something wrong with you, becuase if "I don't like myself, how could you possibly like me"? It's not logical, but it's how a lot of women in these situations act, illogical! The worst thing you can do is try to apply logic to anything she does. I'll bet if you cut all contact off with her, in about 2 to 3 months, your phone will ring. It happened to me constantly. As much as you love her, you need to realize that you can't help her, no matter what you do or say. Where the bottom is, I don't know. Just when I thought my Ex had bottomed out, she would fall even lower. These women don't even respect themselves, how do you think they could ever possibly respect you or I?!

Thanks for the responses ladies, means a lot coming from your perspective. I don't want to call her and don't want to stop by her work. Not for fear of what he would do to her, but just knowing she would shut down and be cold to me. All I can think to do is send a simple Christmas card saying, "(Her name), hope you and Jess (her daughter) have the happiest of holdiays. May this New Year bring both of you all that your heart desires. Miss you...(my name) I want her to know that I don't hate her and am thinking of her. I think she thinks I view her as pathetic, because when we last saw each other in mid October, I asked her a question I already knew the answer to. I said, "you back with him? Are you back with (his name)?" She put her head down and walked to her car, not saying anything or even looking my way. Just the frustration of it all, knowing that she settled for a loser like that got to me, and I just uttered, "unbelievable"! I sincerely don't think she would ever take it, but I wanted to give her a sliver of hope, let her know that I don't hate her and am thinking of her. Then I'll truly let it go, knowing that I played my last hand and there is really nothing more for me to do. I need her to know I still care. Does the card convey those feeling to her?

Thanks for the responses, especially you teacup. I've been trying to get my head around this thing from the start and try as I may, I just can't do it. I want to open a door for her to get back should she ever figure this whole thing out. What you wrote is so true, he does have total control over her. He's either directly cause or been the catalyst for some truly horrific things in her life, most notably, two abortions with this dirt ball. Teacup, she has such a wall up now that he is back in the picture, how do I start to break through that? I don't want to show up at her work or her house, she would just get very defensive if I did anyway; I seen her do the same thing with him and he's the one she's addicted to. What words do I use without making it sound like I'm trying to rescue her, which I am not. I just want her to know that the lines of communication are open should she ever want to talk. She knows she treated me badly through this whole thing, she has admitted as much in the past and actually said, "thank you for not hating me" a couple of times when she wanted to come back. I just think she just has such a wall up, he has had her for 6 years and she has knows nothing else. I just think she doesn't trust anything she feels right now, and she certainly doesn't trust people. She has limited contact with her Parents; if not for the daughter (she isn't the scum bags kid, thank God), has absolitely no friends, and lives a large part of her life in that bedroom of hers, shut off from the rest of the world. What do I write to her, without opening myself up to further hurt, and let her know that I still care for her? Any direction, especially from someone like you, teacup, would be greatly appreciated. Thanks.

