dating pet peeve-can it be stopped?

Hi, all!

I have this HUGE pet peeve. Just about every time I go on a first date, I get pressured for sex. It doesn't matter how I dress. I don't act flirty. Its the same whether i meet the guy online or in irl. I find it especially annoying when i go on dating websites as I actually go there to date. IMo some of these guys would be better off going to a more sexual oriented 'dating' website. I've never meet a man off Tinder.

I get irritated and feel like these guys are mostly wasting my time.

I mean I get the whole #HookupCulture struggle, but if this is every time, I might ask what you could do differently. Are you meeting these guys for a drink at 9:00pm on a Saturday night? Are they sending you suggestive emails or texts and you're still giving them the time of day despite it? I get some people can be pretty damn forward, but I'm a little confused how one gets "pressured" to have sex at a completely public venue.

I've always encouraged folks who want to make it clear they're not in it for a hookup to meet earlier in the day and for something simple like coffee or an afternoon bite. Can't say I've overheard any particularly lewd come-ons at an eatery as of late.

I mean I get the whole #HookupCulture struggle, but if this is every time, I might ask what you could do differently. Are you meeting these guys for a drink at 9:00pm on a Saturday night? Are they sending you suggestive emails or texts and you're still giving them the time of day despite it? I get some people can be pretty damn forward, but I'm a little confused how one gets "pressured" to have sex at a completely public venue.

 

I've always encouraged folks who want to make it clear they're not in it for a hookup to meet earlier in the day and for something simple like coffee or an afternoon bite. Can't say I've overheard any particularly lewd come-ons at an eatery as of late.

Agree. I have learned by trial and error that a number of social behaviors permit the suggestion of sex, and others discourage it, and men (I am a heterosexual woman, so that's what I know) will use those behaviors to signal their intentions. Or not... and this creates confusion, certainly. Or they will use them to trial balloon and then change course to avoid gettting rejected.

For example, the after-dinner cocktail is a hook up opportunity. The Sunday bike ride is not.

It might be that you are playing along in good flirtatious fun, as you have the right to do and to do safely, and that insodoing you are missing the opportunity to check these men sooner.

Humor is always a way of telling a truth. If you end up in flirty or sexual banter with a man, it is playful fun as well as a trial balloon to see whether sex is available. You may need to practice shutting them down in a funny way.

I mean I get the whole #HookupCulture struggle, but if this is every time, I might ask what you could do differently. Are you meeting these guys for a drink at 9:00pm on a Saturday night? Are they sending you suggestive emails or texts and you're still giving them the time of day despite it? I get some people can be pretty damn forward, but I'm a little confused how one gets "pressured" to have sex at a completely public venue.

 

I've always encouraged folks who want to make it clear they're not in it for a hookup to meet earlier in the day and for something simple like coffee or an afternoon bite. Can't say I've overheard any particularly lewd come-ons at an eatery as of late.

I tried to stop going on real dates and instead do coffee. I still got similar results. I didn't dress sexy or act flirty. I don't do 9pm going out for drinks. It doesn't matter if we go for Sunday bowling, movie, coffee, it's always the same result. I don't flirt with these guy before hand. I'm talking about guys who ive barely messaged on a dating website and having talked to much.

I get offers to come back to their places watch a movie or something like that, or in some way be alone with them under some pretense, which i also find very annoying.

Agree. I have learned by trial and error that a number of social behaviors permit the suggestion of sex, and others discourage it, and men (I am a heterosexual woman, so that's what I know) will use those behaviors to signal their intentions. Or not... and this creates confusion, certainly. Or they will use them to trial balloon and then change course to avoid gettting rejected.

 

For example, the after-dinner cocktail is a hook up opportunity. The Sunday bike ride is not.

 

It might be that you are playing along in good flirtatious fun, as you have the right to do and to do safely, and that insodoing you are missing the opportunity to check these men sooner.

 

Humor is always a way of telling a truth. If you end up in flirty or sexual banter with a man, it is playful fun as well as a trial balloon to see whether sex is available. You may need to practice shutting them down in a funny way.

There's no sexual banter, it still happens. Also, I don't think a man should expect sex just because he paid $12.00 for my dinner. I don't know him that well after 45 minutes dinner or lunch.

I even go on dates wearing what is essentially a floor length mumu,and it still happens.

Dating is a major weeding out process. There are lots of people looking for quick hookups, but plenty who aren't.

Start making you goals clear during a quick coffee date, or even in a phone convo beforehand, that youre dating to find a relationship and you don't believe in first date hookups so if he's looking for that he can move on.

