quintana

Hi, Since the topic of staying friends with an ex seems to be as relevant as ever, I thought I'd offer a little update on my attempt to re-unite, platonically, with my ex-girlfriend. Short story is that it seems to be working out well. Longer story is that we've talked on the phone a couple of times and have also met in person to catch up. I was a bit nervous about this because I didn't know how I would react to seeing her. Would I want to be with her again? Or, the opposite, would we be strangers to each other with nothing much in common and nothing to really talk about? Fortunately, neither was the case. It was great seeing her and hearing about her life, family and friends. I felt really comfortable around her. We didn't delve into any tough talks about what went wrong etc., which suited me fine. Just chatting and hanging out and giving each other updates on everything and everybody in each other's lives. It's nice to be able to mention some relative or some interest of mine and she immediately knows whom or what I'm talking about. Obviously we still know each other very well and still care for each other, and I feel I can definitely count on having her in my corner for anything good or bad. And vice versa. She is not with that guy, like I'd thought, and that quite possibly makes it easier for us to meet on common ground. This experience have encouraged me to believe that there is good sense in re-uniting with people you really care about - as long as they really care about you too. Life is too short to hold grudges. Sincerely, Quintana

7tinNC Thanks for your input. Wow, 17 years! That is a long time. I'm amazed you could find common ground after such a long time. Of course, I don't know for how long you two were going out in the first place? Yeah, it's difficult to read a heart on a bulletin board. I've glanced at my posts and they seem pretty formal and distanced. One of the reasons may be that I'm not a native English speaker. Hence, the overly correct language.. I have replied to my ex-girlfriend, and appreciated the possibility of us staying in contact. I feel a bit apprehensive and think I'll wait for her to express the level of contact we would have. She didn't contact me for a long time because I explicitly told her not to, in order to sort out my feelings and get back on my feet. Also, she thought I was mad at her and thereforeeee didn't dare write or call me. I've told her that is water under the bridge, that I'm not mad at her, that in fact I was happy to hear from her, and she seemed thrilled about that. I think there's definitely hope of a very good friendship. Only thing is her current boyfriend (I suspect they are still seeing each other, but I don't know for sure) somewhat played a part in our break-up, and even though I don't know the geezer I wouldn't want to have anything to do with him - on principle. This obviously speaks against us having an open, solid friendship, and so it may all end before it has really begun. An honest heart-to-heart at some point might break down these last barriers, but for now I'm taking it very slowly and with extreme caution. Again, thanks for your input. Quintana

Hello Stolen Shadow, Thanks for your input, but I think you're a bit off the mark or I am not making myself clear. Of course I'd like to be near her - if she'd like to be near me. Why you think that would be such a bad thing, I'm not sure. As there is no intention of starting over with her. She has expressed that she want us to remain in touch now that we've met again. She's called me a couple of times, send me a Christmas card and such things. To which I haven't replied yet. I feel it's right to explore the possibilities of a friendship. I'm curious as to what extent she wants contact, and I'm undecided because I'm usually not in favor of mere acquaintances. I prefer closeness and confidentiality in regards to the people I call my friends. The rest can be categorized as co-workers, drinking buddies or such. She's been put away in the closed category of "ex-girlfriends". Now she's popped up and I'm wondering where to place her. I will proceed with caution, obviously. Happy New Year to you too, Quintana

I don't think you ever recovered from being rejected by her and there lies the root of your problem. Sarah, thanks for your candid point of view. I've been busy spending the Holidays with family and friends and thereforeeee haven't replied earlier. Rejection is obviously important. It was a huge blow to my ego and self-esteem when she left and it was a huge blow when she hooked up with another guy after having (unwittingly) stringed me along for some time after. Rejection made me feel sad and rejection made me feel angry. I haven't felt sad for a long time now, and I haven't felt angry either - even though I only reluctantly let go of that feeling as being angry was such a great motivator in moving on and pursuing new goals. I can't however - in good conscience - feel angry towards her anymore. She did what she felt was right, and absolutely had no intentions of hurting me on purpose. This is a kind and good-hearted girl. The kind of person most people would love to have as a friend. I know I would, as she still is one of the people on this earth who know me best. Why shouldn't we be able to build a friendship? It would probably be typical of me to let my ego get the best of me and shut her out completely - as I have done up till recently. But wouldn't that be a shame? To stop a possible friendship of mutual respect and warm feelings from evolving because of pride? I haven't pursued her in any way since she met that other guy - quite the contrary. I let her be out of respect for her choice and in order to heal. Now the healing's done, I'd like to break that ego-driven pattern of stubborn silence and invite her back into my life as a good friend. And good friends should be able to communicate beyond quarterly e-mails and phone calls each Christmas, shouldn't they? After meeting her it felt obvious that she still cared for me very much. I'm not blind to the fact that some of these sentiments might stem from guilt, but not just that. The only lingering feeling I'll admit to regarding the old relationship is the feeling that she gave up too soon. Something she even admitted to at one point. That might explain the residue of warm feelings on both sides. That we stopped before the tank was completely empty, so to speak. I feel the right thing to do, is to try and turn these feelings into a strong and good friendship - and not to try and ignite a second relationship as lovers. That road is blocked. I hope this clarifies my point of view, and I wish all of you a happy New Year, Quintana

