Is this worth escalating?

i all,

I am kindly requesting your assistance in regards to my current work situation.

I currently work in finance which is a field I greatly like. I have a legal background (two Bachelor degrees and a Masters degree). My past positions involved capital markets-related work. My current position is less challenging as it's not numerical at all and is more of an "admnistrative" one.

I feel slightly overqualified for the position as most of my co-workers don't even have a master's degree nor do they have any finance related experience.

I've been told numerous times I'm the best they've ever had in this position (most people quit after a few weeks/months and the position remained vacant for a long while). I've been working on my market alone and I deal with a huge portfolio of clients. Numerous times I've received positive feedback from senior management, unlike most of my peers who don't have any contact with senior management at all.

Yet, I've seen a few issues in my current situation:

1. I have a local manager & an overseas manager. My overseas manager is in senior management, my local one isn't. About three weeks ago, my overseas manager sent a feedback about me to her own manager (who is basically the EMEA managing director) and a bunch of other senior managers. That was a great feedback, in which she praised my client communication skills, analytical mindset & drive. She indicated I have enough seniority to take on more complex clients ...

To this email, my local manager replied: "We'll see how the issues you had with those teams works out, because those still need to be addressed". Instead of congratulating me. This clearly was uncalled for, because my overseas manager is the one who checks my work directly, not my local manager who doesn't even understand the language nor the procedures. She only brought this up after I had said a few persons wouldn't respond to emails.

2. I have extensive knowledge of capital markets, yet people treat me like I don't even know what NASDAQ is when my former positions included equity related calculations & analysis of listed entities. This comes down to the fact that my position doesn't entail such knowledge and whenever something of the sort comes up, I get treated like I know nothing.

Today, I had a talk with my local manager about how I'm feeling stagnant and would like to get more challenging projects. Her response showed her true colors: "If you want to move internally, I can assist you. It's your career. This position will never be more challenging." She spent 20 minutes telling me maybe I should move on basically, when I had just told her I want more challenging work/projects. She's offering me to shadow other people to make up my mind.

So instead of finding solutions, she's showing me the way out knowing full well my overseas manager (who is in senior management) keeps praising my work and had severe issues finding a great performer who would want to stay. My overseas manager threatened to close the position many times due to the poor performance or former employees & the fact our services can't keep an employee. I was often told I was their best employee on this desk and now my local manager is influencing me to move on.

Can anyone advise whether this should be worth discussing with my overseas manager? As in mentioning I was basically shown the way out by my local manager knowing I'm a top performer. The overseas manager and I have a close bond and speak daily.

FYI, my local manager & I have the same age (in our twenties). My overseas manager has 20 years experience.

Thanks.

Absolutely you should escalate this. Before doing that, you should try to get some sort of response in writing from your local manager. Send her a follow up email saying "I appreciate your time yesterday with our discussion regarding XYZ. I have considered your suggestions of XYZ, and really feel that I will best benefit the company by doing XYZ. Please let me know your thoughts." (I'm not in finance so if my wording is off, I apologize).

If her response still leaves you feeling unsettled, now you have a paper trail of your communications to forward to your overseas manager.

IMO, it sounds like local manager doesn't like that you're overshadowing her and would likely be better at her job than she is, or will likely move above her eventually. Don't settle for that.

It would be best to discuss with your overseas manager in a non-accusatory way. Don't try to get your local manager in trouble. Instead, define the problem and offer alternatives/solutions.

Additionally, I like what the last poster said about emailing your local manager to get the response in writing.

Sorry but I don't see where you are being shown out. You complained that the position isn't challenging. You are in fact complaining in this very post that it's limited, you are over qualified, and you get treated too often like your job description rather than what you actually know. Your local manager was blunt and honest with you that this particular position IS limited and not going to change, BUT if you want to move up, she/he will be happy to help you advance within the company, so that you are happy and able to work within your qualifications and abilities. What is your problem?

Sorry but I don't see where you are being shown out. You complained that the position isn't challenging. You are in fact complaining in this very post that it's limited, you are over qualified, and you get treated too often like your job description rather than what you actually know. Your local manager was blunt and honest with you that this particular position IS limited and not going to change, BUT if you want to move up, she/he will be happy to help you advance within the company, so that you are happy and able to work within your qualifications and abilities. What is your problem?

I didn't complain. I asked for more work/ad hoc projects. People get promoted by asking where they're at and how they could contribute. Everyone feels stagnant at some point of doing two years of the same thing, with no ad hoc projects, nothing.

I haven't even gotten promoted yet. The natural conclusion would be for me to get promoted, especially with all the positive feedbacks I had and targets I met.

I said I'm not going anywhere and would like to contribute more. This is the response I was met with.

She is showing me the way out. Instead of offering solutions, she's basically telling me: "Nothing left for you here, move on".

