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Not sure what to do


Whirling D

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Hi everybody…

 

I had a thread on here about six weeks ago, and appreciated the good bad and the ugly that folks on here had to offer… so, I could use some support again.

 

I have known my lady friend for about a year, and have been dating formally for about six months. As expected, it’s been a bit up-and-down.

 

She came from abusive relationships, I have been single for the past four years, and we are both in our mid 50s… No spring chickens.

 

It’s been well known that things have been difficult for her over the last while, coming from an abusive relationship, and there have been times where she has backed away and questioned whether or not she was capable of being in a relationship right now, given where she is in her “healing”. I see symptoms of this problem when she overreacts to things or gets very anxious under certain circumstances. I have my own issues, as well, so that is part of it, too.

 

So, we got through our first major difficulty about six weeks ago, when she all but ghosted me for about a week. That seemed to pass, but now it seems to be happening again. We have had a couple of major political “arguments” which somewhat made it clear that we were never going to agree on political issues… But we seem to get through it.

 

Early last week we had another one, and we had a strange interaction by texting this past Sunday which seemed a bit odd. Since then, That seemed to pass, but now it seems to be happening again. We have had a couple of major political “argument“ which somewhat made it clear that we were never going to agree on political issues… But we seem to get through it. Since then, she still reaches out time to time to text, but it’s getting further and further in between, and we didn’t actually talk on the phone yesterday, which was the first time since I can remember that we haven’t spoken on the phone. Her demeanor has been very passive, and her texts and phone calls are free of any emoticons that would indicate that she’s doing OK. Up until late last week, we always ended our phone calls with “love you“, but that hasn’t happened since. I even asked her the other day on the phone if there was anything she wanted to talk about, or anything that was on her mind, and she calmly said no. That being said, she says that she has been really busy over the last while, with reasonable things that she has described, but she was evasive the other day when I asked her when I would see her next. She just doesn’t seem to have any interest or energy to engage, and won’t say why.

 

You have to understand, her and I would never not text early in the morning and late in the afternoon, and it was always understood that I would leave it to her to reach out first, given that her schedule is much busier than mine and that Just seemed like the protocol that worked. Lately, she just doesn’t seem to have any interest or energy to engage, and won’t say why.

 

So what am I asking from all of this? Well, my head just spins around and round trying to understand why this girl would be waffling the way that she is. I could be imagining it, but I don’t think I am. I think she’s struggling with something, and it’s related to me more than likely, and she just hasn’t been interested in talking about it, and barely interested in talking to me.

 

For our last interaction that seemed to be testy, we were having a basic conversation about something related to my childcare needs, and she told me she disagreed with my theory on it. So, in order not to make it a debate, I simply forwarded her some professional articles that underscored what I was trying to say. She got very defensive and said a few things that seemed angry that I would dare to challenge her opinion on a subject. I didn’t think that’s what I was trying to do, but clearly it didn’t fit well for her.

 

However, I sensed her distancing herself even prior to that text exchange, so I am a bit bewildered as to where her head is that and why. We seem to have a really nice time the last time we got together, and planNed to get together, which she bailed out on during that day because she said she was too tired. Same for the next day.

 

OK, this is way too long long winded. I know there’s way more folks on here that have more challenging issues than this.

 

What would you do? This whole scenario is starting to make me think that this girl is just not ready for a committed relationship, although the month leading up to this was just fantastic, minus a heated debate here or there. She always seem to insist that those debates were never an issue, though.

 

So, I don’t get it. Truthfully, although I love this girl, I’m not sure I really want this kind of drama.

 

Thoughts?

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If you take a step back, what's happening isn't really a mystery now is it?

 

From the get go, she has told you that she is not healed and not really sure she is in a place to get involved. In short, that should have been your clue to exit. What you are dealing with now are basically consequences of not exiting.

 

Yes, she is up and down. No she will not handle conflict well. You are also learning some things about each other that appear to be more red flags or more like the tip of the iceberg of serious incompatibilities - politics, child rearing, etc. These are not small things. Sure, some people can easily agree to disagree, but it doesn't seem that yours is such a case.

 

If you don't want drama, then let her go on her way. Love from afar. Quite frankly, it doesn't sound like it's even an option as she seems to be actively checking out. Also, in the future, when you date again, be sure that you don't get so fixated on "I like her I want this to work" that you completely ignore major red flags slapping you in the face. Choose more wisely who you invest in.

