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16 years together and married for 10... now I'm confused, angry and jealous.


stackingjp

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This is my first time on a forum and a little uncomfortable sharing my information, but I really need advice. If you are taking the time to read this message, reply and offer advice... thank you. My wife and I started dating in May of 2002 in August 2004 we had sex for the first time as I was her first. For many years I have walked around thinking we have had a great marriage... with our problems but solid. I felt we have had great sex life as my wife is constantly teasing and initiating sex I was under the impression I was satisfying her never felt giving her multiple orgasms was a problem... About 3 months ago after having sex I woke up to my wife moaning a coworkers name as she was masturbating. I waited angrily for her to finish and I popped up asking her why she felt the need to do that beside me, that if I didn't satisfy her to let me know or least tell me what she wants so I can try to fulfill that need... also if that isn't what she wanted we have a guest room because listening to my wife call another mans name in our bed made me uncomfortable. I guess as the days went by I became suspicious of an affair so i hired a private investigator because instead of helping me understand the issues so we could work through it my wife would just become argumentative and shut down. After about 6 weeks he said there was no affair but daily fondling and flirting at work with 3 separate black coworkers one of them was the one she was calling out that night. The race wasn't really an issue but I am white so it made me question is my wife's interest in men only with the opposite race. So I decided to dig a little and one night I grabbed her laptop and cellphone and looked at her search history's. To my surprise it was 100% black porn not even one other race for nearly 10 years.... I'm not innocent and yes I have searched porn but I search a little bit of everything but she had 0 deviation. I repeatedly verified but nothing except black. So I became even more suspicious so i started reading my wife's diaries that were hid in the closet... I know I shouldn't but jealousy and anger is driving me insane especially when she refuses to address the issue. I wasn't really surprised as I already was aware it was all black coworkers and she would discuss how they would draw in hers hands, rub their cheeks together, pinching of her legs, running their hands through her hair, rubbing her sides and once grabbing her butt. She also wrote how this would excite her and she would masturbate in supply closets, break rooms, parking garage and driving home after work fantasizing about these coworkers. Do you think my wife is married to the wrong man.... would it be better to divorce as I just want her to be happy. What are your thoughts? What should I do?

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Her actions with coworkers are absolutely inappropriate! In some places, that could be a sexual harassment issue. I definitely think you should address that with her, but be careful about your approach.

I think your sneaking around and reading her diary, checking her computer, etc. could cause a lot of tension! It is totally natural to want to know what is going on, but hiring a private investigator might be a little overboard?

 

What was her reaction when you spoke to her about saying another person's name?

 

I'm not sure about the ethnicity issue...

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Sorry for all this turmoil.

 

Being emotionally removed from the situation, here's what I see: your wife got married with very, very little sexual experience. She had not fully come into her own sexually, and has continued, in ways, to explore that development both inside and outside the marriage.

 

Let's be clear: the offense here is not an attraction to a race that is different than yours, or fantasizing about that. That's human, stuff that can exist within partnerships. It's that she is crossing lines, big time, out there in the world by realizing these fantasies. I would say her behavior with the coworkers—not her porn preferences—constitute infidelity. If they were white or blue or magenta the story would be the same: not cool, not allowed in a marriage—unless, well, together you build a marriage that allows it.

 

What to do? Let me ask you: What do you want, right now as you read this? Do you want to see if your marriage can be saved, if this is an issue you two can work through together?

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Sorry for all this turmoil.

 

Being emotionally removed from the situation, here's what I see: your wife got married with very, very little sexual experience. She had not fully come into her own sexually, and has continued, in ways, to explore that development both inside and outside the marriage.

 

Let's be clear: the offense here is not an attraction to a race that is different than yours, or fantasizing about that. That's human, stuff that can exist within partnerships. It's that she is crossing lines, big time, out there in the world by realizing these fantasies. I would say her behavior with the coworkers—not her porn preferences—constitute infidelity. If they were white or blue or magenta the story would be the same: not cool, not allowed in a marriage—unless, well, together you build a marriage that allows it.

