How do I ask for an open marriage?

My husband and I have been happily married almost 3 years, but dated for several years before we married.I have made it clear to him ever since we first met that I believe that it's entirely possible to have sex without having emotions for someone. He was raised in a religious family so it took him a while to understand that viewpoint, but he has never been mad about me feeling that way. He has been with a small number of women and dated all of them. I've been with about twice as many people as him, but I've only been with 7 people, male and female.

He feels a little bad sometimes that he didn't get more experience before we got serious. I sometimes feel like, even though I love him very much, I wish I had more time to have fun, casual sex before settling down. We were in our late teens when we started dating. It's been nearly 8 years since I had sex with anyone else, and I think around 9 years for him! He's had women interested in him, I've had men interested in me. So far we haven't had any extramarital sex. But I'd like to. I don't have a specific guy in mind, but I'd love the freedom to have some fun if a hottie crossed my path. And I am completely ok with him having sex with other women, as long as there isn't some double standard where I can't have sex with other people. So how do I ask for it?

I did bring up the idea of an open relationship about 4 years ago. He wasn't totally against it, but was hesitant. Since then, the topic has come up on occasion. He brought it up a couple months ago, and I brought it up about a week ago, but I haven't explicitly asked for it since that first time 4 years ago. He knows I am fine with him having sex with other women, and he and I check out attractive people together all the time, usually we look at women together but he doesn't mind if I check out other guys when I'm with him.

The other piece of this is that, although we love each other and are very attracted to each other, our tastes would suggest otherwise. We are the same age but he generally prefers older women (40+) and I am very attracted to younger men (18-25ish). Neither of us has ever slept with the sort of older woman/younger man that we fantasize about.

He has two reasons that cause him to hesitate: he doesn't know how he'd even proposition another woman, since he's never had casual sex and also he thinks they will say no because he's married and won't believe that I really am ok with it. And he says it is weird to think about other dudes being inside me.

What do I do? I've been so tempted by guys before and haven't had anything happen, but it doesn't mean it hasn't been close a couple times. I don't want to leave my husband, or go behind his back and have an affair. If I'm having sex with other guys, I'd rather he knew about it and he also got to have fun with other women. I'd love it if we could share stories and maybe even share lovers sometime. We've danced around this for so long, how do I make it happen?

I have made it clear to him ever since we first met that I believe that it's entirely possible to have sex without having emotions for someone. He was raised in a religious family so it took him a while to understand that viewpoint

Not wanting an open relationship is not negative, as you seem to imply. Devotion is sexy. And connecting sex with emotions is good. I think that you would be doing him and your marriage a disservice by encouraging him or pushing him towards cheating -- he would not feel good about it and likely the marriage would crumble if he did it -- just like a husband who keeps hounding a wife about a threesome -- when it happens the marriage falls apart. He seems to be telling you that he is going along with it on a fantasy level to keep you happy but deep down he does not want this. But since he loves you and wants to keep you, he is humoring it.

If you really want to sleep with others, i suggest divorcing or at least formally separating from your husband. your marriage equates sex with love and emotion and devotion and to you its just an act.

There is no scenario where you sleep around and he happily sleeps around, too. He is not wired like that. if you choose to break your vows, do not force him to be party to it

I agree divorce is best if you want to be free and swinging.

I don’t necessarily think divorce is the only path here. It’s something you guys have talked about, so, hey, have a real talk about it—one that takes it from the theoretical into the actual. Just be clear: I’d like to try this, and wonder if there’s a way that works for both of us. Then listen, figure out the rules, and so on.

I have some friends, long married, experimenting with being open right now. It’s a pandora’s box, be warned. There’s a lot of room for getting closer, but a lot of room for friction, disconnect. Everyone navigates it differently. Generally speaking, I think what’s hard is that women have an easier time meeting people than men, especially when it comes to casual.

From what you written, it does sound like this is going to be more “your” thing than his. It’s important not to ignore that, if that’s the case. So, for instance, let’s say you’re loving your 22-yr-old fling and he’s, well, not loving any of this. Are you okay “closing” things, to honor your marriage, or are you annoyed that your husband isn’t honoring your not quite “mutual” new pact?

Just saying, things to think about.

