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Separated after 10 years


DKA

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My wife and I recently separated after 10 years of marriage. Both in mid 50's. Kids are from previous marriages and all grown and gone. We had an argument about recurrent issues, stopped talking and are living in separate houses at the moment. We have had issues for many years, my recurrent issues are that she is manipulative and controlling. She rolls her eyes at me, rarely listens to a full sentence I say before interrupting and is dismissive of my wants and needs. I know that a lot of those items are indications of emotional abuse, but if I bring it up, she turns it around and says I do the same thing. I've done some self inventory and realize that while I have many shortcomings, humility, honesty, kindness and compassion are not on the list. I have a big heart and very generous with my time, money and resources. But the woman I've been married to has never cared about those things or acknowledges those traits. And I keep on trying, only to be ignored or dismissed again.

 

I've attempting to schedule a counseling session with a therapist for this week because I need a reality check of sorts. The circular and crazy talk when we engage is exhausting.

 

 

I was glad we were apart for the first few days, but as is normal, I'm now having second thoughts, anxiety at night and all the break-up stuff I thought I had left behind years ago. It is tempting to reach out, but I know it's not a good thing to do. If we were to divorce, there is much in the way of finances etc that need to be settled. It's quite heart wrenching and I don't have much of a support network. Our friends are mutual and I don't wish to share the above with them because I don't like putting people into uncomfortable situations. I could really use some advise. Thanks.

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You need to listen to your wife. Her perception is her reality. If she is telling you that you do these things to her, then she thinks you are truly doing these things to her. Regardless of your own kindness or humility, you have got to look at this from her lens. I would tell her the exact same thing.

 

It sounds like you are kind of holding a grudge against her. Let that go. Have you tried couples' therapy?

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The problem with kind and compassionate men (or women) with big hearts who are only kind and compassionate is that they aren't always able to walk the talk or get things done because their resources are spread very thinly.

 

It doesn't sound like she is open to the idea of reconciliation or working things through. Her levels of resentment seem very high and it may be due most of all to a break down in trust where trust has eroded due to blurry boundaries or lack of boundaries. I'm sorry you're going through this or feeling dismissed by her. I'm glad for you that you've scheduled a counselling session for yourself. Don't be afraid to open up and talk and don't be afraid to start again too.

 

Good for you for maintaining your private affairs and not spreading any inappropriate information regarding your separation with your mutual friends. It doesn't mean that you can't go play pool or go for a drink with a buddy or take yourself out for a ride somewhere. It doesn't have to cost a lot to enjoy a few hours here and there and find some joy.

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We have had therapy in the past. I believe we are beyond that point now and are not in contact with one another. Reaching out, in my belief, would only end it rejection as it has in the past. For our entire relationship, she has been quick to terminate conversations and actually leave the house, me asking her not to and then acquiescing to her needs. Little gets resolved from the initial argument because of the nuke bomb drop of threatening to leave.

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You need to listen to your wife. Her perception is her reality. If she is telling you that you do these things to her, then she thinks you are truly doing these things to her. Regardless of your own kindness or humility, you have got to look at this from her lens. I would tell her the exact same thing.

 

It sounds like you are kind of holding a grudge against her. Let that go. Have you tried couples' therapy?

She rolls her eyes at me, rarely listens to a full sentence I say before interrupting and is dismissive of my wants and needs. I know that a lot of those items are indications of emotional abuse, but if I bring it up, she turns it around and says I do the same thing.

 

Without the benefit of being there, it's hard to say that her word is gospel. I was married to someone much like he just described and he was abusive.

 

Either way, go to therapy. It may not save your marriage but it will help you find your way out and it will give you the support you seem to be lacking. I went to couples therapy and ended up going alone after I realized nothing was going to change. I am glad I did.

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Thanks for the feedback. This is the first time I'm reaching out, so it's difficult. I do journal and some of the notes I have are threatening to harm herself if we have any type of disagreement that doesn't sit well. Not all the time, but probably 5 times in the past ten years. Then she'll downplay it. The constant "I'm' done" method of ending a conversation or simply leaving the room if we're talking and she doesn't like the way the conversation is going. General tantrums, a lot of blustering and challenging. It's also hard to put my finger on but there seemed to be some joy in deprivation. A lot of "I told you that', "that's what I said", or the simple 'whatever!' as she ends the conversation. I have an appointment with the therapist tomorrow afternoon. Reality check needed badly.

