UPDATE: Dating a survivor of childhood abuse

Hello,

I have or had been dating a woman who is a survivor of childhood abuse (sexually and physically abused by her adoptive father from age 5-17). I have noticed several quirky tendencies and have often wondered if these can be attributed to her background.

She often pushes away after an episode of feeling close and intimate. She has admitted that she pushes people away when she starts to care about them because she has "abandonment issues".

She is adorable and sweet, and truly lovely person but when she is angry, it is explosive. Almost to the point opf being hateful. I feel like if she is angry with me, she is venting her anger based on all the experiences that she has had in the past and I am the outlet.

She never understands why I care so much and why I am good to her.

She can't handle any intense emotions on my part. I am usually very temperate, but if I show any anger she freaks out.

Currently, we haven't spoken for two weeks. We had an argument over sometime very minor but she absolutely blew up. She basically told me she never wanted to speak to me again. I was never mean to her, just trying to stand up for myself. I had to cancel a visit to see her (long distance) and it was very dissappointing for me. But I am giving her space and will use the excuse of the Holidays to contact her.

Any thoughts and advice would be appreciated. I can give more details as required.

Thanks much.

This is very much linked to her childhood, she clearly cares about you, but what's happened to her has meant that she is very concerned about others feelings.

She pushes away, and doesn't know why you care for her for obvious reasons, her adoptive father has obviously made her feel used and unloved, and that is a feeling that's hard to shake.

I don't think you should feel remotely disheartened by any of this, she cares for you, you care for her, she probably feels like you don't, try explaining exactly how you feel, if you haven't already.

she is obviously having a hard time right now with the arguments, maybe something came up to remind her of childhood, or maybe it's nothing to do with this.

You should really just talk to her, i'm just offering anything i have, just hope i've helped, good luck with everything!!!

She often pushes away after an episode of feeling close and intimate. She has admitted that she pushes people away when she starts to care about them because she has "abandonment issues".

Sounds like you're on the right track so far. That's what she needs: someone with patience, and that's what you've got. So good job on your part. A lot of the times, these women have a hard time finding comfort in a relationship. It's as if they expect their partners to turn out like their abusers, so they will often close off. What's key here is: Communication. Always make sure to communicate problems in your relationship, and do not leave any issues unattended. The more she see's your sincere efforts, the more she will let go, and begin to trust you.

I'm sure that deep down inside, she's a sweet and happy person like you mentioned. Her anger mostly deals with getting scared of getting hurt, over and over, like she did in her past. It's her way of dealing with things, unfortunately, because that's the life that she's been accustomed to for a long time. Another thing: try to get her to go to counseling. If she has an outlet through a counselor, then it might help her out, but afterwards, she still has to work on her problems too. It's not easy, but eventually, she will heal. It's all a matter of her not repressing her emotions too much.

Let her know that you're there for her, if she needs to talk. She'll appreciate your efforts, and will be able to allow you into her heart. Think of her as being someone delicate. I like to use the anaology of a dove. Think of her as a dove who's been tortured in her cage all throughout her life. When someone does care enough to reach in there to help her out, she backs away and huddles into the corner of the cage. The more you show gentleness, the more she will learn to let go, and be able to come closer to you. I know. This might not be the best analogy, but that's how I think of it. You guys can still share a deep and intimate relationship. It's just all a matter of time.

Good LucK to You,

Mahlina

Unfortunately, she basically said "Good bye" to me in very literal terms. I was hurt and am letting her have time and space. She told me not to come out to see her. I became very upset instead of trying to understand what was going on and my insecurities unfortunately only added to the situation.

The last bit of direct communication was when I wrote to her on Thursday, Oct. 21 to let her know that I had cancelled my tickets:

Hi...

 

I hope that you are doing well. I will cancel the ticket today before

11:35 MT(departure time). I apologize for barraging you with emails

last Wednesday. While it would have been nice to see you this weekend,

I wish that I had just respected your first email and agreed to not

come out according to your wishes, if only to show consideration to

what you needed.

 

I just wanted to let you know. I apologize if this is an intrusion.

She replied rather caustically:

Yes ~ please cancel it. I can't believe you've waited this long to do so.

I had sent some photos to her prior to the argument and received the envelope back last weekend dated Oct. 22 with the writing "Return to Sender".

