Divorced, child visitation questions. Ex not following 50/50 custody orders

I had a terrible divorce 3 years ago. My ex-wife decided the grass was greener and divorced me, tried to steal our two young daughters, took most of the money I had, left me with huge IRS bills, then told me she loved me and wanted to work on our marriage only to try to steal the townhouse that I moved into after our first separation. Since then we've been in and out of court dozens of times. She filed false PFA's (protection from abuse orders) that the court let her pass. We had a shrink spend three days with each of us at our homes and with our kids. The shrink ruled 50/50 custody and said my home was the better of the two with less drama and more educational opportunities. The judge ruled 50/50 custody.

We swap kids at a visitation center, this has been going on for just under a year. I have NEVER missed a child swap, I have never only swapped one child. The ex-wife has skipped swaps multiple times, and another dozen times just brings one child or the other.

The cops don't care, the visitation center workers don't seem to care. The courts are backed up a year or more.

I've not physically talked to the ex-wife in over two years and have not text or emailed in a year due to the PFA.

Yesterday (July 4th) was my day to get the kids, I drove 30 minutes to the visitation building, sat there for 40 minutes, one of the workers said "sorry, she no showed, go home. I drove 30 minutes home.

My girlfriend , her three young sons and I go to the local fireworks display last night, have a nice time, but driving out of the parking lot I see my ex-wife and my daughters sitting in the BMW I used to drive also stuck in traffic.

....

I don't say or do anything but it really hurts that she gets away with things over and over again, while I try to be the better person, follow all the rules, and just get screwed over and over by the courts.

This September the Ex is taking me back to court to try to change our 50/50 custody, hiring a lawyer with the money I send each month (child support). Using my own money to fight custody of my children...

On top of it, the girlfriend gets mad because dealing with the ex-wife (just seeing her in my old car with my kids at an event I was supposed to be at with them makes me sad and shut down for about half an hour). She gives me an earful about how I'm not yet over my ex-wife. I was primarily upset that he courts, police and visitation center employees don't give a hoot and my kids are being brainwashed to think I'm a bad person.

Any help would be greatly appreciated. How to deal with courts, cops and state employees and life not being fair... I realize life is not fair but I really wish Karma would catch up with the ex-wife.

Document and take pictures of EVERYTHING and send it to the court.

I am sorry. :( My brother get shafted too. But if anything take heart children grow up and they can see you whenever they want . My brother’s one daughter who is 16 has come to live with him . And I’m sure soon enough the others will follow . One just turned 15 and the other will turn 13 this next year.

Is it supervised visitation? Do not make your kids pawns in this. Don't ruin your current relationship with ongoing battles. Maybe your gf has a point.

due to the PFA. one of the workers said "sorry, she no showed, go home. This September the Ex is taking me back to court to try to change our 50/50 custody. the girlfriend gets mad because dealing with the ex-wife. She gives me an earful about how I'm not yet over my ex-wife.

Wait, you got back with your ex?

My advise is what it's always been when you start up with the my ex wife ruined my life shtick, take her to court.

The courts of 2018 are not the courts of the past where the woman gets everything. Maybe I'm just in more amicable states, I really don't think that's the case, but I'll give you the benefit of the doubt. My friend has to allow visitation with her ex and he's a meth head, it's documented and everything. Still has to take him to the visitation center to swap out and if she doesn't go for whatever reason he calls the courts and she gets warning letters threatening jail time. So when you keep on saying there's nothing I can do, there's nothing I can do, dude if a meth head can figure it out...

I agree with your gf?/ex gf? you haven't worked through your anger about your divorce so every stumble feels like a mountain when it's a molehill.

If you don't solve this it will slowly begin to eat away and you and every facet of your life.

Document and take pictures of EVERYTHING and send it to the court.

 

I am sorry. :( My brother get shafted too. But if anything take heart children grow up and they can see you whenever they want . My brother’s one daughter who is 16 has come to live with him . And I’m sure soon enough the others will follow . One just turned 15 and the other will turn 13 this next year.

How did he get shafted?

Serious question.

How did he get shafted?

 

Serious question.

How is he getting shafted ? He’s not getting to see his children on his allotted time and he’s not getting to see his children. Don’t you think it would hurt not to see your children ? My brother describes it as the most agonizing feeling ever . I know I would die if I couldn’t see my child .