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You need expert advice at this point. Go to a therapist alone to determine if you should stay or go, if this is what you want etc. Go privately and confidentially. Do not do couples counselling. Also consult an attorney to review your options in the case of divorce. She's most likely already done so. You'll be blindsided if you don't start getting your ducks in a row legally, financially and emotionally. If by some miracle things change, at least you'll be well informed and in a better place mentally.

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You need expert advice at this point. Go to a therapist alone to determine if you should stay or go, if this is what you want etc. Go privately and confidentially. Do not do couples counselling. Also consult an attorney to review your options in the case of divorce. She's most likely already done so. You'll be blindsided if you don't start getting your ducks in a row legally, financially and emotionally. If by some miracle things change, at least you'll be well informed and in a better place mentally.

 

Thanks for the wake up call regarding my finances. I’ve procrastinated on this subject due to fear of her wrath, which I’ve experienced before.

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There are 2 sides to every story. Even though you are humble, honest and compassionate, I'm sure you wife has attributes, too. Everyone has their good and unsavory sides.

 

Find out what the therapist has to say and seek legal advice regarding your finances should you decide to divorce. It's never easy.

 

You do not have to confide in your friends, however, eventually it's inevitable that they'll find out. Your true friends will not judge you and you can retain friendships with them. Divorce doesn't have the same stigma and ostracism as many decades ago. Times have changed and people, too.

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What I see here is a lot of emotional blackmail to get her way.

 

Break down any discussion you have ever had with her or you have witnessed her having with someone else like a family member and see what pops out at you.

 

She threatens to leave or does leave if you don't cave, threatens to harm herself if she doesn't get her way, rolls her eyes and is dismissive like you don't matter and goes silent and disappears.

 

This sounds like a classic "My way or the Highway" type of person you are trying to work out problems with. A total one way street and guess which way the street goes? Her way.

 

Be frank and brutally honest with the therapist. Don't embellish or exaggerate and see what they see.

 

Divorce is not the end of the world. Sure you will loose some stuff and money but what is your happiness and well being worth?

 

Lost

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What I see here is a lot of emotional blackmail to get her way.

 

Break down any discussion you have ever had with her or you have witnessed her having with someone else like a family member and see what pops out at you.

 

She threatens to leave or does leave if you don't cave, threatens to harm herself if she doesn't get her way, rolls her eyes and is dismissive like you don't matter and goes silent and disappears.

 

This sounds like a classic "My way or the Highway" type of person you are trying to work out problems with. A total one way street and guess which way the street goes? Her way.

 

Be frank and brutally honest with the therapist. Don't embellish or exaggerate and see what they see.

 

Divorce is not the end of the world. Sure you will loose some stuff and money but what is your happiness and well being worth?

 

Lost

 

Thanks. I had a therapy session last night and he said the exact same thing you stated above. There are a ton of other examples, some he feels extreme (especially the harming of oneself) which are definitely emotional abuse and neglect and he wouldn't be surprised if it was borderline disorder. I only wanted a reality check at the session, was very candid, as was he. I'm going to continue weekly sessions and concentrate on myself and importantly, why I might be drawn to her.

 

Outside of that, is the issue of our marriage. I know what needs to be done, but it's very difficult to take the next step. For now, I'm just remaining disengaged until I can sort stuff through, but that will not last due to a number of factors like family, friends, money, etc. Thank you all.

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DKA

 

Keep silent on everything you do from now on. No revelations to your wife about what you have and are learning. This is about you figuring out what YOU are going to do so just let her believe she is winning. I am glad you will continue to see the therapist and are open to new ideas on how you got where you are now. There are nuggets of truth along your path that you have chosen to ignore because of the fight you wanted to avoid or you wanted to keep the peace at all costs until one day you looked up and realized your life was not yours any longer. Time to figure out who you are and what happened to the guy you once were.

 

He is still there and once you open your eyes fully you will see what needs to be done. There is no shame in divorce, only in not trying your best to resolve the problems in the marriage. If they cannot be resolved then you are down to two options; live like you have been and accept your fate or divorce so you both can hopefully one day find happiness.

 

Lost

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DKA

 

Keep silent on everything you do from now on. No revelations to your wife about what you have and are learning. This is about you figuring out what YOU are going to do so just let her believe she is winning. I am glad you will continue to see the therapist and are open to new ideas on how you got where you are now. There are nuggets of truth along your path that you have chosen to ignore because of the fight you wanted to avoid or you wanted to keep the peace at all costs until one day you looked up and realized your life was not yours any longer. Time to figure out who you are and what happened to the guy you once were.