The thing is, I know deep down inside, she is sad about the situation. We had gone through something similar in the past. But I had to make the effort to contact her. Problem is now we are long distance and it is easier for her to run away.

That is why I am waiting until a week before Thanksgiving when I can simply contact her and wish a good one. Let her know I am not upset, but I thinking about her.

Kind of up in the air. I am hopeful and confident we can resume communication and she can know that she trusts me.

I'm in the same boat rnorth. My girl was raped by her brother in law when she was only 13. To make matters worse her family decided to pretty much just ignore the whole thing and act as if nothing had happened. To this day she is still expected to go to family gatherings and sit accross the table from this POS and act as if everything is a-ok.

She acts very much the same way that you described your current situation in your post.

She will push away or seem uninterested for no apparent reason at times. Other times she is loving and caring.

Her anger is extremely explosive, and unfortunately for me I'm exposed to it every night. We live together, and so I watch her work herself into a frenzy day after day over trivial things ( such as the dogs not listening and such, I mean, dogs will be dogs ). Eventually she will gear her anger towards me. Some nights I will stick to myself and be quiet so that I don't piss her off. Then she will get upset because she thinks that I am mad and ignoring her. Really starts to feel like a no win situation at times.

I try my hardest to get through to her, and let her know that she is getting upset over nothing. Sometimes she stops and listens, sometimes she just can't.

I find though that in my situation, its almost as though she is pushing me away to see if I will come back. Sometimes I think that she wants to show me her ugliest side, and see if I will stick around. Some times this goes to extremes such as physical violence on her part. Though I think the physical abuse stems more from her previous relationship in which she was beat up, and has less to do with her rape.

All of this is trivial to me how ever, as I truly love and care for the her.

For me the hardest thing to deal with is that fact that I have seen no improvement in her behaivior(sp?) over the course of our relationship ( 1 year + ). If I could somehow tell my self, "Hey, last month there was 20 bad fights, this month there was only 19". Then I would feel like things could eventually be better. But things really are not improving for us/her and lately I've been forced to ask my self if I think I can deal with this for the rest of my life.

I guess the only advice I can offer is to stick in there. Be selfless as that is what women like this need. Be loving and understanding and try to see things through their eyes.

On another note, if any body out there has any resourses (books, web) that could help people in our situations, help the people we are with. I would greatly appreciate a heads up.

Hey mate, I completely feel for you. My recent ex, the woman I've loved and love most in my life, is also a survivor of childhood sexual abuse by an alcoholic father, and general neglect from both her parents.

Just when things were settling down nicely, and we had developed great emotional intimacy, she suddenly decided to pull away. She dumped me, and even spoke to my parents about it with a "Im really sorry, I am weird", and left with sadness in her face.

Its heartbreaking dude, and Im still trying to come into terms with it...with the idea that I may not see her ever again.

Anyways, havent read your entire thread since Im at work right now so shouldnt really be doing this hehe. So i´ll post later. Just to let u know that I really do feel your pain and worries.

Peace.

Her anger is extremely explosive, and unfortunately for me I'm exposed to it every night.

Wow, that is difficult. In my situation, we have very nice periods, lasting about two weeks, followed by turmoil. I feel that I shouldn't walk on egg shells, but it definitely takes a different sort of communication.

I find though that in my situation, its almost as though she is pushing me away to see if I will come back.

But I also feel that there is a part of her waiting to see if I will come back to her, as if she is testing me. All it would talk is the slightest email from my part and she may be back. But it was so hurtful last time that I am afraid to feel that wrath or even worse, indifferent coldness.

My gut feeling is that I will recitfy this with her. But I would like to see her vent her anger or talk about things with a counselor. Its as if I am just an outlet for her.

My advice may not be popular here. You sound like a good guy and have great intentions. From personal experience, I predict this woman will continue to test the limits of your emotional endurance, that just when you thought you have finally broken through, she will present a new, more strenuous challenge. Her circumstances are not her fault, true, but she is a victim. If you are not careful, you will be cast in a very undeserved role in her life. She will superimpose those who have hurt her on your person, and strike out at them by striking out at you. That is what I think has happened to you lately. (Let's just say it sounds really familiar.) You will never be able to understand, soothe, or reason with her chaotic and baseless rages.