I don’t necessarily think divorce is the only path here. It’s something you guys have talked about, so, hey, have a real talk about it—one that takes it from the theoretical into the actual. Just be clear: I’d like to try this, and wonder if there’s a way that works for both of us. Then listen, figure out the rules, and so on.

 

I have some friends, long married, experimenting with being open right now. It’s a pandora’s box, be warned. There’s a lot of room for getting closer, but a lot of room for friction, disconnect. Everyone navigates it differently. Generally speaking, I think what’s hard is that women have an easier time meeting people than men, especially when it comes to casual.

 

From what you written, it does sound like this is going to be more “your” thing than his. It’s important not to ignore that, if that’s the case. So, for instance, let’s say you’re loving your 22-yr-old fling and he’s, well, not loving any of this. Are you okay “closing” things, to honor your marriage, or are you annoyed that your husband isn’t honoring your not quite “mutual” new pact?

 

Just saying, things to think about.

I predict she will sleep with other men and he won't sleep with other women -- he'll attempt to perhaps or try to gear up for it, but end up more in an emotional affair - someone to talk to - and she will freak out and hit the wall when that happens. Or he will stay completely faithful.

I really think you also need to dig deep and explore how you feel this way (sex doesn't have emotional meaning). Perhaps its worth digging deep and becoming vulnerable/letting your husband in more in order to have a deeply connected emotional experience and make that your goal instead of seeking others. I am not saying that style can't work for dating and keep you somewhat detached - but you are married and isn't it worth the risk?

Perhaps its worth digging deep and becoming vulnerable/letting your husband in more in order to have a deeply connected emotional experience and make that your goal instead of seeking others.

1000 percent.

Personally, I think the open/poly stuff is often a short cut to what people are really seeking, which is deep, intense vulnerability. Easy to have the illusion of that when you’re being “radical,” but you may look back and realize it was a lot of surface skimming.

And OP? Make no mistake: I say that with zero judgement. I’ve skimmed the surface a lot, and found plenty of, well, depth along the way. I’m not married, have basically lived the opposite life of you and yours, and am open to all sorts of interpretations of relationships.

But I do believe that ultimately what people are seeking is a deep connection that really only comes from vulnerablity. I know my sex life has been most enhanced not by new/multiple partners, but by finding ways to get more vulnerable with someone I’m close to. It’s so scary. It’s so awesome. And I do believe there is always another layer...

That said, I also totally support this experiment. It can go a million ways, many of them manageable.

This is worth listening to: https://www.thisamericanlife.org/457/what-i-did-for-love/act-one-0

I predict she will sleep with other men and he won't sleep with other women -- he'll attempt to perhaps or try to gear up for it, but end up more in an emotional affair - someone to talk to - and she will freak out and hit the wall when that happens. Or he will stay completely faithful

I agree with this.

Additionally, you really have to have a certain kind of personality or are in a particular situation to make an open marriages work. For example, I would think personality wise you would have to be a bit disattached emotionally. You love your husband, but only so much so you have additional room in your heart for others. You're not all in on the relationship. Or your job takes you away for six months or a year at a time and you find a surrogate wife or husband while you're away. Many doctors in the Army in MASH units would pair up with nurses just to provide that missing intimacy and then when their tour was over, they might never see them again and go back to their wives.

The big problem might be that the sex partners may not share that disattached emotion and might start falling in love. Someone in an affair, for instance, starts thinking about leaving their husband or boyfriend to marry their sex partner. And then things get messy. These relationships only work out if everyone thinks the same way and keeps their heads about what is happening.

So things can get very complicated. And what might seem workable in a fantasy might not be workable in real life.

But obviously you've already sort of talked about it, so you can suggest your try it. But just be careful if your emotions start to get in the way.

I think this is not going to go well, OP.

Neither of you is necessarily wrong in your desires, but I have a feeling it will get messy. Quick. He's already not really comfortable with the idea of you and another man together; he is not likely to get more comfortable with it when it actually happens.

Also, some questions you and he need to think about: what if you want to see the same guy more than once, or he wants to see the same woman more than once? Or one of you starts to have feelings for someone? What sort of boundaries will you two put in place? What happens if you do it once and he struggles so much with the idea that he shuts down any further extra-marital dalliances? Will you still feel happy remaining married with zero possibility of sex with anyone else, forever? What if you found another couple to swing with instead?