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Nothing has changed since December. I'm not sure why you thought it would.

 

What you see is what you get. If you're willing to stay on the merry go round, don't expect things to be any different than they've been all along.

 

This "girl" (are you a "boy"? :tongue:) is who she is, just as you are who you are. You're the type who MUST counter being disagreed with (sending articles to prove you're "right"??) and she apparently is too.

 

You can be happy or you can be right. You're choosing to be right and then wondering why there's conflict. And if you enjoy debating with the person you're supposed to be in a romantic relationship with, you can't be surprised when there's conflict.

 

Decide what you want; a debate partner or a romantic partner.

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Sorry about all this.

 

Recalling your last thread pretty vividly, this really just sounds like oil and water. Trouble is, best I can tell, you really, really want to turn oil into water. So rather than continue to view it through the lens of her being dramatic or not ready for a committed relationship, I would challenge yourself to view it more generously: that the two of you may not match well for the long haul, that you may not be ready to be in a committed relationship with her.

 

You do not seem to take disagreement very well, so it does perplex me why you'd invest in someone who clearly operates from a very different belief system, one you seem immune to respecting. That kind of dynamic is only "dramatic" if you can't accept that what you believe, and what another believes, hold equal value and weight. I suspect she was upset about the avalanche of links you sent, for instance, because it carried a whiff of "mansplaining," of you needing the final word, of you needing to be right and for your rightness to be validated by her.

 

That can get exhausting, quick. Also exhausting? The sense that someone will go into a panic if you don't text message them constantly. To want to win every debate and want constant attention and soothing from a 50something "girl"—well, that is a lot to ask, a very particular needle to thread. Possible? Perhaps. With her? Doubtful, as time as showed.

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Thank you, you guys are not the first people who have Asked whether I want to debate partner or a romantic partner. It’s not always that simple. I think everyone has differences that often seem fairly significant, but the difference this time around, at least for me, is that I’m trying to put those things away and not let them get in the way of an otherwise good relationship. I’ve been trying really hard to not let molehills become mountains, and I think I have done OK with that. My brain goes up and down, as well, but I’m trying to focus on the positive things that she brings to the table, and there are many.

 

As for our arguments… She was trying to coach me on issues relating to my daughter. I appreciated what she had to say, but then SHE openly disagreed with ME about one of the ways to handle it. So, I tried to deflect an argument by just sending her some of the professional literature regarding the topic, which has been well researched over the last 30 years, and then I tried to let it go. That’s when she started to get nasty, simply because she said that she thought her meager opinions must not matter, compared to the “authorities”. Quite frankly, what she was saying didn’t seem to make a lot of sense. She was upset that I was relying on the opinion of professionals that have spent a good chunk of their careers studying this kind of stuff. Not sure this makes a lot of difference, at this point. It is what it is. She’s barely talking to me, but as you say, I now know who she is and what the red flags are bringing.

 

So I guess I have a couple of options. I can tell her that I care about her but we need to talk to see what’s going on, or I just let it fade away and let it be. Maybe it will come back, maybe it won’t. Given that this has happened a couple of times before, once a lesser than this and one more challenging, I suspect she will probably suddenly reappear, like she did last time, as if nothing at all happened and as if things were returning to normal. That’s a roller coaster ride that I’m just not sure I’m ready to continue spinning on.

 

Sadly, the thing I struggle with, is that we have so many other things in common and there are so many good things between us. I’m just struggling with the merry-go-round. That… And that she just isn’t ready or willing to articulate what she struggling with. Maybe it’s nothing, and maybe she’s fine, and she’s just up to her eyeballs with stress. If that’s the case, and there’s a good chance that it is, that’s a whole other issue. That, once again, leaves me riding on the merry-go-round with no end in sight

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Sorry about all this.

 

Recalling your last thread pretty vividly, this really just sounds like oil and water. Trouble is, best I can tell, you really, really want to turn oil into water. So rather than continue to view it through the lens of her being dramatic or not ready for a committed relationship, I would challenge yourself to view it more generously: that the two of you may not match well for the long haul, that you may not be ready to be in a committed relationship with her.