 

He is still there and once you open your eyes fully you will see what needs to be done. There is no shame in divorce, only in not trying your best to resolve the problems in the marriage. If they cannot be resolved then you are down to two options; live like you have been and accept your fate or divorce so you both can hopefully one day find happiness.

 

Lost

 

Thank you for the above. As an update, I've had two therapy sessions to date with another later this week. I've been trying to understand what draws me to her to the point to where I fed on the rejection over the years but also working on myself separately. It's hard to describe all that has happened in our marriage together as most people wouldn't believe some of the things, the slamming of doors, always threatening to leave, hurt herself, the dismissal of my opinions, just a general disregard of stuff I liked, cursing, the circular conversations that never had an end, badgering, etc. When we would converse, more often than not, my sentences would begin with ''That's not what I said" because she would paraphrase some thought she had as if it were my own thoughts that I had to defend.

 

The hardest part right now is remaining disconnected from her. She has reached out a few times, but I haven't replied. In the past, I would have, but after I reflect on her email or text, I see that it's actually manipulation to draw me into communication. It is further complicated by mutual friends and my elderly father in law, with whom I have a great relationship.

 

There is also the longing for her, the fantasy that everything will turn out okay. It's a strong emotion, usually peaking in the early morning, but every once in a while hits me in the head during the course of the day. I know from experience this is normal, but it still hurts incredibly. Txs.

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Thanks. I had a therapy session last night and he said the exact same thing you stated above. There are a ton of other examples, some he feels extreme (especially the harming of oneself) which are definitely emotional abuse and neglect and he wouldn't be surprised if it was borderline disorder.

 

This was my thought as well. Google it and look at the characteristics, and see if some of them don't fit. Then, think of your own childhood.....any similarities? Anything seem familiar?

 

When we would converse, more often than not, my sentences would begin with ''That's not what I said" because she would paraphrase some thought she had as if it were my own thoughts that I had to defend.

 

Ahhh....gaslighting. The best part of any healthy relationship. :D Kidding of course. Please also google "gaslighting". You'll surely be enlightened.

 

your ducks in a row legally, financially

 

Please, please, please make sure that financially and legally, you are protected. Yes, find an attorney....stat. Even if birds start chirping and angels start singing, and she becomes the kindest, sweetest woman in the world who wants a reconciliation (which unfortunately I do not think is the case), you must be protected. Start by gathering all important documents from the house; at the very least, make copies. Take pictures on your phone of any large purchased items still in the house: t.v.'s, etc. Go to the back of those items if they have serial #'s and take pics of those as well. Then, make sure you have unique passwords to all accounts to which you have access, and print out current statements. Put all of this in a folder where you can easily carry it to the attorney's office. Please.

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This was my thought as well. Google it and look at the characteristics, and see if some of them don't fit. Then, think of your own childhood.....any similarities? Anything seem familiar?

 

 

 

Ahhh....gaslighting. The best part of any healthy relationship. :D Kidding of course. Please also google "gaslighting". You'll surely be enlightened.

 

 

 

Please, please, please make sure that financially and legally, you are protected. Yes, find an attorney....stat. Even if birds start chirping and angels start singing, and she becomes the kindest, sweetest woman in the world who wants a reconciliation (which unfortunately I do not think is the case), you must be protected. Start by gathering all important documents from the house; at the very least, make copies. Take pictures on your phone of any large purchased items still in the house: t.v.'s, etc. Go to the back of those items if they have serial #'s and take pics of those as well. Then, make sure you have unique passwords to all accounts to which you have access, and print out current statements. Put all of this in a folder where you can easily carry it to the attorney's office. Please.

 

Thanks. I didn't realize the effects of gaslighting, very enlightening. One of the things that stands out in my relationship is I would just say her comments weren't fair. It usually takes me time to digest information before I can reply to her and by then it's usually too late and we're on another subject. She was quick, fast witted and always kept me on the edge of my seat.

 

I'm on top of the financial situation, I appreciate the advice and have an attorney that works with me at the ready. It is in my best interest to mediate when the time comes.

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An update (maybe this just helps me to write it down). It's now been about a month and I have been successful in keeping our contact to a minimum and only via email, such as her asking for stuff out of the house and just replying yes, etc. We've also ironed out our finances.

 

This is still very difficult and some mornings, like today, I slide backwards from acceptance and go into denial and have fantasies of reconnecting and reaching out. I cannot for my own sake. I know this is a normal process but it hurts very much.