You need to think very carefully about whether this is worth the risk it will pose to your marriage. It is a very delicate matter and usually not without its complications. I would also not rule out the possibility that perhaps you married before you were really ready. You said you've been dating since your late teens, and that you haven't sex with anyone else for 8 years, so I gather you and he are still quite young?

I don't know everything but I will definitely try to give you the benefit of my experience.

I was once where you are- and my marriage didn't last.

From what you posted, it sounds like your husband is on the fence about this idea, because at one point you talk about it together in a realistic and practical sense, and at another point he admits it would feel weird for him to know another man is inside you. This is literally my experience as well, and my then-husband had been intrigued but really only went along with it because I kept pushing for it. I know now that it was a mistake.

As you said you want to have the experience of fun, casual sex. Just be careful what you ask for, because your perspective is not the only one to consider. Any number of things could happen, both bad and good, and you will have to take responsibility for it all. He could get attached to a woman he sleeps with. She could get psycho. You might call another man's name in bed and it would hurt his feelings. I mean literally the list could go on and on.

People do swing or have open marriages and I'm sure many of them are happy. But it would take a certain type of person to survive this lifestyle. If it's really not for you, or for him, it will damage your marriage.

Bottom line, I was not ready to be married, even though I loved him. There has been many tears, a lot of arguing, sadness, and people turning their backs on me.

I'm not saying you're as bad as I was, but I definitely think you should consider all the things that could happen if you move forward with this lifestyle.

Also for what it's worth, I think everyone on here is giving you some good advice.

Good luck

I dated a girl a few years ago that wanted an open relationship. Having recently left a 25 year relationship that started when I was 14, I was up for new experiences.

It's all good fantasising about an open relationship, but in real terms it's not all beer and skittles.

The first issue we faced was jealousy, especially if one is meeting more people than the other and neglecting the main relationship.

Second you need to trust your partner does the right thing. I found once she got drunk and didn't use protection.

Thirdly and probably the most likely thing to happen is...... Don't be surprised when your husband meets someone who rocks his world and you find yourself divorced. You can say it's casual sex and you won't get emotionally involved, but that rarely happens. 4 months in I met an amazing girl and broke it off with my girlfriend. Honestly by that stage, I'd almost had enough of the lifestyle anyway. Juggling multiple hook ups is tiring.

What you forget when being in a long term relationship are all those amazing emotions when you meet someone new. Lust is a crazy drug and eventually turns into love. Once both of you get a taste of it, you will never be able to give each other the same intense feelings. It can be a slippery slope to losing control of everything.

Like another person said, it's probably better to get divorced or at least separate before meeting anyone new, as there is a good chance it could lead down that path anyway and cause a lot of pain if one of you leave for another person.

The only way to "make it happen" is to get divorced since you don't agree on things and want to be single to pursue your fantasies.

-I've only been with 7 people, male and female.

 

-I did bring up the idea of an open relationship about 4 years ago. He wasn't totally against it, but was hesitant.

 

-We are the same age but he generally prefers older women (40+) and I am very attracted to younger men (18-25ish). Neither of us has ever slept with the sort of older woman/younger man that we fantasize about.

 

-We've danced around this for so long, how do I make it happen?

It seems to me that you and him are not compatible on that aspect. You can't change him nor him can or should try to change you.

Well I'm no expert on the subject but I will leave here a quote from Lucretius that worth a reading

"Moreover, we move ever, we spend our time amid the same things, nor by length of life is any new pleasure hammered out. But so long as we have not what we crave, it seems to surpass all else; afterward, when that is ours, we crave something else, and the same thirst for life besets us ever, openmouthed".

Today, society makes us believe that all desire are legitimate, that the important thing is to have "fun" but is the fullfillment of each and every of our desire, a constant seek of the "fun", through casual sex in your case or whatever activities in general, really a path to happyness ? is it really liberating or do we just enslave ourselves to our moving desire ?

If you go down that road, I bet that what Lucrecius say will happen, you will jump from one story to another, seeking "fun" "adventure" and as soon as one casual sex will be yours, you will crave another one, and another until it bores you and you will seek another thing than sex and so on.

So, my advice would be that before asking the question "how do I make it happen?" why not take a few days/weeks and ask yourself "is it really worth it for this to happen ? what am I looking for in this open relationship and at the end of the day if that happens am I going to be happier going around and having sex with other partners ?"