 

What to do? Let me ask you: What do you want, right now as you read this? Do you want to see if your marriage can be saved, if this is an issue you two can work through together?

 

I love my wife... after everything, we have 2 small children and really don't want them to be hurt by this in any way. I try to approach her so we can talk... after we put our kids to bed almost every night but it seems like she only wants to play the blame game. I don't want to fight and definitely not loud enough where our kids can hear whats going on... I don't want to create any negative feeling about either one of us with them as this is an adult issue. I approached a couple of times about the fondling... she only denied the situation and began calling me an insecure crazy liar. I didn't tell her I have the videos taken by the PI and have already her diaries... I know the truth.

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Okay...

 

So she's crossed some major lines. And so have you. Time to own that really quick, before we train the lens back on her.

 

You flew way off the rails, basically giving up the role of husband in favor for that of rogue CIA agent. You've violated her privacy many times over, just as she has violated your trust and commitment with her coworkers. So when you tell her what you've done you have to accept that she is allowed to be royally upset with you—that her sins do not justify your own.

 

In short: yes, you have to tell her. You calmly ask if she has a minute to talk, and you lay it out there. Everything. You begin by saying that you love her and want to work things out. You say you freaked out after that incident, freaked out when the two of you couldn't talk about it, and that you hired a P.I. for the past X amount of time, have looked at her browser history, and have read her diaries in the closet.

 

Here's the hard part—but, however it goes, you will thank yourself later for this part. You stay calm, and do not mention anything you've discovered. You do not attack her. You do not accuse. You simply ask her: Is there anything you want to tell me? Anything you think we need to discuss?

 

Odds are she will blow her top. She'll be furious with you—and, yes, she'll be furious with herself. Again: calm. Think of this like a bomb going off—nothing to do, really, but let it blow. The calm is your bomb shelter. When the dust settles—after five minutes of rage, maybe a day—you ask again: Is there anything you want to tell me?

 

Hopefully she is honest. Because if you have to pry—well, there's no point. It takes two to be honest, to put their sh*t on the table and clean it up. You took the first step, and she can follow or not.

 

There's no way to sugarcoat this: you have a hard road ahead, any way you cut it. Divorce is a hard road, staying together is a hard road, but both are roads that can lead to peace, in time. If you both want to choose the latter—to stay together and see if peace can be found—it means couple's counseling. It means work.

 

Most people would say the odds aren't stacked in favor of this working out. That's probably accurate. But it doesn't mean it can't. If you want it to work and she wants it to work after everything is out there—well, that's not nothing. If you have it in you—and I wouldn't judge you if you didn't—to be open to understanding your wife from a different angle, to be able to see all this as more to do with her than a verdict on you, there may be a shot here.

 

Maybe a shot in the dark, but those do sometimes reach the target.

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She obviously thinks that she is infallible. Is she the controller of the relationship?

 

You need to decide if you want to tell her that you have proof of these things. She will definitely feel like you have been sneaking around, but you will also force her to be truthful. It just depends on whether or not you think your relationship can withstand that...

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Okay...

 

So she's crossed some major lines. And so have you. Time to own that really quick, before we train the lens back on her.

 

You flew way off the rails, basically giving up the role of husband in favor for that of rogue CIA agent. You've violated her privacy many times over, just as she has violated your trust and commitment with her coworkers. So when you tell her what you've done you have to accept that she is allowed to be royally upset with you—that her sins do not justify your own.

 

In short: yes, you have to tell her. You calmly ask if she has a minute to talk, and you lay it out there. Everything. You begin by saying that you love her and want to work things out. You say you freaked out after that incident, freaked out when the two of you couldn't talk about it, and that you hired a P.I. for the past X amount of time, have looked at her browser history, and have read her diaries in the closet.