My advice is to let her go. She cannot maintain a constructive relationship until she has taken personal responsibility for her demons. Yes, she needs someone like you, but she won't stop punishing you for something you didn't do. Most in her position need years of therapy.

My advice is to let her go. She cannot maintain a constructive relationship until she has taken personal responsibility for her demons. Yes, she needs someone like you, but she won't stop punishing you for something you didn't do. Most in her position need years of therapy.

This is what my friends, family would advise. And I understand their concern. They are looking at what they see is my best interest. Certainly, I am taking time to reflect. Its just my gut to see this through.

I agree that she needs years of therapy. But I have faith in her to deal with her own issues. She also is very self-aware and knows when her actions are dysfunctional.

In response to Dirtbubble, that is not true. Just because they were sexually/physically abused, doesn't mean that they should be automatically labeled as someone who needs 'long-term' therapy. Some of the survivors actually tried to fight their saddness all throughout those years. They dealt with their pain in the most effective way, by thinking positively. So, it's really unfair to brand them by saying that a lot of them do not think in a healthy manner. It really depends on each person.

Now, in terms of being there for her, sure, it's good. Nothing's wrong with that. If she feels the same about you, then she would treat you with respect, and eventually be able to let go, and be closer to you. However, if the lady just doesn't feel the same about a guy, then yeah, she will consistantly show him disinterest. So to him, she's battering him, when in fact, all she's communicating is: back off! If a woman of sexual abuse truly likes a guy back, then she will show the same interest, as long as she knows that the guy is sincere about her. She won't get as moody. So, do not label her as someone who's dysfunctional. She's just a victim, and it's not her fault for that. She doesn't need to be continually reminded of her pain! That's the last thing that she needs, when all she's ever known in her life is a world of sick people. She would hope that someone is brave enough to prove her wrong, by loving her the right way that she deserves to be loved.

So, do not label her as someone who's dysfunctional. She's just a victim, and it's not her fault for that. She doesn't need to be continually reminded of her pain! That's the last thing that she needs, when all she's ever known in her life is a world of sick people. She would hope that someone is brave enough to prove her wrong, by loving her the right way that she deserves to be loved.

Thanks for that. I never meant to place that label on her and I never hang anything over her head. I just try and be responsive to her and be there for her.

Her response was one of extreme anger, disproportionate to the situation at hand. That's why I have backed off to let things cool down. I am still there for her and she knows that. Just a week prior to this event, she was so happy about my impending visit and talked about how we would sleep in, order take-out and just stay in her appartment all weekend spending time alone together.

She was also under a great deal of stress, just recently having moved and starting a stressful job. On top of that, she has two children who live with her ex husband and her sense of obligations there have her divided. I chose the wrong time to bring something up that had nothing to do with her abused past.

I never treat her like a victim. I just think that for the event that led to this temporary situation, was blown way out of proportion. Given time, I can try talking to her again. I am taking my own space to deal with my own hurt.

Mahlina, I appreciate your input.

I'm a survivor of childhood abuse (from 9 until 13) and I can relate to what you and your gf are going through (I'm now 25). I have a master's degree in Criminal Justice, work for the Department of Criminal Justice in North Carolina, and specialize in Victim Assistance for Victims of Child Abuse and Domestic Violence. I was also adopted, except my adoptive parents were not my abusers.

1. As to her pushing you away after being intimate or feeling close-- After being abused for so long it's hard to open up and feel vulnerable around other people. The learned response is to either run away and hide, or become "combative" and fight against the perceived enemy. I spent many years dealing with this myself. After being abused for years, I was afraid even my parents and friends would take advantage of my vulnerability like my abusers always had. I had to RELEARN how to allow myself to feel vulnerable with them and fight against my 'fight or flight' reaction when I felt vulnerable.

The mere act of trusting someone may be hard for her- afterall, the person that abused her was her adopted father-- someone she knew in her immediate family circle and was supposed to and expected to trust.

Until she learns how to have a healthier relationship with others, this 'fight or flight' reaction will continue whenever she feels vulnerable around others because her normal idea of a 'relationship' is based on how her father abused her.