My opinion on the matter is obviously bias and I'm not saying I'm right but the question above worth thinking about imho.

Also don't get me wrong, I love shot of adrenaline and dopamine, I still love the "deutsche romantik" the feeling of the absolute unmediated and it is true that passion is a powerfull drive but in principle the passion has tragic ending whether it is in history (great men have tragic destiny) or in opera and I don't see it coming a different way in the life of regular people so think twice before making a move.

Just my 2 cents.

Wish you well.

It seems to me that you and him are not compatible on that aspect. You can't change him nor him can or should try to change you.

I agree.

Instead on focusing on sex, maybe it would be better to look at the marriage as a whole. It sounds like you both rushed into marriage. You sound like two young people who figured marriage was the thing you had to do, but this isn't actually a match nor were you ready for a lifetime commitment.

It's one thing if two people from the start decide to be non monogamous. You married someone though promising to commit yourself to only him. No matter how it is framed, going outside the marriage is breaking that vow.

Are you sure? It doesn't seem so.

I have been happily married

My best guess is by asking prior to making a lifelong contentment through marriage.

I can compartmentalize sex. I can appreciate attractive men and women. Neither is even remotely an implication of an open marriage. We do have a "don't ask, don't tell" policy that was conveyed prior to getting married, but less so as a license to go wild as it was a matter of not wanting to kill the relationship if a one-off, completely incidental / physical thing does end up happening over the course of however many decades we plan to be together. But, again, that was communicated and agreed upon prior to vows being exchanged and, ideally, isn't a privilege that's ever exercised.

That you'd like not only to open the marriage but have dinner talk about your extramarital weekend bangs speaks to the fact you ****ed up marrying this man. If you insist on it, I'd do so with a counselor present.

Wow, thank you all for your responses. I've got a lot to think about! I was saddened to see that most of you think this won't work out. But you all make excellent points, and you've made me think about some things that I had not thought about. This situation really is a Pandora's Box, as someone mentioned, and I've realized that there are lots of emotions involved. Not emotions that I feel for other men, but rather my emotions about my marriage.

When I say I have been happily married, it is true. Not 100% of the time, but who is? Everybody has some dissatisfaction in their marriage I'm sure, nobody is happy with every aspect of their partner and their relationship. I do feel that I married too young, that is something I have been aware of for a while.

I'm sure I could point out all kinds of reasons for why I might have my casual attitude about sex: I was sexually abused as a child, I was raised by a single father who always talked about sex as a casual thing, I have low self-esteem so it just feels good to have the attention, etc. Are any of them truly the reason? Maybe, I don't know.

I love my husband as a partner in life most of the time. And we actually have great sex together! He has been there for me through some tough situations, and he claims that he'd be dead if not for me. That last piece... it sounds romantic but I know he means it. He suffers from suicidal depression. It has become worse over time, starting with events that happened with his job shortly before we married, after we got engaged.

Things have become worse and worse for us, financially, over the course of our marriage. Often I do blame it on him. Not to his face, never to his face, but I've been working full-time for the whole marriage and he has been scraping by working part-time. He changed careers and stopped working for several months to go back to school, then after he got certified he realized he hated the new career and went back to the one he originally went to school for, leaving us about $5000 in debt for nothing. The original one, which he still does now, requires lots of networking, but he can't push himself to do that, so he makes barely any money. So I do get resentful, feeling like I work hard and it's his fault we can never get ahead. He knows he isn't pulling his weight, and feels bad. But he just sinks into depression instead of letting it motivate him to take action. I have always comforted him, assured him we'd get through it, etc.

I guess the more I think about it, the more unhappiness I find within myself. I have always had to be the strong, mature one in our relationship. He has always let me wear the pants, despite me always saying I want to be equal with my husband, not his mom or his boss. I handle all the finances. I plan and cook all the meals. I do almost all the grocery shopping. Whenever we need to move, it's up to me to find a new apartment. When either of us wants to find a new job, I have to be the one to find it unless a friend of his knows someone who is hiring. If I am upset about something, I have to be careful that I don't trigger him to be depressed if I try telling him about my problems, because that will be worse than struggling on my own with what makes me unhappy. Then I'm still unhappy but have to focus on making him feel better.

