My Marriage: Breaking Point is here (Please read and comment)

Hey guys. Long-time ENA member, first 'new post' in a long time.

In short, I've been married for 4 years to my college sweetheart. In total, we've been together for 10 years and both of us are approaching 30. We don't have kids and rent an apartment that we've lived in for 6 years now.

Alike most relationships, a lot of things ancillary things happened that indirectly put strain on our marriage. A short list is presented below.

*My parents got divorced 3 years ago after 32 years of marriage. My Dad cheated and my Mom has MS. My mom has a hard time getting around, so my wife and I spent endless weekends with her. She lives about 2 hours away, so we spent a lot of time in the car. We were there for her emotionally and helped her pack and move into her new home. This whole process took at least 9 months. My Mom has 'split personality disorder', so sometimes, the relationship is good. Other times, the relationship is rocky. I think she views me as a trigger and has been very nasty to me. My Mom and I haven't talked in 3 months. My Dad and I have light, half-hearted converations that I don't go anywhere.

*My wife's Mom has been in-and-out of the hospital with health issues.

*My sister just left rehab a few days ago.

My parent getting divorced had a huge impact on me. I've been very 'closed off' to everyone (e.g., work people, my wife, friends). I don't think I'm depressed--I think I'm just not in a good head space right and don't want to 'let anyone in'. To anyone, it's clear that I'm not my same usual self.

A few months ago, I expressed to my wife that I wanted solo counselling because it didn't like how I felt, individually, and wanted help. At the time, she was afraid of what 'may happen' (divorce) and was against it. I respected her wishes, to my own detriment, and buried myself in work. Fast forward to today and she's on-board with doing solo counselling and marriage counselling. Our first session is in 2 weeks. I'll admit that I've been closed off to everyone, even her, for a long time now. I knew this was an issue and I wanted to work on it.

On her side, she agrees that I've been closed off to her. However, she's started hanging with a new group of girlfriends that she goes to the gym with. Value-wise, they are much different than we are. (They are lower class, IMO.) She spends a lot of time with this group and recently, has gone to bars, done overnight trips for birthdays, etc. I don't have any issues with her seeing friends, but it's become too frequent. I expressed this to her and she agreed with me that it has become too frequent. She justifies it by saying that I haven't been as available to her emotionally and she sought out fun friends as an outlet (She admits this wasn't a good decision.)

Last night, I went through her phone for the first time in 5 years because I don't like where things are going with the new friends. I went through the group text with the 'new friends' and saw a lot of things I didn't like. They went on an overnight trip last weekend. All women trip for a birthday.

1. One text talked about her doing 'the walk of shame' due to drinking too much. She a social drinker, never been a heavy drinker.

2. Her talking about she's become a 'degenerate' like they are. (She's super successful in her career, so this was stunning to see)

3. Her friend's male cousin saying he wanted to marry her because she posted stuff for him.

4. Her aunt not liking my zodiac sign and saying she should consider other things.

None of these texts are good, at all. We talked about all of this for 2-3 hours last night--and didn't really come to a resolution. She told me over-and-over that she loves me, didn't cheat/do anything bad, but I'm skeptical. We've never cheated on each other. Things haven't been good recently. I don't know if I trust her because this new group of friends is just so different than what we normally see.

ENAers--what do you think? Should I give her the benefit of the doubt and work through things in counselling? Or is this is a big time red flag that I should just move on from?

P.S. Our sex life is still very good. We've been intimate 3-4 times this week alone. Maybe because it's another outlet for expression. Either way, that facet of our relationship is good.

Absolutely, counseling is worth it. You both have to be committed to it though . You just can’t go through and cut everybody out. And she has to reel in time spent with the friends . It has become make it or break it time .

This time make it about you and her NOT about mom and dad and sisters and aunts and everybody else in the universe . Let those people all fend for themselves . There’s no point in helping those people if it devastates your own life .

If I were her, I'd be very upset about you going through her phone (and THAT'S the big red flag here, along with you disapproving of her new friends because you consider them lower class), or did you do so with her permission while she was present? Whatever, none of the following sounds like cheating although it does suggest a bit of over-indulgence in alcohol:

1. One text talked about her doing 'the walk of shame' due to drinking too much. She a social drinker, never been a heavy drinker.