 

You do not seem to take disagreement very well, so it does perplex me why you'd invest in someone who clearly operates from a very different belief system, one you seem immune to respecting. That kind of dynamic is only "dramatic" if you can't accept that what you believe, and what another believes, hold equal value and weight. I suspect she was upset about the avalanche of links you sent, for instance, because it carried a whiff of "mansplaining," of you needing the final word, of you needing to be right and for your rightness to be validated by her.

 

That can get exhausting, quick. Also exhausting? The sense that someone will go into a panic if you don't text message them constantly. To want to win every debate and want constant attention and soothing from a 50something "girl"—well, that is a lot to ask, a very particular needle to thread. Possible? Perhaps. With her? Doubtful, as time as showed.

 

You make some good points.

 

However, we have a lot of other valuable things in common that are worthy considerations.

 

As far as arguments, I tend to try to look at things from multiple perspectives as much as I possibly can. I tried not to get into a back-and-forth debate about child rearing with her, because I sensed she was going to not agree. I just told her my perspective on it, based on professional literature, and it was her that got defensive back to me and started going on and on that she didn’t care what the authorities said. I let it go pretty much right after that for the exact reasons that you are describing. I feel I am pretty good at negotiating disagreements and arguments, and I felt like I bailed out of this one fairly quickly.

 

As a oil and water. Sometimes. Maybe. We talked about that or something like that a while ago, and she told me that she thought I was really good for her. I think, at least previously, I made her feel a sense of peace and groundedness, because I don’t think she had felt that, and does feel that, in much of her other environment. As for whether it will work in the long run.... there is a lot of good in this girl, and there’s a lot of good in me, and I am waiting right here to share those things that I know she feels… I guess it’s really up to her.

 

I suppose my biggest question is what do I do?

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Sending her professional materials is not "deflecting" the argument. It's an attempt to shut it down by proving you're right and she's wrong.

 

That simply is not conducive to a harmonious relationship.

 

Deflecting the argument would be saying something like "It's cool if we disagree. We don't have to agree on everything. So, would you want to get together for dinner tomorrow night? I'm craving hot wings!"

 

I can see you like a good debate because you even engage in it here. I remember your last thread and how you countered every single responder.

 

Again, that's fine but don't expect harmony. Some people love a "spicy" relationship. If that's your jam, terrific, but it's not everyone's cup of tea.

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When people say they aren't ready for a relationship, we really have to believe them.... bc this is what happens.

 

You are showing, love, support, benefits of the doubts and so on... but in the end they are a MESS! And will not see it, appreciate or reciprocate....

 

I would stop being so caring and understanding... don't lay out all you've done and all you'd still be willing to do for the bare min she is giving you.

 

Down to brass tacks- you see, now, she was right, unable to be the partner you need and you're sorry to say, but you need to move on.

 

the eggshell approach does not help the broken. It only confirms they are broken. if you walk, she'll either step up and try to fix this. Or you have your pride and self confidence somewhat in tack and can focus on meeting someone that will work WITH YOU.

 

In your fifties, you gotta be more practical. Do not waste time on projects.... This is who she is....

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You can have 100 things in common and only 3 things you are incompatible on and that's enough to break the relationship. Can you wrap your mind around that?

 

You don't agree on politics, which is the tip of the iceberg of incompatible values at large. You don't agree on child rearing. Your biggest incompatibility of all though is the way you both communicate and ironically, you are too alike in that respect. You are both stubborn, thin skinned, you need validation from your partner to feel secure, and you need to win. Both of you. This will always cause immense conflict no matter the topic.

 

In the situation about the kids, a more confident and easy going personality would have simply stepped back with "your children, your business". Basically, this is what I'd do, but ultimately you need to do what you see fit. You'd have never reached the level where you send articles to prove your point and even if you did, a more secure, easy going person would still look at it as "do as you see fit with your children." instead of getting defensive and insulted and feeling demeaned as if their opinion doesn't matter. Unfortunately, this argument at its heart became about who is right, who wins, who gets validated in their approach and neither one of you has the capacity to step back from....being yourselves. This is your go to approach in life like it or not.

 

The dynamic between you is that every time there is disagreement it will result in gasoline on a fire situation. That's a serious, major incompatibility and at some point it does get old regardless of other good times you may have....when you aren't in a toxic cycle of arguments and hurt feelings.

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Sending her professional materials is not "deflecting" the argument. It's an attempt to shut it down by proving you're right and she's wrong.

