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We haven't had any discussions about the future of our relationship..


OceanMoon18

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Been dating my BF for 16 months now, we are really in love and deeply committed to each other.

He actually moved to a city 3 hours away for his job (he had no choice in the matter and was an amazing job offer) that he had to move away for.

He's been there almost 2 months now, and we have to wait 2 weeks sometimes 3 weeks in between seeing each other due to him travelling for business trips.

 

Anyway.. we haven't had a discussion recently on weather I will eventually be moving to his city or not. I would love to move to his city!

He lived with me for 3 months before he moved away, and it was amazing.

 

I will be spending Christmas holidays with him at his family home. I am very involved with his family too.

 

He's busy with his new job and training currently, so I don't want to hassle him and ask what the future plans are with us..

 

But surely we can't keep doing long distance forever? Plus I miss him so much.

 

I have a really good job that I just got here when he moved away, and I also don't want to leave this job.. but I know I could get another good job easily in his city. Or if even I stayed here for a while, just to have some sort of plan figured out would ease my mind.

 

It's driving me crazy not knowing what he envisions happening, anytime I have brought it up in the past he has got annoyed and said to just enjoy the moment and that he loves me heaps and he didn't know.. but that was a while ago now.

 

Do you think in this instance any other couple would have had this discussion already?

 

Is this weird not to know what the future plan is?

 

Thanks

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I’d really love to hear a guy’s opinion on this...

 

To me it’s weird... but I’m a woman.

 

Not to stereotype, but I think as women, we like to have visions of the future and at least some kind of vague plans. It gives us a sense of security and overall purpose and direction to the relationship. Even if things don’t work out exactly that way - we kind of want to have an idea where we are going.

 

In my observation with my guy friends, I don’t think men are like that as much. I do think that they like to go with the flow more. It’s only really when they decide they want to commit/marry/move in do they start making real plans (and then they are real plans).

 

So... I don’t know. It could be that your bf is not settled yet and it’s clear that you need more time at this job, etc. - so he’a content going with the flow.

 

... but yeah... it would drive me crazy too. I’d at least want a rough sketch?

 

I think we need a man to answer. It could be that he’s not that into it if he’s putting it off... it could be that you are prematurely discussing something that needs not be discussed yet.

 

Sorry. That probably wasn’t very helpful. :/

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I am a guy.

 

Can I ask how old you both are? As a guy it seems clear to me that he is not ready to start planning for a future together. I don't think that it is exactly the same as saying the he doesn't want a future together, but if I am being completely honest it doesn't look great to me in terms of long term potential.

 

For me it comes down to age. If you are young (for me this means under thirty) and you really like this guy then maybe give it some time and see if he is ready to make a firmer commitment in six months or a year. If you are older (say 35+) and he is not even willing to discuss where this relationship is headed then, honestly, he is never going to be ready and you should either just be willing to accept this or (probably better for both of you) just end it.

 

Sorry that you are in this situation. Hope this is helpful.

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Considering one of your most recent threads where you indicated the amount it costs you per month to travel & see him, if I were in your shoes, I’d want to have an idea of where the relationship was going as well.

 

Plus, you’ve been together long enough where this discussion shouldn’t come as a surprise and you were living together before he moved, so why not?

 

Just brace yourself for his answer since it could go either way.

 

I realize you two discussed it before and he brushed it off, but surely he has to have some idea if he sees a future with you, especially after 16 months.

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This is the guy that you always have to travel to, and makes pay your own expenses for the flights?

 

You have created three threads on this within the last few weeks.

 

This.

 

OP, you need to talk to him about this now. We can speculate all we want, but you're essentially asking the same questions over and over.

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I don't know. What do you want us to say? You've asked this question several times already.

 

https://www.enotalone.com/forum/showthread.php?t=555735

https://www.enotalone.com/forum/showthread.php?t=555614

 

You've also talked about how he's still in touch with his FWB girlfriend.