2. Her talking about she's become a 'degenerate' like they are. (She's super successful in her career, so this was stunning to see)

3. Her friend's male cousin saying he wanted to marry her because she posted stuff for him.

4. Her aunt not liking my zodiac sign and saying she should consider other things.

Her friend's male cousin saying he wanted to marry her because she'd done him a favour just sounds like a bit of OTT banter (I've lost count of the number of people who've said they wanted to marry me because of something trivial I've done!)

And as for your zodiac sign... well...! Is that really something you're taking seriously?

It sounds as though she's felt very lonely in the marriage, as have you, and now would be a very good time to get together and really reconnect. The fact that she is on board with this is really positive and I'd strongly encourage you to go down this route - before it's too late.

If I were her, I'd be very upset about you going through her phone (and THAT'S the big red flag here, along with you disapproving of her new friends because you consider them lower class), or did you do so with her permission while she was present? Whatever, none of the following sounds like cheating although it does suggest a bit of over-indulgence in alcohol:

 

 

 

Her friend's male cousin saying he wanted to marry her because she'd done him a favour just sounds like a bit of OTT banter (I've lost count of the number of people who've said they wanted to marry me because of something trivial I've done!)

 

And as for your zodiac sign... well...! Is that really something you're taking seriously?

 

It sounds as though she's felt very lonely in the marriage, as have you, and now would be a very good time to get together and really reconnect. The fact that she is on board with this is really positive and I'd strongly encourage you to go down this route - before it's too late.

I agree with you; I shouldn't have gone through the phone without permission. It's unlike me because I've always trusted her 100%. The recent events, however, haven't made me feel as good and I felt like she was hiding something from me by spending so much time with friends when there are obviously issues at home.

Yes, but there are obvious issues that you know you have with emotional intimacy which you so far have not addressed. Time to address that and stop using other people’s issues as a way of avoiding your own .

Yes, but there are obvious issues that you know you have with emotional intimacy which you so far have not addressed. Time to address that and stop using other people’s issues as a way of avoiding your own .

Yes, I agree with you 100%.

I agree with you; I shouldn't have gone through the phone without permission. It's unlike me because I've always trusted her 100%. The recent events, however, haven't made me feel as good and I felt like she was hiding something from me by spending so much time with friends when there are obviously issues at home.

For an entirely different set of reasons, I've felt alone in a marriage before now. It's an incredibly deep kind of loneliness, and one of the ways to overcome it is by going out with a bunch of OTT females who you don't have to take seriously, who make you step aside from your sorrows and just provide some temporary respite. The significant thing about being with a group of women like that is that most guys are going to find them intimidating and there's safety in numbers - which is why I really don't think you need to worry about her cheating. My bunch of ladies were really into jazz dancing, but it sounds similar to the scenario you describe.

The fact that she's prepared to go to counselling suggests that she's prepared to address the issues at home in a constructive way; trying to do so with someone who (on their own admission) is closed off is also despair-making and I can understand why she gave up.

Also, I don't know you, but your posts in this thread have a really sorrowful feel to them, and it would be good to allow yourself to accept meaningful emotional support both from within your marriage and from professionals.

Good luck!

Even now you are using your wife’s friends as the major issue. No, lack of emotional intimacy and being a white Knight is what is destroying everything . I used to do this too, be everybody’s Saviour so I could avoid my own problems. That almost completely destroyed my life . You need to sort yourself out before you tackle other people . Your marriage is definitely worth saving but you have to be invested in it so far you haven’t been .

P.S. You aren't a Scorpio, are you? Both Seraphim and myself are, and we Scorpios get a lot of flack! ;)

Hahah truth. We can be a bit firey. 😉

P.S. You aren't a Scorpio, are you? Both Seraphim and myself are, and we Scorpios get a lot of flack! ;)

P.S. You aren't a Scorpio, are you? Both Seraphim and myself are, and we Scorpios get a lot of flack! ;)

I'm a Sagitarrius. She is a Leo. Both of my parents were Scorpios.

