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Thread: Feeling down about a setback

  1. #51
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    Originally Posted by dias
    I don't think you are in the wrong here. I also don't think they are in the (very) wrong too though. Probably they rethought your pay rate and figured out they could find someone cheaper. You will tell me yeah they knew the price before suggesting the interview so why did they waste your time? People change their minds, you can't blame them for this.

    Regarding copying your boyfriend's work, in an ideal world that might be unethical. In this world, hmm, I doubt your will find your right. I am thinking though, if you just needed to copy your boyfriend's work you could have made some easy bucks there...?

    PS to DancingFool. Outsourcing is not that cheap. Maybe 50% less, not 90%. At least in software engineering.

    Ok but on that note if its ok to change their mind? Its ok for me to focus my energy on other things besides a contrived thank you? Thank you for what?

    I cant stress this enough... It is VERY MUCH NOT OK to do this in my field. Its extremely unusual if not unheard of for a big company to even ask for this. If people found out it was me, I would be ashamed and embarrassed. And finally quick bucks are not quick, I have to actually do the work and communicate with them frequently for weeks or months. It would only even be worth the money if I could work in my own way as usual, because this is otherwise not even interesting, inspiring, or going to help me in the long run besides the 12,000 that will be made and spent, possibly even during the course of working for them. And then what?

  2. #52
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    I will add too that it's HIGHLY unusual to do a video call at all in my line of work. So therefore it does feel like a more exponential waste. I send deliverables. My face and personality are a non factor, assuming I'm a normal person. But having a reputation for them to find me in the first place, kind of already screens for that.

  3. #53
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    Originally Posted by blitzkrieged
    Ok but on that note if its ok to change their mind? Its ok for me to focus my energy on other things besides a contrived thank you? Thank you for what?

    I cant stress this enough... It is VERY MUCH NOT OK to do this in my field. Its extremely unusual if not unheard of for a big company to even ask for this. If people found out it was me, I would be ashamed and embarrassed. And finally quick bucks are not quick, I have to actually do the work and communicate with them frequently for weeks or months. It would only even be worth the money if I could work in my own way as usual, because this is otherwise not even interesting, inspiring, or going to help me in the long run besides the 12,000 that will be made and spent, possibly even during the course of working for them. And then what?
    Don't thank them. It's not necessary.

    Hmm I don't know your field. Generally employers have the upper hand. If you can turn the tables kudos to you. If not, just forget it?

  4. #54
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    Originally Posted by dias
    Don't thank them. It's not necessary.

    Hmm I don't know your field. Generally employers have the upper hand. If you can turn the tables kudos to you. If not, just forget it?
    Yes I know what you mean when it comes to an abundance of unskilled labor, or someone highly dependent on one job. But in the arena of skilled freelance professionals its different. Yes employers have options but so do we. Theres A LOT of companies out there constantly in need of these services. I could accept this and then another better offer could come at any point but I would be able to take it.

    However I feel my initial rate was very fair considering the workload and what they've paid in the past ( which I'm asking for less by the way, and they are not strapped for cash in any shape or form).

    I just wanted to see IF there was a way to turn the tables, or even just respond well without kissing their greedy unethical butts, or lowering my price. But it looks like silently walking away is the best answer.

    Part of me also wants them to just know they're out of line, without having to say it. They know damn well what they're asking is wrong (and Im sure they know I talked with bae about how much they paid him), so for someone feeling guilty, no response MEANS something. But for someone who doesn't see it that way, I'm sure they could equally assume I'm just busy and theres nothing much else to say. Thats why I don't think this would harm me or come off as rude in any way, unless they feel they did something wrong.

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  6. #55
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    May I ask you OP? You said you are medicated, what medical condition is that for? You don't have to say if you prefer not to. Also how old are you? Look I'm a regular here and I try to give unbiased advice. It is honestly unbiased due to the fact that I don't actually personally know anybody on these forums. You've given A LOT of detail here. Also no offence but you keep repeating yourself over and over. From what I'm reading in all your replies, my advice remains the same.

    It doesn't matter if you don't normally have actual "job interviews" in your work field. Many people work as independent contractors or have their own business. Just because they contacted you first doesn't mean anything. They are a client, you're the service. So they still need to have an interview (and so do you) to see if the other entity is suitable to them. You need to see if they're suitable to you too.