If the guy starts to pressure then treat it like a bad job interview, as in thanks but no thanks and just get up and leave. And start going Dutch on early dates and paying for yourself or alternating paying since this isn't Victorian England. Women who expect men to always pick up the tab and pay for all the dates tend to end up with these types of neanderthal men who think paying for dinner means the girl should put out. Start acting like an equal and pay for yourself on early dates and you'll get more respect and more respectful guys.

I'd really like the play-by-play of these 1:00pm coffee dates leading into them pressuring you for sex from across the table. I'm assuming the reality lies somewhere between the genuine bad luck and hyperbole.

Also, it's not just because women are grown adults that I encourage them to pay their own way, but it is also to avoid the more transactional line of thinking a lot of guys have when paying. Not saying they're justified or that you do in fact owe them anything, but, as you say, they don't know you. They're not paying for you because you're a great person or because they think you're in need. They're not paying for you because your time has a larger dollar value than theirs. And with women coming ever closer to parity in society, the whole muscle reflex of paying being "just what guys do" is fading. In this day and age, I do tend to scrutinize more heavily guys who would insist on adding that unnecessarily disproportionate dynamic. Not saying every guy keeping to the old ways is looking to buy women into bed. Ton of people out there who simply get joy out of treating folks. But pulling out your own wallet is a good way to avoid that potentiality.

I've actually been in the opposite position with girls wanting sex from me (although not on the first few dates, admittedly). I think you've proven that a lot of guys on social media sites are just horny guys looking for sex. Men particularly are "lone wolves," not really interested in relationships other than for sex. Woman are nest builders. They want create friendships and relationships. They use sex to create trust and closeness. Men come at it from from the opposite direction, they might start feeling closer to the woman they're having sex with. Obviously, this isn't universal. I've only been able to make love to people I've actually loved. And there are predators on both sides. But certainly j.man has a good solution by keeping dates to earlier in the day.

Dating is a major weeding out process. There are lots of people looking for quick hookups, but plenty who aren't.

 

Start making you goals clear during a quick coffee date, or even in a phone convo beforehand, that youre dating to find a relationship and you don't believe in first date hookups so if he's looking for that he can move on.

 

If the guy starts to pressure then treat it like a bad job interview, as in thanks but no thanks and just get up and leave. And start going Dutch on early dates and paying for yourself or alternating paying since this isn't Victorian England. Women who expect men to always pick up the tab and pay for all the dates tend to end up with these types of neanderthal men who think paying for dinner means the girl should put out. Start acting like an equal and pay for yourself on early dates and you'll get more respect and more respectful guys.

Thanks for your response. These guys i wouldnt call neanderthals.

Im not gonna pay for the first date. In my relationshios i have paid for plenty of gifts, movies, and dinners, but im not doing that with someone i just met.

Im also not looking for an equal. I want someone who will lead. If i want equal, ill date another woman.

Getting up and leaving is an option for sure. Im done with the movie invutes, which is why i pretty much stopped mass dating.

I'd really like the play-by-play of these 1:00pm coffee dates leading into them pressuring you for sex from across the table. I'm assuming the reality lies somewhere between the genuine bad luck and hyperbole.

 

Also, it's not just because women are grown adults that I encourage them to pay their own way, but it is also to avoid the more transactional line of thinking a lot of guys have when paying. Not saying they're justified or that you do in fact owe them anything, but, as you say, they don't know you. They're not paying for you because you're a great person or because they think you're in need. They're not paying for you because your time has a larger dollar value than theirs. And with women coming ever closer to parity in society, the whole muscle reflex of paying being "just what guys do" is fading. In this day and age, I do tend to scrutinize more heavily guys who would insist on adding that unnecessarily disproportionate dynamic. Not saying every guy keeping to the old ways is looking to buy women into bed. Ton of people out there who simply get joy out of treating folks. But pulling out your own wallet is a good way to avoid that potentiality.

Well, the dates arent flirty. That guy invited me to some strange place for sex.

Imo if a man is looking to trade sex and money, he would be better suited elsewhere. Like i said before, if i had to pay for the man or for myself all the time, ill date another female. I need a man who is strong, a leader, etc. Im not looking for sameness. I dont ask for anything expensive. Im not getting fancy steak dinners.

Somehow i also doubt this would stop guys from asking for sex asap.

Ive thought abt dating only men who im extremely physically attracted to, but thats rare for me.

In a way you're contradicting yourself.

You want a leader but you don't want them to lead. Right? They are initiating sex and you don't like it.

I try and only date men I see as an equal. I have never had a guy invite me back to their place after a date. Ever. If you're pursuing the very confident, masculine types, I would think that's part of your problem.

In a way you're contradicting yourself.

 

You want a leader but you don't want them to lead. Right? They are initiating sex and you don't like it.