 

https://www.enotalone.com/forum/showthread.php?t=552736

 

I don't think the guy cares about you. As long as you keep coming out to see him, he's going to sleep with you, but it doesn't sound like he cares one way or another. Even when he lived locally, you had to go over to his place. And you're spending a fortune on air travel.

 

Taking all your posts together, I think you're wasting your time. Move on from this guy and find another guy who lives near you and you can have a normal relationship with. Your BF is not the only guy in the world. Find someone who will at least meet you half way.

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I understand that you're really invested in this guy, but if he saw a future together he'd have talked about it by now, even in general terms. The fact that he gets annoyed when you bring it up, and tells you to enjoy the moment, is a very accurate reflection of his feelings about the relationship. Because "enjoying the moment" is all he's doing. Although you're clearly committed to him, I'd question how committed he really is to you - at least, when it involves any effort on his part.

 

It sounds as though he's fine about paying your costs, and then he gets the benefits of sleeping with you - but he isn't prepared to disrupt his lifestyle to come and see you. In other words, the emotional investment just isn't there. When it's convenient for him, you're included in his life, but not otherwise.

 

For your part, you have commitments closer to home, and I think you'd be better served concentrating on those than looking to a future with someone who doesn't see a future with you. Cut down on the number of visits, get out and about and meet new people. "Enjoying the moment" is great - but not at this cost to your sense of wellbeing.

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I'm a guy, and I reckon I've been this guy.

 

It sounds to me like his emotional investment is simply not as high as yours, at this moment. That can be for any number of reasons. It could be his nature, just kind of where he is in life right now. It could be because he's focused on his new job, and the way he works is to focus on one thing at a time. It could be that he's just not at a place—either with you, or in general—where he understands what it means to really include another person in his life.

 

You can pick all that apart, but it will likely just tighten the same knot.

 

I think moving forward you have two options.

 

1. You can try to let go a bit of future talks, and focus on the reality of the moment. He's got a new job, you've got a new job—now is the time to kind of just enjoy things for what they are a bit longer, respecting both the connection but also where there's some disconnect. If, of course, that's genuinely possible.

 

2. Now is the time to focus on what you want, what you need, and clearly express that. Not out of anxiety or frustration, but simply self-expression and confidence. To do that, though, you need to be ready to let this relationship go if he's unable to step up in the way you need.

 

My last relationship had this dynamic, almost from the get-go. I liked her, was enjoying the moment, not really thinking about what any of it meant. I had too many balls in the air at the time: new city to adjust to, some emotional residue from a past relationship blocking my heart's arteries. Whenever talks came up I'd reply with my version of "enjoy the moment," and she'd kind of swallow her deeper feelings and go with it.

 

The trouble with this dynamic is that she was essentially accommodating my fog, which only rewarded it, kept me (and her) in it. Deep down, I wanted her to challenge me more, to assert herself more. Maybe because (selfishly) I wanted to be tugged out of the fog, maybe because one of the ironies of the relationship is that I couldn't totally take it totally seriously if she chose accommodation over assertion. Point being that what made the relationship work—her toe-stepping, her reluctance to push—is also what made it not work, and from this and past posts of yours it sounds like you're dangerously close to walking a similar line.

 

So just be honest with yourself so you can be honest with him.

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This is the guy that you always have to travel to, and makes pay your own expenses for the flights?

 

Oh my. Yes. Sorry... I take back my earlier post. I didn’t check the history before responding.

 

... and really, I want to echo what bluecastle is saying...

 

If the “3 hours” means a flight (and all the money associated with that) and in turn, you are losing time with your child, then the luxury of “going with the flow” goes out the window for very practical reasons. And guys understand that too.

 

There definitely comes a point where you need to look after yourself and what’s best for you. Not doing so isn’t charming - it simply makes you look desperate and makes someone lose respect for you (sorry). You are actually losing your chances to be with him, in my opinion, rather than increasing them.