    You now think they are not suitable because they don't want to pay you the rates you required. To me it looks like a job interview/meeting where two parties discussed their expectations. The expectations didn't match, so one party decided not to take it further. That could have just as easily been you that decided you're not interested.

    Honestly it sounds like you call yourself an experienced professional, but you sound very bitter and not very mature. In work situations it's very important to be level headed and professional. There may be a lot not to our liking or we think something is unfair. I've had literally the same things happen to me many times. And yes even when they actually contacted me! That's happened because I have my resume visible to the public on a renowned job seeking site. So sometimes the employer contacted me themselves. Sometimes we even had a chat on the phone first. Then they asked me to travel to their office. I travelled an hour, had a long interview, then didn't get the job. But the employer was the one who contacted ME. It's immature to think everyone owes you something just because you're good at your work. A lot of people are good at their work, but companies are looking for the best fit for THEM.

    I don't think you have good self-esteem from what you're saying. Someone who has good self-esteem wouldn't be strongly jealous of other people and compare themselves to them. And feel so bitter and angry a job meeting didn't go well. Someone mature with high self-esteem would take it in their stride and not write twenty posts on a forum lashing out at people because they didn't get the responses they wanted to hear. You're getting a few replies that are saying the same thing. Do you think maybe that's for a good reason?

    Actually you're not 100% right in saying that employers hire staff only for their professional skills and not their personality. Personality is also important in the sense that pretty much all employers want someone friendly, polite, mature. If they have a lot of options to choose from then they want someone with the right skills but also right personality fit for that job. E.g. in telemarketing someone charming and persuasive is required to be able to sell products. In counselling a good listener is required with a caring personality. And so on. One thing employers do look for is professional manner and maturity. I understand you're upset about what happened and to feel disappointed is natural. But to get highly emotional, angry, defensive and make this personal is not actually how a professional and mature person acts. Employers don't want a drama queen.
    Last edited by Tinydance; 05-17-2020 at 08:10 PM.

  7. #56
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    Originally Posted by blitzkrieged
    I will add too that it's HIGHLY unusual to do a video call at all in my line of work. So therefore it does feel like a more exponential waste. I send deliverables. My face and personality are a non factor, assuming I'm a normal person. But having a reputation for them to find me in the first place, kind of already screens for that.
    It was only forty minutes out of your whole life. I think you'll live?

  8. #57
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    Originally Posted by Tinydance
    May I ask you OP? You said you are medicated, what medical condition is that for? You don't have to say if you prefer not to. Also how old are you? Look I'm a regular here and I try to give unbiased advice. It is honestly unbiased due to the fact that I don't actually personally know anybody on these forums. You've given A LOT of detail here. Also no offence but you keep repeating yourself over and over. From what I'm reading in all your replies, my advice remains the same.

    It doesn't matter if you don't normally have actual "job interviews" in your work field. Many people work as independent contractors or have their own business. Just because they contacted you first doesn't mean anything. They are a client, you're the service. So they still need to have an interview (and so do you) to see if the other entity is suitable to them. You need to see if they're suitable to you too.

    You now think they are not suitable because they don't want to pay you the rates you required. To me it looks like a job interview/meeting where two parties discussed their expectations. The expectations didn't match, so one party decided not to take it further. That could have just as easily been you that decided you're not interested.

    Honestly it sounds like you call yourself an experienced professional, but you sound very bitter and not very mature. In work situations it's very important to be level headed and professional. There may be a lot not to our liking or we think something is unfair. I've had literally the same things happen to me many times. And yes even when they actually contacted me! That's happened because I have my resume visible to the public on a renowned job seeking site. So sometimes the employer contacted me themselves. Sometimes we even had a chat on the phone first. Then they asked me to travel to their office. I travelled an hour, had a long interview, then didn't get the job. But the employer was the one who contacted ME. It's immature to think everyone owes you something just because you're good at your work. A lot of people are good at their work, but companies are looking for the best fit for THEM.

    I don't think you have good self-esteem from what you're saying. Someone who has good self-esteem wouldn't be strongly jealous of other people and compare themselves to them. And feel so bitter and angry a job meeting didn't go well. Someone mature with high self-esteem would take it in their stride and not write twenty posts on a forum lashing out at people because they didn't get the responses they wanted to hear. You're getting a few replies that are saying the same thing. Do you think maybe that's for a good reason?