 

I try and only date men I see as an equal. I have never had a guy invite me back to their place after a date. Ever. If you're pursuing the very confident, masculine types, I would think that's part of your problem.

Its not a contradiction. A man can lead and also take the time to get to know me. The best leader i ever dated, albeit casually, was celibate. He always respected me, he was a leader, and a man of his word.

I go on dating websites to date, not to have random sex with a bunch of guys. I want to be treated like a human being with a personality, not a piece of meat.

When i say lead, i dont mean to the bedroom.

Ive dated all kinds of men, and all of them do it. Like i said before, i can be nonflirty and show up in a mumu yet it still happens.

Right. You're not getting my point. If you're going after strong confident leaders, they will pursue what they want. Try changing up the kinds of guys you go out with and I bet you have more luck.

There's no sexual banter, it still happens. Also, I don't think a man should expect sex just because he paid $12.00 for my dinner. I don't know him that well after 45 minutes dinner or lunch.

I even go on dates wearing what is essentially a floor length mumu,and it still happens.

Like others have said, there has to be something happening. I admit, I didn't recognize the signs right away either, but after some time, patterns occur, pay attention to them. If hes calling you pet names before you even meet? Probably a bad sign. Focused mainly on your looks? More of a bad sign. Texting you after 10 asking what you're doing, definite bad sign, tell him you're being a child of God and keep it moving. And yeah, I agree with you, if a man expects sex because he paid for a Denny's grand slam, hes got some screws loose, but I think what the poster is saying is the time is what you should be looking at. If hes trying to plan a date for after 9pm and its not because of his work schedule, odds are hes got some ulterior motives. I know youre saying dudes are doing it during lunch dates too, thats why I say somethings gotta be going on. I dont think its at all the 'norm' for men to be pigs so the fact that its happening every time? Statistically speaking, it just doesn't add up and considering you're the common denominator, it might be wise to take a good look at your weeding out process and actions.

Well, the dates arent flirty. That guy invited me to some strange place for sex.

 

Imo if a man is looking to trade sex and money, he would be better suited elsewhere. Like i said before, if i had to pay for the man or for myself all the time, ill date another female. I need a man who is strong, a leader, etc. Im not looking for sameness. I dont ask for anything expensive. Im not getting fancy steak dinners.

 

Somehow i also doubt this would stop guys from asking for sex asap.

 

Ive thought abt dating only men who im extremely physically attracted to, but thats rare for me.

In any case, I was going off your lamenting men paying for dinner and them feeling like you then owed them sex. You stated outright that it is a concern of yours, so quite obviously the simplest and easiest remedy would be to invest in your own cup of brew.

The consensus, and by a large margin, is you're the common denominator. Want dudes to pay for you but don't want them to have a sense of entitlement afterward? That's fine. You do you. Those guys do exist even if in waning numbers. But it's pretty apparent you'll need to step up your game and filter in other ways we're probably not being filled in enough to provide you feedback for.

To be quite honest, the whole paying thing aside, in 2017, men are increasingly looking for partners and not followers. You're going to command a whole lot less respect with your current outlook, or at least as far as I can interpret it. I don't think it's coincidental you're getting guys brazenly inviting you back to hook up as a near completely constant occurrence. I really mean that less as a political or social commentary than it probably comes off. Just to say, if I had to guess, we're only seeing the tip of the iceberg as far as your attitude and conduct in dating goes and their respective implications.

Right. You're not getting my point. If you're going after strong confident leaders, they will pursue what they want. Try changing up the kinds of guys you go out with and I bet you have more luck.

Like i said, i lve dayed all kinds of men, and they pretty much all try to get sex asap. I know what youre saying. Thats kind of why maybe to stick with only guys im really, really physically attracted to after all, they all treat me the same.

I mean if these $4 coffees are breaking your bank, then maybe dating shouldn't be your focus right now. Also not sure where this conflation of pulling cash out of your own wallet and absolute "sameness" comes about.

 

In any case, I was going off your lamenting men paying for dinner and them feeling like you then owed them sex. You stated outright that it is a concern of yours, so quite obviously the simplest and easiest remedy would be to invest in your own cup of brew.

 

The consensus, and by a large margin, is you're the common denominator. Want dudes to pay for you but don't want them to have a sense of entitlement afterward? That's fine. You do you. Those guys do exist even if in waning numbers. But it's pretty apparent you'll need to step up your game and filter in other ways we're probably not being filled in enough to provide you feedback for.

 

To be quite honest, the whole paying thing aside, in 2017, men are increasingly looking for partners and not followers. You're going to command a whole lot less respect with your current outlook, or at least as far as I can interpret it. I don't think it's coincidental you're getting guys brazenly inviting you back to hook up as a near completely constant occurrence. I really mean that less as a political or social commentary than it probably comes off. Just to say, if I had to guess, we're only seeing the tip of the iceberg as far as your attitude and conduct in dating goes and their respective implications.