I expected solutions, not this.

Besides, she offered me to move to customer service ... how is this moving up? I really don't think she has my best interest at heart given her past reactions.

She is offering you to move up internally and to help you achieve that any way she can. That is the definition of promotion. You move from existing position to a better position within the company. So I'm asking you again, what is your problem?

If you don't like what she is suggesting then look around at what other openings/positions company has that are more to your liking and ask her to help you get there. I bet she will too. Not because she has your interests at heart, but purely because she would like to see you out of her hair. If that means getting you a good promotion, she'll do it. Be realistic. This is a workplace not a love fest. People don't need to like you to help you achieve. Quite the opposite sometimes. Be smart and know how to use that to your advantage.

How is moving on from my position to a customer service position, moving up?

Customer service doesn't even require a college degree. Is this a joke?

Your local manager does not have to share the same opinion of you that the other one has of you.

You have several degrees, have you learned in your education that that does not necessarily equate to being better than your peers?

I suggest you have some humility and attempt a career change despite having two managers.

Your current job is a dead-end job.

As an aside, I was working in a tech job awhile back and the person one cube over from me doing the exact same job kept crowing about her Harvard degree and how it was the only thing that let her succeed at the job.

She would make it clear to us all that she considered herself to be slumming it.

One day I had had enough of it. i asked her how much that Harvard degree cost her. It was tremendously expensive.

I pointed out that I thought it was a waste of money because I was doing the same job after attending a community college and a state university. I spent a small fraction of what she had spent--ending up in the same place!

Your degrees are not worthless. However, they are only the start. What you accomplish and how you interact with your coworkers and clients count for a lot. If the only career advancement in your department is to replace your local manager or take the opportunity that the local manager may want, then you have to try something else.

Well, it's not so much about my education or how much they cost me. It's about the fact that I cannot utilize the skills I acquired during my education and my former jobs in this current position. However, for now, I said I'm not seeking a position change. I never even hinted I wanted a position change. I simply said I'm feeling slightly stagnant and would like to get more challenging tasks. The next thing, I'm offered to look at other options.

Don't you think it's a bit of a drastic measure considering how well I've been doing with senior management?

Senior management wouldn't be providing any feedback if they didn't feel I was doing a good job. They never provide individual feedback on anyone, since they know no one on our floor.

Most of my knowledge is going down the drain, because I'm not using my full skill set. It's not about being better than my peers, but it is about making the most out of my potential. This position doesn't require a Master's degree nor a Bachelor really. Hence, my skills are being set aside. I never brag about my degrees, some people don't even know my background. I simply feel as though there's some skill set that is not being used and those are skills I acquired in my former positions, not my degrees.

I would agree with you if I only had the degrees, with no real skills. Clearly, a director with 25 years experience is more aware of my skills than my manager with 4 years experience in this industry. Whose opinion do you think I shall trust the most? My overseas manager who is older, more respected and wiser or someone who became a manager 4 months ago?

It's all about perspective.

OK, so you want more but you don't want to change your position but your position is a dead end and you are not happy with that..... Do you realize that you are talking out of both sides of the mouth right now? If you want more, that necessarily means change. Again, what other positions does this company have that would be up your alley? Have you even looked? Why do you expect your manager to spoon feed you advancement?

"I said I'm not seeking a position change. I never even discussed a position change. I simply said I'm feeling slightly stagnant and would like to get more challenging tasks. The next thing, I'm offered to look at other options. Don't you think it's a bit of a drastic measure considering how well I've been doing?"

Yes, it's all about perspective as you wrote. I think you gave the impression that you were complaining and this person probably interpreted as you wanting a position change since this position doesn't include more challenging tasks. Why did you take this job in the first place?

"I said I'm not seeking a position change. I never even discussed a position change. I simply said I'm feeling slightly stagnant and would like to get more challenging tasks. The next thing, I'm offered to look at other options. Don't you think it's a bit of a drastic measure considering how well I've been doing?"

 

Yes, it's all about perspective as you wrote. I think you gave the impression that you were complaining and this person probably interpreted as you wanting a position change since this position doesn't include more challenging tasks. Why did you take this job in the first place?

Well, I'm going to be honest, there's a lot of people who "complained" about the same in my department.

I specifically said: "I just feel stagnant, nothing is fundamentally wrong". As soon as I said: "I'm feeling stagnant" - She told me, you can look at other options. I hadn't even dived into the issue yet.

To which I replied: "I'm not saying I'm not suited for the position anymore, I just would like to get different additional tasks and to see a different perspective of the job".

Besides, I wasn't aware that this position didn't include any more challenging tasks ... until she told me today!

Some girl complained about how she didn't see her future in the company and they did everything they could to keep her. She's still here.