 

That simply is not conducive to a harmonious relationship.

 

Deflecting the argument would be saying something like "It's cool if we disagree. We don't have to agree on everything. So, would you want to get together for dinner tomorrow night? I'm craving hot wings!"

 

I can see you like a good debate because you even engage in it here. I remember your last thread and how you countered every single responder.

 

Again, that's fine but don't expect harmony. Some people love a "spicy" relationship. If that's your jam, terrific, but it's not everyone's cup of tea.

 

You know, it’s interesting… I have a good friend that lives far away, and we talk about this kind of stuff all the time. My brain doesn’t feel that it is a debate or an argument, it feels like it is sharing information. My friend and I had almost this exact discussion last week, by text, and it is no defensiveness or argument that came from the discussion. He had the exact same perspective as my lady friend does.You know, it’s interesting… I have a good friend that lives far away, and we talk about this kind of stuff all the time. My brain doesn’t feel that it is a debate or an argument, it feels like it is sharing information. My friend and I had almost this exact discussion last week, by text, with no defensiveness or argument that coming out of from the discussion. He had the exact same perspective as my lady friend does, and I even said to him the same things I said to her, which is that the professional literature all agrees on a particular ideology. He wasn’t defensive. It didn’t turn into a big argument. And I still don’t get it. I like to share information, and I like to hear if someone has something that I don’t know, because it might be relative to what my belief system is.

 

Clearly, the way that I am doesn’t work as well for her in this capacity. I work hard at understanding how things work, it was part of my profession quite a while. I feel like I should be able to provide evidence within a discussion that isn’t taken as being a personal attack, which it is almost never intended to be. It’s conversational. I don’t take it that way when people show me new things that I hadn’t thought of before. My mother says it’s a boy/girl thing. I scratch my head.

 

As far as me needing to have validation by text and phone calls on a regular basis, well as I mentioned… I pretty much have exclusively let her get back to me. Always. With that being said, I wonder if I should reverse that role a bit and reach out to her a bit more.

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When people say they aren't ready for a relationship, we really have to believe them.... bc this is what happens.

 

You are showing, love, support, benefits of the doubts and so on... but in the end they are a MESS! And will not see it, appreciate or reciprocate....

 

I would stop being so caring and understanding... don't lay out all you've done and all you'd still be willing to do for the bare min she is giving you.

 

Down to brass tacks- you see, now, she was right, unable to be the partner you need and you're sorry to say, but you need to move on.

 

the eggshell approach does not help the broken. It only confirms they are broken. if you walk, she'll either step up and try to fix this. Or you have your pride and self confidence somewhat in tack and can focus on meeting someone that will work WITH YOU.

 

In your fifties, you gotta be more practical. Do not waste time on projects.... This is who she is....

 

I hear you. I think what you were saying is pretty much spot on.

 

The thing I’d like to clarify is… She has only said that she didn’t think she was ready for a relationship a couple of times in the six months that we have been dating formally. Each time, I pretty much backed away and gave her the time to figure things out, and she came back. Don’t know if the same thing is going to happen this time around, but we didn’t even really talk it out last time as to what happened and where her head was. I suppose that’s pretty clear.

 

There was no doubt in my mind that she believes that this is a good thing, although that may be changing from our disagreements from last week, who knows, And she hasn’t imploded this time around by stating that she doesn’t think she’s ready, nor has she said that she doesn’t think this is going to work. She is still reaching out, although I haven’t heard from her today, which is very unusual. We texted several times last night, although it seemed rather detached. She did conclude by saying “talk to you tomorrow”.

 

I suppose these are the egg shells that you are describing.

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It's a basic incompatibility.

 

Can you stop yourself from sending her professional literature if she disagrees with you on something? Or is it a "need" you have, you feel like you have the right to do it and you're not going to stop?

 

Relationships are about compromise. They also are NOT about changing who you are to please the other person. If you feel it's a vital part of who you are to engage in these kind of "discussions" with your romantic partner and she disagrees...basic incompatibility.

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It's a basic incompatibility.

 

Can you stop yourself from sending her professional literature if she disagrees with you on something? Or is it a "need" you have, you feel like you have the right to do it and you're not going to stop?

 

Relationships are about compromise. They also are NOT about changing who you are to please the other person. If you feel it's a vital part of who you are to engage in these kind of "discussions" with your romantic partner and she disagrees...basic incompatibility.

