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Thread: Is she self-centered? Am I being unreasonable?

  1. #11
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    Originally Posted by MirrorKnight
    Sorry I think I should have been clearer with the lateness thing. I was not just waiting at a restaurant for an hour for her. I was waiting at work (so using time productively), she kept me relatively informed. I was just annoyed that she began her journey an hour late and did not seem to rush to be less late, like a quicker shower and makeup routine.

    I am really not trying to look for reasons to end things. Most of the time I really enjoy her company and I am still blown away by how beautiful she is. The punctuality thing really did strike a nerve with me though.
    If she weren't so beautiful would you tolerate it? How would you advise your best friend if he were experiencing the same?

    You should be focusing on her values and how she treats you, and others. This is what is important in a relationship.

  2. #12
    Platinum Member Wiseman2's Avatar
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    There seems to be too much of a cultural gradient. Time frames and social standards vary greatly and you don't understand hers. You'll have to take it or leave it. She may have become educated but she has not transcended her environment. Can you find women with a closer socioeconomic and cultural background to date? Rather than get annoyed at her for not being you or just like you, you may be better off finding a closer match.
    Originally Posted by MirrorKnight
    She is Chinese, from a very poor village, I admire her for how far she has come in life from such a rough beginning. But I do feel like it has possibly left some legacy issues...

  3. #13
    Platinum Member j.man's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by MirrorKnight
    Sorry I should have been clearer on the "an hour late" situation. I have explain in the above the context. Unfortunately I cannot edit the original post.

    When I say she gave me a little attitude last night. Basically after she was 30mins late, I messaged her...

    "If you actually care about me and respect me, you need to fix this punctuality problem. Disrespecting my time means disrespecting me. If your previous BFs tolerated this and you equate never confronting you with loving you and caring for you, then you are wrong, because it means enabling a bad habit, and having no self-respect."

    She rang back another 30mins later, I told her that I was angry, and her initial response was (I am translating Chinese here) something like, "I can't help that you are angry"...

    Obviously I was expecting an apology and explanation, so I got even more angry and said, "nevermind, clearly you are upset tonight, so am I, I don't want to say something I might regret, so let's just leave it for tonight and talk tomorrow"

    At this point she suddenly started crying and explaining what happened, and apologized in the process. We ended up speaking for 40mins, including 30mins of video chat at her request, because she said she wanted to see me.

    I still have not fully processed how to interpret what happened, whether I overeacted or not. Since Jane, I've been second-guessing myself when it comes to women, and I am just not as sure as I used to be, I guess because I feel I messed up the whole Jane situation so badly.
    Honestly, even when it comes to the one gripe I want to get behind you on, you still manage to come off as kinda petty. I couldn't imagine lecturing someone like they're 11, never mind over SMS. I know plenty of people who don't tolerate dates who are an hour late, and understandably (rightfully, in my view) so. So they don't ask them out on another. Especially given your qualification that you'd been productive at work in the meantime rather than sitting idly with your phone at the restaurant table for an hour, there's not even much of a practical element to be upset over. You're simply stuck on the offense in her not respecting your time. And that's where it gets from understandable to petty.

    Really, all of it screams "emotionally overinvested," and I'd say at a general level just as much as an intimate one. You have your standards, and that's just as fine as it is your right. Some people aren't going to live up to them. Some people are going to conduct themselves in admittedly more conventionally rude ways such as being an hour late to a date. It is what it is. Insofar as you're not actually beholden to that person-- which you certainly aren't to this woman-- you're free to let it roll off your shoulders and simply deselect them. If you're catching yourself lording over someone in text messages and dramatically "being afraid of saying something you'll regret" to a lady you've gone on a handful of dates with, that's a pretty clear sign you overshot the exit.

    This coming from the only punctual member of the Spanish side of my family, with whom if I'm scheduling anything, I have to set the time an hour early hoping for them to show up a half hour after I actually want them there. That's just family tradition. And even then I'm at the point I'm gonna start running errands until one calls asking where I am. The frustration is real. But it just means I unashamedly had a very low threshold when it came to punctuality and completely elective dates. Even the unannounced 10 - 20 minute "lost the time putting on my makeup" tardiness never flew for me. Never lectured. Thanked them for their time and didn't see them again. Life's a lot less miserable that way.
    Last edited by j.man; 11-06-2019 at 11:55 AM.