 

In no way should you be going into debt over some guy and losing time with your child. You need to draw a line. He needs to make a decision and he won’t do that while you keep accommodating his wishy-washy behavior.

 

Given the context and circumstances, I really think he’s just leading you on at this point. You need to pull the plug. Sorry.

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It's only been 8 weeks since he relocated and he has been busy with his new job. Wait until you see him over the holidays to revisit the topic of you possibly moving to his city. It seems he is not on the same page as you and not interested in having you move there or especially move in with him.

 

What are logistics of that and your child support/visitation? Can you afford the move and paying child support and travel to visit your child? Can you find work there that is as good as what you have now? Would you get your own place or expect to move in with him?

 

It seems you are rushing and pushing to live together and run away from your life and parental responsibilities. Why was your exbf awarded custody of your child?

He's been there almost 2 months

I will be spending Christmas holidays with him at his family home.

I have a really good job that I just got here when he moved away, and I also don't want to leave this job.

anytime I have brought it up in the past he has got annoyed and said to just enjoy the moment and that he loves me heaps and he didn't know.

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My last relationship had this dynamic, almost from the get-go. I liked her, was enjoying the moment, not really thinking about what any of it meant. I had too many balls in the air at the time: new city to adjust to, some emotional residue from a past relationship blocking my heart's arteries. Whenever talks came up I'd reply with my version of "enjoy the moment," and she'd kind of swallow her deeper feelings and go with it.

 

The trouble with this dynamic is that she was essentially accommodating my fog, which only rewarded it, kept me (and her) in it. Deep down, I wanted her to challenge me more, to assert herself more. Maybe because (selfishly) I wanted to be tugged out of the fog, maybe because one of the ironies of the relationship is that I couldn't totally take it totally seriously if she chose accommodation over assertion.

 

Point being that what made the relationship work—her toe-stepping, her reluctance to push—is also what made it not work, and from this and past posts of yours it sounds like you're dangerously close to walking a similar line.

 

 

This^ is interesting. So you actually needed her to push to move forward towards commitment?

 

Can you describe what that pushing looks like? In my experience it's best to not push, that the only thing pushing does is push him further away.

 

On the other hand, a woman expressing her needs only to be told "let's live in the moment" and her dismissing what she wants and needs in favor of his by accommodating isn't good or smart either.

 

In that instance, simply best to walk away, as you're not on the same page; frankly for me, I don't push, would not want to push.

 

If he's not there after 16 months as in OP's situation, then wish him well and move on.

 

That said, I am open minded which is why I ask what that "pushing" looks like to you (an ultimatum? trying to convince you?), and also if your ex did push, how do you know that you would have responded positively? Given your mindset at the time was "let's live in the moment."

 

Your response might be helpful to OP too.

 

Thanks in advance bc!

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Hi Oceanmoon, I read your other threads... first off, the whole thing about the fwb girl... wow, the fact that he was so concerned with her and not you baffles my mind. That in itself is very disrespectful.

 

Why do you only see your son every other weekend?

 

You are spending too much time thinking about this half-a** relationship and not about yourself, your self respect, your son. (Sorry to be harsh).

 

This guy moved out of town, he’s got a friends with benefits girl on the side... obviously the universe is trying to tell you something. Try to loosen your ties with him and move on to someone more available who puts you first. You need to put yourself first, not him.

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I'm a guy, and I reckon I've been this guy.

 

It sounds to me like his emotional investment is simply not as high as yours, at this moment. That can be for any number of reasons. It could be his nature, just kind of where he is in life right now. It could be because he's focused on his new job, and the way he works is to focus on one thing at a time. It could be that he's just not at a place—either with you, or in general—where he understands what it means to really include another person in his life.

 

You can pick all that apart, but it will likely just tighten the same knot.

 

I think moving forward you have two options.