Do you recognise those mixed feelings of familiarity and separation when you happen to see the ex again? I mean, she's definitely off the piedestal now, and I can see her without looking through rose-tinted glasses, but at the same time she looks as beautiful as she did back then, and I had a nice, warm feeling in my body when we we're talking. It's like there's still a great distance between us - a lack of honesty in a way - and at the same time there's a strong bond and a true sense of love and care. How to progress in re-building a friendship? I feel that we have to go over the past at some point to erase those barriers in order to have proper, honest communication again. But I don't think a big talk like that should be right now. It's way too soon. And, actually, I would feel bad being rejected a friendship. It's one thing that I was rejected as a lover in the past, I'm over that now, but to have it happening again as a friend wouldn't go down well with this big ego of mine. Any thoughts on this? And how to go about it. What did you do Andy? Quintana

Yesterday I met my ex-girlfriend at a big Christmas-party at work. I hadn't seen her for almost 2 years, but we have had brief mail-contact for the last couple of months. It was weird seeing her again, but over-all it was more nice than bad. She looked good, was smiling and very friendly. We gave each other updates of our lives. Talked about family, friends, work and such stuff. Nothing involving current partners (I'm not seeing anyone right now, while she's probably still with the guy she was seeing back when we last saw each other - I don't know, didn't feel like asking). We chatted for a couple of hours, none of us were really drunk unlike the rest of the party, and conversation went pretty smooth although definitely awkward at times for both of us. Many times we looked each other in the eyes and then looked away, goofingly laughing (must have been a silly sight to see). She confided in me a lot of things concerning her family, whom I am very fond of and do miss a lot, whereas I was more protective of my personal life and withheld that kind of info. She teased me quite a bit - about my mannerisms, expressions and such things, but not in spiteful way. More like, she remembered the way we were (to quote a crappy, sappy movie-title) and felt at ease teasing me about it. She was quite at ease touching me as well. In a non-intimately way, I should add. I left the party, and her, quite suddenly to her expressed sadness. I was feeling tired after a long day, and also, I admit, I wanted to be the one to leave this time. She was the one that broke up with me back then, after living together for about 4 years. I was devastated, and spent a lot of time getting back on my feet and trying to figure out what the hell happened. I'm still not sure of all the why's and I guess I never will be, even if she decides to explain it sometime. I have in many ways moved on, and have had a lot of self-developing experiences since, along with two very short relationships. This is, however, a woman that will probably have a place in my heart forever. I suffer from pride, stubborness and a big ego (which of course can be a good thing as well) and still feel the effects of her rejecting me. More than this (?), though, I have the ambition that two people who care for each other on a fundamental level, which seems to be the case here, should make the effort to be in each other's lives as friends. I don't have ambitions to be with her as boyfriend/girlfriend again for a lot of reasons, one of them being that I don't feel my pride, stubborness and ego would allow me to trust her in that particular context. But I would like to be her very good friend, and for her to be mine, in a way that goes beyond the odd e-mail or phone-call. None of my friends or family understand this ambition of mine, but still they all think the world of her and have fond memories of her. Any of you have any experience with the succes-rate of these types of friendship? If I detect that she's not willing to put in the effort to be friends I'm quite willing to shut the door again, but I feel it would be a shame to waste loving feelings between two people even if these feelings are no longer romantic. I'd appreciate any input. Cheers, Quintana

"it's not so much that I want to tell him about the new boyfriend because I want to show him it's over -- it's more that I want him to move on too." In my experience that would be one and the same thing. I only began truly moving on when my ex-girlfriend informed me that she was seeing someone new. Before that I still had hope, even confidence, that we would get back together. But then again my ex had been one big question mark for months after breaking up with me, so the need for closure might have been more urgent than in the case of you and your ex. I think you might be helping him move on by telling him, but it really depends on the vagueness/resolution with which you broke up with him. And hopefully he has already moved on. Take care. - Quintana