I'm sure there's more I could say but I am running late getting ready for work. But wow, I had no idea how much was festering inside me. What do I do with this? I am about 98% certain that if I asked for divorce, he would kill himself. He is a good, kind, generous, funny man who is loved by so many people in our life. How could I possibly do that?

Edit: I feel I need to add that he has actually been diagnosed with a mental illness that causes his depression, and he does take medication and see a therapist about it. He is bipolar, and his meds seem to stop the manic episodes but they no longer seem to do much for the depression. He has had his meds adjusted many times.

So I would say this isn't really about sex but about wanting a temporary escape from a stressful and unsatisfying marriage.

I predict that if you don't get the "open marriage" you ask for you will just end up having an affair. And you will fall in love with your affair partner, who will either be everything your husband is not or will be exciting and fun.

Why do you feel responsible for your husband's very life? How did you end up getting assigned this role?

Sorry to hear this. With all due respect, your marriage sounds horrible. Asking for an "open marriage" will not fix anything. That is like trying to fix a caved in leaking roof by shining your shoes. It sounds like an excuse to shop for a better partner without feeling guilty for cheating or having to divorce him and feel guilty about that.

Also what you are asking is "does anyone have ideas on how I can sell this idea to him without making it sound like what it is?"

Sadly you have a huge role in being the mothering and smothering and domineering. It sounds like a horrible situation that you wish to find a guilt-free solution for by spinning it as "an open marriage".

You label him as the sick fragile one. However being with someone like that means you would benefit greatly from your own private therapy where you could discuss reasonable, effective and viable solutions.

He suffers from suicidal depression.

Things have become worse and worse for us, financially, over the course of our marriage. Often I do blame it on him.

 

-I've been working full-time for the whole marriage and he has been scraping by working part-time. He changed careers and stopped working for several months to go back to school, then after he got certified he realized he hated the new career and went back to the one he originally went to school for, leaving us about $5000 in debt for nothing.

 

-I do get resentful, feeling like I work hard and it's his fault we can never get ahead.

 

-I guess the more I think about it, the more unhappiness I find within myself. I have always had to be the strong, mature one in our relationship. He has always let me wear the pants, despite me always saying I want to be equal with my husband, not his mom or his boss.

 

-I am about 98% certain that if I asked for divorce, he would kill himself.

 

-He is bipolar, and his meds seem to stop the manic episodes but they no longer seem to do much for the depression. He has had his meds adjusted many times.

 

Don't be surprised when your husband meets someone who rocks his world and you find yourself divorced.

That can happen even in a non-open marriage. And it's not gender specific, she could meet someone else too.

Emotional affairs under the guise of a "friendship" are not all that uncommon.

 

Lust is a crazy drug and eventually turns into love.

 

Not always but agree it can happen. The openness, freeness and non-pressured environment within which sex and lust are happening with a new person is a perfect recipe.

Unlike marriage where there are "obligations" "expectations" and "rules" that can sometimes lead to complacency, boredom in the bedroom, lack of passion, love lost.

Hence the reason OP is considering this imo.

You have shared some really great insight OP... in your second post you get honest about what is really going on... have you sat down and spoken to your husband about any of that?

I love what bluecastle said about intimacy... and I 1000% agree with him... that what people are often searching for when they are dissatisfied in relationships is that next level of intimacy with their SO.

You need to take the burden of his well being and life off your shoulders... you are in a codependent relationship where you are essentially twisting yourself into a pretzel trying to make sure he will be okay. It's like watching someone be in a relationship with an addict or alcoholic. It isn't because of you that he is alive today (you don't have that much power I'm sorry) and it wouldn't be because of you that he did do something foolish like try to hurt himself.

I see an open relationship in your case as an excuse to escape the feelings you are having and to potentially relieve yourself of the burden of caring for him by getting him to fall for someone else. I suggest that instead, seek a couples therapist that can help you guys discuss these feelings you are having.

updated...not the right advice after reading a follow-up post

I'm sure I could point out all kinds of reasons for why I might have my casual attitude about sex: I was sexually abused as a child, I was raised by a single father who always talked about sex as a casual thing, I have low self-esteem so it just feels good to have the attention, etc. Are any of them truly the reason? Maybe, I don't know.

