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He can't commit to marriage because I'm not a 10...


alibabac

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Hi all,

BF and I have been together nearly 2.5 years & we love each other a lot, we are seriously best friends!! I'm 33, he's 34, we're both pretty secure in our career. We have similar spunky driven energies, similar interests, & since meeting we've been on the same page about marriage, starting a family, future goals... This is important to both of us. We have a great compatibility, run a business together, get things done easily together... He's a very kind, compassionate & fun person, he makes me laugh, his sense of humor is like none other, he cooks, he cleans, it's great!! We live together & have combined finances. This past year we've been talking about paying off all debts, buying land, & building a house. We've both been married before and have openly discussed marriage with specific timelines in our heads for engagement. However, these timelines have come and gone, getting pushed back further. I'm starting to think he has some major commitment issues and insecurities.

 

Last year we took a trip to Europe, he had hinted that he may propose in Venice. During the trip, I discovered a ring box in his suitcase & thought WOW this is gonna happen, but then realized the ring was one of my own rings that my mom had given me (it looks like an engagement ring). Venice came & went, & he didn't propose. I told him I was a bit disappointed, & he apologized for leading me on. I was also disappointed that he was using one of my rings. He said he didn't want to tote an expensive ring abroad that might get lost. (Besides that, it also meant he hadn't saved up for a ring!) After much discussion, he said he wasn't ready, so we decided to focus on our relationship & possibly getting engaged the following summer (1 year in the future)... Since then, he's hinted on occasion "you never know, I may be saving up for a ring!" and I've kept my hopes up.

 

However, I'm starting to think that this is not the case & we may have an expiration date because during our fights or discussions, he'll often start talking about what would happen in the future if we were to break up & scheming it out.

 

Over Christmas, he told me he spoken with his dad who has been encouraging him to marry me but he's conflicted because he's not ready... he wants to be considerate of possessing my time, & says he's under a lot of pressure to make the decision every day. I don't usually push the topic, so the pressure is not coming from me! We had hit our 2 year mark. In the beginning we had talked about engagement at 1.5 years so I asked him how much more time he needs. He says he doesn't know. I told him I'll be patient & enjoy the relationship, but I'm not going to wait forever...

 

Last week, we were moving into a new apartment in a different city, he was starting a new job. The goal for doing this is to pay off our debts so we can buy land & go off the grid. With logistics, we were super stressed. He has a lot of friends in the new city, & I have a lot of friends in our current one, so I'm going through a process of letting go. We got into arguments every single day about weird things that he would normally start. (ie: He's the cook in the household, but after his first day of work I had agreed to cook dinner one night & have it ready by 6. Unfortunately I didn't have it ready until 6:15. He got home & started bossing me around about how I wasn't cooking things right, & was upset because I didn't apologize right off the bat for not having it ready on time. 'If it were him, he would've had it ready AND apologized,' so he says he can't rely on me). Later he apologized for acting like that, it was his first day of work & he had been really stressed. We continued having arguments like this every day, by the end of the week we were exhausted & he asked me if I wanted to just stay in the current city & not move up to the new city with him. I said no, & asked him if he wants to break up, he said no. After the weekend, he said he's willing to put that week behind us & move forward, acknowledging it was just a hard week for both of us.

 

We really love our new apartment and the new city, but things were still hanging in our heads so we went on a hike to talk about it. I opened up that I'm starting to get uncomfortable talking about buying land & building a house without having an important step mentioned: marriage. We'd be coming up on 2.5 years this summer & I told him by the 3rd year, it seems like people should know enough about the other to marry. He says that he can't get over the fact that we may just be settling for each other when we're not each other's ideal types. He prefers tall girls with dark long hair, & yet I'm short with short dark hair. In the past I have gone for many darker guys with long hair, yet he's white with short hair (I have no issue with this but he thinks that's what I prefer & am not admitting it)... Also in the past he thought it'd be fun if we ranked each other on a scale of 1-10, and we both ranked each other at an 8. This seemed to really bother him & he says that I deserve someone who thinks I'm a 10, & vice versa. He says one of his ex's was a 10 in his eyes & she thought he was a 10, & she doted on him all the time. He says I don't dote on him nor show him that I love him as much as he's experienced with that ex. He says he doesn't feel the same passion. In fact, nobody he's dated after her has met the mark & he's been struggling with this fact for our entire relationship. (I honestly dote on him a ton & don't understand why he's not receiving it as such..) He's spoken to his dad and a friend about his afflictions & they told him that he may want to reconsider being with me if he doesn't feel a satisfying level 10 of attraction. When he tells them about our compatibility, they changed their minds & said chances are, he wouldn't meet someone who is as compatible as me AND a 10 in his eyes, so that's messing with his decision as well. He doesn't want to ever get divorced again & wants to be 100% sure.

