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Thread: Hot Mess Proposal

  1. #21
    Platinum Member Wiseman2's Avatar
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    Is there a ring or just a string? His values will not change if you get married it will be an "open marriage" whether you know about it or not. Call it whatever you want. Polyamory, open relationship, "ethical non-monogamy", cheating, open marriage,etc. Bottom line is he wants variety you'll never be able to provide. There was no epiphany. He'll just shift whatever nonsense philosophy, label, etc he puts on what he ultimately wants and will do.
    Originally Posted by nyghts628
    He preferred, as he calls it "ethical non-monogamy".

    guess who pops up the day after Christmas, professing his love, wanting to get back together, and WANTING TO GET MARRIED?

  2. #22
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    Originally Posted by bluecastle
    How oh how did have I been so late to stumble upon this one?! Smack in the middle of my wheelhouse!

    My feeling (just trying to gauage you over a few posts) is to try to be patient, stay open, and explore this moment. But Iíd do that while putting a pin on the whole proposal thing. Iíd do that being aware that thereís going to be another few rounds of push/pull, confusion, drama, heat, dashed hopes, hopes met, and so on. Iíd do that if the sentence I just wrote sounds kind of fun and interesting as opposed to just insane.

    I wouldnít offer that advice to everyone, but it sound like youíre kind of game to play in those waters. More than game, even. I think these are the very waters you want to play in and find partnership in. I think the same is true for him.

    I can relate. But enough about me...

    Truth is, I donít think either of you know exactly what you want. And thatís okay! What you do know is that youíre drawn to each other, pretty nuts about each other, and youíd like to explore that more. So, if you can make a little room for that without going nuts, why not?

    As for the whole poly/ethical non-monoagomy component: hmmmmm. My read is that dude is just, well, a dude. Heís been a bachelor for a while, I assume? He kind of wants to keep having it every which way, reaching for language that makes that possible, except somewhere in there he doesnít actually want to have it every which way. But, well, heís kind of set in his ways, or thought he was...

    I can go on and on here, but Iíll cut this one off for the moment.

    Some questions: In the three months was he sleeping with anyone else that you know of? Do you assume he was or wasnít? How do you feel about the idea that he was? Did you sleep with anyone else? Or just a kiss? Go on other dates?
    haha! I'm totally game, as you suspected. And I think you're right on your other points. I know *mostly* what I want. I want to be monogamous, but I proceed in life knowing that such a thing is probably not realistic for most people. So my philosophy is to proceed as monogamous and adapt as the relationship requires, but I DON'T want to start off poly (if that makes sense).

    To answer your questions, though:

    1. According to him he was NOT sleeping with anyone else during our relationship. I don't even think he was looking for anyone else during our relationship. I just think that the poly-thing is a release valve, or a "just in case I stumble on someone who's hot", thing. But it doesn't seem as though he's actively looking for relationships or sex while we are together, and when I asked him such, he confirmed.

    2. How would I feel if he did? I'm kind of an a-hole, I guess. Like, do I care about the fact that his peen might have gone into someone else? No. Because he loves *me*, and for him, it's just sex. What I really care about is that someone else might draw
    his time, attention, affections, energy, and his money away from me. It's not the act so much as my own, well, princess-y attitude. I like being number one. Yes, I realize this is probably a selfish defect here, but I'm working on it.

    3. What was I doing this whole time? THE MOST. Plot twist and reveal here: I took full advantage of our polyamorous arrangement. Sex, dates, sugar daddies... SMDH to me, YES. I admit it. But I only dated around because I thought HE was dating around, and I felt I had to because I didn't want to put all my focus on him (especially AFTER he told me he was poly), only get hurt by him when I found out there was another woman. Saving grace: about a month before I broached the topic on exclusivity, I cut all my side pieces off. I wanted only him, and those other relationships pretty much paled in comparison.

    There. I'm an a-hole. I said it. LOL!