 

I thought about sending links to professional literature because, in part, I thought it might be of interest to her. However, what she was saying sounded reactionary and disconnected from what’s well known within the field., so I thought reading up on it might be helpful to her.

 

In truth, I didn’t really care that much about the Childcare topic, because I’m a little on the fence about it anyway. I just saw that what she was saying was pretty extreme, and I thought it would be a good opportunity to offer an alternative perspective on it. Clearly, she wanted no part of it.

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How long since her last breakup?

 

Things had been going downhill for quite a while with her former husband. They separated one year ago, and she was by herself until we really started getting together in early August of last summer. So, she didn’t have a lot of time to decompress.

 

Interestingly, it seems that when things start going really well is when they start to crash for her. In many ways, despite the political debate that we had last week, we got through that fairly unscathed, And the resulting discussions brought us much closer together emotionally and physically. So, her seemingly crash after one texting disagreement seems to come out of nowhere.

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I thought about sending links to professional literature because, in part, I thought it might be of interest to her. However, what she was saying sounded reactionary and disconnected from what’s well known within the field., so I thought reading up on it might be helpful to her.

 

In truth, I didn’t really care that much about the Childcare topic, because I’m a little on the fence about it anyway. I just saw that what she was saying was pretty extreme, and I thought it would be a good opportunity to offer an alternative perspective on it. Clearly, she wanted no part of it.

 

But are you willing to stop doing that?

 

Are you willing to just let it go when you two disagree? Can you just change the subject or something?

 

I've had men I dated tell me that giving birth without anesthesia (as I did twice) "doesn't hurt THAT much". I mean, how would they know?? But not worth the effort. I just changed the topic.

 

Just because you and your friend don't react the same way she does, doesn't make it wrong.

 

If you know she reacts poorly to your approach to disagreements on certain topics you can either choose to change the subject or choose to continue doing what you've been doing. But, again, you shouldn't be surprised when the result is either conflict or withdrawal.

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But are you willing to stop doing that?

 

Are you willing to just let it go when you two disagree? Can you just change the subject or something?

 

I've had men I dated tell me that giving birth without anesthesia (as I did twice) "doesn't hurt THAT much". I mean, how would they know?? But not worth the effort. I just changed the topic.

 

Just because you and your friend don't react the same way she does, doesn't make it wrong.

 

If you know she reacts poorly to your approach to disagreements on certain topics you can either choose to change the subject or choose to continue doing what you've been doing. But, again, you shouldn't be surprised when the result is either conflict or withdrawal.

 

I think I’ve made improvements in letting go of these kinds of topics. We were much better with our political debate the week before, and I tried hard to not debate the childcare issue. I said what I thought was relevant to the topic, she began to get snappy, told her something to the extent of… “Well, you will have to argue it out with the authorities about this one…“ after I sent her a few links. She got snappy again, at which point I said “feel free to disagree with those who have spent years in their career to understand this stuff”. Clearly, I said that out of frustration, given she was ignoring what has been Studied for years by psychologists. She got snappy again and said “I guess I will just keep my Meager opinions As compared to the very best to myself.” Then she said good night. I suspect she was tired and was cranky, because I can’t understand that perspective otherwise.

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I think I’ve made improvements in letting go of these kinds of topics. We were much better with our political debate the week before, and I tried hard to not debate the childcare issue. I said what I thought was relevant to the topic, she began to get snappy, told her something to the extent of… “Well, you will have to argue it out with the authorities about this one…“ after I sent her a few links. She got snappy again, at which point I said “feel free to disagree with those who have spent years in their career to understand this stuff”. Clearly, I said that out of frustration, given she was ignoring what has been Studied for years by psychologists. She got snappy again and said “I guess I will just keep my Meager opinions As compared to the very best to myself.” Then she said good night. I suspect she was tired and was cranky, because I can’t understand that perspective otherwise.

 

Therein lies the key.

 

You can't understand why she would take offense to your actions.

 

She is not you. She is not the friend you referenced. She will not react the way you would or the way your friend would.

 

Basic incompatibility.

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Therein lies the key.

 

You can't understand why she would take offense to your actions.

 

She is not you. She is not the friend you referenced. She will not react the way you would or the way your friend would.

 

Basic incompatibility.