 

But then he started to discuss what would happen if we broke up again, the logistics, who would move where, & says it's good to discuss such things. Through all this he continues to reassure me that he's not going to leave me, that he has both feet in, that I have his whole heart, that talking about buying land & building a house is a sign of commitment, & that he just needs time to sort these things out in his head. I asked him "Have you actually been saving up for a ring then?" He admitted that he has not, so I asked him to please stop pretending like he like he might be, and he apologized.

 

I'm happy that he's open and communicative to me about this but now I'm feeling very confused and insecure about us. It's not just about marriage: it's about having his whole heart, it's about commitment & security, it's about having a family... It's also about him comparing everything to his ex (who he was with in his 20s, & he thought she was cheating on him a lot during his deployments -- clearly they didn't work out)... I feel like I'm being strung along with all the mixed messages. I asked him what he would say if I were to propose to him, and he asked me not to propose to him.

 

The summer is coming up & I want to keep waiting. I love him so much and would hate to lose him. He's such a wonderful person & adds so much to my life. I think I add much to his life as well. He's even said "if I were to marry you, my life would be so easy, you are zero drama." My life would be incredibly easy too, I believe. We have a lot of fun together, we really do.

 

Does anyone have any advice, or have you been in a similar situation? Constructive feedback is appreciated.. Thank you friends!

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He says that he can't get over the fact that we may just be settling for each other when we're not each other's ideal types.

 

OMG, this whole post should be a definition in the dictionary for "shallow" if it wasn't so long. Worrying about who's a 10 and why an 8 is just not good enough...putting your own ring in a box to make you think it's going to be a proposal. Tell me what's so wonderful about this guy who I'd kick to the curb.

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Unfortunately, my advice is what you don't want to hear - leave him.

Yes, he is actively stringing you along. Implying that he might propose any time now when in reality he has no intentions is pretty asinine.

Picking all those fights - he is actively trying to drive you away. Basically he is too much of a coward to dump you, so he is hoping that you'll do the hard work for him if he makes you miserable enough.

What it all comes down to is that he is being honest with you that he is currently OK with status quo, but that when it comes to that next big step, something is missing between you, that "IT" factor isn't there for him.

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He’s wasting your time stringing you along, giving you false hope of marriage whilst comparing you to his ex and thinking you’re not good enough for him. He doesn’t want to marry you and if he had any integrity he would cut you lose so you could find someone who did.

 

Do yourself a favour and leave, rather than waste more years on a guy who will tell you with words he doesn’t want to be with you but doesn’t have the balls to leave.

 

Everything he has said means he has one foot out of the door and the only thing keeping him in this relationship is pressure from you, his friends and family.

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He's got one foot out the door because he's afraid he'd could do better? I'd give him a hard fast push.

 

You are living together doing everything including considering to buy property.

You are married in every way but legally and his heart is not fully into it.

 

There is no motivation for him to make that final step while he gets to take you for test drive, accumulate mileage and waste your time.

I'd move out and work on the fact that you are indeed worth more than your reluctant boyfriend who compares you to others.

 

If he was lucky, he'll recognize your value, court you and win you back.

If not, hold out for someone who's crazy in love with you.

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There's a saying about cows and free milk....

 

I'm so sorry, I know this has to be so tough.

 

My advice is the same as everyone else's: leave him, move back to the city you were in, with all your friends, and let him find his perfect 10. He won't, but that's ok, you'll have long moved on.