 

1. You can try to let go a bit of future talks, and focus on the reality of the moment. He's got a new job, you've got a new job—now is the time to kind of just enjoy things for what they are a bit longer, respecting both the connection but also where there's some disconnect. If, of course, that's genuinely possible.

 

2. Now is the time to focus on what you want, what you need, and clearly express that. Not out of anxiety or frustration, but simply self-expression and confidence. To do that, though, you need to be ready to let this relationship go if he's unable to step up in the way you need.

 

My last relationship had this dynamic, almost from the get-go. I liked her, was enjoying the moment, not really thinking about what any of it meant. I had too many balls in the air at the time: new city to adjust to, some emotional residue from a past relationship blocking my heart's arteries. Whenever talks came up I'd reply with my version of "enjoy the moment," and she'd kind of swallow her deeper feelings and go with it.

 

The trouble with this dynamic is that she was essentially accommodating my fog, which only rewarded it, kept me (and her) in it. Deep down, I wanted her to challenge me more, to assert herself more. Maybe because (selfishly) I wanted to be tugged out of the fog, maybe because one of the ironies of the relationship is that I couldn't totally take it totally seriously if she chose accommodation over assertion. Point being that what made the relationship work—her toe-stepping, her reluctance to push—is also what made it not work, and from this and past posts of yours it sounds like you're dangerously close to walking a similar line.

 

So just be honest with yourself so you can be honest with him.

 

I love your honesty, and I think it’s so true. Too many of us try to make someone else happy, but then in the end it makes us unhappy, and too many times we stay in something that we shouldn’t stay in just because we think it’ll make us happy.

 

I’ve seen too many women friends (I’m a woman) who are too accommodating to their men and then in the end the man ends up leaving them, because, like you said, they’re not challenging enough. And I’m sure it happens the other way around as well. What did you end up doing in this situation?

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Having read your other threads in addition to this one OP I have to wonder why you haven't yet put these questions to him... I wonder if, as you alluded to in your first post, that you are worried that if you challenge him he will end things with you. Bluecastle paints a pretty clear picture of what will happen if you continue to accommodate his "fog" as it were... you lower your value of yourself in his eyes and he starts to see you as someone that will put up with anything to be with him. I mean you have already kind of proven this anyway... you go out of your way to travel to him all the time, you foot the bills for travel, you put up with his relationship with this FWB, you are willing to leave your child behind in order to move to his city. The fact that you don't take a stand on anything that is important to you is diminishing your worth, both in his eyes and your own, and shows that you don't value yourself enough to have a reciprocal relationship.

 

Nagging him for an answer and then accepting his answer no matter what it is is NOT the same as taking a stand by the way... taking a stand means standing up for your values and what is important to you despite the fact that the outcome might not be what you want. It's walking through fear to be true to yourself and what you want. This is the only way you will be able to have a successful relationship with this person.... turning yourself into a pretzel isn't going to cut it.

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Having read your other threads in addition to this one OP I have to wonder why you haven't yet put these questions to him... I wonder if, as you alluded to in your first post, that you are worried that if you challenge him he will end things with you. Bluecastle paints a pretty clear picture of what will happen if you continue to accommodate his "fog" as it were... you lower your value of yourself in his eyes and he starts to see you as someone that will put up with anything to be with him. I mean you have already kind of proven this anyway... you go out of your way to travel to him all the time, you foot the bills for travel, you put up with his relationship with this FWB, you are willing to leave your child behind in order to move to his city. The fact that you don't take a stand on anything that is important to you is diminishing your worth, both in his eyes and your own, and shows that you don't value yourself enough to have a reciprocal relationship.

 

Nagging him for an answer and then accepting his answer no matter what it is is NOT the same as taking a stand by the way... taking a stand means standing up for your values and what is important to you despite the fact that the outcome might not be what you want. It's walking through fear to be true to yourself and what you want. This is the only way you will be able to have a successful relationship with this person.... turning yourself into a pretzel isn't going to cut it.