 

Here's the hard part—but, however it goes, you will thank yourself later for this part. You stay calm, and do not mention anything you've discovered. You do not attack her. You do not accuse. You simply ask her: Is there anything you want to tell me? Anything you think we need to discuss?

 

Odds are she will blow her top. She'll be furious with you—and, yes, she'll be furious with herself. Again: calm. Think of this like a bomb going off—nothing to do, really, but let it blow. The calm is your bomb shelter. When the dust settles—after five minutes of rage, maybe a day—you ask again: Is there anything you want to tell me?

 

Hopefully she is honest. Because if you have to pry—well, there's no point. It takes two to be honest, to put their sh*t on the table and clean it up. You took the first step, and she can follow or not.

 

There's no way to sugarcoat this: you have a hard road ahead, any way you cut it. Divorce is a hard road, staying together is a hard road, but both are roads that can lead to peace, in time. If you both want to choose the latter—to stay together and see if peace can be found—it means couple's counseling. It means work.

 

Most people would say the odds aren't stacked in favor of this working out. That's probably accurate. But it doesn't mean it can't. If you want it to work and she wants it to work after everything is out there—well, that's not nothing. If you have it in you—and I wouldn't judge you if you didn't—to be open to understanding your wife from a different angle, to be able to see all this as more to do with her than a verdict on you, there may be a shot here.

 

Maybe a shot in the dark, but those do sometimes reach the target.

 

This is a pragmatic and logical solution to a super $hitty problem... at least to let her know that you have evidence of her behaviour... it’s enough to get her mind grinding away on it, and unless she is in a particularly sociopathic mood, her guilty conscience will eventually force her to come clean about it.

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She obviously thinks that she is infallible. Is she the controller of the relationship?

 

You need to decide if you want to tell her that you have proof of these things. She will definitely feel like you have been sneaking around, but you will also force her to be truthful. It just depends on whether or not you think your relationship can withstand that...

 

I am actually embarrassed that I was forced to read her dairies.... but I felt I needed to know the truth. I have always considered myself the head of the household.... 12 years active duty military, D personality. I wanted other opinions before I acted upon the evidence, I have gathered and what was found in the diaries is enough for a divorce... just worried about our kids...

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Was it an open relationship, since you were away a lot? Did you adopt a don't ask don't tell policy while away on active duty? Many couples struggle with that and choose to find sexual release and company while apart. If divorce is not an option ask her to go to marital therapy with you. The prison guard/investigator approach is pointless if you are not filing for divorce. You need to rebuild trust and a connection if you want to stay together. Being draconian and staying together will just devolve into utter chaos and damage your kids. Even if you divorce you'll need to co-parent and therefore need to have some sort of cooperative rapport for the sake of your kids.

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Was it an open relationship, since you were away a lot? Did you adopt a don't ask don't tell policy while away on active duty? Many couples struggle with that and choose to find sexual release and company while apart. If divorce is not an option ask her to go to marital therapy with you. The prison guard/investigator approach is pointless if you are not filing for divorce. You need to rebuild trust and a connection if you want to stay together. Being draconian and staying together will just devolve into utter chaos and damage your kids. Even if you divorce you'll need to co-parent and therefore need to have some sort of cooperative rapport for the sake of your kids.

 

No not at all I ETS in February of 2002, and we have never had an open relationship it’s not my thing. We have been living together since early 2004. She has worked overnight since 2007 and I work 8-5.

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You need to confront her with this. Why play games? You both know whats going on and she denies the indiscretions and you deny you know about it. Lying to each other is not going to help this. Use facts and objective observations, not subjective "talking in your sleep" debatable nonsense or the nature of her pornography browsing nonsense, since both are irrelevant. .. It will be a ruckus and bring things to a head by revealing the PI tapes, but what choice do you have?

I didn't tell her I have the videos taken by the PI... I know the truth.
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I wanted other opinions before I acted upon the evidence, I have gathered and what was found in the diaries is enough for a divorce... just worried about our kids...

