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Thread: Seeking breakup advice - Very confusing situation

  1. #11
    Platinum Member Wiseman2's Avatar
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    Sorry to hear this. "Make it work", "fight for" "took for granted". These are not the words of love. This type of manipulation is about your ego. Stay apart and get some help from a counselor. Focus on integrity and reducing hypocrisy. Reflect on being a better man and not putting someone through the wringer like this to make yourself feel better.
    Originally Posted by Will87
    I took her for granted and I wasn't committed to Christian morality at that time.
    we decided to stay together and try and make the relationship work.
    I prompted the fight that led to the break-up.
    I wanted her to fight for me.

  2. #12

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    Originally Posted by bluecastle
    Can I ask how old you guys are?

    I'm sorry for this moment of turmoil, I am, but it seems that you are pretty aware of the big truth here: you plus her do not equal something good, something sincere, something sustainable. You started off on a sour note, tried to make it a sweet one, but genuine sweetness proved elusive for a good long while. There was a whiff of it when you were in atonement mode, but then it kind of flip-flopped and she was the one pulling away. Poke, prod, push, pull: interesting, for sure, but also exhausting.

    You sound like a good dude, and I bet she's a good dudette. Yeah, people make mistakes, so I'm not going to read either of you the riot act. Have made some myself. Live and learn. Still, when your go-to mode of communication is wanton manipulation? It's telling. It's generally a very good sign that you are in a chemistry experiment that is bringing out the worst in you, accentuating immaturity and lack of growth, rather than the opposite. It means that the thing everyone craves and needs—authenticity—isn't in the wheelhouse. And without that? It's just wheels spinning, gears grinding.

    I know all the post breakup activity feels vital and important and unique and perplexing right now, but being frank? It's just two people flailing, the exhaust fumes of a thing ending and a void opening. It's always sour, this moment. The more dramatics involved? The blocking, the tears, the forehead kisses, all that? Well, I think that's generally a reflection of the core of the connection, what two people ultimately bring out in another. With the "label" ripped off, the truth is kind of revealed and what you're seeing right now—and reeling from, understandably—is that the core is a bit rotten. It was a few months ago, if not longer. It's just exposed.

    You struck a humble note, or grazed it, in your earlier post, seeing this as a good moment—hoping she finds happiness and, I hope, hoping you do the same. Good line to keep walking, right there. Your recent post has some ego snarling in it, which is understandable, because your ego is pretty swollen right now. But I say just see that, acknowledge it, but don't indulge it. You've done that enough and it's not cute. Walk away from that line, knowing you'll thank yourself later.

    So let her go, for real, and have faith that the lessons in that will reward you, sharpen your compass, trigger some self-work, and eventually lead you to something that doesn't trigger these cycles of manipulation and atonement subbing in for sincerity. That's the win here. Trying to unpack all this noise and find salvation in that? That's the loss.
    Thanks for this. You're right, I would love to reach a point of humble acceptance. To appreciate the relationship for what it was, flaws and all.

    She brought out the worst in me, but she brought out the best in me too. There were genuinely beautiful moments between us. That's why it hurts now. If it was a totally crap relationship, then surely I wouldn't be hurting.

    I'm just frustrated that I'm hurt and I don't want to be stuck in this "anger" stage of grief for too long. The first week after the breakup, I couldn't access the anger emotion. I only felt paralysing fear and helplessness - "Oh my God, is she actually gone?" Just cycling through the disbelief. I fully expected her to come back. It thought it was all a big joke. I think they call this "Denial."

    Now that it has been 2 weeks, it feels more real now. These thoughts keeping hitting me- She's actually made a decision, She's not playing games, She's actually trying to move on, She's probably with another guy now, How is she maintaining this with the COVID lockdown? These realisations keeps hitting and anger wells up inside me. I don't like feeling so angry, but it's better than feeling like I've just had my balls cut off and I'm a quivering mess on the couch. Anger is more self-empowering than fear.

    I'm 32, she's 26.

  3. #13

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    Originally Posted by Wiseman2
    Sorry to hear this. "Make it work", "fight for" "took for granted". These are not the words of love. This type of manipulation is about your ego. Stay apart and get some help from a counselor. Focus on integrity and reducing hypocrisy. Reflect on being a better man and not putting someone through the wringer like this to make yourself feel better.
    Respectfully, I don't think you understand relationship dynamics and attraction.