 

I so agree with this! I didn’t want to say too much about your kid situation, as I don’t know the background, but why would you move to a different city from your kid? I’m a single mom, and my daughter is with me 24/7, I can’t imagine moving away from her ever. Think of what your son might think— oh mom is moving to a new city to be with a guy... a guy who doesn’t even respect her! Sorry to be harsh.

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This^ is interesting. So you actually needed her to push to move forward towards commitment?

 

Can you describe what that pushing looks like? In my experience it's best to not push, that the only thing pushing does is push him further away.

 

On the other hand, a woman expressing her needs only to be told "let's live in the moment" and her dismissing what she wants and needs in favor of his by accommodating isn't good or smart either.

 

In that instance, simply best to walk away, as you're not on the same page; frankly for me, I don't push, would not want to push.

 

If he's not there after 16 months as in OP's situation, then wish him well and move on.

 

That said, I am open minded which is why I ask what that "pushing" looks like to you (an ultimatum? trying to convince you?), and also if your ex did push, how do you know that you would have responded positively? Given your mindset at the time was "let's live in the moment."

 

Your response might be helpful to OP too.

 

Thanks in advance bc!

 

I'lll try to pick this apart with some nuance.

 

There is a kind of "pushing" that comes from a place of insecurity. Typically this comes early and/or with someone who doesn't have a grip on themselves. This is when pushing crosses the line into nagging. Total turn off, that, especially if it's coming early on. You need real history with someone, a real foundation, the seeds of genuine trust, to make space for the weight of (occasional) insecurities seeping in in reckless ways. We're all human, deserve soft hands on occasion, etc.

 

But that's not what we're talking about here, not at the 16 month mark.

 

The pushing I'm describing, I suppose, can be seen as two things I'm deeply drawn to in women: 1. A fearlessness when it comes to calling me out on my bs. 2. A fearlessness when it comes to owning her own needs, even if they may differ from mine (or from what I think mine are). Of course, I'm also drawn to comfort and regular sex, as are most of us, so sometimes the presence of the latter can negate the absence of the former.

 

So what does the pushing I'm describing look like?

 

Small example. I once dated a woman who always wanted to go away on a trip. At the time I was stubborn, obsessed with work, stuck in some delusional thinking that if I left NYC for longer than 24 hours I'd lose my place in some mythic line, come back to the city forgotten and irrelevant. She entertained that for a bit, because it was a fragile time in my career, then stopped: we're taking a damn trip, or we're having a real talk. That trip was amazing! Exactly what she, I, and we needed. She had to push a bit in order to be seen and, in the process, I saw myself a bit clearer too. I became a regular traveler after that, with her, eventually with other women, and ultimately with myself. Fog annihilated, thanks to a little "push."

 

Abstract example related to OP. It looks like a conversation in which gf asks me what's what, where things stand, or some such. And I pull the string in my back and out comes the comfy monologue spoken from the place of wanting comfort and regular sex: enjoy the moment, see where it goes, with some sprinkles of affection and confessions of inner confusion (unrelated to the relationship) thrown in. If this is genuinely sating—great, because I'm not being totally disingenuous. But I am being a little lazy, a little complacent, probably a touch afraid to look some feelings in the eye and, you know, express them.

 

But if what I'm saying doesn't soothe, if it sounds a whole lot like what I was saying three months earlier? Well, call it out. Let me know that I'm sounding ridiculous, that you don't know what's behind the ridiculousness, but that it's getting old. Let me know that you think there's something very rare and special here and coasting along isn't cutting it. Let me know that stagnation bores you, that evolving excites you, and that you'd like to evolve with me. And, hey, if that's not possible—all good, but you're in this, as you're in life, to evolve.

 

If I'm feeling you, I'm going to step the f up. And if I'm semi-feeling you? Odds are I'm feeling you a lot more after that moment—because you know what's hot? FIRE. And sometimes it's the fire of another that can help us burn through our fog. Ideally that's the subtle dance of a sustainable relationship.