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I haven’t commented on a post in a long time, but I felt the need to comment on this one because this man made me so angry. He rated you an 8?! And you didn’t walk out the door? He’s comparing you to others in telling you that there’s someone better out there for him. He’s constantly bringing up his “perfect” ex-girlfriend. Let him walk out that door and find that long-haired tall “10” that he thinks that he’s going to find. Or rather push him out the door. You deserve someone who’s not that shallow and who would appreciate you and who would consider you a “10” instead of an 8. Jerk.

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Wow.

 

I will sing the same song as these posters. He is stringing you along. He can't let go of the past and grow. He needs to do that alone.

 

You are also settling for this and not realizing you can have better. Life is easy as a couple is not a good reason to be a couple.

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Wow sorry to hear this. Take him up on the offer to stay in your city and let him move on alone. You are with a mentally abusive jerk who wants roommates with benefits, free housekeeping and someone who he can train like a dog in obedience school. By chronically putting you down, unfavorably comparing you to an ex etc, he's hoping you jump through more hoops, pay more, move more, do more, kowtow more, etc.. Cease all joint financial activities at once. It sounds like your self respect has been severely damaged in the past and you've become blind to what he's saying and doing to the point of financing his goals and dreams of roommates with benefits in some remote primitive cabin.

We live together & have combined finances.

He got home & started bossing me around. he asked me if I wanted to just stay in the current city & not move up to the new city with him.

He says one of his ex's was a 10 in his eyes

He says I don't dote on him nor show him that I love him as much as he's experienced with that ex. He says he doesn't feel the same passion.

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i would leave him. this is not healthy or loving. life is too short.

 

If you leave you could accomplish one of two things

 

1 he gets his head out of his butt and realizes that he's an idiot.

 

2 you get away from somebody who obviously doesn't value you enough

 

I hate that men that are able to verbally discuss these inner thoughts (that really should remain inner,) are somehow perceived as so open and caring. When the fact is, they're willing to tell you straight to your face that you might be settling for each other. And then you kind of stand there like an idiot and wait for them to decide whether you're settling or not.

 

I definitely have been in that situation and that relationship ended at least 3 or 4 years ago. And when I think of it, I think what a d-bag. Those Rose Colored Glasses really pulled a trick on me.

 

Break it off with him. I think that's the only way to get your respect and show him you don't need him either....

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I agree with everyone else. He is leading you on and acting like a total jerk (it's jerky to lead someone on and I mean in addition to that he's acting like a jerk). How dare he compare you to his ex and rate you and tell you he's afraid to settle and how you're "zero drama" -what he means is he doesn't feel the passion - sure it's great to be low maintenance -man do I struggle sometimes to be lower maintenance - but the way he says it he's going through the motions -he's not that into you and he doesn't respect you or value you.

 

And yes if he comes back to you after time apart with no contact -and I mean no -and he realizes as Lambert wrote so eloquently and accurately too that he's an idiot -and if you're still interested and available then sure, you might want to give it a chance, keeping in mind that you're in your 30s (do you want kids -and if so, maybe freeze your eggs if you're going to wait around for him).

 

I came back to my ex -I valued him when we first dated but found him too passive and nearing doormat territory. 8 years apart and we both changed -and he was far far more confident and no doormat anymore. We got back together and got married. And sometimes i wish he'd be a bit more of a yes man lol and I know I don't want what I wish for. Because it's more challenging this way and definitely healthier for me. Your boyfriend is passing the time with you thinking he "should" marry someone like you, should just get on with it. Please do not settle for that. Please.

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It's very obvious he does not want to marry you. You say you want that. So what is there to wait for?!

 

It honestly sounds to me like neither of you are ready for a marriage. You both seem to be carrying a lot of weight of the past into your decisions now. Him, he's stringing you along. You, you are working against your own self interests every step of the way.

 

You've entangled yourself in a business together, joint finances.. why did you do that if you wanted someone who prioritized marriage? It doesn't make sense to me, something is going on with you that you'd make those choices. Do you have a tendency to merge into a man in your relationships? How old were you when you married and divorced? Did you have a period of not being with somebody?