  4. #14
    Platinum Member Rose Mosse's Avatar
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    I have a few thoughts and it's mostly about the general feeling I'm getting from your dates, your background of just breaking up and some of your reservations you have of your own self.

    I got the feeling that this seems very casual (the dating set up). It's a see how it goes type of thing. Does she know that you just broke up with your ex a couple of months ago? She may have serious reservations about that that you don't know about or she hasn't been vocal about. Most people would not take well to information like that. What you may be experiencing is difference in expectations. You're holding her to a standard that she's not sure she needs to be around you because she may think that you're not ready to date in the first place.

    If you ever told her about Jane or your previous relationship, there's a good chance that she's keeping you at arm's length for a reason but still wants to take her chances with you. She seems very naive. There may also be other vibes you're giving off that are inconsistent to her. I'm just throwing this out there. Your reservations or strictness might be difficult to be around with over a long period of time. You may be finding also by getting out there and meeting new people that the subservience of Jane was over the top. Many other people will not be like Jane and would not take as many things as seriously as you. If I recall, Cathy is also younger than Jane. Jane might have been more mature and that is one of the things you ended up disliking (her age).

    You should strike a balance somewhere. If you're still not happy with yourself and where you're at with life, you'll never really be at peace with anyone. And you also will not be able to invite anyone fully into your life. Things are still fresh after your break up. If you're still thinking about Jane and mourning or feeling bad about the falling out, you are definitely not ready to date seriously. You might want to in your loneliness and you might want to seeing great people pass you by but you're just not ready.

    I agree with jman in the sense that when two people come together to build something towards the future, there should be some big picture views and a lot more understanding. It's a willingness to see flaws. We also accept the flaws in ourselves and are humbled that our partners accept those in us.

    For the moment, I'd let things blow over. Thinking that she might have manipulated you with her tears or any such thing is extremely negative and speaks very poorly of your mental/emotional state or perhaps of a very deep and pervasive distrust of women in general. This is a problem if you find that you're very distrustful of women. I'd go back and ask yourself why and if it's something in-built and backwards in the way easterners treat women or the way some men view women.

    It was wrong of her to be late to a date but it happened. What now? How can we move past that so that both people feel good enough to continue learning in the relationship? It's not a bad idea to learn to curb negative thoughts. Accept when something happened which should not have but don't let it fester and cause you to question everything so often. It'll drive you crazy living that way.

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  6. #15
    Platinum Member bluecastle's Avatar
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    I'll give you my gut read, and then expand.

    Gut read, from your first post, is that you are jumping into this quick, scrutinizing Cathy through a lens of "future forever partner" rather than "compelling woman I'm excited to get to know," which is essential to early dating. Part of that is simply your nature, I understand, and I'd say a fair amount is basic incompatibility here, which I'll circle back to in a moment.

    But I think a lot of that is because you're still healing from Jane, your point #4 getting in the way here. The vibe I get—from the above, and from your scolding text to her—is that you're looking for a Jane Replacement, or Jane Upgrade, or, put more frankly, a bandage for the Jane Pain. This is basic human nature—what's generally referred to as "rebounding"—but it comes with serious limitations, as any romance front-loaded with the question of "Is he/she the answer?" is a romance that will struggle to grow organically. People don't breathe well in pressurized air, and people don't see well in a fog.

    Does Cathy sense this, on some level, and is she responding by keeping you at some distance? I'd wonder—and I'd respect her for it—as most mature adults would be supremely skeptical of being serious with someone who is (a) three seconds out of a relationship in the scheme of the universe and (b) already lecturing them about respect. That's another snag to rebounding. You yourself are in a life station that makes you hard to respect romantically, at least in a "serious" way, and yet you are thirsty for a version of respect you didn't get in your last relationship and believe is essential to relationships in general.

    This is, alas, why people suggest taking some real time to heal, especially if casual dating isn't in their repertoire, by which I don't mean "more than one person" but just being genuinely chill about things, letting them unfold rather than trying to sculpt them into a predetermined shape. Aside from being good for your own spirit, it helps in dating, when you're ready, as "I broke up with someone a year ago, took some time to myself, have dated a bit, am now interested and ready for something deep and meaningful" is a much more comforting and respect-triggering line than "I broke up with someone yesterday and am ready for the real deal—feel like a drink? Also, BE ON TIME OR ELSE."