 

So it's not a full-on ultimatum. Its just not backing down, basically, until you get the conversation you want. So, like, with my ex? She'd wade a little toe into those waters, but then back down at the monologue, go back into accommodation mode. See, I pushed her, no problem, during those conversations. I asserted my truth, best I understood it. I said things no one wants to hear, like: "I'm not sure I have more to give than what I'm giving." Let's say, hypothetically, she responded with her truth: "Well, it's not enough for me." I would have respected her, liked her more, and reached for another gear.

 

In other words, my mindset was not simply "let's live in the moment" and have sex and be comfortable. It was also "c'mon—show me who you are so we can get to the next moment" while enjoying the comfort of regular sex.

 

There'a a very sad epilogue to all this that I'm happy to share. Kind of gets at the importance of asserting yourself early and when needed. But, for now, I'll leave it at this.

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But if what I'm saying doesn't soothe, if it sounds a whole lot like what I was saying three months earlier? Well, call it out. Let me know that I'm sounding ridiculous, that you don't know what's behind the ridiculousness, but that it's getting old. Let me know that you think there's something very rare and special here and coasting along isn't cutting it. Let me know that stagnation bores you, that evolving excites you, and that you'd like to evolve with me. And, hey, if that's not possible—all good, but you're in this, as you're in life, to evolve.

 

If I'm feeling you, I'm going to step the f up. And if I'm semi-feeling you? Odds are I'm feeling you a lot more after that moment—because you know what's hot? FIRE. And sometimes it's the fire of another that can help us burn through our fog. Ideally that's the subtle dance of a sustainable relationship.

 

 

Wow, this was quite enlightening, thank you!

 

Although not quite convinced all men would feel the same as you, however I do know that most men love that "fire" in a woman's belly, calling him out on his BS, getting a little angry, and respond well to it; I think I've even posted that before in a different thread.

 

And to make the point, although it was just movie, I had attached a clip from Goodfellas wherein Henry stood Karen up on a date (he wasn't all that into her at the time) and she got so angry at him, had someone drive to where he and his friends were hanging out, and proceeded to lambast him right in front of his friends!

 

His reaction to her calling him out on his BS was priceless! Just like that, he became super attracted and they actually ended up getting married.

 

I've been known to have that fire in me too, while in the RL, calling him out on his BS, in my own feminine way (not as aggressively as Karen in Goodfellas was - not my style), and yeah my boyfriends do respond well to that.

 

However, I can't imagine having that sort of fire after telling a man what I want (you said in your first post that you had already talked about it, that after she expressed her feelings wanting more, you responded by giving your version of "let's live in the moment.")

 

I think it takes a GREAT deal of confidence and strength to confront a man after announcing something like that, especially after 16 months, I would take his words at face value, assume we're not on the same page and walk.

 

But then again, I suppose "assuming" anything would be a mistake, as you yourself just attested to!

 

Thanks again for responding bc, I just learned something and hope OP did too!

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This is 16 months of, I'm sorry, probably a convenience-based, go-nowhere relationship.

 

In 16 months, he's:

--Kept in touch with his F buddy, which is completely inappropriate

--Made you pay him back for your visits to him, but doesn't visit you? I'm unclear as to how that all works, but the visitation thing seems way lopsided, both financially and physically

--Moved 3 hours away, and hasn't made one comment about the future for you two.

 

This is a great convenience for him. You hop on a plane, at your expense, and I'll assume.....sex all weekend???.....and then, off you go, buh bye. All the while, he keeps his string to his ex (really ex?) F buddy.

 

He doesn't have to make one future plan with you, nor does he even have to bring it up.

 

Sex comes for him, on a plane whenever he wants it, at your expense.

 

I know this hurts, but this should be the time for you to break away from this.

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Well, I hardly speak for all men. And for all the ways I'm capable of conforming to some very male stereotypes, good and bad, I've never been much of a guy's guy.