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I think that 1/2 of this is him, but 1/2 of this is you -- on the basis that you run a business with this guy already, etc. I think that unless you are married or became business partners on the basis of a platonic business relationship that has gone on for years and then things got romantic later -- opening a business with someone and assuming commitment will follow is setting yourself up for disappointment and it also has made it harder for him to be honest earlier on and walk away. I would break up -- but in your next relationship - keep yourself a little more open ended. No joint property or business so you can more freely decide if he's the one or not - and that he doesn't get every part of you up front. I think not everyone is ready to get engaged in a year and a half -- and actually people should not do so - its not enough time -- but on the same token, you should not be with someone who does not want to be with you and is always looking for someone else. if he thought the world of you but just wasn't ready to marry -- then that is another matter.

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I hate that men that are able to verbally discuss these inner thoughts (that really should remain inner,) are somehow perceived as so open and caring. When the fact is, they're willing to tell you straight to your face that you might be settling for each other. And then you kind of stand there like an idiot and wait for them to decide whether you're settling or not.

 

A caring man would have ended it long ago when he decided that she wasn't someone he wanted to marry. My ex did that to me --- i wasn't the one he *really* wanted but I was there.... but then again, I did it to myself -- where *I* should have left.

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A caring man would have ended it long ago when he decided that she wasn't someone he wanted to marry. My ex did that to me --- i wasn't the one he *really* wanted but I was there.... but then again, I did it to myself -- where *I* should have left.

 

I was in doubt on and off for years with my ex as to whether he was the one I should marry. And was transparent with him about my doubts but also very sure I would not marry him just to marry him, to settle. He chose to stay and he also chose to take breaks as I did during the years we were together. In part it was on him to choose whether to stay with me, with all my doubts. I did leave him a few times and we'd get back together. I think adults have responsibility to themselves to know their worth and not settle and the partner also has the responsibility not to lead on. What is and isn't leading on can be a fine line. In the OP's case I don't see it as a fine line because his doubts are that she's not good enough for him (which were not my doubts, ever at least that I was aware of on any level). If those are the doubts then yes he should leave her unless he feels he can resolve his own doubts through personal counseling or some other way so that he is marrying her only for the right reasons. I can see both sides to an extent and see where she has responsibility, too.

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I was in doubt on and off for years with my ex as to whether he was the one I should marry. And was transparent with him about my doubts but also very sure I would not marry him just to marry him, to settle. He chose to stay and he also chose to take breaks as I did during the years we were together. In part it was on him to choose whether to stay with me, with all my doubts. I did leave him a few times and we'd get back together. I think adults have responsibility to themselves to know their worth and not settle and the partner also has the responsibility not to lead on. What is and isn't leading on can be a fine line. In the OP's case I don't see it as a fine line because his doubts are that she's not good enough for him (which were not my doubts, ever at least that I was aware of on any level). If those are the doubts then yes he should leave her unless he feels he can resolve his own doubts through personal counseling or some other way so that he is marrying her only for the right reasons. I can see both sides to an extent and see where she has responsibility, too.

 

Agreed...

Also...

You never told your ex that you could never be with him because he didn't have hair to die for, was differently heighted than your ideal - things that were unlikely to be able to change about himself and that you knew going into it. In other words, you did not get together initially under the false pretense. He had potential for you initially, but the way the relationship played out proved otherwise.

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Agreed...

Also...

You never told your ex that you could never be with him because he didn't have hair to die for, was differently heighted than your ideal - things that were unlikely to be able to change about himself and that you knew going into it. In other words, you did not get together initially under the false pretense. He had potential for you initially, but the way the relationship played out proved otherwise.

 

Yes. Potential to the hilt. I write this to the OP because the truth is in hindsight I have some guilt about those years. I wish I'd been stronger to walk away for good a lot earlier than I did(and when we finally broke up I think he'd finally had enough -good for him). I think he had insecurities which motivated him to stay and settle for being with someone with doubts and anxiety. The saving grace is that two years after we broke up he met his future wife and as I far as I can tell he's been happily married for years now.

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To me he doesn't sound like he is actually stringing you along.