Why I accepted the job? It was a permanent position, in a big city, in a massive corporation. The job specs didn't exactly reflect the reality. You really get to know the job after a year and see it's not in line with the job specs.

The fact that I was offered a job which requires even less education and experience (customer service) is reflective of how she feels about me. She just wants to get rid of me.

From my perspective, admittedly based on a really small amount of data from you, is that your perceptions are off.

In my experience, career growth has most often come from jumping ship and going to a different employer.

You make some statements about others in your department not getting the kind of feedback from senior management that you get. How the heck would you know this?

And you compare the relative value of your local manager with senior management. Are you aware that when the company decides what to do with employees that they rely on your first-line manager's opinion quite a lot?

If it is important to you to use the skills yo acquired in college, then, dang, time to move on!

In my entire career I can count on one hand (actually, two fingers) the times my manager or a higher in the company got me a better job.

By far, my career advanced only when I sought employment elsewhere.

From my perspective, admittedly based on a really small amount of data from you, is that your perceptions are off.

 

In my experience, career growth has most often come from jumping ship and going to a different employer.

 

You make some statements about others in your department not getting the kind of feedback from senior management that you get. How the heck would you know this?

 

And you compare the relative value of your local manager with senior management. Are you aware that when the company decides what to do with employees that they rely on your first-line manager's opinion quite a lot?

 

If it is important to you to use the skills yo acquired in college, then, dang, time to move on!

 

In my entire career I can count on one hand (actually, two fingers) the times my manager or a higher in the company got me a better job.

 

By far, my career advanced only when I sought employment elsewhere.

I did not ask her to advance my career by getting me a job in another department. She offered for me to move.

Yet, I have not gotten promoted yet in my current position. Why would she offer me to move to a higher position in a different department?

As I said, she suggested customer service which is hardly a career advancement.

How would I know about the senior management's feedback? Because she told me herself that senior managers of other markets never provide any feedback. It's not an assumption, I was told this reality when I started and later on as I progressed. People themselves told me they have senior contact with senior management (as some heard about certain feedbacks). I would not speculate something like this, unless I had information.

There's a difference between my line manager and my overseas manager:

My overseas manager has a complete overview of my work since her office owns the procedures and checks my work since I deal with her portfolio. I'm in daily contact with her.

My line manager does not know the procedures since she works under a different jurisdiction and doesn't even speak the language. She can only assess my performance based on my overseas' manager's feedback.

To clarify: Let's just say the line manager manages "USA", "Brazil" and "Ireland" markets yet she's only specialized on Brazilian procedures/market and has no clue about US-related procedures. Hence, she can't effectively assess the quality of my work.

 

How would I know about the senior management's feedback? Because she told me herself that senior managers of other markets never provide any feedback. It's not an assumption, I was told this reality when I started and later on as I progressed. People themselves told me they have senior contact with senior management (as some heard about certain feedbacks). I would not speculate something like this, unless I had information.

 

You know only that your local manager expressed the opinion that senior management never provides feedback. You do not know it to be a blanket true statement.

 

There's a difference between my line manager and my overseas manager:

 

My overseas manager has a complete overview of my work since her office owns the procedures and checks my work since I deal with her portfolio. I'm in daily contact with her.

My line manager does not know the procedures since she works under a different jurisdiction and doesn't even speak the language. She can only assess my performance based on my overseas' manager's feedback.

 

To clarify: Let's just say the line manager manages "USA", "Brazil" and "Ireland" markets yet she's only specialized on Brazilian procedures/market and has no clue about US-related procedures. Hence, she can't effectively assess the quality of my work.

And no other employee has a similar situation?

So, then why are you reporting at all to someone locally when you really work for this senior person?

You know only that your local manager expressed the opinion that senior management never provides feedback. You do not know it to be a blanket true statement.

 

 

 

And no other employee has a similar situation?

 

So, then why are you reporting at all to someone locally when you really work for this senior person?

No, I'm the only employee who has direct contact/works for a senior manager abroad.

All the others only work with the line manager as there's a sort of Chinese wall between all local/overseas teams, except for me & my overseas colleagues.

Dont' ask me why, I don't know. I'm just the only one in this position.

Maybe you should ask this last question to higher management .. I don't have an answer on this. How am I supposed to know the rationale behind this?

"As soon as I said: "I'm feeling stagnant" - She told me, you can look at other options. I hadn't even dived into the issue yet.

To which I replied: "I'm not saying I'm not suited for the position anymore, I just would like to get different additional tasks and to see a different perspective of the job"."

I would not have led with that. I would have said "I have some ideas of how I can contribute more to the department. Then you give 2-3 bullet point examples. Starting off with your emotions (honestly, who cares -you're there to do a job not share your emotions, with rare exception) and with no concrete ideas understandably triggered that reaction in her. I just think it was a miscommunication, you flubbed your presentation a bit, and at this point you could try to backpedal, again, and explain what you truly meant.

