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Thread: Was it considered normal to hit a wife years ago (to ''control her verbal outbursts'')?

  1. #11
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    I appreciate your advice Krankor but I've already solved my issues. I will not ever tolerate a bf, much less my future husband making the slightest gesture of aggression. My long-distance relationship is ok and we're both against abuse.

    As a kid I made my own private vow to never let a man hit me and that I wouldn't ever accept it.

  2. #12
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    Originally Posted by dragonfly87
    I appreciate your advice Krankor but I've already solved my issues. I will not ever tolerate a bf, much less my future husband making the slightest gesture of aggression. My long-distance relationship is ok and we're both against abuse.

    As a kid I made my own private vow to never let a man hit me and that I wouldn't ever accept it.
    I think being "against abuse" is a small part of it. It's spending time together and knowing in real life, in person, how you each deal with being hangry/angry/frustrated/etc. when you're with the other person. And there's a range -some people think raising one's voice even if the words are fine is "yelling" and others are totally fine with arguing and yelling at each other, then getting it out and making up romantically -and it doesn't feel abusive and it is not abusive -it's just letting off steam and respecting certain boundaries (no name calling, etc). Physical abuse is another category.

    So yes it's positive that you both are "against abuse" but for me that would be way too general if it was about getting involved in serious relationship.

  3. #13
    Platinum Member rosephase's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by Krankor
    One thing that is interesting and kind of surprising is that intimate partner violence is most common in lesbian relationships and least common among gay males.
    citation needed.

    The research I've found is that same sex relationship have a higher rate of reported domestic violence then hetero relationships. Nothing at all about lesbians being more violent and gay men being less.

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    Platinum Member DancingFool's Avatar
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    OP, I think you need to consider that while abuse is generally considered bad and taboo, corporal punishment isn't necessarily viewed the same way and is very much alive and well in many place and cultures around the world.

    In fact, within your own family, I would bet good money that your parents would both be very strongly against abuse, but do not see their own actions as falling into that category. Meaning that if your father had a bad day at work and came home and simply beat up your mother just because, she would consider it abuse and would have left him. The behavior that you describe, with her yelling out of control abuse in his face and refusing to stop and him resorting to corporal punishment isn't actually abuse at all in their mind and interpretation of the situation. This subject, in many instances isn't so black and white.

    I'd also be concerned with your certainty about your LDR. How well do you really know him? Have you seen him angry in person? Nobody in their right mind will tell you that they think abuse is OK. No abusive person is ever going to admit to being abusive.

    The reason I'm raising these distinctions, OP, is as food for thought for you in terms of how you vet a potential partner. He may well have this distinction in mind as to what constitutes abuse and what is justified and not seen as abuse. You might want to consider asking more subtle questions. That said, seeing someone truly angry is the only way to know how they handle their anger.

    Just to be clear, I am not condoning physical violence of any kind. However, we do live in a world where not everyone sees violence as violence.

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    Originally Posted by DancingFool
    OP, I think you need to consider that while abuse is generally considered bad and taboo, corporal punishment isn't necessarily viewed the same way and is very much alive and well in many place and cultures around the world.
    In fact, within your own family, I would bet good money that your parents would both be very strongly against abuse, but do not see their own actions as falling into that category. Meaning that if your father had a bad day at work and came home and simply beat up your mother just because, she would consider it abuse and would have left him. The behavior that you describe, with her yelling out of control abuse in his face and refusing to stop and him resorting to corporal punishment isn't actually abuse at all in their mind and interpretation of the situation. This subject, in many instances isn't so black and white.
    I understand your point but isn't corporal punishment in a marriage something that both are aware of and had a prior discussion about it (when to do it, when not to, how hard, when is it too much, etc) before even marrying that person. There was no prior discussion at all the very first time he went physical on her, which was a year after they got married; he pushed her out of bed in anger during an argument.
    Clearly in those incidents I've mentioned, my mother was crying and telling him to stop, saying (in Spanish) ''Ok, alright stop hitting me, stop it''. That right there doesn't sound like consentment to me.
    My father thinks abusing a woman is when you beat her up so badly that she's missing teeth or gets punches to the point of disfigurement and needs to seriously go to the hospital. However, he doesn't think slapping a woman if she backtalks or doing what he did was/is abuse.