 

Anyway, just to be clear: My ex never, ever broached a big talk, and never put it out there what she wanted, needed, or was feeling. I mean, looking back, it was nutty the dynamic we had, created. I'd ask her what she felt like for dinner. "What do you want?" she'd reply. Within weeks I was saying things like, "What I want is to know what you want." For dinner, in bed, in life—say it, challenge me, assert yourself.

 

Sure, on some level I obviously liked that role—insert cringe, eye roll—but I was also keen on seeing if we could expand/evolve into something more. I found her intriguing.

 

On the relationship front, it was always toe-stepping check-ins, and I kind of fear this may be the case with OP. Like, we'd been hanging and having sex for two months, never saying a thing, which at that point was frankly fine with me. One day comes a, "So, hey, like, what is this?" I'd be honest—I'm not sleeping with anyone else, but not ready for a label—and she'd kind of nod and retreat and I'd stay in my fog.

 

Those early retreats, I think, were bricks in the foundation of what became our dynamic where they could have been something else with someone else. In those moments my "power" was consolidated, hers was lost, where in something healthier those are moments where it gets equally redistributed. Sure, had she pushed too hard early I likely would have bailed. But after a year I was in something, as OP's dude is in "something" with her, and I was down to be challenged to figure out what it was together. But she remained scared, ever-cautious, always accommodating, and as a result a part of me struggled to take the whole thing seriously.

 

Regarding standing up for yourself, calling someone's bs, here's a story from a friend that has always resonated with me. He's a headstrong dude, complicated, deeply weird family trauma. One day he is in the car with his gf—early days—who accidentally spills some coke on the floor mat. He kind of snaps, much the way his father kind of snaps, much the way previous gfs put up with. Nothing malicious, but totally uncool.

 

Cool, calm, she looks him in the eye, flashes her fire, and slowly pours the rest of the coke onto the floor. "That's when I knew I was going to marry her," he says. And they're married, happily, awesomely. Dramas like that don't play out on the regular, at all. They keep each other in check, and just knowing they can means they don't need to often.

 

Anyhow, OP, at this point you've both allowed something nebulous to expand past its due date, certainly past your own comfort zone. I think it's time to see what happens if you try to tweak it. If he can't hang in the place you need—well, his loss.

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Well, I hardly speak for all men. And for all the ways I'm capable of conforming to some very male stereotypes, good and bad, I've never been much of a guy's guy.

 

Anyway, just to be clear: My ex never, ever broached a big talk, and never put it out there what she wanted, needed, or was feeling. I mean, looking back, it was nutty the dynamic we had, created. I'd ask her what she felt like for dinner. "What do you want?" she'd reply. Within weeks I was saying things like, "What I want is to know what you want." For dinner, in bed, in life—say it, challenge me, assert yourself.

 

Sure, on some level I obviously liked that role—insert cringe, eye roll—but I was also keen on seeing if we could expand/evolve into something more. I found her intriguing.

 

On the relationship front, it was always toe-stepping check-ins, and I kind of fear this may be the case with OP. Like, we'd been hanging and having sex for two months, never saying a thing, which at that point was frankly fine with me. One day comes a, "So, hey, like, what is this?" I'd be honest—I'm not sleeping with anyone else, but not ready for a label—and she'd kind of nod and retreat and I'd stay in my fog.

 

Those early retreats, I think, were bricks in the foundation of what became our dynamic where they could have been something else with someone else. In those moments my "power" was consolidated, hers was lost, where in something healthier those are moments where it gets equally redistributed. Sure, had she pushed too hard early I likely would have bailed. But after a year I was in something, as OP's dude is in "something" with her, and I was down to be challenged to figure out what it was together. But she remained scared, ever-cautious, always accommodating, and as a result a part of me struggled to take the whole thing seriously.

