Father's visitation rights?

Basically, my partner had been acting emotionally abusive towards me and my children for the past 3 years of our relationship. At first I blamed myself, tried to get mental help, was put on anti depressants for my depression and anxiety. I began to see his behaviour as abusive and with the help of a women's shelter and the police there was an emergency protection order put against him. He's not allowed to see me or the children.

Next week, there is a court date to either confirm and extend the order for a year, or make amendments to the order like supervised visits for him and the children.

I'm torn whether to allow the visits. My counsellor advises against it and says the amendment should be him receiving counselling for a year before seeing the children. But my father is pressuring me to allow it and says I'm being spiteful in not allowing it

2 weeks ago, my partner broke his order and showed up at the house. Crying, begging and pleading that he sees the wrongs in his ways and vows to change. I felt terribly guilty after seeing him. My counsellor worries that if I open up communication between him and our children, it gives him a chance to manipulate me and guilt trip me into getting back together.

I'm torn because I don't agree with taking children from their father, they are as much a part of him as they are me. But I worry what it will cause as iv been very happy since not seeing him and the children's behaviour has improved 100% since him not having contact with them!!

Any advice?

You are their sole protection. And I’m sorry but no abuser gets better without therapy just not possible . The crying and the whining and the crap is all part of manipulation . In normal circumstances I would agree seeing the father is very important . But if he’s a known abuser he should be required to attend therapy before he can see his children . And initially visitation should be entirely supervised . That can be done by third-party such as children services .

If he violates the protection order again call the police immediately . And don’t fall for his shenanigans .

Nobody is perfect and if he is going to get help and be responsible then you should let him see his children ...you as well had depression and anxiety and you know how difficult that can be! I agree with your father in this case not to be spiteful, show some compassion...how would u like the court to take away your children because of your anxiety?

What if your anxiety could get worse and you accidently lashed out and made your children not feel comfortable...you want your husband to take your kids away

even my father has told me things or swore at me when I was younger and it doesn't me bother me one bit...I actually would hate my mother if she took my father out of my life for swearing...

you probably heard your dad say F___K at some point in your life...does that mean he is no longer human?!!!????

Nobody is perfect and if he is going to get help and be responsible then you should let him see his children ...you as well had depression and anxiety and you know how difficult that can be! I agree with your father in this case not to be spiteful, show some compassion...how would u like the court to take away your children because of your anxiety?

 

even my father has told me things or swore at me when I was younger and it doesn't me bother me one bit...I actually would hate my mother if she took my father out of my life for swearing...

 

you probably heard your dad say F___K at some point in your life...does that mean he is no longer human?!!!????

We are talking about abuse with a protective order, not some swearing.

You are their sole protection. And I’m sorry but no abuser gets better without therapy just not possible . The crying and the whining and the crap is all part of manipulation . In normal circumstances I would agree seeing the father is very important . But if he’s a known abuser he should be required to attend therapy before he can see his children . And initially visitation should be entirely supervised . That can be done by third-party such as children services .

 

If he violates the protection order again call the police immediately . And don’t fall for his shenanigans .

I reported the order broken and he has spent time in prison for it and charged and hasn't tried again thankfully.

I also believe due to his abuse the children suffered, which is why they have been so incredibly happy and behaved since he was removed from the house. I can see the devastation the abuse had on us all, even though at the time, I believed I sheltered them from it.

I guess I fear the backlash from family and friends from not allowing the visitation yet.. but my intuition tells me it's the best thing for my children.

Do not believe the crocodile tears!! No visitation. he must go/continue counseling. And i would extend it for more than a year --- whether you can do that now or have to wait until the following year

I'm torn because I don't agree with taking children from their father, they are as much a part of him as they are me.

You did not take them from their father, you PROTECTED THEM from their father. There is a huuuuge difference. When they are adults or older teens they can make their own decision whether they want to see him or not -- but be prepared for him to make you the bad guy. Now that they are young - you have to be the fierce mama bear. Don't worry about the backlash..

Nobody is perfect and if he is going to get help and be responsible then you should let him see his children ...you as well had depression and anxiety and you know how difficult that can be! I agree with your father in this case not to be spiteful, show some compassion...how would u like the court to take away your children because of your anxiety?

 

What if your anxiety could get worse and you accidently lashed out and made your children not feel comfortable...you want your husband to take your kids away

 

even my father has told me things or swore at me when I was younger and it doesn't me bother me one bit...I actually would hate my mother if she took my father out of my life for swearing...

 

you probably heard your dad say F___K at some point in your life...does that mean he is no longer human?!!!????

The last incidents were him threatening to chop my head off if I left, take my kids away from me if I left and threatened to harm our 1 year old if he cried. That resulted in police intervention.

He blames all of his behaviour on mental illness, financial stress, and says the threats were just jokes.

It wasn't anxiety or swearing, he physically abused me during my last pregnancy and refused to take care of the children, flying into rages if I asked him to, left my 1 year old in his crib when he did watch them while I was at work, and refusing to work or support us.

The last incidents were him threatening to chop my head off if I left, take my kids away from me if I left and threatened to harm our 1 year old if he cried. That resulted in police intervention.