    I wanted to get more serious with this girl. I wanted us to get a place together and think about planning a family. She was stalling me on this and she needed more time because she sees herself as a character from Sex and the City (free, independent, cosmopolitan woman). If I continued to push this matter then I would have just pushed her away further. She had the power because I wanted something that she wasn't giving me. And she loved it.

    I was forced into a position where I had to pretend I was okay with waiting for her will she wasted time doing yoga and going to dinners with her friends, without making any plans for our future. That's obviously a miserable existence for me. So what I decided to do was orchestrate a fake break-up and see if she really wanted this or not. She could have easily stopped it from happening, but she immediately latched onto the opportunity to leave me.

    What is happening now is she is experiencing life without me. She is in a relief period. At some point she will get curious and start to miss me. I believe that our relationship had enough good things in it that she will experience "dumpers regret" at some point.

    Unfortunately for her, by the time she starts to miss me, maybe months from now, I would have already moved on. That will be her tragedy, but that will just be too bad for her.

  4. #14
    Platinum Member Wiseman2's Avatar
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    She did the right thing. It seems like she would rather be happy in her own way than deal with your pressure. Relationships based on cheating, controlling, manipulating, hurting, etc often crash and burn like this. Sorry.
    Originally Posted by Will87
    I decided to do was orchestrate a fake break-up and see if she really wanted this or not. she immediately latched onto the opportunity to leave me.

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  6. #15

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    Originally Posted by Wiseman2
    She did the right thing. It seems like she would rather be happy in her own way than deal with your pressure. Relationships based on cheating, controlling, manipulating, hurting, etc often crash and burn like this. Sorry.
    I respect your view and I agree. However, we had a solid 12 months of good times before this break-up. The only issue we had was my desire to get serious faster than she was ready to (if she was ever going to be ready at all). The toxic stuff was in the early stages. Redemption is always possible and, when she looks back on the relationship after the emotional fog has cleared, she will feel the loss. Sorry to say, but cheating isn't always a deal-breaker. It should be, but it isn't in my experience, especially if you demonstrate a willingness to change.

  7. #16
    Platinum Member Wiseman2's Avatar
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    Her friends and family may have advised her that your treatment of her is abusive. She may have read up on it or gotten counselling. Blocking and deleting is the best recourse.
    Originally Posted by Will87
    How can someone just disappear like this, and aggressively block me everywhere?

  8. #17
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    Originally Posted by Will87
    What is happening now is she is experiencing life without me. She is in a relief period. At some point she will get curious and start to miss me. I believe that our relationship had enough good things in it that she will experience "dumpers regret" at some point.
    Gently and with respect - not necessarily, Will. Not in the way you hope, anyway.

    It sounds like she had been losing interest in the relationship for a while. Maybe she has someone else in mind, maybe this simply ran its course for her. Breaking up is sometimes the best option when one party has reached that point. She will probably miss you as a person, and your companionship, but it appears she's been emotionally checked out for some time. I think that for her, the romantic part was already over. This is why she kept stalling when you wanted to move things forward to a greater commitment. She doesn't want those things with you, unfortunately, but didn't know how to come out and say it.

    I know you're angry and hurt that she didn't take the bait when you staged this break-up. But, that should tell you what you need to know. She didn't have the stones to pull the plug herself yet, but the end was coming at some point. Your behaviour post-break-up wasn't stellar, but that isn't the real issue. The real issue is that you have two people whose future goals no longer matched, in that you saw a future with her, but the opposite was no longer true.

    I have a feeling when the fog has cleared for you, you will see that this break-up was the best for you, too. She wasn't on the same page as you anymore and staying together would have been a waste of time for you also.

  9. #18
    Platinum Member bluecastle's Avatar
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    A few thoughts.

    Big picture? What you're feeling—and what she's feeling—is all par for the course. You've been broken up for basically five seconds, so think of this stage like a city at wartime five seconds after some bombs have dropped. It's ugly, chaotic, everyone's running around trying to make sense of things. If you can kind of just accept that, rather than analyze every morsel, you'll be on the path to humility, growing from this as you let it go: appreciating what you had, appreciating the lessons to get you somewhere new.

    Smaller picture stuff? Your tone, in talking about her, is not particularly respectful. Reducing her to a Sex and the City aspirant, for instance, who "wastes" time in yoga rather than in using that time charting a future with you. Um, not cool. Whoever she is in the world, whatever her interests and ambitions, she should be around people who think all that is awesome, compelling, and wants to support it and be part of it. That, more than anything, is how the present stretches into the future with relationships. When someone has to reject someone to find themselves—as it seems she was beginning to do—it's not really a sign that there's much of a shared future on the horizon. Things to think about, or not, as you see fit.