 

Is this the choice, then? I tried to offer a pragmatic approach to a sh*tshow—or, to put it in terms maybe relatable, a battle plan with as little collateral damage as possible.

 

The same goes for divorce.

 

Whatever choice you make, this really is about being a titan of a man, which means being a father first, not a jealous husband spinning into a void.

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I would recommend counseling.......you have multiple issues here.....you both have porn addiction and her love level for you might be low - you need to find out how to bring it back up.

 

Porn addiction... Where did that come from? I haven’t watched any type of adult material since my wife was probably 7-8 months pregnant with our son and that was early 2010. I definitely don’t think I have an addiction.

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Since you were already clear about what you'd find as you continued to snoop, what did you plan to do with that information?

To be honest when I was searching I just wanted an answer and the more she would fight me the harder I would search. I think my flaw is I didn’t ask questions or snoop.... I think I trusted her 100%. If I knew this before our wedding I would have definitely not have gotten married. I grew up in a household where my parents have been together for 51 years so divorce isn’t a conversation I take lightly. There isn’t a minute that goes by that I don’t worry about the impact this will have on our kids, but for me if I don’t have communication and trust it is impossible to stay in that kind of relationship. I think when I created the post I wanted reassurance but also wanted to know if others also thought my wife married the wrong race? Is it just a case of sexual curiosity or looking for attention?

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Stack I am sorry you are in this horrible position I can feel your pain

 

This IS an affair! It is already physical and she is going to take it all the way!

I am glad you hired a PI and have a better idea of the probable truth. Checking her computer and dairy is what you had to do. Do not let anyone tell you different. She lost her right to privacy when she started cheating. Yes EA is cheating and she is fondling men at work that is PA just not PIV!

 

Now you must protect yourself and her.

 

Do you have access to her cell phone? You must!

Check cell records on your account

Can you start showing up at her job? Maybe for lunch or dinner after work

You will not be able to let her go out with coworkers without you, that will suck but if you what to save this marriage you will have to stop the cheating

Put a VAR in her car now! If she is making plans you need to know.

 

You are on the right track to gather evidence. She is not going to admit anything without proof.

 

DO not confront her without evidence but NEVER NEVER give up your sources.

 

She must quit this job until she does the affair will continue. You will have to hope she isn't in the broom closet with the OM, she might not write that down.

 

I wish she was talking to you about her fantasies have you confronted her about the porn she uses?

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What are these abbreviations? PA? PIV? 👽🛸

 

Stalking, harassing, abusing, controlling and treating her like a criminal under surveillance is the not going to help. In fact only a paranoid control freak would do that. Many abusers do the things you recommend. He doesn't want a divorce and he has evidence a private investigator provided to either get marriage therapy or file for divorce.

 

Why waste time and money on nonsense surveillance? It would be hilarious listening to the GPS instructions or radio on the voice activated recorder in a car. Are you advertising/selling these services or equipment? Do you sell ankle monitors too?🤑 Those are known to improve any marital problems.

is PA just not PIV!

 

Do you have access to her cell phone? You must!

 

Can you start showing up at her job?

 

You will not be able to let her go out with coworkers without you

 

Put a VAR in her car now!

 

She must quit this job until she does the affair will continue.

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Stack I am sorry you are in this horrible position I can feel your pain

 

This IS an affair! It is already physical and she is going to take it all the way!

I am glad you hired a PI and have a better idea of the probable truth. Checking her computer and dairy is what you had to do. Do not let anyone tell you different. She lost her right to privacy when she started cheating. Yes EA is cheating and she is fondling men at work that is PA just not PIV!

 

Now you must protect yourself and her.

 

Do you have access to her cell phone? You must!

Check cell records on your account

Can you start showing up at her job? Maybe for lunch or dinner after work

You will not be able to let her go out with coworkers without you, that will suck but if you what to save this marriage you will have to stop the cheating

Put a VAR in her car now! If she is making plans you need to know.