- purple_monster First off, I don't think you're a monster. I commend you for treading in these testy waters where waves of emotions run high, and where all of us dumpees might snap at you for just being "you" - the dumper. I guess you have to suffer the plight of representing all of our exes and bear with the fact that we tend to ascribe the sentiments of these exes to you - and vice versa. It is relevant and quite interesting to hear from "the other side" and to gain that access to the "mind of the female dumper" we crave so much. So, thank you for posting and I, like the always eloquent Caveat, respect you for your honesty, respect your decision, and sympathize with your situation, which I am sure sucks big time. Even though it might suck to a smaller extent than the situation of the unsuspecting dumpee. It should be clear by now, but to be sure: I was in a situation that seems to resemble that of your ex-boyfriend. I will only echo the sentiments of most other posters and tell you that if the emotional restoration of your ex-boyfriend is at the top of your priority-list you ought to keep doing what you're doing and leave him be. If you acting "cold", or at the least firm in your decision that it is over, might lead to him resenting you, it really is a small price to pay. Should this happen, I'm sure he'll get over the whole thing sooner and in due time his feelings of resentment will subside. What happened to me, and to a great extent I allowed it to happen, was that my ex-girlfriend's confusion and second-guessing kept me in a limbo of hope, which led to an almost irreversible collaps. Also in this period of 6 or 7 months many unhappy memories between the two of us were created, and to this day (another 7 months later) these sad memories eclipse the many beautiful ones that I know we shared, but are somehow now blocked out. It took her meeting another guy to get me out of the limbo and shift focus from her and me to just me. I wish she had stuck to her decision instead of trying to soften the blow. I understand that she really wasn't sure about what she wanted for quite a while after the break-up. But she did want something else bad enough to break-up with me and she should have stood by this decision. In the end I had to cut off contact to salvage what tiny piece there was left of my self-respect and also to save myself from hating her on a very permanent basis. Something she really doesn't deserve - despite it all. Well, I guess I'm not bringing anything new to the table, but I would hope that any dumper-to-be that should stumble accross this post would break up with quite a lot more consistency than my ex-girlfriend. Speaking of her : is finding a new man more compatible than your ex a primary and immediate goal of yours? Is it just about sorting your head out and embracing whatever life has to offer while you do this? And what would it require on your part to possibly rekindle the relationship with your ex further down the road? What will be will be? Or do you see yourself actively pursuing a relationship - albeit only as friends - with him at some point? A lot of questions, I know, but as the Official Spokesperson of All Female Dumpers in their Mid-20's you are under oath and must answer Disregard that last remark, but seriously it would be interesting to hear your answers. I wish you well, Quintana

Nap-Man, I would disagree with your definition of "success" I do know where you're coming from, though. For at least 6 months my primary objective was getting back with my ex, as I could not picture a life without her. That in itself made my goal unobtainable, b/c I wasn't focusing properly on the most important person in my life - me. Anyway, I was suffering from selective hearing and would pretty much turn a deaf ear on those of my friends who did not get back together with their ex'es, and listen with delight to those that did. Didn't do anything but prolong my state of agonising hope. However, it did provide me with a couple of "succes stories". 1) One couple both in their mid-20's had lived together for 4 years. She met someone who was quite the opposite of her boyfriend and moved in with him instantly. He had seemed like the perfect guy when they had first started flirting at work. But the perfect image turned out to be just that. She moved out again after just a month, but continued to live alone for the next 6 months while sorting out the mess in her head. Meanwhile her former boyfriend went partying with a vengeance and was with quite a few women. Purely sexual - if that isn't a contradiction in terms, that is They remained in touch, and he would always profess his love for her. After these 6 or 7 months they got back together and are now - 6 years later - married with 2 children. I guess they both needed to see what else was out there before settling down with each other. She pursued a romantic dream, he fulfilled som sexual fantasies, and in the end they found a healthy combination in each other. 2) Both in their mid-20's. After 3 years together she found another. He realized immediately that this new guy was not the real deal, and ventured into the danger-zone as her friend. He preserved their confidentiality and although he would hurt inside whenever she brought up the topic of her new boyfriend he remained cool and supportive. Things turned around when he began dating someone else. She got jealous, and one year after the break-up they were back together. They are now living together with 2 kids and have been for many years. He admits to using his interrim girlfriend and feels somewhat bad about this. But not too much though. He's a cunning bastard. 3) Both in their mid-20's (see a pattern?). She broke up with him due to poor communication and a general confusion about what she wanted out of life. He was totally devastated and consistently pursued her with one "romantic" effort after another. Only pushed her further away. After 6 months or so she began dating another guy, dumping my friend even further in the green pit of jealousy. He said to hell with it. Broke all contact, and started an affair with a married woman. After another 6 months she came back all of sudden. Threw pebbles at his window in the night and said she realized she had made a mistake and that she wanted him back. They also are living together with 2 children now, and have been together for several years. I don't know if you can conclude anything from these stories other than what most other posters have emphasised. Which is that re-unions usually occur when the dumpee has finally moved on or at least shifted focus to him- or herself 100 %. I could tell you five times as many stories in which they never got back together again, but this post is getting long enough as it is. You should know, however, that all of my friends, who all have suffered devastating break-ups, without exception are now very happy albeit in new relationships. - Quintana