I kept reading your initial post, waiting for the shock......that you read her texts and found stuff from another guy......or that you found an opened box of condoms, and you guys don't use them.....or......

But the big crescendo ending was that she has the wrong zodiac sign? Am I missing something?

You're admittedly closed off. You've had a lot of issues for a young married couple, but this is what marriage is about: going through these things together.

She's found new friends. She's going to the gym, doing girls trips, having fun.

You're criticizing her new friends, with a holier-than-thou attitude, going through her phone, demeaning her for drinking a bit too much on a night out, and.....criticizing her zodiac sign?

Yes, you need counseling. Solo.

Here's how I'd start looking at this whole thing, hard as it is. This moment, right here, right now, is a gift. It's exciting. For many years now you've both buried a lot of feelings, from yourselves, from each other. Under the rug, they've hardened a bit, creating space between you both where before there was distance. It happens. You've both been dealt some hard, fast hands from life.

Therapy is so, so good. That you are both on board is so, so good. This is not the sign of the apocalypse. No, it's a new adventure, a needed adventure, a moment to go deeper with yourselves, as individuals, and hopefully with each other, as a couple.

For me, having no emotional investment here, it's easy to be compassionate to both of you. I'm sorry for your pain, and sorry for hers. The stuff with your family, with hers—hard. Big hugs to you both. You reacted by closing down, she reacted by some light partying—it happens. Big hugs there too.

But none of this needs to be the end of the world, unless you choose to keep looking at it like that. Those texts, the new friends—from the outside it looks very, very harmless. A lonely person looking to be seen a bit, maybe not in the most sustainable way, but also not the most destructive. It's not that different than you looking through her phone—not cool at all, but something she seems able to forgive. In that ability is the love you have. Embrace that. The wounds are really just ego and insecurity.

You both coped inelegantly—have compassion for her, so she can have compassion for you. Just as her new friends have bothered you, your distance has bothered her, and I'm sure your breach of her privacy bothered her. Fine—be little bothered. Step one. Step two is that you both want things to change, which is the real beauty here, the gift, and not something many couples get. You unwrap that slowly, together, by showing her grace.

Those texts were nothing. You should not have gone through her phone.

The focus should be on you. It is good you are seeking counseling;otherwise, your marriage could be over. You need to work through your stuff.

How is your social life?

Stay out of her phone.

I kept reading your initial post, waiting for the shock......that you read her texts and found stuff from another guy......or that you found an opened box of condoms, and you guys don't use them.....or......

 

But the big crescendo ending was that she has the wrong zodiac sign? Am I missing something?

 

I had the same reaction. There was no cheating, She still loves you. She got drunk. Big deal.

What's more troubling is that you've been responsible for the trouble in the marriage. You were closed off emotionally. You spent all your time working. She felt ignored so she found new friends and went out to have fun. Now you're trying to blame things on her? No. You've got to make an effort again. A marriage takes two people. And you've got to step up.

Sorry to hear you've been through a lot. You both sort of cocooned yourselves to protect yourself, but that unfortunately disconnected you from each other. Therapy can help unravel this and unpack all this stress and help you reconnect.

P.S. Our sex life is still very good. We've been intimate 3-4 times this week alone. Maybe because it's another outlet for expression. Either way, that facet of our relationship is good.

Here's how I'd start looking at this whole thing, hard as it is. This moment, right here, right now, is a gift. It's exciting. For many years now you've both buried a lot of feelings, from yourselves, from each other. Under the rug, they've hardened a bit, creating space between you both where before there was distance. It happens. You've both been dealt some hard, fast hands from life.

 

Therapy is so, so good. That you are both on board is so, so good. This is not the sign of the apocalypse. No, it's a new adventure, a needed adventure, a moment to go deeper with yourselves, as individuals, and hopefully with each other, as a couple.

 

For me, having no emotional investment here, it's easy to be compassionate to both of you. I'm sorry for your pain, and sorry for hers. The stuff with your family, with hers—hard. Big hugs to you both. You reacted by closing down, she reacted by some light partying—it happens. Big hugs there too.