    Actually you're not 100% right in saying that employers hire staff only for their professional skills and not their personality. Personality is also important in the sense that pretty much all employers want someone friendly, polite, mature. If they have a lot of options to choose from then they want someone with the right skills but also right personality fit for that job. E.g. in telemarketing someone charming and persuasive is required to be able to sell products. In counselling a good listener is required with a caring personality. And so on. One thing employers do look for is professional manner and maturity. I understand you're upset about what happened and to feel disappointed is natural. But to get highly emotional, angry, defensive and make this personal is not actually how a professional and mature person acts. Employers don't want a drama queen.


    You say I keep repeating myself but thats because people don't seem to be reading it well in the first place. Case and point: I never said I was on any medication.

    I would agree with you about being emotional and angry, however, I'm not being emotional and angry WITH THEM. My communication with them has been nothing short of professional, polite and straightforward. This isn't a personal relationship and Im not as emotionally involved as you may have percieved from my post. I was pretty mad when I first posted it, yeah but like everything else that passed. Now I am simply considering not responding to this last message because there is no benefit for me. And Im not "strongly" jealous of other people as you say, not sure where you got that idea from besides to casually put me down? But yes from time to time everyone compares themselves to people doing similar things. This is normal if you want to be at the top of your field, you have to be realistic about the standard and where you fall.

    And again, Im not ashamed of having feelings and emotions. Just because I have to make a living, does not mean my emotions shut off during working hours. Ive heard office people talk about their jobs and they are hands down the most dramatic about things like 'oh karen touched my lunch" lmao. So you guys act fake and let it stew until youre on the brink of a mental breakdown. I just think its healthier to acknowledge what you feel. Do I act on it in a crazy an unrestrained way? Of course not. I agree you don't express this to a client ever, but I didn't so whats your point? Its really seems like its just to shame me for my reaction.

    I came to vent on a forum called "e not alone" and people just love to tell you its wrong to have emotions. But thats not even the point of what Im asking.

    Saying I'm a "drama queen" is seriously so condescending and rude when Ive made it so darn clear, that video interviews is not what people do in my industry, it wasn't necessary at all to make the same decision they did, the rate was already known. I have plenty of wonderful repeat clients that actually respect and I still dont even know what some of them look like! So I know I'm not the problem in that regard. I still know I am a professional despite your armchair diagnosis. They upset me for perfectly legitimate reasons. End of story. Now if you have something better I can respond with than "thank you for your time" it would be much appreciated.
    Last edited by blitzkrieged; 05-17-2020 at 08:42 PM.

  9. #58
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    Originally Posted by blitzkrieged
    You say I keep repeating myself but thats because people don't seem to be reading it well in the first place. Case and point: I never said I was on any medication.

    I would agree with you about being emotional and angry, however, I'm not being emotional and angry WITH THEM. My communication with them has been nothing short of professional, polite and straightforward. This isn't a personal relationship and Im not as emotionally involved as you may have percieved from my post. I was pretty mad when I first posted it, yeah but like everything else that passed. Now I am simply considering not responding to this last message because there is no benefit for me. And Im not "strongly" jealous of other people as you say, not sure where you got that idea from besides to casually put me down? But yes from time to time everyone compares themselves to people doing similar things. This is normal if you want to be at the top of your field, you have to be realistic about the standard and where you fall.

    And again, Im not ashamed of having feelings and emotions. Just because I have to make a living, does not mean my emotions shut off during working hours. Ive heard office people talk about their jobs and they are hands down the most dramatic about things like 'oh karen touched my lunch" lmao. So you guys act fake and let it stew until youre on the brink of a mental breakdown. I just think its healthier to acknowledge what you feel. Do I act on it in a crazy an unrestrained way? Of course not. I agree you don't express this to a client ever, but I didn't so whats your point? Its really seems like its just to shame me for my reaction.

    I came to vent on a forum called "e not alone" and people just love to tell you its wrong to have emotions. But thats not even the point of what Im asking.