 

I've continued with therapy and have been introduced to transactional analysis, which is very interesting and helpful. I wish I had learned of it years ago. I use communication skills like TA for work naturally, but amazingly it was never present in my marriage despite my best efforts. It was impossible, every conversation revolved around emotions and rarely facts and logic.

Thanks for listening.

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Excellent. You're doing great even though it still feels awful for now. Good you are keeping contact at a minimum and you've enlisted the help of the pros to navigate through all this.

It's now been about a month and I have been successful in keeping our contact to a minimum and only via email, such as her asking for stuff out of the house and just replying yes, etc. We've also ironed out our finances.

I've continued with therapy and have been introduced to transactional analysis, which is very interesting and helpful.

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And now I’m continuing my slide back to denial and anxiety has kicked in. In the past I’ve always reached out to try to rescue the relationship but nothing was ever resolved and have those fantasy thoughts again. I have pages of journal notes I re-read to reinforce my decision and think logical but emotions are rampant and cloud rational judgement. Why is it that we slip sometimes from what we know to be right and true? I had a really bad night .

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And now I’m continuing my slide back to denial and anxiety has kicked in. In the past I’ve always reached out to try to rescue the relationship but nothing was ever resolved and have those fantasy thoughts again. I have pages of journal notes I re-read to reinforce my decision and think logical but emotions are rampant and cloud rational judgement. Why is it that we slip sometimes from what we know to be right and true? I had a really bad night .

 

Why? . . I don't know. I want to believe that when we recover from backsliding we push that much further ahead.

Hence the saying, two steps forward, one step back.

Just recognize it's just part of the process and don't give it any more value than it deserves.

There are no short cuts. Ride it out and hang in there.

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Update:

 

I’m doing well and feel somewhat indifferent but somewhat guarded of my emotions. My wife has tried multiple attempts at drawing me into an emotional conversation but I have stayed disengaged.

Sometimes I feel like I’m a cold human being by being non-responsive and indifferent but it’s almost like self protection. The relationship was emotionally exhausting and I am beginning to feel invigorated without the guilt I felt earlier.

 

I will note that I do recognize that the mental breakup began long before the actual separation. It was only after journaling that I discovered this fact and I encourage everyone to journal their feelings.

 

I thank everyone here and their input. I hope to someday give back valuable insight that assists someone else.

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  • 2 weeks later...

Another update, I guess I just need to vent. A step backwards over the past few days and this morning I feel sad and depressed. It's been helpful to read through my journal notes from the past month or so, to remind me of all that has happened between us, but it all feels very surreal this morning. Like either the breakup didn't happen or the marriage didn't happen. I seem to have lost the indifferent feeling I had in place. My support network isn't very big so could use some words of encouragement. I still see a therapist once a week and he's been very helpful. We've been working on understanding why I ended up in this marriage and a more in-depth understanding of BPD and narcissism. The sense of longing can be overwhelming at times.

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Another update, I guess I just need to vent. A step backwards over the past few days and this morning I feel sad and depressed. It's been helpful to read through my journal notes from the past month or so, to remind me of all that has happened between us, but it all feels very surreal this morning. Like either the breakup didn't happen or the marriage didn't happen. I seem to have lost the indifferent feeling I had in place. My support network isn't very big so could use some words of encouragement. I still see a therapist once a week and he's been very helpful. We've been working on understanding why I ended up in this marriage and a more in-depth understanding of BPD and narcissism. The sense of longing can be overwhelming at times.

 

Thank you for the update. Sad and depressed is ok. You're working through it. Keep seeing your therapist. It is ok to feel lonely, bereft and disoriented. Letting go and grieving are part of the process. Keep up the good work journalling. It sounds progressive and positive overall for you. Looking back on the journal entries gives insight into your thought processes. Don't be afraid to share those entries during therapy or ask your therapist about questions you may have about the way you process events and your emotions.

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Thank you for the update. Sad and depressed is ok. You're working through it. Keep seeing your therapist. It is ok to feel lonely, bereft and disoriented. Letting go and grieving are part of the process. Keep up the good work journalling. It sounds progressive and positive overall for you. Looking back on the journal entries gives insight into your thought processes. Don't be afraid to share those entries during therapy or ask your therapist about questions you may have about the way you process events and your emotions.

 

Thanks. I read a book yesterday cover to cover call Healing from Hidden Abuse, which was very enlightening. It also triggered a lot of memories, both bad and good, which created a little more anxiety. The good memories I'm learning, may be based on an adrenaline rush I received from the crumbs I was given over the years. Now that that is gone, I have a void of adrenaline, which is allowing anxiety and depression to show.

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