I think the Previous poster was looking for specifics — is the ex not giving him access or is it the court that didn’t give him shared custody or what?

I think the Previous poster was looking for specifics — is the ex not giving him access or is it the court that didn’t give him shared custody or what?

It was plain to me the ex is screwing him out of access to his kids on his allotted time.

Get a better girlfriend. One that's more understanding. Kicking you while your down is not cool.

Get a better girlfriend. One that's more understanding. Kicking you while your down is not cool.

This. You do not need a GF that isn't empathetic or compassionate towards your situation.

I'm sorry you are going through this OP... this stuff makes me feel horribly sad, yes there are deadbeat dads out there (my bio kid has one sadly :( ) but you are not one of those dads from the sounds of it.

As Seraphim says... document every interaction... if you get witnesses to correlate your story even better... all the times you showed up and all the times she didn't... the courts love facts, data and evidence so the more you have the better. Don't bother fighting with her, you know it won't help... spend your time and energy gathering the evidence you need to prove your case.

sorry, i don't buy your story that the wife "stole" the townhouse and so forth. She legally couldn't "steal it" and she couldn't legally take all your money.

Unless she was awarded the townhouse and you got the marital home. I agree to document every interaction and state that she has not stuck to visitation - document when she no shows and when she only brings one child.

You don't buy that she stole the townhouse? I never said she stole the townhouse, I said she tried to manipulate me so that she could steal it. Luckily for me I was able to keep it. People getting divorced can't legally take money from the other??? Are you serious? You must be one of those people who believe the courts are in business to do the right thing and only make fair decisions. Let me fill you in.... It's all about the money. It's a multi billion dollar industry. Family court does not follow the constitution.

I go to a visitation center only to swap the kids, not to have visitation. I have to show up 15 minutes early, wait for the kids to be dropped off, then wait another 15 to 20 minutes after the ex leaves so that I don't shoot her with an RPG, run her over with a semi truck, or cut off her arm with a machete. How stupid, I know where she lives, if I wanted to hurt her I would have long ago. It's just another opportunity for the state to take money from me. I get to pay for the convenience of having something that should take no more than 2 minutes take nearly three hours every week + 6 gallons of gas.

It's been three years. For the most part I've put the ex-wife behind me. I only have to think about her in court and when she doesnt share the kids as our 50/50 custody sates.

I do document things but in court the judge usually says he doesn't care or I don't have a witness to back up my statements. Guess what, when you sign up at a visitation center you have to sign a form that says you won't take any of their employees to court. I can ask for a record of the times my ex-wife no showed at the visitation center signed by the manager of the office, but in court the judge will just tell me it's a forgery.

I swear the court does not care about anything but me paying child support. The ex-wife can keep the kids as often as she likes and break nearly every item in the custody order without penalty but I call her a bad name or miss a child support payment... off to jail I go...

It's been over a year since I told her to quit F'ing harassing me and that's what caused the PFA. You can't swear at your ex-wife even if she's breaking and entering your property.

So I don't swear, don't talk, don't text, don't ask the kids what goes on at mom's house.... All I want is my 50% of the 50/50 custody and to be left alone.

Unfortunately, I think I'm in for 10 more years of abuse and harassment from the ex-wife, and again, all the courts care about is child support. It's really sad and probably the reason so many guys kill themselves after a divorce where kids are involved and the courts side with the mother. I've considered just giving up. I love my kids but is it worth 10 years of fighting a woman who won't stop? She's like the F'ing Terminator.

I feel for you. I really do. My brother has the same scenario .

But yes, your kids are worth it. It is horrible to be abandoned by a parent. Please continue with your kids. ❤️

Wait, you got back with your ex?

 

 

I agree with your gf?/ex gf? you haven't worked through your anger about your divorce so every stumble feels like a mountain when it's a molehill.

 

If you don't solve this it will slowly begin to eat away and you and every facet of your life.

It's not something I sit and dwell on every day. It usually bugs me a few days before court and a few days after. And it bugs me when I drive to the visitation center to get my kids at the scheduled time and she doesnt show up with them.

Does that really sound like I'm not over my ex or just worried about court and hoping to spend time with my children when it's scheduled?

If she's just show up with the kids on time as ordered by the court I'd have almost no reason to think about her.

