Pursuing too much or too little?

Hi All,

I am a brand new poster here and I was wondering if you all could give me some advice. I met a girl after a college lecture and found that we had a ton in common. She seemed very nervous talking to me the first few times that I approached her and I assumed that this was an indication of attraction. I asked her for her number the next time that I saw her, and she happily gave it to me.

We went out on a date the following week. I wanted to learn more about this girl before spending money on an expensive date so I simply asked her out for coffee. We mostly just walked around and enjoyed the environment together. The date went well, but not great. We talked and had light-hearted fun the entire time but I felt that she was much less interested in me than I was in her. I did almost all of the question asking, and I was the only one between the two of us that ever moved the dialogue to a new topic. Afterward she agreed that she wanted go on a second, more romantic date in the future.

I decided to ask her out (officially) on a second date the following week. We went out at night to a nice but casual restaurant. I got her to open up more this time, but she still seemed pretty reserved/not touchy the entire time. After dinner, we held hands and walked around for a while. Eventually I stopped walking, we made eye contact and I kissed her. She remarked that she had been wondering when I was going to do that. We escalated back to my place and made out, and felt each other up on my couch but I could tell that she was not comfortable enough to take it to the bedroom. Whenever I tried subtly to escalate the encounter physically she would (with a (smirk) bring it back to PG-13. But, she took the initiative in making out each time. After this point it was very late so I decided to take her back home. She told me that she had a great time and that she would like to go out again, we kissed goodbye and she went inside.

I did not contact her for 4 days and she did not contact me either. When I finally texted her the following week, I tried setting up a date for the next weekend and she gave me the "can I let you know the day before" speech. I responded that I was more interested in setting up a firm date and if she could not commit to a day and time that I would prefer to just find a day where she was free. She recanted her hesitancy and said that she could definitely meet on that day. The day before the date, however she cancelled with the "hope to get together soon though" speech.

I played it very casually and decided that if she wanted to go out again, she would have to contact me first. I waited two weeks, but eventually she reached out and asked for another date. She said that she had been very busy but that she wanted to go out that Saturday to a movie. I told her that I wasn't that interested in anything in the theaters, but i'd be happy to make dinner and watch an old movie at my place. She asked what time i'd be free on Saturday, and I told her but after that I got no response until two days later (Friday). She told me that some family had surprised her and came in from out of town and that she couldn't meet that weekend. I responded the next day with a simple "that sounds nice".

Another week passed and I ran into her again after a class and we had a nice short talk, where she seemed more receptive to me than she had been in the past. She made better eye contact and was more casual and enthusiastic in the conversation. I walked her to her next class, gave her a hug and we went our separate ways.

I wanted to know how (or if) I should contact her next. Should I even bother with this girl? She has cancelled a firm date and she waited two days to reply after trying to set up a second date. I don't know at this point if I should reach out and try to set up another date, or if I should just allow her to come at her own speed.\

I do have a few other options, but this girl is just way better than any of the other girls that I am talking to.

I wanted to know how (or if) I should contact her next. Should I even bother with this girl? She has cancelled a firm date and she waited two days to reply after trying to set up a second date. I don't know at this point if I should reach out and try to set up another date, or if I should just allow her to come at her own speed.\

 

I do have a few other options, but this girl is just way better than any of the other girls that I am talking to.

I would say for a girl being "way better than any of the other girls", if anything, she seems rather flaky. Really lukewarm, imo. I would cut my losses and go for your other options. Who knows, you may actually find someone who IS "way better".

the biggest problem is that on the two subsequent dates that I have gone on with other girls I have been aloof/uninterested because I was thinking about the other girl throughout the date. I took this as a sign that both of these subsequent dates just weren't that good and ended contact but now I have no girls that I am really that interested in going on dates with.

I wouldn't bother with her anymore. I'm not sure if she's flaky or game playing, or maybe both, but it doesn't sound like she would be worth your time and investment.

the biggest problem is that on the two subsequent dates that I have gone on with other girls I have been aloof/uninterested because I was thinking about the other girl throughout the date. I took this as a sign that both of these subsequent dates just weren't that good and ended contact but now I have no girls that I am really that interested in going on dates with.