Today, I had a talk with my local manager about how I'm feeling stagnant and would like to get more challenging projects. Her response showed her true colors: "If you want to move internally, I can assist you. It's your career. This position will never be more challenging." She spent 20 minutes telling me maybe I should move on basically, when I had just told her I want more challenging work/projects. She's offering me to shadow other people to make up my mind.

Actually, I think she gave you the EXACT right advice. You've taken a position that you're over-qualified for. It doesn't require the full skill set that you've developed, and it never will. Now that you have experience with this company, it sounds like you can make a better move and she will help you. I really don't get the doom and gloom.

She told me, you can look at other options. I hadn't even dived into the issue yet.

I think you've failed to recognize that the actual "issue" is that you are in a dead end job.

Besides, I wasn't aware that this position didn't include any more challenging tasks ... until she told me today!

There may be even more that you aren't aware of.

Some girl complained about how she didn't see her future in the company and they did everything they could to keep her. She's still here.

What did they do for her?

The fact that I was offered a job which requires even less education and experience (customer service) is reflective of how she feels about me. She just wants to get rid of me.

You seem to feel threatened by your current manager--do you think she is trying to rob you of your chance to advance?

I don't see why you don't just have the same conversation with your overseas manager. If they are the ones directly reviewing your work, they are the ones who would be more apt to develop you professionally.

Again, get your local managers dismissal in writing, and then approach your overseas manager. You're following the chain of command. That's exactly what you're supposed to do.

How long have you been in your current position?

Speaking only for myself, I would be less offended and more inspired to move beyond a manager who I felt didn't recognize my talents. I'd consider taking her up on the opportunity to find a position within the company that's more challenging and suitable for my education level and skills. She's aware of the limited scope of your current job, and she's offering to help you move beyond it. Why is that not a good thing?

I would be less offended and more inspired to move beyond a manager who I felt didn't recognize my talents.

It sounds like a win-win situation!

Today, I had a long and intense talk with my manager. I opened up about how "stagnant" I have been feeling because I have not been learning anything new. She suggested a few things, but when I ultimately asked her where she sees me in a year time, she said: "Not here, I think".

She had a very strange scripted speech which broke down as follows (The "I" are her words):

• I think you're a very strong minded individual with amazing confidence, but you're too harsh sometimes (perhaps, it's a cultural thing?).

• I think you should direct your career towards a more "law" oriented field, especially given your education and experience. This would be more suitable for you.

Perhaps we can schedule meetings with people in these departments, so you can chat with them and get an overview of what they do.

• I can promote you towards the end of next year, then what? Nothing. Your career won't progress after that (this is somewhat true, since there's only team leads positions as next level and all are already taken).

• There are people who are born natural leaders and you have the ability to be very successful, if you choose the right path. You're young, you should make the move now.

• Perhaps, a change of location would be something to consider. Would moving you to another location be something you'd be interested in?

She said she'd set my year's target as development for an internal move which she would facilitate. Basically, a promotion is not on the cards, despite the fact I worked hard all year and kept getting positive feedback from senior management. In the beginning of last year, she said I had no confidence and at the beginning of this year, I'm the polar opposite. There's been no change in attitude, I just know what I'm doing better now.

I find this whole thing really bizarre, especially as this comes a month after senior management provided extremely positive feedback about my performance.

My manager is not in senior management. She's only a team leader. Hence, I don't comprehend why she's seeking to get rid of me, when I'm the only one in my position. I don't have a team, so if I'm gone, that's it. I can't comprehend. This is all too strange for me.

To me, it's code for "better find a job now, I'm giving you the boot here".

I am taking all this in, and what is running through my mind is, "Could she feel threatened by you in any way? Does she feel that you would replace her?" It is either that or she is genuinely telling you that it would be better for you career wise to seek employment elsewhere. :eek:chi

I opened up about how "stagnant" I have been feeling because I have not been learning anything new.

As a manager, I'd be enthusiastic about helping someone who opened up a positive negotiation about what more he or she can offer to me and my team in exchange for my assistance with further development, either on my team or beyond it rather than someone who laid a complaint at my feet as though it's up to me to resolve it. That's just a bummer, not an incentive for me to invest in that person.

Work is not a therapeutic environment. Those who seek to use it as an educational one can do so through proper negotiation of a quid pro quo exchange of the added value he or she is willing to bring TO management in exchange for the additional value he or she seeks to gain from management.

Nothing comes for free. If you want to complain to management about ANYthing, be prepared to offer at least 3 options for resolution that demonstrate a value-added reason for that manager invest in implementing your suggestions.

So what did you bring to the table as your offering beyond your complaint?