 

It sounds like he doesn't want to be with you but is too much of a coward to end it himself.

 

So he is trying to give you enough reasons to not want to be with him anymore.

 

Seriously, you don't tell someone that they are an 8 and you want to marry a 10 unless you don't want to marry them.

 

Not only is he saying that you don't meet his marriage requirements, but he is insulting you in the process.

 

The whole "you should have someone better" is a load of crap people frequently tell their SO when they are too much of a chicken to break up.

 

He also doesn't sound like much of a nd anyways.

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To me he doesn't sound like he is actually stringing you along.

 

It sounds like he doesn't want to be with you but is too much of a coward to end it himself.

 

So he is trying to give you enough reasons to not want to be with him anymore.

 

Seriously, you don't tell someone that they are an 8 and you want to marry a 10 unless you don't want to marry them.

 

Not only is he saying that you don't meet his marriage requirements, but he is insulting you in the process.

 

The whole "you should have someone better" is a load of crap people frequently tell their SO when they are too much of a chicken to break up.

 

He also doesn't sound like much of a nd anyways.

 

This sounds judgmental and immature. I mean, the whole "8 and not a 10" thing. And naive and delusional.

 

People are people. There is no such things as perfection or a 10 or a soul mate. You will have ranges of compatibility with many people.

 

It sounds like the compatibility level in this relationship is moderate at best and currently on a very weak foundation.

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OP here...

 

Thank you all for your thoughtful responses & for taking the time to consider all of this. I would like to clarify a few things!

 

While I realize this does make him look very superficial, he is everything BUT superficial & shallow. He is an ultra-communicator & very honest, more than any guy I've ever known. I love being around him because the conversations are endless, he's very thought-provoking, and we do get into the nitty gritty that most people would consider inappropriate, such as discussing our ex's together and who we think is attractive, and this deepens our understanding of each other and intimacy. Our relationship started with great conversations and I appreciate his over-honesty, never feel like he's hiding something. I can see how expressing your every inkling and doubt can be detrimental for some people but when there is a mutual understanding, it can work... For a while, I didn't like how open he was so he tried to stuff things down & filter them for my sake, but that made him miserable, & I'd rather have him feel like he can be himself & open up to me than bottle it all down. I myself have had issues being as open and am more private, but he's helped me to become a better communicator and I've grown immensely. He's also not a lazy person, he's incredibly smart, cleans the house, cooks the meals, has a great job, & is just one-of-a-kind, all packaged up. He thinks highly of me as well and loves me for my character, my personality, my passions in life, my independence, my looks (even if I'm not his ideal "type") etc.

 

To be fair, we both rated each other an 8 -- I do not feel insulted because an 8 is still very high. He says 8 is a good number for dating, but has an issue with what it actually means for marriage. What I think this is really boiling down to is determining whether marriage would work without the level 10 full package of attraction, and what's missing for him is passion. We have a great compatibility and a decent level of passion in my opinion, but he's not sure if we have a high enough level of passion for each other to survive the long-term. He needs to be shown this passion on the daily to believe it's there. I am passionate about him & try to show him in many different ways on the daily, but he's not quite convinced & wants to make sure I'm not forcing it. I express my passion for him by trying to hold his hand everytime we walk, putting my hand on his thigh when he drives, squeezing his arms & hold onto them, I always stroke my hand through his hair, I bring him gifts on occasion, tell him how much I love him & appreciate him, tell him how proud I am of him, I encourage him, gaze at him from across the room or up close, nuzzle my face into the nook of his neck, give him mini shoulder rubs, inhale his scent fondly, tell him how much I love him, stop him while walking for small and long kisses, tell him he's handsome & sexy (he is!!!), etc... I could do better at being passionate in bed and don't often initiate things or engage fully if I'm tired, and have less of a sex drive than he does... There are times that I'm stoic or tired... but so is he sometimes & doesn't always show me passion either, but I know he's a VERY passionate and driven person. He says that his friends, coworkers and biological dad show him their love and appreciation for him, & he feels it from them but he doesn't feel it from me. I'm not really sure how I could be showing more passion, love or appreciation, which leads me to think he just doesn't see it or notice it? Or he doesn't want to see it because he's scared, I don't know. I think it's different because we're involved romantically, & I get to witness his TRUE self including the bad stuff that other people don't get to see. If we're fighting, obviously that influences whether I'm able to fully show him my love.