^Unfortunately, this comes with the world of dating. But let's face it, even if this other girl wasn't on your mind or in the picture, it doesn't sound like you were interested enough in these other girls regardless to go out with them again.

There will be other girls in the picture. Just be patient and don't rush into anything only to be with someone.

You give her a lot of silence, waiting for her to reach out. She did. But she probably thinks you just want to have quick sex. You tried to take it to the bedroom and when that didn't happen, you disappeared on her. She reached out with a Saturday night availability to go out on a date. Again you tried to take it to the bedroom by suggesting your place instead (cooking and movie at home leading to makeout and bedroom). She probably became more casual later because she lost interest so she's no longer nervous. And she might be seeing someone that's why she no longer fears appearing eager.

You give her a lot of silence, waiting for her to reach out. She did. But she probably thinks you just want to have quick sex. You tried to take it to the bedroom and when that didn't happen, you disappeared on her. She reached out with a Saturday night availability to go out on a date. Again you tried to take it to the bedroom by suggesting your place instead (cooking and movie at home leading to makeout and bedroom). She probably became more casual later because she lost interest so she's no longer nervous. And she might be seeing someone that's why she no longer fears appearing eager.

Yah I was just about to post the same thing.

OP, please tell us you are not following some PUA garbage?

First date coffee, second date dinner, back to yours, you pushed for sex, she's not biting, so you take her home and didn't contact her for four days?

May I ask what your thought process was about that?

When you did contact her, you asked her out, she wasn't sure she could on that day, so you heavy handedly told her that wasn't gonna fly, you needed a firm day.

My goodness, inflexible much?

Then after two weeks of no contact she calls, proposed going to the theatre, you knocked that down, instead proposing another date back at yours??

Good lord from her perspective, could it be any more obvious what you were after?

No she didn't "flake," she just wasn't interested in what you were after, again from her perspective based on your actions/non actions --- sex at yours on the third date.

Next time, try and be more flexible and try to not be so obvious about wanting sex with her so soon.

You give her a lot of silence, waiting for her to reach out. She did. But she probably thinks you just want to have quick sex. You tried to take it to the bedroom and when that didn't happen, you disappeared on her. She reached out with a Saturday night availability to go out on a date. Again you tried to take it to the bedroom by suggesting your place instead (cooking and movie at home leading to makeout and bedroom). She probably became more casual later because she lost interest so she's no longer nervous. And she might be seeing someone that's why she no longer fears appearing eager.

I definitely see this perspective as being potentially legitimate. I don't want to come off as someone who is just trying to have sex with her.

On the other side of the coin though, she was the one who cancelled the last date and didn't hit me up for a week and a half after that. It made me feel like she didn't really care that much about my time so I felt like I needed to test whether she was interested in just spending time with me or if she wanted someone who was just going to take her out to dinner and pay for her movie ticket. I thought that if I gave up my Saturday so easily after she flaked on me before that she would lose respect for me or value my time even less.

Most the girls that I have dated in the past who wanted serious relationships were very communicative and didn't play games from the beginning. So my impression was that this girl had a lower level of initial attraction and was either testing me to see if I would just open up my weekend to her or she was just keeping me on the back burner in case her other plans fizzled out. I guess there's a chance that she actually wanted to go out but was afraid that I was only in it for a hook-up though.

@katrina1980 Initially I waited to contact her for a few days after the date because in the past the girls that I have dated will text me first on the day after if they really enjoyed it. I assumed that since I didn't get a text that she wanted some space or she just wasn't that interested. I didn't want to come across as pushy or over-eager so I decided to play back and let her come to me if she wanted to spend more time with me.

When she cancelled the second date despite agreeing to firm plans, I took it as a more official rejection. She never offered up another time to hang out so I just stopped pursuing at that point. When she did hit me up I offered for her to come over as a test of whether she actually wanted to spend time with me or whether she just wanted someone who was going to take her out and show her a good time but she wasn't super interested in just spending time with me.