 

You are on the right track to gather evidence. She is not going to admit anything without proof.

 

DO not confront her without evidence but NEVER NEVER give up your sources.

 

She must quit this job until she does the affair will continue. You will have to hope she isn't in the broom closet with the OM, she might not write that down.

 

I wish she was talking to you about her fantasies have you confronted her about the porn she uses?

 

If you have to resort to any of these secret police tactics, the marriage is already over.

 

Do you think the two of you will think back fondly on any of this 20 years from now? "Honey, remember the time you put a listening device in my car and physically escorted me out of my workplace so I couldn't fondle my coworkers? I'm sure glad you did that, it saved our marriage!!!!!!1111"

 

I do know a couple that came back from a very threatening affair (she was sleeping with her boss), but the husband didn't resort to any of these tactics. He simply stated his case; he wanted to stay married to her but couldn't if she continued the affair. Her choice. She chose to end the affair and they've been married over 30 years. But, none of this spying silliness.

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In gonna take a different approach here.

 

There's nothing wrong with you spying. You smelled smoke (or bullsh1t) and protected yourself by looking into it.

 

The fact that you found evidence of her cheating on you (that's what she is doing) and the fact that she's being dishonest and disrespectful justified what you did.

 

What was the alternative? Put your head in the sand? Let her carry on like a..... You know??

 

Eff all that.

 

Id tell her you know what she's up to and demand a fix... Not sure what that would entail but you can't carry on this way.

 

I also wouldn't tell her how I knew unless she makes a full effort to fix things.

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  • 2 weeks later...

First and foremost, my heart goes out to you. I'm so, so sorry you're going through this.

 

I wish I had words to say that would grant you a moments reprieve from the emotional rollercoaster you must be on, but unfortunately I don't. All I can do is sympathize and tell you please believe it will get better in time and once the dust settles you're going to be okay.

 

I have mixed feelings about what's going on, honestly. I agree that spying on your significant other isn't something good, and yes two wrongs don't make a right, but I also can't necessarily say I agree with just allowing someone to lie to you like she clearly was. I've left myself at the mercy of a dishonest partner before and when the walls came crashing down I suffered for it. I'm still working through PTRD after discovering the final truth. So I would say hiring the P.I. was a reaction to your gut instinct telling you something was wrong. It's a natural instinct to protect yourself, but it also speaks volumes for this relationship.

 

If your wife was truly loving and right for you, would you really have to rely on your instincts to self-protect?

 

Self-protection.

 

Your wife should be protecting your heart since she's the one you gave it to. She's got two small children at home with you. This is just not okay by any stretch of imagination and the fact she's shut down and refuses to talk about it could mean that she's so far gone into this fantasy that she doesn't want to stop and think about all the wrong she's done by chasing it this far. No one can give you that answer aside from her, unfortunately, but if I had to venture to guess I would say it's an aversion to directly address the issue at hand because she realizes what's at stake. A have your cake and eat it too moment.

 

This is blatant disrespect for you, your marriage, and your children. If not for yourself, I would think of your kids. In your own words, tell her that she has two choices: Come clean and tell you what's going on or continue this game and lose both you and the children. Here's the key though, you need to mean it. If you don't, then please don't say anything because she won't ever take you serious and that tiny amount of respect she does have will drown. You need to be 100% willing and ready to pack up yourself and the kids, and get out of the house if she refuses.

 

It's going to hurt, a lot, but she needs to realize you won't tolerate it. You won't sit on the sidelines while she plays games to play second choice. You and your children should be her 1st priority, not some sexual endeavor. We all have sexual fantasies, but we're adults so we curb them and put our priorities ahead. We're not slaves to biological impulses, so she has no excuses here.

 

I wish you all the luck and hope she comes to her senses rather than forces your hand to do the hard work.

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