  3. #23
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    Originally Posted by Wiseman2
    Is there a ring or just a string? His values will not change if you get married it will be an "open marriage" whether you know about it or not. Call it whatever you want. Polyamory, open relationship, "ethical non-monogamy", cheating, open marriage,etc. Bottom line is he wants variety you'll never be able to provide. There was no epiphany. He'll just shift whatever nonsense philosophy, label, etc he puts on what he ultimately wants and will do.
    This is real. And honestly, it sounds like pretty much most other marriages out here, except I guess I can at least be thankful he told me what he was about ahead of time. I see so many men on their "you're the only one" stuff at the altar, but screw everything that moves during the marriage after.

    I just wonder if an open marriage might be a better and more realistic option. I wonder if the marriage itself is the thing that I really want vs complete and total fidelity.

    Hmm. I have questions.

  4. #24
    Forum Supporter ~Seraphim ~'s Avatar
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    If you have a dismal view of marriage why bother with it?

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  6. #25
    Platinum Member Jibralta's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by nyghts628
    What do y'all think? Wait and see / show and prove? Or should I just walk away completely?
    I know you're marriage-minded, but don't just jump at the first thing that looks like a proposal. I would not consider Adrian's impulsive proposition to be a proposal of marriage.

    Adrian does seem to fall into the hot mess category, however. It honestly sounds to me like he's missed out on something or someone he wanted and is now grasping at straws to make up for that loss--temporarily. To take the sting away, so to speak. This is my conclusion because no emotionally intelligent person reacts so desperately. I think he's an instant-gratification sort of person and just needs your attention for a little while. I don't think he is confessing his undying love.

    Now, if you still want to test him out, set aside a reasonable amount of time to focus on a relationship with him. Date him exclusively for a year or two and see where you are then. Pretend that whole 'proposal' thing didn't even happen.

    One more thing: I think you should examine some of the beliefs that you have about men before you marry anyone. These two claims make me think that you take a rather narrow view of men, and that you don't have much respect for them:

    Originally Posted by nyghts628
    Hmmmm, I've yet to meet a single man who isn't playing the field with multiple women BEFORE he gets serious with one of them. (Just because you don't know about it/her doesn't mean it's not happening.)
    The bolded statement above is pretty dismal. It says that men who appear to be monogamous are simply lying by omission, fooling and thus disrespecting their partners. More should not be expected of them.

    Is that really what you want to marry? It seems like a great argument against marriage, in my opinion.

    By the way, I do not agree that all men play the field, or that all men are sneaky.

  7. #26
    Platinum Member ThatwasThen's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by nyghts628
    This is real. And honestly, it sounds like pretty much most other marriages out here, except I guess I can at least be thankful he told me what he was about ahead of time. I see so many men on their "you're the only one" stuff at the altar, but screw everything that moves during the marriage after.

    I just wonder if an open marriage might be a better and more realistic option. I wonder if the marriage itself is the thing that I really want vs complete and total fidelity.

    Hmm. I have questions.
    I don't mean to offend, but that statement makes you sound either desperate or codependent in nature. You are contemplating tearing down a personal boundary to accomodate a flake.

    Truth is, I donít think either of you know exactly what you want. And thatís okay! What you do know is that youíre drawn to each other, pretty nuts about each other, and youíd like to explore that more. So, if you can make a little room for that without going nuts, why not?
    People who have an end dating goal of getting married to a man that wants the same thing is going to have a hard time romantically and by being able to maintain a long haul relationship with that kind of fly by night dogma.

    If you just want to be a serial dater who enjoys things until the new relationship energy wears off, then I say "have at it."

  8. #27
    Platinum Member ThatwasThen's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by nyghts628
    This is real. And honestly, it sounds like pretty much most other marriages out here,
    Wow, what a jaded conception you have of marriage. Maybe you are better off with a philanderer since you think most men are promiscuous and incapable of being loyal!

    The chances are quite high that you are going to keep going with your particular philanderer since your ongoing posts point towards that conclusion. I wish you luck in changing the essence that is you to be able to accept sharing him with others.

    Google "compersion" and read how other poly people deal with possessiveness and jealousy. Jealousy is a type of energy after all so you might as well learn how to channel it productively.

    Good luck.