I had a relationship with a girl I went to high school with, 20 years later. Our paths had crossed, we hit if off great, grew close pretty qucikly, and in time started making long term plans. I knew she had a rocky previous relationship that involved mostly mental abuse, but some physical abuse also. She was with a guy for 6 years that made her life hell, and to be fair about it, it was just as much her fault for staying in it that long and continuing to go back to it. She did the whole conseling thing; wound up seeing numerous different therapists, and not one of them helped. Got so bad that 2 of her brothers found out, drug the guy out of her house, and put him in the hospital. The dirt ball wound up suing the brothers for $8,000. And in the end she went back to this abusive, fat, dead end job having, white trash, loser. My mistakes were letting her come back, not once, but twice. I thought it was just part of the process of her finally trying to break away from that loser. Things got to a point where her constant depression and mood swings got to be too much, and when I found out she went back with him after the second time we had broken up (something I was unaware of), that was pretty much it for us. She couldn't shake this guy, for God knows what reason. Not only is he not much to look at, he's got nothing to offer, and I'd be here forever if I told you the horrific, nasty, things he had done to her over the years. I never chased her, never asked her back, never crowded her. She'd ask for alone time, and I'd back off. But then a few days later my phone would ring, and I'd get a line like, "keep me here with you, where I belong". Yet the abusive Ex, when he was with her would call her up to 6 times a day, would stop by her house and work uninvited. One day he went to her house uninvited, went to her work uninvited, called her that night, and then went to her house that night. When he got to the house she wouldn't open the lower door to her condo, so the loser knocked for 30 mins, until the downstairs neighbor let him in. Then once in he banged on her house door for another 30 mins. He also left messages on her machine that would run the length of the time on the machine, saying things like he hates his life, hates his job, and that he can't live without her. Guess what, that needy, whining, crying, B.S. worked. That was one of the things I told her when we parted ways. Told her you have a double standard, had I done a fraction of what he did, you'd loathe me, yet he gets a pass. In the end I told her that they deserve each other, I said, "he's a sick for treating you the way does, and you're a sick for always going back". Also told her to never call me agin, and she swore she wouldn't. I was the only other persons he ahd been with during their six years. I think she just thought it was too much work to stay in the new relationship, and that she had too much time invested with the loser to let it go. She did call 3 months later just to see how I was doing, which really shocked me. We talked about work, and nothing about us or the relationship. I tried calling her and saying hello a few weeks after that and was met with one word answers, obvious that the call wasn't welcomed. Strange being that it was ok for her to call me and I was civil, yet when I return the same courtesy, I'm met with coldness and one word answers. Unbelievably, I found out she is back with him now. She has a 12 year old daughter that I loved like my own kid. Her daughter seen and heard the one instance of the abuse, the one that led to the beating by the 2 brothers. I just can't believe she would bring someone like that around her kid again. At the first breakup when she went back to him, it crushed me. I actually told her, "it's one thing if you left me to go back to your Ex husband, or yu found someone new, but to leave me for that dirt ball is insulting". This was said after she called me in hysterics, telling me that everything I predicted would happen, actually happened. And with all of this said, I stil miss her. I've been in a couple of relationships since this happened, but I miss her, and miss what could've been. I don't know how to crack the door open with the abusive boyfriend still in the picture. A Christmas card maybe? I can't let go without reaching out one more final time, but how do I do it?

Charlotte, Think about it this way. By breaking up with you, this person is telling you that their level of feeling and commitment is not as strong as yours. When you love someone, you would never risk losing that person by pulling away from them. Ask yourself this, if you were with someone that you truly cared for and had throughts of a long term future with, would you ever risk walking away from the relationship? No, you would stay and try to work things out, like is done in normal, healthy, relationships. When someone breaks up with you, they've quit on you. You can dress it up however you like, but they quit on the relationship and they quit on you. Be very careful investing time and emotion into someone that has already showed you how they will treat you when they get bored, or a problem should arise. I will tell you this from first hand experience too. Once someone does that to you, pulls away from you, and then you two get back together, it will hover over the relationship like a black cloud, and worse yet will wear on your mental well being. You will find yourself always waiting for the other shoe to drop because this is a person that has no problem quitting on you again. You'll start to analyze words they say, or moods that they are in, and it is impossible not to think, "here we go again". When I talk about looking yourself in the mirror, that is more directed to the people whose Ex's have done some really out of line things to them such as; cheated, lied about important things, used them, abused them, or had the basis of the relationship totally on their terms. Don't kid yourself, people know when they have mis-treated the person they were with, and for you to welcome them back with open arms is not going to have the effect you believe it will. You will be treated as a doormat, I'll guarentee it! So yes, you better look yourself in the mirror and ask yourself those questions first, because they absolutely will find themselves being asked eventually, by either you or the person you've taken back.