 

But none of this needs to be the end of the world, unless you choose to keep looking at it like that. Those texts, the new friends—from the outside it looks very, very harmless. A lonely person looking to be seen a bit, maybe not in the most sustainable way, but also not the most destructive. It's not that different than you looking through her phone—not cool at all, but something she seems able to forgive. In that ability is the love you have. Embrace that. The wounds are really just ego and insecurity.

 

You both coped inelegantly—have compassion for her, so she can have compassion for you. Just as her new friends have bothered you, your distance has bothered her, and I'm sure your breach of her privacy bothered her. Fine—be little bothered. Step one. Step two is that you both want things to change, which is the real beauty here, the gift, and not something many couples get. You unwrap that slowly, together, by showing her grace.

Thanks. This is a great reply. Hits in the nail on the head.

Just a quick update.

We spent a lot of time this morning discussing the issues. We have a plan of action (Therapy is scheduled and will happen 2 weeks from now.) Now, the hard part is---trying to go about the normal day-to-day stuff.

We both agreed that we can't keep talking about the same issue over and over. There's only so much say. Rather, we both decided to go out and see friends tonight. I got home a few minutes ago, she is still out. She sent me a text while she was out, saying that she's thinking of me. I responded by saying I'm thinking of her too and said some time apart with friends is healthy. She agreed.

I've debated leaving for a few days and stay with a friend or at a hotel. This location would be near my job. We talked about this as well and she didn't seem opposed to it, as long as it's just a breather for us. Any thoughts from the ENAs? (We only have one bedroom. She has family nearby. I don't, but I have some friends).

It is THAT bad you need to be apart?

It is THAT bad you need to be apart?

No, it's not that bad. It's more or less a chance for both of us to take a breather.

No, it's not that bad. It's more or less a chance for both of us to take a breather.

It's a very common thing that once people "take a breather" it's as good as saying "I'm done" and very rarely ever gets back on track to a happy marriage.

One thing to mention....

I’ve been through a lot of traumatic events over the last few years. Granted, my wife has been there every step of the way. But when (I) your parents get divorced, (2) sister goes to rehab, (3) sitting with job uncertainty (4) attempting to manage my mother who has a split personality but ultimately walking away from the relationship, things get tough.

No, it's not that bad. It's more or less a chance for both of us to take a breather.

Spending time apart usually means it is REALLY bad. I think it is just another way to emotionally put off and divest.

I've debated leaving for a few days and stay with a friend or at a hotel.

NO NO NO NO NO!!!

However you dress it up, and say it would be good to have space and do it for apparently all the right reasons - it's going to feel like you're punishing her. Walking out on her. In other words, something you really don't want if you're serious about repairing your marriage. As Seraphim says, it's just another way to put off emotionally and divest, except in a way which is going to be even more hurtful than the way you've been previously. If I were in her place and my partner took off like that, I'd just give up in despair.

If you're wondering what to do, take her out to places where you don't need to spend all your time talking - e.g. concerts, films etc - and make sure you hold her hand to maintain the loving connection.

You don't solve problems by hiding from them, you really don't!

I’ve been through a lot of traumatic events over the last few years. Granted, my wife has been there every step of the way. But when (I) your parents get divorced, (2) sister goes to rehab, (3) sitting with job uncertainty (4) attempting to manage my mother who has a split personality but ultimately walking away from the relationship, things get tough.

You need to establish better boundaries and a better sense of where your responsibilities begin and end. Several of the things you mention there, e.g. your sister and parents, are not events which should be affecting you directly, though you can obviously feel concerned for them. It shouldn't be making your life tougher. And you certainly shouldn't be taking it out on your wife who by your own admission has been there every step of the way. If you're prepared to let people be there for you, going through tough times together actually brings you closer, and doesn't mean the death knell of the relationship at all. But please don't try to justify pushing her away and abandoning her by saying you're having a tough time - when a lot of that tough time belongs to your sister and parents.

...it's going to feel like you're punishing her.

Also manipulative.

'See how hurt I am'.., can backfire on you in a very big way.