  9. #28
    Platinum Member superfan's Avatar
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    I wouldn't wait around. If he's poly that won't change and nor should it. Being polyamorus is no different than any other lifestyle choice people make and in many cases it's not something they either can or want to change.

    Poly relationships can be very successful with other poly people who know and understand the lifestyle. I have many friends who are poly and in happy strong relationships - in some cases marriages with their primary partner and other side relationships.

    This guy told you who he was. You are not looking for ethical non monogamy and that's perfectly fine. It's not for you just like monogamy is not for him. You are fundamentally incompatible which is a shame but I don't think anything can be done to change that.

    I would take his proposal with a grain of salt. Anybody who is truly poly will not be able to change so easily. Thinking he will is foolish especially given how old he is. You might not think the age difference matters but if nothing else it's given him ample time to figure out who he is and what he wants and doesn't want. That's unlikely to change in a month

    I think you're better off leaving this guy and starting fresh.

    And no, not all guys sleep with tons of women before settling down. My husband didn't feel the need to do that.

    When someone shows you who they are, trust that.

  10. #29
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    True, my husband only slept with one other person before me.

  11. #30
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    Originally Posted by ThatwasThen
    I don't mean to offend, but that statement makes you sound either desperate or codependent in nature. You are contemplating tearing down a personal boundary to accomodate a flake.

    People who have an end dating goal of getting married to a man that wants the same thing is going to have a hard time romantically and by being able to maintain a long haul relationship with that kind of fly by night dogma.

    If you just want to be a serial dater who enjoys things until the new relationship energy wears off, then I say "have at it."
    This post is going to repond to both of your responses.

    1. You don't offend me at all. Your opinion is your opinion. :-) But honestly, it's really not my fault that I have these views of marriage. I pull my reality from what I've seen and what I see; I draw my conclusions from what IS, not from what I hope things to be. I don't go by emotion and fluffy Disney princess wishes and unrealistic concepts of true love; I go by facts, statistics, and draw my conclusions from what I see in the world around me. And what I've seen is a LOT of infidelity and a lot of divorce.

    2. That doesn't mean that I still don't believe in marriage or fidelity. I DO, in fact. I'm just really realistic about folks' capacity to remain faithful for 10, 20, 30, or even 40 years at a time. It's not a personal defect; it's just human nature and life to develop attraction, feelings, or sexual desires for others who are NOT your mate, and many of us (not most, but enough) actually act on these desires. Again, this doesn't mean men (and women) who cheat are bad people. We are all just *human*. You can fault me for living in that reality all you like, but it's the reality that has formed my opinion on the matter, and it is living in that reality which will allow me to employ real logic when dealing with the differences between emotion (love) and institutions (marriage). Having said that...

    3. You asked why I want to be married. To be real? I do not marry for love. Love is a glue and a foundation, but it is not enough. For me to consider marrying a man, he needs to be a good provider, make good money (and be able to keep it and grow it), be a good person/kind, a good role model, a good father, and steeped in his masculine energy (such that the former requirements are more likely to be met). That is literally all I require for marriage. Love is not a primary factor, though it IS there and it IS important. (Honestly, I was born in the wrong culture; I should have been born in the Indian culture with arranged marriages, because my personality is better suited for such things.)

    So if I sound jaded or damaged or broken to you because I don't balk at the idea that most men like variety (and are only as faithful as their options), please know that I've arranged my life in a way that such a "defect" will not pose any opposition in the least to my marriage prospects. Fidelity is super important to me (more for health/time/energy/money/resource allocations reasons than anything else), but other factors weigh in here.

    Yes, I sound a little cold. Superficial. Calculated. "Damaged". Etcetera. But the key to the enjoyment of life, for me, is to hope for the best and prepare for the worst. As far as marriage is concerned, I've got that sort of preparation pretty much in the bag. And for whoever my future husband is, he is lucky: I might take a jaded view on his capacity to stay faithful, but that will never stop me from loving him to pieces and being the best wife I can be.

    Still. I really appreciate your feedback and will consider all your points as I go forward! xoxo

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