Thanks for all of the great responses. I wanted to share things that are universal to every relationship. These weren't read on a message board or learned from a book, they were lived by me first hand. I cringe when I see some of the posts on here by people who are hanging on and living in an altered reality. It's just amazing how much we put up with when we love someone. It's painful to see guys and girls whose Ex's are with new partners, stringing them along by telling them, "I still think of you", "I still love you", "maybe someday we'll get back together", etc... Wake up! Try switching roles in your mind. Would you have ever risked the relationship by doing what your Ex or even current bf/gf is doing. It's all about respect, when you lose that, or worse yet, give it away, your relationship is over. Another thing I wanted to share with everyone, and also a lesson you sometimes have to live first hand to understand it's importance: Don't let anyone bring the problems of their past into the relationship. If that starts happening to you, it's one of the biggest red flags that you can get. Don't become their counselor and the shoulder to cry on because in the end it will destroy your relationship, and worse yet, screw with your mental well being in a way you can't imagine! We all have our own set of problems and hardships from time to time. There are two types of people, those that wallow in those problems and never move on from them, and those that conquer them and treat them as nothing but a glance in the rear view mirror. Seek out people who do the latter, who don't let life drag them down and have enough inner strength to work through and get through anything. When you settle for the former, you will eventually get drug into that persons drama and you are going to have a real tough relationship, and even worse, a real tough life. Hope I've helped a few people take a new perspective on things, because afterall, heartache and depression are really just a state of mind. Never let anyone in life dictate your perspective, stay true to yourself, don't change for anyone, and never settle for someone that is not and cannot give you 100%.

Echo, though a little harsh, Veritas is right. I know you love this guy, but the longer you stay his friend, the longer you stay available, the longer he will use you; even if it's just keeping you as a backup plan. Be honest with yourself, you want more than his friendship. You want him to come back to you, else you wouldn't be in this forum. The longer you stay in contact with him, the more likely this won't happen. Let me rephrase that, it definitely won't happen. I've been in one of these relationships, had someone run back to me twice and then try for a third, but I wouldn't play her game anymore. I'll be honest, I don't wish the Ex the best, I hope she regrets what she did to our relationship the rest of her life. I have no remorse in wishing her pain and heartache, due to the simple fact that I won't be the one causing it. She made that decison herself, and it's something she'll have to come to peace with someday. My conscience is clear because I treated her and her daughter as well as they've ever been treated. What she does and who she does it with is no longer my concern, but I certainly don't wish her happiness.