2. As to her rage, and feelings of low self worth-- I feel it's all tied to the feelings of a deep-setted sense of shame within her. Particularly, shame that developed from having been abused by her adoptive father. Shame is the feeling that something about you, inherently, is wrong-- that the core of who 'you' are as a person, is not loveable, not worth anything, ugly, and bad- and you were born that way. She may blame herself for being abused and being put up for adoption because she feels that the core of herself is so inherently ugly and unloveable and not worth anything she might think "Who would want to treat ME good or want to stay around and not abandon me? I don't think I"m worth it so why should they?'.

3. She learned that when her father got angry SHE felt the consequences by being verbally and physically abused and violated in the most intimate ways-- so it's not surprising that she may have an extreme emotional reaction when she sees you get angry with her. This is her learned reaction. She doesn't want to get physically or emotionally hurt again, especially by someone she cares about- like a boyfriend.

Shame-based anger and the scars from child abuse CAN be mediated, but it involves seeking help and the willingness of that person to look within and heal themselves as well. She needs to find the strength to look within-- and then she'd most likely find that she's NOT as ugly or unloveable or valueless as she thought.

What helps is to be in a relationship of unconditional love, enduring patience, behaviorable reliability and trustworthiness, open and loving communication, and utmost honesty. After awhile of experiencing these good qualities in a relationship she may LEARN what it means to be in a healthy relationship and how much you value her and how valuable she truly is. She may find the strength she needs to deal with her problems. This is how my adoptive parents dealt with my reactions to my abuse and how I've come so far in healing as I have.

Best of luck, hon. Hope this helped you to understand the dynamics behind her 'quirks'.

Here are some links that have some good information and further resource links:

Stop It Now, Campaign To Prevent Child Abuse

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The Wounded Healer: A Community to support those who had been abused or experienced trauma or abuse - oriented to psychotherapists that experienced abuse and trauma.... lots of good links.

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The National Child Assault Prevention Project

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Rnorth, that is true. Please take the time for yourself as well. You don't need to put up with being emotionally abused. There is so much that you can handle, and she has to realize it too. She shouldn't use her past as an excuse to mistreat you either. So, you're doing the right thing so far. Come clean to her, and tell her that you care, but she needs to be calm down, if she's throwing tantrums, yelling and screaming at you. That's not fair for you either. You're only human, and deserve to be loved too.

Give it a bit more time. Sounds like she's a little indecisive about her feelings for you. She has a lot of things going on in her life right now, so it's understandable that she's stressed out, but it's not understandable is she blows up on you like that. Everyone has their sorrows, but it doesn't mean that they should be able to take down their partners, and stomp on their heart, just because other people mistreated them.

On the side note: I don't agree with women who hurt others, just because they've been hurt all throughout their whole lives. Often times, I find that those who do do this, often resort to a life of drugs, or try to find different alternatives to coping with their pain. It's their escape route, but that doesn't mean that they should use someone who loves them as a scapegoat to lash out on their frustrations. So, know your limits. Stand your ground. Tell her in a mature manner that you're there for her, but she needs to settle down on her temper. If not, then it's best for her to take some time off for herself. She should be able to respect you too, if she feels the same for you.

She learned that when her father got angry SHE felt the consequences by being verbally and physically abused and violated in the most intimate ways-- so it's not surprising that she may have an extreme emotional reaction when she sees you get angry with her. This is her learned reaction. She doesn't want to get physically or emotionally hurt again, especially by someone she cares about- like a boyfriend.

sayer7, thanks so much. Your post was insightful and inspiring.

So can you suggest a way for me to break the ice with her? I almost feel a simple emailing letting her know I am thinking about her and hoping that she is well would be almost intrusive given her powerful language towards me. Yet, I feel that it is almost incumbent upon me to make first contact as she does tend to respond only after I have reached out during after such episodes.

I agree with Mahlina,

Perhaps it is best that you both take time away to heal especially for you... I don't believe that anyone, man or woman, should be entitled to hurting others just because they feel it's justifiable because all their life they were hurt by others. There's no reason to not give others respect.

Like I said, I feel a lot of her anger/rage/emotional outburts/tantrums are based on her sense of shame. Until she effectively deals with this feeling of shame I don't believe her anger/rage/emotional outbursts/tantrums will change. Please be aware of this and consider what is best for you.

Avoid going into a co-dependent relationship. Only she and a trained professional therapist can effectively deal with her childhood issues and mend the problems that are emerging in her current life stage. Trying to help someone you love and care about can become unhealthy and addictive even. Make sure you see the relationship for what it is and not chocolate coat it and convince yourself the relationship will get significantly better without any effort on her part to deal with her issues. She has to put effort into it learning about what a healthy relationship is all about... and if she keeps running away from you and the relationship- doing the fight-or-flight thing, that's not going to help the relationship in any way.