Like i said before, i need a man who lead. Im not looking for an equal. If i want equal or tge same, ill date females.

If i pay for myself, will guys stop asking me for sex on the first date or soon thereafter?

Aldo, ice paid for many dates, movies, and gifts, just not the first ones. Actually, i did pay for a $100 date in the beginning with my ex.

So you believe women are subordinate to men? You keep saying you would date women if you wanted equals. I wouldn't date women because I'm not attracted to them. Are you somewhat attracted to them?

If you want a guy who is more powerful than you, he will pursue what he wants. It's as simple as that.

Not sure why you have this pattern but keep in mind that a first meet is not a date so if you choose dinner at least offer sincerely to pay your own way. I met over 100 men in person through online sites and was flirty and only a very few made sexual remarks or were focused on getting me alone. I think I gave off an ivory girl girl next door impression. And back then 1980s to 2005- there certainly was a lot of sex and hooking up going on. I simply would keep don't what you are doing and perhaps consider that you are attracted to men who seem to be very focused on casual sex. Think about whether you have a type and what that type is.

So you believe women are subordinate to men? You keep saying you would date women if you wanted equals. I wouldn't date women because I'm not attracted to them. Are you somewhat attracted to them?

 

If you want a guy who is more powerful than you, he will pursue what he wants. It's as simple as that.

No i dont believe women are subordinare to men. I have ny own relationship needs that i follow.

But all kinds of men do this to me, not just certain ones. It has nothing to do with wanting to lead.

Not sure why you have this pattern but keep in mind that a first meet is not a date so if you choose dinner at least offer sincerely to pay your own way. I met over 100 men in person through online sites and was flirty and only a very few made sexual remarks or were focused on getting me alone. I think I gave off an ivory girl girl next door impression. And back then 1980s to 2005- there certainly was a lot of sex and hooking up going on. I simply would keep don't what you are doing and perhaps consider that you are attracted to men who seem to be very focused on casual sex. Think about whether you have a type and what that type is.

If these guy are gonna expect sex on the first date, then they will also pay for a $4 latte or $12.00 lunch. This is actually fairly easy compared to what guys used to do.

I paid for many dinners, movies, and gifts in the past, but i dont pay for first dates, esp if guys are expecting sex.

I dont do my makeup, i dress conservatively, and dont flirt. I dont know whats going on.

If these guy are gonna expect sex on the first date, then they will also pay for a $4 latte or $12.00 lunch. This is actually fairly easy compared to what guys used to do.

 

I paid for many dinners, movies, and gifts in the past, but i dont pay for first dates, esp if guys are expecting sex.

 

I dont do my makeup, i dress conservatively, and dont flirt. I dont know whats going on.

I didn't pay for first dates. First meets are not dates -no one has asked you out -a stranger has suggested to meet to see if a date should happen in the future.

Of course you should wear makeup and dress in a flattering way and flirt -it's a date. Just don't make sexually suggestive remarks or be all over the guy -so that then you wouldn't be a victim- he would just reasonably assume you were up for having sex/hooking up.

If these guy are gonna expect sex on the first date, then they will also pay for a $4 latte or $12.00 lunch. This is actually fairly easy compared to what guys used to do.

 

I paid for many dinners, movies, and gifts in the past, but i dont pay for first dates, esp if guys are expecting sex.

 

I dont do my makeup, i dress conservatively, and dont flirt. I dont know whats going on.

Your attitude. It is hard to take you seriously.

Your attitude. It is hard to take you seriously.

So to run with this comment your attitude makes me wonder whether you're actually giving off negative energy/body language -or acting in a cynical or jaded way such that the guy figures that even if you two aren't a match maybe some fun can be had (or maybe that will make you loosen up) - certainly I wouldn't react that way but it might explain the pattern

I get irritated and feel like these guys are mostly wasting my time.

You're right, they are wasting your time, but that's because you're dating them.

Skip that. Use OLD to screen potential dates and set up quick coffee meets to check one another out--maybe 15-20 minutes at most. Ground rules are that neither can ask the other for a real date on the spot, but either can contact the other afterward with an invitation. If the answer is yes, the other responds, and if not, then no response is necessary.

That's how you can screen out anyone who's seeking casual sex instead of wasting a whole date night on them to find that out.

Don't get discouraged. Most people are just not our match, and that's true of everyone. When you're clear that you're seeking a needle in the haystack, you can adopt resilience, roll with the screening, and take breaks when you're tired.

Allow wrong matches to pass earlye, and you're golden.

Head high.