    Saying I'm a "drama queen" is seriously so condescending and rude when Ive made it so darn clear, that video interviews is not what people do in my industry, it wasn't necessary at all to make the same decision they did, the rate was already known. I have plenty of wonderful repeat clients that actually respect and I still dont even know what some of them look like! So I know I'm not the problem in that regard. I still know I am a professional despite your armchair diagnosis. They upset me for perfectly legitimate reasons. End of story. Now if you have something better I can respond with than "thank you for your time" it would be much appreciated.
    Wow OK. Sorry but you just have a rude manner which you began to speak with as soon as you started replying to commenters. I comment to so many people here and normally I don't sense this from most others I interact with on these forums. Yes of course you are allowed to have feelings, it's natural and we all have them. I just sense a very bitter vibe coming from you, in relation to how you speak about your work, this interaction with a client, and how you speak to posters here. Of course you don't know anybody here so you don't have to worry about what people think of you. I just hope you don't sound so jaded when you talk to people in real life. Basically you didn't like some people's responses so you're saying "just f off", not in so many words. Which is basically what you just said to me not in exactly those terms. What I mean by taking something in your stride and maturity is that you don't just get really self righteous, defensive, rude, when you don't get the result YOU want in life. E.g. the interaction with clients or what people are saying here. I'm not trying to hurt you deliberately, I have no reason whatsoever to do this. You wanted people to give you replies you were looking for and you didn't get them. So I'm just pointing out how you choose to speak, a strong tone that comes through. And that tone is rude and very confrontational. Almost like you have a "my way or the highway" attitude. Which I kind of sensed when you were speaking about the situation in your original post. You sound intimidating and maybe that's something to consider in professional life. People really pick up on vibes and personality IS also important.

  10. #59
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    Originally Posted by Tinydance
    Wow OK. Sorry but you just have a rude manner which you began to speak with as soon as you started replying to commenters. I comment to so many people here and normally I don't sense this from most others I interact with on these forums. Yes of course you are allowed to have feelings, it's natural and we all have them. I just sense a very bitter vibe coming from you, in relation to how you speak about your work, this interaction with a client, and how you speak to posters here. Of course you don't know anybody here so you don't have to worry about what people think of you. I just hope you don't sound so jaded when you talk to people in real life. Basically you didn't like some people's responses so you're saying "just f off", not in so many words. Which is basically what you just said to me not in exactly those terms. What I mean by taking something in your stride and maturity is that you don't just get really self righteous, defensive, rude, when you don't get the result YOU want in life. E.g. the interaction with clients or what people are saying here. I'm not trying to hurt you deliberately, I have no reason whatsoever to do this. You wanted people to give you replies you were looking for and you didn't get them. So I'm just pointing out how you choose to speak, a strong tone that comes through. And that tone is rude and very confrontational. Almost like you have a "my way or the highway" attitude. Which I kind of sensed when you were speaking about the situation in your original post. You sound intimidating and maybe that's something to consider in professional life. People really pick up on vibes and personality IS also important.
    I would say that's because so many people on here are lost and confused in a very vulnerable state. A lot of questions like, "he hasn't called me in 3 days, he talks to other girls online, and he called me stupid, is it over? should I move on?" uhh yeah people like that will usually accept any crumbs and let people tell them who they are and whats best for them.

    I actually do have some self esteem, and Im not desperate for this job, yet people are shtting on me because apparently I should be content with crumbs and big time wasters. Yes people are allowed to change their minds. But the respectful thing would have been to discuss their budget amongst themselves before involving me. Once again, my personality is fine. I have repeat clients, I have friends in my field that I met through work. I am a passionate person but I am very fair and I felt a vibe from them too: it was uncomfortable, awkward, and definitely hiding something. I even caught them in a lie about why they haven't been working with my boyfriend anymore...
    They blamed it on his agency being soo difficult to go though. Is the agency unprofessional too? Like its actually literally them thats the problem.

  11. #60
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    So now Im bitter lol. Its not my way or the highway but we do show others how to treat us, don't we? I've already compromised and been flexible with them by agreeing to any calls in the first place, and that was ONLY because the price was right. Had they not agreed to the price, they would not have gotten my time, because I would already know its not a good fit. And yet this is made out to be a problem with MY personality and professionalism that they werent being fortright? And then this attitude of 'oh well life sucks, corporations have all the power and you're just a pawn, deal with it you crappy attituded' diva, hehe". Well not me.

    Like, would you set up a private fitting at louis vuitton, schedule it and everything when you know you probably cant afford anything and most likely wont even buy? Who does that?

    These people are not the last bottle of coke in the desert and as such, I think an f u is warranted in this case, not least of the reasons being the time wasting.
    Last edited by blitzkrieged; 05-17-2020 at 09:50 PM.

  12. 05-18-2020, 06:01 AM
    Reason
    Flaming/Disrespectful.

  13. 05-18-2020, 06:10 AM
    Reason
    Flaming/Disrespectful.

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