I agree that maybe the "dinner at my place" approach is a bit PUA-esque but I also don't want to spend time and money on someone who doesn't really have that high of an interest in me as a person. Her behavior leading up to that point lead me to believe that she was attracted in me but didn't totally respect my time and that she wasn't overeager to talk to me or go out with me.

Now that some time has passed, do you think that I should ask her out again or should I just let this one go?

Flakey, flakey!

I would lose the number, plus you said she did not carry on a very good convo or show much interest in you.

Hi All,

 

I am a brand new poster here and I was wondering if you all could give me some advice. I met a girl after a college lecture and found that we had a ton in common. She seemed very nervous talking to me the first few times that I approached her and I assumed that this was an indication of attraction. I asked her for her number the next time that I saw her, and she happily gave it to me.

 

We went out on a date the following week. I wanted to learn more about this girl before spending money on an expensive date so I simply asked her out for coffee. We mostly just walked around and enjoyed the environment together. The date went well, but not great. We talked and had light-hearted fun the entire time but I felt that she was much less interested in me than I was in her. I did almost all of the question asking, and I was the only one between the two of us that ever moved the dialogue to a new topic. Afterward she agreed that she wanted go on a second, more romantic date in the future.

 

I decided to ask her out (officially) on a second date the following week. We went out at night to a nice but casual restaurant. I got her to open up more this time, but she still seemed pretty reserved/not touchy the entire time. After dinner, we held hands and walked around for a while. Eventually I stopped walking, we made eye contact and I kissed her. She remarked that she had been wondering when I was going to do that. We escalated back to my place and made out, and felt each other up on my couch but I could tell that she was not comfortable enough to take it to the bedroom. Whenever I tried subtly to escalate the encounter physically she would (with a (smirk) bring it back to PG-13. But, she took the initiative in making out each time. After this point it was very late so I decided to take her back home. She told me that she had a great time and that she would like to go out again, we kissed goodbye and she went inside.

 

I did not contact her for 4 days and she did not contact me either. When I finally texted her the following week, I tried setting up a date for the next weekend and she gave me the "can I let you know the day before" speech. I responded that I was more interested in setting up a firm date and if she could not commit to a day and time that I would prefer to just find a day where she was free. She recanted her hesitancy and said that she could definitely meet on that day. The day before the date, however she cancelled with the "hope to get together soon though" speech.

 

I played it very casually and decided that if she wanted to go out again, she would have to contact me first. I waited two weeks, but eventually she reached out and asked for another date. She said that she had been very busy but that she wanted to go out that Saturday to a movie. I told her that I wasn't that interested in anything in the theaters, but i'd be happy to make dinner and watch an old movie at my place. She asked what time i'd be free on Saturday, and I told her but after that I got no response until two days later (Friday). She told me that some family had surprised her and came in from out of town and that she couldn't meet that weekend. I responded the next day with a simple "that sounds nice".

 

Another week passed and I ran into her again after a class and we had a nice short talk, where she seemed more receptive to me than she had been in the past. She made better eye contact and was more casual and enthusiastic in the conversation. I walked her to her next class, gave her a hug and we went our separate ways.

 

I wanted to know how (or if) I should contact her next. Should I even bother with this girl? She has cancelled a firm date and she waited two days to reply after trying to set up a second date. I don't know at this point if I should reach out and try to set up another date, or if I should just allow her to come at her own speed.\

 

I do have a few other options, but this girl is just way better than any of the other girls that I am talking to.

OP, the thought of you only wanting to have sex with her didn't cross my mind until you counter-proposed her theatre idea with dinner and a movie at your place.

But, this doesn't negate my thought that there was still some game playing or flakiness on her part.

I did not contact her for 4 days and she did not contact me either. When I finally texted her the following week, I tried setting up a date for the next weekend and she gave me the "can I let you know the day before" speech. I responded that I was more interested in setting up a firm date and if she could not commit to a day and time that I would prefer to just find a day where she was free. She recanted her hesitancy and said that she could definitely meet on that day. The day before the date, however she cancelled with the "hope to get together soon though" speech.