If she's quit trying to modify custody, I wouldn't have to worry about court outcomes, or preparing for court or having to argue with attorneys and judges.

Again, does this sound like I'm not over my ex-wife or worried about court and loosing my kids? I know courts are unfair, you can be the perfect parent and if the other side lies and gets away with it, say bye bye to your 50/50 custody.

I used to believe the country was more or less fair until I started spending time in the courthouse. It's anything but, and the decisions they make can make HUGE differences in your life.

Yes, the OP stated quite plainly that the mother has skipped out on meets to swap custody. If it's 50/50, I'm assuming he's not just missing out on taking them out to dinner (as terrible as it would still be), but rather is being denied his 3 - 4 days with them and is effectively being cut off for the next week, assuming she keeps the appointment the following week.

How seriously it's taken when a parent refuses to comply with a visitation or custody order varies wildly from state to state, or even just locality to locality. A custody order is technically enforceable by police, but they're typically not bound to do so if there's no order to enforce (requiring going to court after non-compliance of the initial court order). Law enforcement is pretty notorious for not wanting to get involved in family law violations if not expressly pressed by a judge's order to do so, so mileage will definitely vary there. Add to it the likelihood, albeit completely conjectural, of law enforcement feeling more compelled to respond to a mother being denied her child vs. a father and I'm not so sure it's as clear cut as a meth head being able to see her kid elsewhere. Even if resorting to the filing of a motion to enforce, some states very fortunately require them to be heard within 30 days, while others don't, wherein a backlog can present a very real obstacle to a parent's rights.

On top of it all, public and otherwise subsidized legal resources to men in this situation are also relatively limited. It can be remarkably expensive just convincing a judge to award joint-custody rather than defaulting custody to the mother (a problem that is fortunately getting much better), never mind putting in the time and money to have that order enforced. A lot of parents like the OP have to ask the very hard question of whether that time and effort would be better off invested in the child's school, every day needs, or a college fund. It's unfortunate how many fathers are essentially victim blamed and shamed in what I can only assume is one of the most horrifying experiences any parent could go through.

OP, if you haven't in fact filed for a motion to enforce, that's most likely the step you should be taking. I'm not a lawyer, though, so speak to one about it if you haven't already (or haven't already filed, for that matter). Documenting is important, though I hope the visitation center is documenting the custody swaps they're in charge of facilitating as well as any incidental no-shows. I'd make sure they've got a record themselves, and even ask them to sign off on your own record of her not showing up. That's likely going to be your strongest evidence to present at a hearing. Again, something to speak to your lawyer about with regard to how best to collect the evidence you need. Do your best to keep your interactions with her squeaky clean. And I'd sincerely give the police a call every time she no-shows. You may be lucky and catch them on a day they're feeling more sympathetic. But that's up to you and what you're willing to have your kids potentially endure with officers being involved.

Without knowing you personally and whether you could in fact be the world's next biggest ***hole, I'll say that I sympathize heavily with you and any other healthy and caring mother or father in your situation. I'd also really consider seeing a mental health professional who can help you stay mentally fit during this emotionally arduous ordeal.

I'm three years into it and the sad thing is that I'm becoming alright with it.

I've become used to not having my children in my life every day. I've become ok with the fact that someone else controls their lives more than 50% of the time. I've gotten used to bending over and taking it every time the court makes a decision that I don't like.

I no longer feel like a father, they no longer feel like my kids, I no longer feel like I have a real family.

Before the court got involved I was 100% a regular Dad.

I was raised in a traditional "Leave it to Beaver Family" My parents are still married. I'm now 47 years old.

What other option do I have?

Fight it and let it burn me up inside? Let it take every free moment I have to think about it or just accept it and get on with my life?

The ex has my daughters on a large number of medications. I fought it for two years, it got me nowhere.

The ex literally stole my daughters for a year of the last three years, the court didn't even slap her wrist but would have locked me up.

I was given sole medical custody of my daughters and the ex broke it the first week, the courts did nothing.

I got locked up for three days in jail (30 if I had not had a friend bail me out) for not paying support because I told her if she wouldn't share the kids, I wouldn't pay support.