This is directed toward those that are hurting over a breakup and want to get their Ex back. I've been there this last year and have done it not only once, but twice with the same girl. In fact, she made a third attempt at coming back but I just couldn't do it. As much as I missed her, loved her, and wanted her back, I knew that nothing had changed with her and in a matter of a month or two, her problems would've crept back in and started dragging me down again. Someone you love should never drag you down, they should be a source of strength and happiness. She is one of those rare women that sabotages the good people and the good things in her life, someone who is more at home in the depression of her past than the possibilities that the future holds. We all seem to overlook the obvious and excuse bad behavior when we are in love with someone. My relationship was nothing short of a movie of the week, filled with drama, involving an abusive relationship that she had been in for six years before dating me, that she has now unbelievably gone back to. A few things I've learned that may help you and stop you from making stupid mistakes: 1. No Contact! Any attempt you make to call, email, vist, etc..., is going to make you look bad, real bad. In fact, it starts to remove the doubt that the person has about dumping you. Your actions start to justify their decision. How did I get her to come back twice and have her calling to try again for a third time? I ignored her! You don't acknowledge holidays, birthdays, or anything else. You do not remain friends in any way if there are not kids involved. Give them the gift they wanted, to live life without you. Words and actions have circumstances, and your Ex will never learn that if you are only a phone call away. 2. Always judge someone on their actions not their words. People with agendas will string you along and tell you what they think you want to hear to keep you hanging on. Anyone who is giving you the "I care for you but need my alone time" speech, "need my space" speech, "I'm not sure what I want" speech, or things along these lines, is using you as a comfort zone. As soon as you get one of these lines, believe it! Don't try and rationalize it away and excuse it. It's the biggest red flag you can get. When someone hits you with this, you serve it right back to them by agreeing. Say something like, "well being you don't have the same commitment as I do to the relationship, I think it's best we go our separate ways". Believe me, this is not what they are expecting to hear! It shows control, strength, and respect for yourself; three very attractive qualities. 3. Always stay cocky and funny throughout the entire relationship. Cocky does not mean arrogant, it means confident. Never be afraid to laugh at yourself, but do it in a confident way. Never be afraid to poke fun at your bf/gf, but do it with humor. It's amazing how a humorous, sarcastic line, can drive home a point without creating an argument. Never, ever, walk on egg shells around the person you love. As soon as you do this, your relationship is all but over. Never be afraid to speak your mind, or call your bf/gf for acting out of line, or treating you with dis-respect. Never tolerate dis-respect from anyone! 4. Look in the mirror of your soul and ask yourself these questions. Can I respect myself for taking someone back that thought so little of me that they walked away from the relationship? Will the other person respect me if I let them come back after how poorly they've treated me? This is one where logic and emotion battle. Logically we all know the answer, but emotionally we stumble. See things for what they are, not for what you want them to be. See people and situations for what they truly are; it will save you so much pain and heartache. If your answer is still yes then go back and reference point number 2 and hold them to this standard. 5. Have confidence in yourself and in how well you treated them. Without going into detail, I will tell you for a fact that your Ex being with someone else means nothing, and that the time you two were together or apart means nothing, and in most cases, the circumstances of the breakup mean nothing. If they truly love you, they will find their way back to you. If they ended the relationship, don't you ever be the one to pursue them for another chance. You are the prize in the relationship, not them. Don't let how good or well you treated them confuse you. We've all been there, "I treated him/her so good, how could they leave me"? Instead let it be a weapon of strength. If you were good to the other person, it will always stay with them, and as they discover that the grass wasn't greener on the other side, it will begin to haunt them. Have confidence that they will never find someone as good as yourself. Have confidence that when they are with someone else, they will constantly draw comparisons between you and the other person, whether they want to or not. It's just how the mind works. So you may think that they've forgotten you, but they haven't, there's a database of good memories that they will reference back to. Never forget this point when the thought of them with someone else starts to eat at you. And through it all, please remember that you only get treated the way you allow someone to treat you.

Guys, I've been there myself recently. If you're interested read some of my posts about her. Basically she left me for a guy that abused her for 6 years, she went through two abortions with this dirt ball, and he physically abused her, not to mention the horrific mental abuse he put her through. Two of her brothers found out about the abuse and drug him out of the hosue 2 Christmases ago and proceeded to put him in the hospital. The abusive bopyfriend sued the 2 brothers and won $8000. While we were broken up and ran into each other, she made it a point to tell me how she hollered and screamed at him on the phone about the lawsuit. Then I come to find she is back with him. Ugggh! He is spending her own brothers money on her! It's ruined the relationship with the 2 brothers and strained the relationship with her parents. She left me twice for him and then came back. The second time she went back with him I found out after the fact. She somehow decided to withold that little tidbit of info until we had been back together again. But once she started her BS again, giving me the silent treatment, twisting every word out of my mouth, I'd had enough of it all and brought the last breakup to a head. I told her never to call me again, and she looked at me with disdain and said, "I will never call you again"! The phone rang 3 months later and she just wanted to see how I was doing?! I didn't pursue the chase immediately, let a month pass and then called her to see how she was dioing, and I got the cold shoulder, nothing but one word answers. Then absolute most frustrating relationship I have ever been in because she sent nothing but mixed messages the entire relationship. I curse the day she came into my life. She showed me her best side but just couldn't keep it together and the real her came through, a mean, cold, heartless, and vindictive woman who continually battles depression. I used to leave her house at night, get in my car and scream, waht the ****. She would take the most basic, little, thing, and turn it into a problem. I was played too, and used. In fact she even admitted it. I was used as leverage against the abusive boyfriend. She took everything I offered her, marriage, a baby, a house, ect..., and used as an ultimatum to the abusive Ex. Talk about COLD HEARTED. I don;t wish her well, like so many on here say you should. I hope her life continues to be a living hell, filled with more heartache and sorrow. I hope karma comes back to get her 10 fold, and I hope she never has another day of happiness.