 

He blames all of his behaviour on mental illness, financial stress, and says the threats were just jokes.

No visitation for him unless you want yourself or one of your kids in a body bag.

It's obviously in the best interests of everybody for him to get the counseling he needs to suitably co-parent. But he needs to do just that. That will most likely be formally spelled out to him during this visitation hearing. Don't enable him with shortcuts and informal visits.

I'm torn because I don't agree with taking children from their father, they are as much a part of him as they are me.

 

You did not take them from their father, you PROTECTED THEM from their father. There is a huuuuge difference. When they are adults or older teens they can make their own decision whether they want to see him or not -- but be prepared for him to make you the bad guy. Now that they are young - you have to be the fierce mama bear. Don't worry about the backlash..

I should look at it as though I'm just protecting my babies. They mean the world to me and I believe we as parents should earn our right to be an active part in their lives. Something that my partner horribly took advantage of.

Keep him away until he has been treated.

Do not listen to friends and family.

Follow your heart. Take care of the kids.

Maybe your husband will change, but until then keep him away.

It may be difficult for you, so do it for the children's sake.

I will tell you in part I have life long PTSD because my mom stayed with my abusive dad and his abusive family and allowed visitation and felt bad for him. So I have PTSD and occasional crushing anxiety. Protect your kids and forget him.

Follow your intuition. You are protecting your children and yourself. Do not be shamed into doing differently.

Thank you all for validating my feelings and opinion on the matter.

Iv decided I'm going to confront my father on the issue this weekend and ask him to either stop talking to my ex or stop relaying his sadness and manipulation on to me.

My dad is caring and he has definitely fallen for my exes cries for attention and pity.. which makes me in turn self doubtful as iv always taken my father's advice in the past.

I will continue to be stern!

iv been very happy since not seeing him and the children's behaviour has improved 100% since him not having contact with them!!

At the very least, his visits be supervised by a third party (not you, op) for a limited amount of time.

Have you asked your children if they want to see their father?

You are against the supervised visits?

To what extent was he emotionally abusive? Enough to not allow someone to be in their children's lives, even when supervised?

That ^ alone would be enough for me to know that he doesn't get to see them until he's gotten the therapy he needs.

At the very least, his visits be supervised by a third party (not you, op) for a limited amount of time.

 

Have you asked your children if they want to see their father?

My boys are too young to understand anything. They are 18 months and 3. I'm sure would jump to see dad though if given the chance.

You are against the supervised visits?

 

To what extent was he emotionally abusive? Enough to not allow someone to be in their children's lives, even when supervised?

I'l copy and paste what I wrote above ..

No matter what, the visits would be supervised if it was granted at this point. My eldest who is 9, feels sorry for him. I'm sure she would like to see him if I asked her. But partly because the last time he was alone with her, he unloaded on to her about how hurt he was and cried in front of her.. also innapropriately asked her to ask me not to sleep with other men.. grrr.

 

My boys are too young to understand anything. They are 18 months and 3. I'm sure would jump to see dad though if given the chance.

Yes, he is entirely inappropriate.

You are against the supervised visits?

 

To what extent was he emotionally abusive? Enough to not allow someone to be in their children's lives, even when supervised?

The last incidents were him threatening to chop my head off if I left, take my kids away from me if I left and threatened to harm our 1 year old if he cried. That resulted in police intervention.

He blames all of his behaviour on mental illness, financial stress, and says the threats were just jokes.

Oh, dang. I'm sorry, I missed that. That would be reason enough to be scared of his visitation. Maybe the therapy is necessary first.

Oh, dang. I'm sorry, I missed that. That would be reason enough to be scared of his visitation. Maybe the therapy is necessary first.

He seems to think it was just a mistake but it feels like he destroyed us and caused a lot of pain to us all.

I can't help but be annoyed by his begging and pleading.. if he loved at all like he claims to... how is it possible he would have ever treated us this way to begin with? And not just once or twice, it was every day for 3 years.

Supervised means supervised by a third party, not you, and court order means that you don't get a vote.

If he violates the protection order again, dial 911 immediately, and don't let him in.

Report this violation to your lawyer to learn whether it can be raised in court without penalizing you for not contacting the police.

That's okay.. and I think he really needs to get into counselling and therapy first to maybe understand and realize what he has put us through in the past little while.

He seems to think it was just a mistake but it feels like he destroyed us and caused a lot of pain to us all.

I can't help but be annoyed by his begging and pleading.. if he loved at all like he claims to... how is it possible he would have ever treated us this way to begin with? And not just once or twice, it was every day for 3 years.

Yes = its not like it was ONE incident. It was a pattern of behavior. Believe me, my abusive ex changed for a few weeks and then was back to his ways bigger than ever. He doesn't know how to act any other way and you need to protect your children. If the court leaves it up to YOU if he can see the kids -- then you keep saying NO until they give you no choice. Extend the protective order as far out as you can. He is not a good man if he physically abused his pregnant wife. To me, that should warrant no contact for life. If the kids decide to know their father at 18 there is little you can do, but for now -- he is not a changed man.