    Originally Posted by DancingFool
    I'd also be concerned with your certainty about your LDR. How well do you really know him? Have you seen him angry in person? Nobody in their right mind will tell you that they think abuse is OK. No abusive person is ever going to admit to being abusive.

    The reason I'm raising these distinctions, OP, is as food for thought for you in terms of how you vet a potential partner. He may well have this distinction in mind as to what constitutes abuse and what is justified and not seen as abuse. You might want to consider asking more subtle questions. That said, seeing someone truly angry is the only way to know how they handle their anger.

    Just to be clear, I am not condoning physical violence of any kind. However, we do live in a world where not everyone sees violence as violence.
    I've met him in 2006 and at the time I was in Miami, Fl. We were dating for nearly 10 months and he has never laid a hand on me. We could have been married long ago to be honest but we're in a tought situation. He's trying to come here to my country, to bring me back to Miami, FL.

  7. #16
    Platinum Member Krankor's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by rosephase
    citation needed.

    The research I've found is that same sex relationship have a higher rate of reported domestic violence then hetero relationships. Nothing at all about lesbians being more violent and gay men being less.
    This is according to the CDC's 2010 findings on domestic assault.

    Unfortunately most jurisdictions are still using the debunked "Duluth Model" for dealing with domestic violence, which posits that all domestic violence is a matter of "patriarchal terrorism." The fact is, domestic violence really isn't a gendered issue. This model ignores male victims of domestic violence and female on female victims.

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    Originally Posted by rosephase
    citation needed.

    The research I've found is that same sex relationship have a higher rate of reported domestic violence then hetero relationships. Nothing at all about lesbians being more violent and gay men being less.
    It is not more common in lesbian relationships but it does follow it much more closely in heterosexual couples and the incidence of violence is much lower in gay (men) relationships. This is what the best research does seem to show but none of it is very good because it is difficult to do good science when the issue is so politicized.

    Gay long term relationships tend to look very different than lesbian relationship, and lesbian relationships tend to look a lot more like hetero relations and also mimic violence patterns.

    It is very difficult to get good information on the cause of violence because we are actually not interested as a society about what causes violence because it is seen as somehow condoning it.

    Personally I believe a very strong biological component where it follows "mate guarding" behavior. Obviously mostly a problem for men as they have parental uncertainly which women for obvious reasons do not. (Lets call it type 1)

    The other type of violence simply comes down to poor communications skills both men and women are well represented, and you could call it type 2.

    Gay men relationships simply do not have type 1 violence, just the type 2. For some reason because lesbians do have children biologically there is some mimicking of mate guarding behavior that you see in straight couples. The violence is surprisingly high and you can find this information online.

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    As far as the OP's question specifically, no it was never considered normal to hit a wife, it was however seen as comical for a wife to hit a husband, but attitudes are changing slowly. Mainly because the female body is seen as something sacred while the male body generally is not. That is because that there are many sacred notions around where human life is created. What has changed mostly I think is the notion of family itself as something sacred. Family used to be seen by extension where human life is created where it can nurture and grow, we don't think that way anymore, right now it can mean anything. People were far more reluctant to interfere in the family years ago, but not anymore now that sacred notion of the family has disappeared. The good news is nowadays it is far easier for family members who are abused to get help, but there are trade offs too.

  10. #19
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    When I get a chance I'll do a research on DV within gay/lesbian relationship. For the meantime, let's focus on my specific topic regarding a husband thinking he's in the rights to hit his wife with household objects without even talking to her in advance at all and isn't even listening to his wife's cries nor pleads. If a bf or a future husband suddenly start hitting me in anger with a belt during an argument he wouldn't be in my life anymore.

    lukeb it's good news that nowadays more abused women are seeking help and their family members are getting involved as it should be. If I ever have kids, I want to teach them that hitting isn't ok at all.

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