-John25 I'm glad to hear that you're feeling so much better already - and getting better each and every day. The 1-year recovery is the AVERAGE amount of time, I must stress. And it should also be noted that we all may think differently of the words "healed" and "recovered". In my personal understanding to be fully recovered is when you're able to engage whole-heartedly in another serious relationship without the risk of jeopardizing this new relationship with too much (if indeed any) feelings of resentment, anger and so on stemming from your former relationship. You may be able to do so in a couple of months. If so, great! And you should by no means feel bad about feeling great. Meanwhile, though, others will not be ready for this for a couple of years, and they should by no means feel bad for feeling bad either. Or being made feel bad for feeling bad, rather. John25 wrote: Look on the bright side: the world is also in many ways more beatiful when you finally have your eyes open again. I can definitely confirm that breaking up is an opportunity for personal growth! I completely agree with this, and every major change in your life should be viewed as a possibility to grow. Congrats on your new car, John25, and keep going by the speed you're going. You will get far! Quintana

- Pebek. 4 1/2 years is a long time, and to have it end so abruptly must have left you bewildered. It sounds like (lack of) communication was the major issue. She let her concerns develop for close to a year until they grew to resentment and she just wanted out. If she is truthful about this, of course. Fighting shouldn't be part of a healthy relationship, but to argue is indeed healthy and necessary. That way you learn to vent, compromise and keep minor issues from snowballing into major obstacles. I feel for you. It isn't fair of her to have kept these things to herself and then out of the blue to hit you with a definite decision. I don't mean to beat you up about all this, but maybe the importance of communication is one of the lessons to learn from this relationship? Continuing NC is good for you, I think. In time you will come to peace with the whole thing. But I sense that you would like some sort of explanation from her. A more lenghty one than what you got? You may not get one that will satisfy you, though. I wrote a long letter to my ex-GF void of anger, accusations and such. It was a farewell letter with much warmth and me trying to understand where we went wrong. Didn't bring her back, of course, but it was well received and it felt like a big relief to share my inner thoughts with her for one last time. (we didn't fare too well in the communication department either, you see). Something for you to consider, maybe? All will be well, trust me. - Quintana

- Pebek The average amount of time needed to recover from a break-up is 1 year. That's the word around the campfire, anyway. Some, like John25, might get there in a few months or sooner, and some will not properly heal for many years. There any many factors involved, naturally. Depending on the level of commitment, how many years together, previous luggage, specific circumstances of the break-up etc. But the average healing time is approximately one year. I am average, in that area, as it took me precisely a year to reach a perspective on my past, present and future that "makes sense" and makes me feel good. First six months was still a question of "us", whereas the last six months was all about "me". NC helped a lot. Being angry was also great. And even greater when channelled through various sports. Getting drunk and getting laid shouldn't be knocked either. And yes, self-pity, even to alarming degrees, can be useful. Do it to a point when you feel sick about yourself and you don't ever want to be like that again. There are many roads to recovery. Mine might have been a long and winding one (still average, though;-)), but I've reached the destination, which is: happiness with what was, acceptance of it never coming back in that particular version, a sense of optimism and purpose, and I find myself to be stronger, wiser, and even happier than ever. Can't wait for you to get to the other side. It's great! Be patient, and you WILL come through stronger and better. -Quintana

John25, I'm surprised, to say the very least, by your schedule of recovery. It's not that I disagree with your insights. On the contrary, but replace "days" with "months" and you have my situation. From my experience, it is close to impossible to gain your kind of perspective so early on in the process. You did see it coming, though, which may explain what seems to be a rapid recovery. I didn't. Letting go is the only right thing to do when "negotiations" break down, but how you force yourself to let go just by rational thought, I don't know. Your heart also has to be in it, I guess. You wouldn't want to dwell on your misery, but I think a lot is gained in the longer run, if you allow yourself to embrace the pain and find possibly unpleasant insights to your own nature and personality. This may take quite a while, at least it has for me, but it's time well spent, I find. Even though it often feels like precious time wasted.