 

Sometimes I wonder if this is all stemming from his broken home and insecurities from childhood, and maybe he's having trouble receiving and believing true love & thinks passion/love are what he had with his ex. His parents got divorced when he was young & his mom re-married his stepdad, who was very strict, beat him up all the time, threw him against the wall, was never proud of him, very verbally/physically/mentally abusive, restricted his food, etc. His mom was verbally abusive, blamed my BF who was a kid for her misery, & was checked out... His brother couldn't stand it anymore and committed suicide at 15. When my BF was 8 years old, he dreamt about having a healthy family someday. He's determined to be a great dad, to have a solid marriage, to passionately love his wife who passionately loves him back, and wants to be able to show his kids that mom & dad still have passion and are in love even years down the road. That's why this is so important for him, and that is admirable to me. I've seen him with kids and he's amazing. We've talked about having kids & marriage, though the discussion about level of passion is what keeps coming to make him doubt it would work through the long-term, through the thick & thin. I've stuck with him through some really hard things that he was going through, so he knows that I'm solid in that aspect.

 

As for the business, it was his business that he started years before he met me. I jumped on board happily because it was actually a bucket-list item for me. It'd be easy for me to step out without hang-ups. It would break my heart to leave the business because it is a wonderful model & personally adds value to our lives.

 

The internet has a tendency to say "just leave him," so I appreciate the constructive feedback & consideration of the backstory here. I will continue to wait and to fight for this for a bit longer. At the same time, I also recognize that I might need to walk away. UGH!

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Yes one day, & I know he wanted to work on things before then so we're 100% sure. Our next timeline was going to be this summer/fall, & he's started to say "what if I'm not ready by then?" He believes in the spectacular, not the mediocre, and wants to be sure of that.

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He believes in the spectacular, not the mediocre, and wants to be sure of that.
Have you read up on this? :

mayoclinic.org/narcissistic-personality-disorder/symptoms

Signs and symptoms of narcissistic personality disorder and the severity of symptoms vary. People with the disorder can:

Have an exaggerated sense of self-importance

Have a sense of entitlement and require constant, excessive admiration

Expect to be recognized as superior even without achievements that warrant it

Exaggerate achievements and talents

Be preoccupied with fantasies about success, power, brilliance, beauty or the perfect mate

Believe they are superior and can only associate with equally special people

Monopolize conversations and belittle or look down on people they perceive as inferior

Expect special favors and unquestioning compliance with their expectations

Take advantage of others to get what they want

Have an inability or unwillingness to recognize the needs and feelings of others

Be envious of others and believe others envy them

Behave in an arrogant or haughty manner, coming across as conceited, boastful and pretentious

Insist on having the best of everything — for instance, the best car or office

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Yes one day, & I know he wanted to work on things before then so we're 100% sure. Our next timeline was going to be this summer/fall, & he's started to say "what if I'm not ready by then?" He believes in the spectacular, not the mediocre, and wants to be sure of that.

 

Yes, that is what he says. Spectacular is in the eye of the beholder. Most people who want to commit want to feel like their mate is spectacular even though all relationships have ebbs and flows - they want at least the memory of the "za za za zoom" (a la Sex and the City) when things are rough. All he's telling you is he wants to feel sure that even though there technically might be someone even better than you (because technically there could be), that is irrelevant to him because he is happy with you, happy with what he has with you so that even if someone described a perfect 10 to him he might listen to the words but would never act on it or even have any serious doubts like "wow I could have been with her if I wasn't tied down to my wife".

 

I would not jump to the conclusion that his desires are not normal or that he is narcissistic. That is because someday you might hear that he's married someone and that they are happy and that she is far, objectively, from a perfect 10 and not "spectacular" -and then it will hurt even more - just accept that you two are not the right match and move on ASAP. His comments to you are unfair and soul destroying. If he really feels that way the right thing to do for him is to move on.

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