I'm a college grad, decorated military vet, semi successful business owner (before the divorce). Ex-wife also worked in the same field and made the same money I made. 50/50 custody and I'm still forced to pay her child support which she spends on attorneys instead of food and clothing for my kids. My kids want for nothing. I buy them piles of clothing, we eat well and often at nice restaurants, travel often, hike, camp, fish, museums, they get great grades... Yet somehow I'm a deadbeat dad and always have to look over my shoulder to see what's coming next from the courts.

I've seen a handful of therapists, most of whom say I'm a pretty normal guy, I am on an antidepressant and two years ago came down with some stress related heart problems that have cleaned up with a procedure, a lot of meds and a lot of exercise.

You sound a lot like my brother. Successful financial advisor and even though his wife makes the same money as him he has to pay support. She has their martial house. SHE decided everything about the kids or threatens to call the police if he tries to determine anything about his kids. Luckily my brother’s daughters are getting much older and are seeing their mom for who she and the eldest has moved in with him .

 

OP, if you haven't in fact filed for a motion to enforce, that's most likely the step you should be taking. I'm not a lawyer, though, so speak to one about it if you haven't already (or haven't already filed, for that matter). Documenting is important, though I hope the visitation center is documenting the custody swaps they're in charge of facilitating as well as any incidental no-shows. I'd make sure they've got a record themselves, and even ask them to sign off on your own record of her not showing up. That's likely going to be your strongest evidence to present at a hearing. Again, something to speak to your lawyer about with regard to how best to collect the evidence you need. Do your best to keep your interactions with her squeaky clean. And I'd sincerely give the police a call every time she no-shows. You may be lucky and catch them on a day they're feeling more sympathetic. But that's up to you and what you're willing to have your kids potentially endure with officers being involved.

I've ran out of money for attorneys and grown tired of filing paperwork. I did it non-stop for the first three years, I don't want it to eat up the next 10 years of my life.

It takes days to put together a motion, then I spend weeks stewing about it, practicing presenting it, go over all the facts and figures in my head till I'm blue in the face, show up at the courthouse at the required time, then sit and wait 4 hours for the case to be called while sitting with the scum of the earth, watching the pigs coral the defendants to and from the stand. Listen to the ex lie her head off, watch the judge nod in agreement to everything she says only to vote down or blow off whatever I spent weeks preparing and then send me a bill.

No thank you. I'm worn out. I started doing better in court when I fired my attorney and started representing myself, but it's a lot of work both physically and mentally and victory is unlikely.

If she want's to take me to court, I have no choice but to attend, but I'm done fighting. I won't be filing any more paperwork.

You sound a lot like my brother. Successful financial advisor and even though his wife makes the same money as him he has to pay support. She has their martial house. SHE decided everything about the kids or threatens to call the police if he tries to determine anything about his kids. Luckily my brother’s daughters are getting much older and are seeing their mom for who she and the eldest has moved in with him .

I don't know what goes on at my ex-wives house. I don't ask and I don't pry. She's no longer part of my life. AS evil as I think she is, my daughters seem to like her. I don't badmouth her to them, but I do prey that she get hit by a freight train every night...

Maybe someday they will see all I tried to do to spend time with them and appreciate it, but there's a good chance they won't, their mother is doing a good job of brain washing them. They'd have had a very different upbringing if their mother hadn't broken up the family. We'd still be in the big house, money would not be an issue, we'd go on bigger more expensive vacations and most importantly we'd get to spend every day together. It all really sucks to think about, I wish my life had a rewind button.

I don't know what goes on at my ex-wives house. I don't ask and I don't pry. She's no longer part of my life. AS evil as I think she is, my daughters seem to like her. I don't badmouth her to them, but I do prey that she get hit by a freight train every night...

 

Maybe someday they will see all I tried to do to spend time with them and appreciate it, but there's a good chance they won't, their mother is doing a good job of brain washing them. They'd have had a very different upbringing if their mother hadn't broken up the family. We'd still be in the big house, money would not be an issue, we'd go on bigger more expensive vacations and most importantly we'd get to spend every day together. It all really sucks to think about, I wish my life had a rewind button.

Same thing my brother never badmouths his ex-wife to his children ever as that is their mother . But my eldest niece was in severe psychiatric crisis and severely self harming so he had to become involved . Doesn’t ask what goes on at their mother’s house because he could care less and secretly hoped she would get hit by a truck. He hates her now was much as he loved her, but he adores his daughters . My brother and I are also children of divorce several times over so we know how it feels to be the child version . Just sad all the way around .

sorry, i don't buy your story that the wife "stole" the townhouse and so forth. She legally couldn't "steal it" and she couldn't legally take all your money.