^This made me think twice and wonder if she was game playing. I can appreciate wanting to make plans in advance and wanting to firm-up a date. I wouldn't expect any guy (or anyone in general for that matter) to be okay with me asking if I can let them know whether or not I can make it for a date the day before. I can't imagine making that request. The ONLY way I would request this is if I had other plans I had to confirm, and even then, I would say, ''I may have other plans on the go, they just haven't been firmed up yet. How about I contact you when I have a better idea of my schedule''. This way I'm not leaving anyone hanging, or expecting anyone to wait for me to confirm plans.

Then, she cancels the day before, says ''hope to get together soon'', and then doesn't reach out for two weeks (and then, it took two days for her to respond to a text convo that she initiated).

Out of curiosity, OP, when did you contact her about this second date after your first date and when did you propose to see her? Did you contact her on a Monday and propose to see her the following Saturday, for example?

I do think you could have reached out sooner after your first date, OP, and the counter-proposal re: having a dinner and a movie as a second date at your place does sound like you're only after sex.

Some women would be okay with this, but if you're ultimately looking for an exclusive, monogamous relationship with a like-minded woman, I'd err on the side of caution and not propose this type of date so early on.

It's not to say that a second date at home with dinner and a movie wouldn't lead to a relationship, because it could. It's just that there are a lot of women out there in the dating world who suspect that there are many men only looking for sex, and this type of second date suggestion would make a woman think twice and question your intentions.

Your first paragrah in your last post -- clearly she is not like other girls you dated, not into chasing, and by waiting four days to contact her after second date during which you pushed for sex, she was most likely feeling like YOU were not interested.

If I may ask, where did you learn that texting/calling a girl a day or two after a date is over-eager, needy, clingy?

Corey Wayne? Lol

It's not, it shows you are interested and real versus playing the waiting "game" which is BS.

I think things probably started heading downhill for her after that.

Combined with your heavy handed attitude about her not being sure when she could commit to next date, it went further downhill.

Then after no contact for two weeks, SHE reaches out which indicates strong interest, suggests a date outside the house, you reject instead proposing an in-home date at yours.

DONE.

Sure, reach out and ask her out on a "proper" date, court her a bit. Be flexible and try not to see rejection at every turn..

Hope it's not too late.

Good luck!

Unless. I plan on sleeping with some dude - one I had been dating - I would not be receptive to a date with him at his home. OP, ask girls on proper dates. Not this one, though.

OP, the thought of you only wanting to have sex with her didn't cross my mind until you counter-proposed her theatre idea with dinner and a movie at your place.

 

But, this doesn't negate my thought that there was still some game playing or flakiness on her part.

 

^This made me think twice and wonder if she was game playing. I can appreciate wanting to make plans in advance and wanting to firm-up a date. I wouldn't expect any guy (or anyone in general for that matter) to be okay with me asking if I can let them know whether or not I can make it for a date the day before. I can't imagine making that request. The ONLY way I would request this is if I had other plans I had to confirm, and even then, I would say, ''I may have other plans on the go, they just haven't been firmed up yet. How about I contact you when I have a better idea of my schedule''. This way I'm not leaving anyone hanging, or expecting anyone to wait for me to confirm plans.

Then, she cancels the day before, says ''hope to get together soon'', and then doesn't reach out for two weeks (and then, it took two days for her to respond to a text convo that she initiated).

Out of curiosity, OP, when did you contact her about this second date after your first date and when did you propose to see her? Did you contact her on a Monday and propose to see her the following Saturday, for example?

I do think you could have reached out sooner after your first date, OP, and the counter-proposal re: having a dinner and a movie as a second date at your place does sound like you're only after sex.

Some women would be okay with this, but if you're ultimately looking for an exclusive, monogamous relationship with a like-minded woman, I'd err on the side of caution and not propose this type of date so early on.