 

Regarding standing up for yourself, calling someone's bs, here's a story from a friend that has always resonated with me. He's a headstrong dude, complicated, deeply weird family trauma. One day he is in the car with his gf—early days—who accidentally spills some coke on the floor mat. He kind of snaps, much the way his father kind of snaps, much the way previous gfs put up with. Nothing malicious, but totally uncool.

 

Cool, calm, she looks him in the eye, flashes her fire, and slowly pours the rest of the coke onto the floor. "That's when I knew I was going to marry her," he says. And they're married, happily, awesomely. Dramas like that don't play out on the regular, at all. They keep each other in check, and just knowing they can means they don't need to often.

 

Anyhow, OP, at this point you've both allowed something nebulous to expand past its due date, certainly past your own comfort zone. I think it's time to see what happens if you try to tweak it. If he can't hang in the place you need—well, his loss.

 

This is completely off topic, but when I read this post of yours, bluecastle, I immediately thought of Lex’s thread and her situation (i.e. - Lex wanting more, but seemingly not wanting to cause any waves by asking for more, and being somewhat trepidatious).

 

Interesting read.

 

Sorry, OP!

 

Don’t want to hijack your thread.

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^^ bc, it's a shame you didn't respond to my recent thread entitled "Honeymoon Over" wherein I discussed my bf snapping at me, nothing abusive by any stretch, but in a very harsh aggressive way.

 

Anyway, my response was to understand where it came from and to essentially let it go, not make a huge deal of it; in fact I was the one who approached him afterwards asking "are we friends again"?, and he responded very well to that; he ended up apologizing profusely and we went on to have a great night!

 

So it's interesting reading how your friend responded when his gf poured the rest of the coke on the floor! That it turned him on and at that moment knew he would marry her!

 

In my case, there was no coke to pour on the floor mat, but my friend told me that the way I handled that situation was "wrong" that I should have gotten pissed and called him out for speaking to me in such a harsh way. In fact, my friend telling me that was what prompted me to create the thread.

 

I would say literally ALL the responses from both men and women agreed that how I handled it was the best way; that I diffused what otherwise might have been a volatile interaction between us which tends to serve no good purpose. Just my experience.

 

Anyway, it's so interesting how different we all and as such how we can all respond so differently; like I said, wished you had responded so everyone could have read a different viewpoint.

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If this is the same poster that has a child and her bf moved away, I would be concerned if a woman chose her boyfriend of 16 months over her child. He may not feel strongly enough about her to want her to relocate, or he may feel strongly about her, but its too soon to think about any form of commitment - so he doesn't make one. She could stay where she is at, put her foot down more about HIM visiting HER once he gets settled and is able (if he just started the job, he can't take time off yet, etc.). That's the only thing i would do at this point, or decide to see where it goes - whether the relationship peters out or keeps going. And in the meantime, be a "present" mother - when she has her kid -- don't pawn her kid off on someone else, and maybe work to see the child even more. Something sounds fishy if she only sees her kid every other weekend IF that and sometimes not

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Katrina, I'm mortally offended that you don't remember me responding to that thread. Because I did. Tear stained face emoji.

 

Anyhow, I agree you handled that like a champ. I think the difference was, in this case, this was very, very early. More like your bf snapping like that on date 3 rather than month 9.

 

Not saying the coke pour was the pinnacle of dealing with it, but it was her way of saying: um, no, not if you want to keep exploring this.

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This is completely off topic, but when I read this post of yours, bluecastle, I immediately thought of Lex’s thread and her situation (i.e. - Lex wanting more, but seemingly not wanting to cause any waves by asking for more, and being somewhat trepidatious).

 

Interesting read.

 

Sorry, OP!

 

Don’t want to hijack your thread.

 

Oh, the infamous thread! I've shared, I think, versions of all this on there.

 

But, yes, it's related. At the end of the day, accommodation has its limits. People want to be seen. To be seen we have to reveal. To accommodate, we are often concealing. Double-edged blade.

 

You might not be alone, technically, but you can end up feeling awfully lonesome and unseen.

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