Unless she was awarded the townhouse and you got the marital home. I agree to document every interaction and state that she has not stuck to visitation - document when she no shows and when she only brings one child.

This!

And to attack his gf?

She probably has the insight to see that he can't seem to let this go.

Without making this a man against women custody/court argument let's pay attention to the details here, there's more ban enough evidence to see he's got some baggage with his ex wife to deal with.

Why people are writing novels about how men are wrongs by the courts systems just shows people are more concerned with standing on milk cartons than actually giving advice.

But who lets go of their kids?! For most parents that’s impossible . He just wants to be a dad to his kids .

Bear in mind I've never been in a situation someone has withheld my children from me, but I'm willing to take a wild stab in the dark and say he probably feels just a bite spiteful of this woman for having seemingly done so. When it comes to a level of spite that may come from, I don't know... being cut off from your children, it's not completely implausible it could manifest itself into other categories. If someone cuts me off on the road, I'll probably go straight into judging whatever crappy bumpers sticker they've got, but that doesn't mean my concern for their exterior's decor is anywhere near the level for them having almost caused an accident.

I mean, the general response to someone going after your townhome after essentially stripping you of your fatherhood or motherhood probably isn't going to be, "okay, that's fair enough." If a father took a mother's kids and was denying her visitation, we wouldn't be perplexed if she ever vented about him wanting the car, too. I can't say it's the healthiest of coping mechanisms, but it's normal enough. And, frankly, I'd be scared to be around the parent who has had their kids taken away from them, is being denied visitation, and isn't carrying "baggage" from the person denying it. That's a sociopath right there.

I wrote a novel because many people aren't informed on the matter, and simply assume a father who's getting "shafted" simply hasn't tried hard or smart enough, so there's the opportunity. I'd be happy to discuss the facets of family court that disproportionately disparage women should a relevant thread come up. I can respect not wanting to settle for offering a pat on the back and instead opting to offer something with utility, but you're sitting here essentially victim shaming someone and inferring his efforts to be a part of his children's lives aren't even on par to that of a meth head's, when the nuance of family court and law enforcement involving itself in matters of family law are epileptic even on the most consistent of days.

For the record, I don't think he should find a better girlfriend, but I also don't think he should have one right now. Expecting a level of support and understanding his situation would require within the context of a relationship isn't realistic, nor should it be. He does have baggage, and until his children are back in his life, that baggage doesn't have a chance of going away. It's either that or give up on his kids. No loving parent is out there engaging in a battle for custody or even their basic parental rights and treating it like it's just another day at work.

I've ran out of money for attorneys and grown tired of filing paperwork. I did it non-stop for the first three years, I don't want it to eat up the next 10 years of my life.

.

I don't know what state you live and if what you say is true, you have a very compelling case.

Document everything, fight for your kids and sue her for your attorney expenses.

I did it and received restitution.

Bear in mind I've never been in a situation someone has withheld my children from me, but I'm willing to take a wild stab in the dark and say he probably feels just a bite spiteful of this woman for having seemingly done so. When it comes to a level of spite that may come from, I don't know... being cut off from your children, it's not completely implausible it could manifest itself into other categories. If someone cuts me off on the road, I'll probably go straight into judging whatever crappy bumpers sticker they've got, but that doesn't mean my concern for their exterior's decor is anywhere near the level for them having almost caused an accident.

 

I mean, the general response to someone going after your townhome after essentially stripping you of your fatherhood or motherhood probably isn't going to be, "okay, that's fair enough." If a father took a mother's kids and was denying her visitation, we wouldn't be perplexed if she ever vented about him wanting the car, too. I can't say it's the healthiest of coping mechanisms, but it's normal enough. And, frankly, I'd be scared to be around the parent who has had their kids taken away from them, is being denied visitation, and isn't carrying "baggage" from the person denying it. That's a sociopath right there.