It's not to say that a second date at home with dinner and a movie wouldn't lead to a relationship, because it could. It's just that there are a lot of women out there in the dating world who suspect that there are many men only looking for sex, and this type of second date suggestion would make a woman think twice and question your intentions.

Yea I am starting to see the error of asking for a date at my place. I guess I was kind of annoyed by her flakiness on the second date and I didn't want to spend more money taking someone out if they were going to play games and treat my time like that. Obviously she wasn't interested in me enough to where she would agree to that, and I accept that I may have pushed her away at this point by seeming only interested in having sex.

to answer your question, the first date was a coffee date where we just wandered around and talked for a couple hours and it happened on a Friday afternoon. She texted me the following night by asking how my meeting had gone (I had a big meeting on Saturday) and we texted (lightly) for a couple hours before I took the opportunity to set up the next date for the following Thursday. We went out to dinner that Thursday. On Tuesday of the next week, I tried setting up a third date for the upcoming Sunday. Then on Saturday night she cancelled the date saying that she was going to be too busy and wouldn't be able to meet but wanted to get together soon.

Your first paragrah in your last post -- clearly she is not like other girls you dated, not into chasing, and by waiting four days to contact her after second date during which you pushed for sex, she was most likely feeling like YOU were not interested.

 

If I may ask, where did you learn that texting/calling a girl a day or two after a date is over-eager, needy, clingy?

 

Corey Wayne? Lol

 

It's not, it shows you are interested and real versus playing the waiting "game" which is BS.

 

I think things probably started heading downhill for her after that.

 

Combined with your heavy handed attitude about her not being sure when she could commit to next date, it went further downhill.

 

Then after no contact for two weeks, SHE reaches out which indicates strong interest, suggests a date outside the house, you reject instead proposing an in-home date at yours.

 

DONE.

 

Sure, reach out and ask her out on a "proper" date, court her a bit. Be flexible and try not to see rejection at every turn..

 

Hope it's not too late.

 

Good luck!

I learned this from Corey Wayne and a few other internet dating coaches, yes. I think that some of the stuff that he believes in is a little bit old fashioned, but a lot of what he said is true and it has shown to be true in my real life. I have always had more success with the women I was less interested in than the ones that I was really interested in. I don't necessarily think this is based solely off appearance as I have dated women who I definitely felt were out of my league physically but just proved to be incompatible or uninteresting after a few dates. The ones that I really wanted I always was willing to clear my schedule to see them. This never got me anywhere and the more effort I put in the more they seemed to take advantage of me and blow me off.

You really gave off the impression that you wanted sex. She probably isn't keen on it so soon so dial to back. Trying to get her into your bedroom and following it up with 4 days of silence wasn't cool.

That's the problem with following advice from dating coaches. In overall, some of them do have interesting things to say to open your eyes to some things, but when you use their advice as a 'recipe' for how you should act without considering the specifics of your situation, you can up screwing up momentum that was in your favor (given she contacted you again after those 2 weeks).

Backing off is good sometimes and can create attraction, just not right after you tried for sex and didn't get it. Probably made her think that you were frustrated with the situation. Also, following that with a 'dinner at my place' option when she invited you for a normal date (clearly trying not to end up in sex), again, you need to read your situation and not try to apply a dating coach's recipe.

In the end, I hope this teaches you why you should do what YOU think is best, according to your values, not what a dating coach suggests in a generic video trying to get people to book a paid 'session' with them.

You are pushing way too hard to get in your dates pants. Very common mistake stemming from inexperience with women. You have to cool it with the pickup artist nonsense with refusing to contact her, "escalating to the bedroom", etc.

The last thing you want while in university is a date-rape charge. Use common sense when dating and start to learn more about women. Lack of contact, pushing for the score, etc is why you are striking out.

Go on a few dates, text here and there in between, stop forcing anyone to "give you a firm date". Relax and don't push this hard. It makes you seem desperate, inexperienced, horny and immature. Not exactly what the ladies go for.