    It's not that simple, I know, as it never is. You two already had a bit of a connection, life is life, sometimes it's blurry. Still, I think a lot of the above is at play: you're wound awfully tight, and I think the tension in those shoulders is a lot of Jane residue. Cathy has "represented" a lot of things to you: the greener grass, but also a source of shame and guilt. Those are thick weeds to slice through in pursuit of an authentic connection, no two ways about it.

    But also? Maybe, as Rose said, the vibe just isn't quite there: she's more of an orange, you're more of an apple. I also got that impression, as sometimes that level of scrutiny is simply a sign that you're not really feeling someone. Better to own that, than to turn to lectures to turn the hot woman into the perfect woman. The instinct behind that could be seen as "self-centered," which is what you're questioning in her. But your main definition of her self-absorption seems to be her unwillingness to be the Cathy You Want Her To Be, in ways.

    I don't mean all that critically, in the judgmental sense. We all flail in the wake of heartache and breakups, and I just think you're flailing a bit. The more grace you can extend to yourself in accepting that will result in extending more grace to others—and with grace comes space, where connections are cultivated and grown.

  7. #16
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    Dude, you still have your recent ex living in your house (albeit you don't live there). Tie up loose ends before worrying about Cathy or Mary or Sally.

    Honestly, as far as the seat thing. you were almost to your destination. She would have to get her bags and move them, too. Why did you not just book seats together? would have left it alone. You asked, she didn't jump, that's ok.

    For a late person, i tell them the event is 30 minutes before it actually is - and i also start without people. If they find that i have already gotten through half my dinner by the time they arrive, they shape up themselves.

    Above all, the "you don't respect me" "big man" speech has got to go.

  8. #17
    Platinum Member maew's Avatar
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    These interactions seem more like a power struggle than self-centeredness... like she wants to do what she wants to do and in her mind, you can either accept her as she is or not.... which is really no different from what you want from her.... you are who you are and don't want to bend on these areas of your life, and want her to accommodate your needs.

    You've been dating only a few months and already have quite a list of things that annoy and frustrate you... probably a pretty good indicator that you aren't compatible for a relationship, as these would only continue to pile up and annoy you even further.

    There are no rights or wrongs with what you are willing to accept or tolerate in a relationship, they just have to be things you can live with without wanting to stick a fork in your eye on a regular basis.

    That all being said.... that text you sent? Pretty ball$y my friend... my own father doesn't speak to me that way, much less someone I was dating.... curious as to her response to said text, as mine would have been to immediately block you and delete your number without explanation.

  9. #18
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    That text was bad. You sounded like a parent.

  10. #19
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    Way to much pressure and way too much eggs in one basket. She could have been a total mess, so instead of showing up rolling out of bed, she let you know she was running late.

    I am the "show up 15 minutes early everywhere and anywhere possible" person, and stuff happens. If she didn't tell you, then it's not cool. But she did, so just let it go; she didn't want to show up smelly - you are not at the roll out bed look and be cool with it junction of your relationship.

    The good morning, good night texts? BARF! BARF! Double BARF! I couldn't stand that. I love my hubs to bits, when you're feeling secure, you don't need that. Just call her and hang out together. Don't base your relationship on nonsense texts. I know plenty of people who were in constant communication, and posting how awesome and in love they were on facebook, and ya know where they are? BROKEN UP!

    And the seat thing? You ever open those doors? Not easy for a thin, lean Chinese girl. Probably didn't see the point of trying to open 8 train doors! And it's a bit scary.

    I think you still have SOOO much baggage from your ex. So, you just gotta take a deep breath, and just talk it out with your friends and family and your enotalone family, cuz god's honest truth, you are really grasping at straws here. And I don't think this relationship will last; you still have a lot of work to do on yourself.

  11. #20
    Platinum Member Wiseman2's Avatar
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    This type of statement is manipulative and comes from a point of weakness. Don't keep beating her up to displace your issues about Jane on her. However it sounds like she's not going to put up with your crap for much longer as revealed in her remark reflecting your anger back on you...where it belongs. Improved self respect would help you communicate better. That means stop thinking you need to bully to get respected.
    Originally Posted by MirrorKnight
    "[I]If you actually care about me and respect me, you need to...

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