I think you sound like a great person and someone who deserves a great mutually loving/rewarding relationship. Remember that you and your emotional health matters also!

Mahlina and Sayer,

I do agree with you about not deserving to be a recipient of her rage.

It is not incessant. But the real issue is her fight and flight response. That gives me the most grief.

Given your experiences, does someone in her position feel regret for their actions? I know that she feels guilty. But her biggest response when I tell her that I am hurt is to push back even more. I think that is part of her guilt. She even mentioned feeling guilty while not completely due to her actions and reactions towards me.

But if I have the chance, I will continue to find ways to stand up for my own rights while still honoring her feelings. I do agree though, that if I show human faillibilities, I should be "given a break" every so often. I am not perfect.

I am giving her time. I will still contact her by the Holidays if I don't hear from her before hand. But I will keep it light while showing that I still care.

Does my approach sound correct?

I agree with Sayer. If she's emotional or shows frustration, it's mostly because she's scared and/or fears abandonment. But, there is a limit to this as well. If she is 'serious' about you, and see's potential in building a long-term relationship with you, then she should take action, and try to resolve her emotions as well.

Relationships are about a give and take, an equal balance of attraction. So, if she feels that mutual attraction for you, then she will make an effort to improve herself, without having to feel the need to bear too much of her emotions on you. A lot of the times, I think that it's important for survivors to learn to cope with things effectivley, by not being so co-dependent, because in the end, co-dependency is just a temporary way to pacify their emotions. It's unhealthy.

In order to establish a healthy relationship, they also must realize that they should stop playing the role of the victim, and stop making excuses for themselves. They should realize that life is full of potential. And, it can be just as beautiful, if they have someone to share it with. They still can start over and build a happy life for themselves. But in order to do this, they must somehow, let go of the past, and enjoy the future for what it is. That also means respecting their partners.

To answer your question: I think that she does feel guilty. That's why, if she does, then she should really make an effort to improve on herself as well. Your approach is good, but remember to communicate things with her. That's the most effective approach. When people don't communicate, it leaves room for assumptions, and can thereforeeee, destroy a potentially beautiful relationship from happening.

If you know you will always care about her, then email her and tell her that and that you will always care about her no matter what and leave communications open with her-- and then just wait.

My parents, after I had a angry tantrum like that under those circumstances, would always say "Nothing you could do could make us not love you. You are our daughter and that's what you'll always be to us. We will always love you." I even went to the lowest of lows and told my mom I didn't love her and even hated her (all the while I was bawling on her shoulder with her hugging me, lol)... my mom of course saw through all of it. In anycase, I finally got it through my head that their love for me was unconditional- that they would always love me- and that was that- whether I liked it or not. Period.

However, they did say "We are a family and we try our best to treat you with respect at all times... and even if we are angry, we must take some time to think about what we want to say and what is making us angry and address the issue in a respectful tone." Both of you deserve some time out to heal and think and recouperate and remind yourself that you deserve respect at all times.

My parents would leave me alone to think for about 30 minutes to an hour and when they came back we would discuss the issue, but if the discussion became a full out argument again we'd take another break to think and then try to discuss it again. Usually after that first break we'd be cooled down enough to talk the issue out, and of course I'd be apologizing for every mean thing I said to them.

So in your case, I would just send an email tell her you care about her and will always care about her and leave the communication open... but overall leave her alone to think for awhile. Don't discuss or rehash anything about the argument in the email... just tell her you care about her no matter what and that you're available to talk with when she feels ready.

Focus on your healing and regain your own strength in the meantime. Don't forget about your needs and keep your own mental health in mind as well. You deserve respect... they don't have a right to speak to you in a spitefully mean morally degrading or abusive way. To speak to you at all is a priviledge right?! 8) lol You get what I mean....you're deserve better treatment and assert yourself. Afterall, you teach others how to treat you.

Oh and yes, I think your approach is fine. Just don't rehash the argument.... if the holidays come around and you still don't hear from her I think it's fine to send a holiday card or email and keep it light and friendly to wish her a happy holiday season. That's what people who truly care about someone do-- and the Holiday Season is the best excuse to make contact with people you don't want to lose contact with.

the Holiday Season is the best excuse to make contact with people you don't want to lose contact with.