I love my husband as a partner in life most of the time. And we actually have great sex together! He has been there for me through some tough situations, and he claims that he'd be dead if not for me. That last piece... it sounds romantic but I know he means it. He suffers from suicidal depression. It has become worse over time, starting with events that happened with his job shortly before we married, after we got engaged.

Things have become worse and worse for us, financially, over the course of our marriage. Often I do blame it on him. Not to his face, never to his face, but I've been working full-time for the whole marriage and he has been scraping by working part-time. He changed careers and stopped working for several months to go back to school, then after he got certified he realized he hated the new career and went back to the one he originally went to school for, leaving us about $5000 in debt for nothing. The original one, which he still does now, requires lots of networking, but he can't push himself to do that, so he makes barely any money. So I do get resentful, feeling like I work hard and it's his fault we can never get ahead. He knows he isn't pulling his weight, and feels bad. But he just sinks into depression instead of letting it motivate him to take action. I have always comforted him, assured him we'd get through it, etc.

I suggest you seek counseling to address the sexual abuse you have endured instead of seeking sex outside of marriage and stop suggesting an open marriage.

Men often feel that their wives don't love them if they are not having sex/seeking it elsewhere and it will only break it down.

His education was not a waste -- if he didn't try it, he would have regretted it and always wondered - it was a risk that didn't pan out.

Maybe he will be able to use some of those skills in some way.

Are you living within your means? Are there other ways you can "right size" your life? whether that means a more sensible car, coupons, etc, and maybe

you knew the job he had when you met him.

Telling someone they are a financial burden doesn't help the person get motivated.

I'm sure I could point out all kinds of reasons for why I might have my casual attitude about sex: , I have low self-esteem so it just feels good to have the attention, etc. Are any of them truly the reason? Maybe, I don't know.

 

I love my husband as a partner in life most of the time. And we actually have great sex together! He has been there for me through some tough situations, and he claims that he'd be dead if not for me. That last piece... it sounds romantic but I know he means it. He suffers from suicidal depression. It has become worse over time, starting with events that happened with his job shortly before we married, after we got engaged.

 

Things have become worse and worse for us, financially, over the course of our marriage. Often I do blame it on him. Not to his face, never to his face, but I've been working full-time for the whole marriage and he has been scraping by working part-time. He changed careers and stopped working for several months to go back to school, then after he got certified he realized he hated the new career and went back to the one he originally went to school for, leaving us about $5000 in debt for nothing. The original one, which he still does now, requires lots of networking, but he can't push himself to do that, so he makes barely any money. So I do get resentful, feeling like I work hard and it's his fault we can never get ahead. He knows he isn't pulling his weight, and feels bad. But he just sinks into depression instead of letting it motivate him to take action. I have always comforted him, assured him we'd get through it, etc.

 

I guess the more I think about it, the more unhappiness I find within myself. I have always had to be the strong, mature one in our relationship. He has always let me wear the pants, despite me always saying I want to be equal with my husband, not his mom or his boss. I handle all the finances. I plan and cook all the meals. I do almost all the grocery shopping. Whenever we need to move, it's up to me to find a new apartment. When either of us wants to find a new job, I have to be the one to find it unless a friend of his knows someone who is hiring. If I am upset about something, I have to be careful that I don't trigger him to be depressed if I try telling him about my problems, because that will be worse than struggling on my own with what makes me unhappy. Then I'm still unhappy but have to focus on making him feel better.

 

I'm sure there's more I could say but I am running late getting ready for work. But wow, I had no idea how much was festering inside me. What do I do with this? I am about 98% certain that if I asked for divorce, he would kill himself. He is a good, kind, generous, funny man who is loved by so many people in our life. How could I possibly do that?

 

Edit: I feel I need to add that he has actually been diagnosed with a mental illness that causes his depression, and he does take medication and see a therapist about it. He is bipolar, and his meds seem to stop the manic episodes but they no longer seem to do much for the depression. He has had his meds adjusted many times.

OP, when reading all of the above, asking for an open marriage should be the last thing on your mind. Having low self-esteem and looking for attention this way has disaster written all over it and will not end well for you. The situation with your husband in general, again, I highly doubt an open marriage will ever work for him. If anything, it will backfire on you so badly.

You mention that your husband is seeing a therapist, but maybe YOU should look into therapy yourself to help you sort out all of your own issues. I think it will be of benefit to you - far more than looking for attention outside of your marriage.