    I've got a pretty forgiving view of cheating—it's a bad thing that a lot of pretty good humans have done, more or less—but at the same time? It destroys most relationships, with reason. Look back at yours, with clear eyes, and you may see a case study in that: how that choice of yours, along with her choice to try to get past it, recalibrated the whole machine in a toxic way that prevented authenticity, sincerity, a connection built on trust rather than one built on winning trust back, working through things, mini cycles of atonement and salvation and judgement. Imagine building a house where the floorboards are cracked and made of cheap wood. You can dress it up with great furniture and fixtures, but the foundation is weak and, eventually, it will crack, no matter how nice the kitchen counter is.

    Your story, after all, is not that of two people who built a solid foundation, for years and years, and then had to see about rebuilding it after you made an awful, selfish choice. No, it's the story of a foundation built from an awful choice, and I do wonder, per the above, if deep in your core you could never quite respect her for forgiving you, and taking you back. Maybe she sensed that, maybe not, on some cellular level. But there's a reason she wasn't "all in," a reason she started looking for meaning and power outside of the relationship.

    Your ego is fired up right now. This business of how she has a "tragedy" coming her way when she realizes she misses you, but you're already gone? Dude, c'mon. Get big by getting a little small. That's just more of the manipulation stuff, but the shadow puppet version: you alone in the a room creating stories where you're still king and your errant queen has yet to remember that. A mode of thinking that is best seen, and discarded, not indulged.

  10. #19

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    Originally Posted by bluecastle
    A few thoughts.

    Big picture? What you're feeling—and what she's feeling—is all par for the course. You've been broken up for basically five seconds, so think of this stage like a city at wartime five seconds after some bombs have dropped. It's ugly, chaotic, everyone's running around trying to make sense of things. If you can kind of just accept that, rather than analyze every morsel, you'll be on the path to humility, growing from this as you let it go: appreciating what you had, appreciating the lessons to get you somewhere new.

    Smaller picture stuff? Your tone, in talking about her, is not particularly respectful. Reducing her to a Sex and the City aspirant, for instance, who "wastes" time in yoga rather than in using that time charting a future with you. Um, not cool. Whoever she is in the world, whatever her interests and ambitions, she should be around people who think all that is awesome, compelling, and wants to support it and be part of it. That, more than anything, is how the present stretches into the future with relationships. When someone has to reject someone to find themselves—as it seems she was beginning to do—it's not really a sign that there's much of a shared future on the horizon. Things to think about, or not, as you see fit.

    I've got a pretty forgiving view of cheating—it's a bad thing that a lot of pretty good humans have done, more or less—but at the same time? It destroys most relationships, with reason. Look back at yours, with clear eyes, and you may see a case study in that: how that choice of yours, along with her choice to try to get past it, recalibrated the whole machine in a toxic way that prevented authenticity, sincerity, a connection built on trust rather than one built on winning trust back, working through things, mini cycles of atonement and salvation and judgement. Imagine building a house where the floorboards are cracked and made of cheap wood. You can dress it up with great furniture and fixtures, but the foundation is weak and, eventually, it will crack, no matter how nice the kitchen counter is.

    Your story, after all, is not that of two people who built a solid foundation, for years and years, and then had to see about rebuilding it after you made an awful, selfish choice. No, it's the story of a foundation built from an awful choice, and I do wonder, per the above, if deep in your core you could never quite respect her for forgiving you, and taking you back. Maybe she sensed that, maybe not, on some cellular level. But there's a reason she wasn't "all in," a reason she started looking for meaning and power outside of the relationship.

    Your ego is fired up right now. This business of how she has a "tragedy" coming her way when she realizes she misses you, but you're already gone? Dude, c'mon. Get big by getting a little small. That's just more of the manipulation stuff, but the shadow puppet version: you alone in the a room creating stories where you're still king and your errant queen has yet to remember that. A mode of thinking that is best seen, and discarded, not indulged.
    Excellent post and I can't help but agree with all of it. I have no choice now but to walk into my future without her. When my own fog of ego hurt clears, as you say, then the hopelessness of the situation will become apparent to me.

    When I look back now, the relationship was a slow-motion Goodbye for 12 months. She had trouble letting go, and she told me this constantly. One day she found the strength to leave (with a little push from me), and I suppose I had internalised an idea that she "wanted to leave me, but she couldn't."

    It turns out she was able to find the strength in the end. It's best for both of us.

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