You can send her a little card through the mail, just to lighten up the mood. I always love receiving packages through the mail box. You can buy her a cute or funny card. Send her a little plush toy along with it. It's adorable, and will remind her that you're someone who's there for her, just in case if she needs a little tight squeeze or hug. When she looks at that teddy bear, she'll smile, and hopefully, remind herself to soften up a bit!

If what sayer7 and Malinga say makes more sense somehow, then go with it, although I don't see how their analysis differs that much. My suggestion is to take responsibility for your own well-being. She probably does need a personal Jesus--but is that really you? If you are always there for her, she will see no reason to change.

No. There is a difference. You can still be there for her. If you are always there for her, but stand your ground, then she would change. But, if you are there for her, and do not speak your mind, then she will just take advantage of the situation, and not change. It's all about showing both self-respect and love at the same time.

Walking away, and leaving her alone will do no good. It will only communicate: "I'm just another heartless jerk who hurt you in the past." And will make her feel even more depressed. She will run away from the relationship, and resort to thinking negatively about life in general. It's hard for people to understand the emotions that these survivors go through. They just make assumptions that leaving is just an easy/quick solution, when it isn't. Being there for her shows that you care. It will be a turn on for her, knowing that you are a brave man. That way, she will make the effort to invest in you as well.

I am not going to run away. And I will effectively stand my ground when I need to. She will find the path she needs to take to heal herself, I am certain. And I will not abandon her unless she just no longer has mutual feelings for me. But I don't think she needs a "Personal Jesus" just some self-awareness and the mobility to help herself.

Incidentally, she is supposed to return to this state for Thanksgiving to visit her grandmother and her aunts. My thought is simply to send her a quick note the week before Thanksgiving wishing her a Happy Holiday and let her know that I am thinking of her.

I know not to have the expectation of being able to see her during this holiday, but perhaps being out here and hearing from me will have a positive affect on her.

Its hard and I miss her, but I have to let things go for a couple more weeks at least until I can do so. I just don't feel secure in writing to her now after she said such hurtful things and risking having those fresh wounds opened. I've been pretty strong, but this is out of respect to both myself AND her. She needs her space right now and is really busy with work, kids, etc. so I will give her time and space.

but perhaps being out here and hearing from me will have a positive affect on her.

My point is be there for her, but when she's frustrated, tell her "Ay, settle down. Let's talk." It's important to let her talk about what's bothering her. Communication is key. Every relationship has its ups and downs. There are times in which it will be very rocky, but embracing the problems and not walking away is worth the effort. That's what love's all about. It's about showing effort, and being there for each other out through thick and thin. It's a compromise that both partners should realize. On her part, not taking you for granted. On your part, consistantly reinforcing the fact that you are doing the right thing.

If all else fails, then realize that maybe it's just an incompatability. Make sure that the relationship doesn't go off into something that's borderline abusive (i.e. too much fighting). Talk it out with her. If she's going to act irrational, then let her be. The relationship will be more self-destructive for you. This whole process should be a gentle approach. If she's gentle to you, then that's a good sign. But if she's a little harsh, then find a way to heal your heart, and apply the no contact rule. You deserve to be happy and in love with someone who cares about you the same. RNorth, you are doing the 'right' thing so far. Good lucK to your relationship. If it doesn't work out, then realize that you deserve better!

I took the advice of Sayler and Mahlina and contacted my friend.

A little background. There was a train accident in the city where she lives. So I sent the following email:

Hello...

 

I saw that there was a train crash in xxxx and it immediately made me

think of you. I checked it out and I guess it occurred on the Red line

which I don't think you take to work, but it still made me stop in my

tracks...

 

Anyway, I truly hope that you are well.

xxxxxxxx

And she replied:

Thanks ~ It's not my line, but it did affect everyone's commute on

Wednesday.

 

How about that election?!

I just replied back something about not getting me started, etc. But needless to say, this is very positive given our last interaction. She responded positively and even kept it open ended. So I will continue to give her space and let her come slowly to me. But the important thing is that she now knows that I am open to her and she is also demonstrating that she is happy to hear from me.

Any feedback is welcome!