 

I wrote a novel because many people aren't informed on the matter, and simply assume a father who's getting "shafted" simply hasn't tried hard or smart enough, so there's the opportunity. I'd be happy to discuss the facets of family court that disproportionately disparage women should a relevant thread come up. I can respect not wanting to settle for offering a pat on the back and instead opting to offer something with utility, but you're sitting here essentially victim shaming someone and inferring his efforts to be a part of his children's lives aren't even on par to that of a meth head's, when the nuance of family court and law enforcement involving itself in matters of family law are epileptic even on the most consistent of days.

 

For the record, I don't think he should find a better girlfriend, but I also don't think he should have one right now. Expecting a level of support and understanding his situation would require within the context of a relationship isn't realistic, nor should it be. He does have baggage, and until his children are back in his life, that baggage doesn't have a chance of going away. It's either that or give up on his kids. No loving parent is out there engaging in a battle for custody or even their basic parental rights and treating it like it's just another day at work.

Please bear in mind I was not speaking of you individually but the general way the post was going. I realize we often go in many directions with posts and side conversations start and it can be very interesting and helpful to the poster and responders. I really just dont think this is one of those cases. I think the tales of men who are wronged is just feeding the victim mentality he is clinging to.

Lets be realistic here, for every man who feels the court system is screwing them over there is a woman who is struggling to keep food in her childs mouth and shes told theres nothing they can do because the fathers working under the table or has the man not showing up for his visitation. Men and women both suffer in these situations. Separations and divorces bring out the absolute worst in people and the only way it doesn't is for the adults TO BE ADULTS but often times when you have these acrimonious custody battles its the adults fighting each other, it has very little to do with the children. The courts dont force themselves into this, the ADULTS bring them in. If you have to have someone else tell you how to raise your kids equitably thats says more about you than anything, and please dont tell me this is a man who is just trying to raise his kids there are too many signs this is a battle they're both participants in. Come on, she 'stole' his children, she 'stole' his condo, she 'thought the grass was greener' you cant tell there's no animosity there.

and his question is

Any help would be greatly appreciated. How to deal with courts, cops and state employees and life not being fair... I realize life is not fair but I really wish Karma would catch up with the ex-wife.

and when people tell him he has to go to court his response is:

I've ran out of money for attorneys and grown tired of filing paperwork. I did it non-stop for the first three years, I don't want it to eat up the next 10 years of my life.

 

It takes days to put together a motion, then I spend weeks stewing about it, practicing presenting it, go over all the facts and figures in my head till I'm blue in the face, show up at the courthouse at the required time, then sit and wait 4 hours for the case to be called while sitting with the scum of the earth, watching the pigs coral the defendants to and from the stand. Listen to the ex lie her head off, watch the judge nod in agreement to everything she says only to vote down or blow off whatever I spent weeks preparing and then send me a bill.

 

No thank you. I'm worn out. I started doing better in court when I fired my attorney and started representing myself, but it's a lot of work both physically and mentally and victory is unlikely.

 

If she want's to take me to court, I have no choice but to attend, but I'm done fighting. I won't be filing any more paperwork.

So what was the point of asking the question?

Let me fill you in.... It's all about the money. It's a multi billion dollar industry. Family court does not follow the constitution.

I swear the court does not care about anything but me paying child support. The ex-wife can keep the kids as often as she likes and break nearly every item in the custody order without penalty but I call her a bad name or miss a child support payment... off to jail I go...

It's been over a year since I told her to quit F'ing harassing me and that's what caused the PFA. You can't swear at your ex-wife even if she's breaking and entering your property.

To complain. Not to find a solution, to complain.

I don't know what state you live and if what you say is true, you have a very compelling case.

 

Document everything, fight for your kids and sue her for your attorney expenses.

 

I did it and received restitution.

You can sue for court fees especially frivolous court fees. You cant tell me his lawyer didn't point that out. Its a question on the documentation, I know, I did it!

Men and women both use their children as pawns. Both men and women need to pull up their boy boy/girl pants and be adults, work through their baggage and put their children first. My ex husband was physically abusive to me for 10 years and I successfully co parent with him, with minimal court interference, don't tell me it cant be done. It starts by putting your kids first. Fights end real quick if you're the only one participating.

Do the work, document, research, do what you're supposed to be doing. Put them first. It works out. Ive seen it enough to know its possible, Ive also seen enough failures to know as much as the woman acts like a victim, as much as the man acts like hes wrong, all I see is two adults who need to put their kids first.