 

Well, in this instance, yes. I didn’t really care that much about disagreeing regarding this topic, because as I mentioned before, I am a little bit on the fence about it, but I respect what authorities have studied.

 

I woke up the next morning not thinking that much about it, but I’m not sure she did the same…

 

I’m going to say something that will not be popular on here, and you can call it arrogant or self righteous or whatever you want, but I’m going to say it. I tend to think that this girl is used to being the boss and being the alpha in all the situations she is in. I have no interest in being someone’s beta, nor do I really have an interest in being an alpha. My interest is to discuss things with people And not have it get out of hand if we don’t agree on stuff. Our first political debate, it got out of hand, and I was an equal participant. I don’t think that has been the case since. I think her frustration, and I’m going to take heat for saying this, is perhaps her subconscious understanding that she isn’t going to be the alpha in this relationship. I don’t mean that meanly, I just think that that’s how she has evolved in her own skin. I think she needs to be the alpha. I’ve seen plenty of evidence of that. I’ve almost never been an alpha anywhere (except for with my kid, and the classroom that I led for almost 20 years), and that’s my own issue. That comes with its own set of baggage, of course.

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One can totally get the tone of your relationship by the responses you've given here.

 

Seeing that you are a mature man, one of the best lessons maturity can teach us is to respect another's differences and give them the right to have it.

 

You don't have to agree with it. It doesn't need to mirror yours.

 

You learn to embrace the differences. If the divide is to wide, then you reconsider the relationship.

 

From what I have read, you seem to fight about being right.

 

Had you sent me articles from an `authority' to drive home your opinion, I'd be cancelling dates too.

 

Well, in this instance, yes. I didn’t really care that much about disagreeing regarding this topic, because as I mentioned before, I am a little bit on the fence about it, but I respect what authorities have studied.

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What's your goal in this thread?

 

- Multiple goals: To see what folks would do in this kind of situation, if it were them….What should I do next? This is really the main goal.

 

- And also to purge by typing and see what people have to say.

 

 

Clearly, folks on here have said that there’s just a basic incompatibility issue. That may be true, but I’m also not willing to say that people that are different can’t learn to alter their expectations and their styles to make the other good things work. I think that’s proactive thinking. This girl may be worth it… I’m still considering that.

 

I am trying very hard not to reach out to her, and to give her her space. That has somewhat worked before, and I think it allows her to experience whatever she’s experiencing without feeling pressure. The downside to that is that it makes me feel hugely anxious. It makes me feel abandoned and blowing off, and I don’t have a strong support network where I live.

 

My history with her has shown that she’s not good with my anxiety. She said six weeks ago that she’s dealing with her own problems, which she tries hard to keep concealed, and doesn’t have room for more issues during her recovery.

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One can totally get the tone of your relationship by the responses you've given here.

 

Seeing that you are a mature man, one of the best lessons maturity can teach us to respect another's differences and give them the right to have it.

 

You don't have to agree with it. It doesn't need to mirror yours.

 

You learn to embrace the differences. If the divide is to wide, then you reconsider the relationship.

 

From what I have read, you seem to fight about being right.

 

Had you sent me articles from an `authority' to drive home your opinion, I'd be cancelling dates too.

 

I guess that goes to show incompatibility, even between you and I.

 

My former spouse And I send articles back-and-forth all the time, even during debates. That’s the way we convey information to each other. I don’t think it’s a matter of being right or wrong, it’s coming up with the best solution to a problem. That’s the way my brain sees it.

 

My lady friend was saying something to me that was going against what the scientific community has understood for years. My interest had less to do with me wanting to prove I was right, and more for her to see where I was coming from. There’s a difference there. It could be just as easily said that she was not letting me be OK with my own opinion on the matter. I think the fact that she was so seemingly hostile in her response was what concerned me most. I pretty much sent her articles and was willing to drop it, but she seem to want to have the last word.

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“Well, you will have to argue it out with the authorities about this one…“ after I sent her a few links. She got snappy again, at which point I said “feel free to disagree with those who have spent years in their career to understand this stuff”.

^^ This seems rather antagonistic, but when you began to explain the exchange you painted yourself rather innocent and unaware of how it might come off.

 

You stated you thought she would be interested in the literature.

 

Rereading this, you were basically goading her.

 

And now you're here wondering why she's cooled off?

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