Engagement

So my partner and I have been together 2 years. We have a 6 month old. We don't share money. Everything is 50/50. Although I've paid for most of the baby things as my partner has to pay for a child from a previous relationships school fees. And he's just not good with money. I currently earn a bit more than him but I have loans whereas he doesn't.

We agreed we should get married. But can't afford a wedding so I suggested going to the registry. We wouldn't even be able to go on a honeymoon. It's a little annoying but that's life.

What has made me incredibly hurt is the fact that in his previous relationship he was going to propose to his ex and buy her an engagement ring. She ended up cheating on him. Now we're together and he thinks I should have to either pay for half the ring or buy him something to equal value. Let me just clarify I already stated $600 is more than enough. I'm not an over the top flashy girl.

I think what's more hurtful is that by all accounts he would've bought her the ring and used to help her out and take care of her. But the reason I pay for so much for the baby is that no matter what I want to buy he says it's not needed or extravagant ( even a high chair). We argue over money to the point that I no longer ask when it comes to our daughter.

I don't think I'm being unreasonable but he says I am. Please help.

What do you think will change about his attitudes if you marry him -especially about parenting?

There's nothing really to afford with a wedding other than license fees (and officiant fees I guess). You can have a wedding reception and a honeymoon in the future. We could afford a large wedding and chose not to have one - our wedding including my dress and shoes was around $1,500 and it was an amazing wedding with our immediate family and a few close friends.

I would do premarital counseling (maybe even at your place of worship) and work through what's underlying these spending/saving incompatibilities and your insecurities. I do think a stable marriage is better for a child but it doesn't sound like this marriage would be stable because your relationship does not seem to be. Good luck.

When you say he's not good with money, what does that mean, exactly? Does he spend carelessly? Not work enough? Where does his money go?

I think him telling you that you should buy him something of equal value to the ring might be his way of stalling an engagement. If he's not interested in financially participating in your baby's life now, I can't see that changing. He's already the father; being married won't change that. And if he's not pulling his weight as a dad already, he's not likely to suddenly take on his share by legally committing to you.

I would thus have some serious reservations about marrying him. He doesn't sound particularly interested right now. As Batya suggested, pre-marital counseling would be a good idea so you two can get all your cards on the table. There could be more than financial constraints holding him back from this, and if so, you need to know.

I'm not marrying him to change him. Anyone going into a relationship thinking they'll change the person is set for failure in my opinion.

I have a $20 dress. I'm happy with not having an extravagant wedding. The registry is fine. I'm not a bratty child. It's not the materialistic side of it. It's that I feel as if I'm paying for his exes mistakes and I'm truly at a loss as to how to fix that. I've tried discussing it and he says I'm being ridiculous and ends the conversation every time.

I wouldn't say our relationship is unstable. I don't let it outwardly show. I'm all about keeping things calm and stable for our child and his.

He's very careless with money whereas I'm very careful. I think you might be right about the stalling and that was my though but I needed a second opinion. He's a great father in terms of showing our daughter care and affection. That's not something I'd throw away easily. I wasn't at all thinking marrying him would change how he is just to be clear. I wanted it for a child to grow up in a traditional household as much as possible. And I guess it is important to me.

He's very careless with money whereas I'm very careful. I think you might be right about the stalling and that was my though but I needed a second opinion. He's a great father in terms of showing our daughter care and affection. That's not something I'd throw away easily. I wasn't at all thinking marrying him would change how he is just to be clear. I wanted it for a child to grow up in a traditional household as much as possible. And I guess it is important to me.

If he's careless with money and you want stability for your daughter what will be the plan once you're married (and review the laws where you live as far as whether you'd be responsible for his carelessness, etc). Maybe a prenuptial agreement? It's not "just" money which is why I suggested counseling. And maybe get some kind of individual counseling to help you get perspective on his past and work towards maybe letting it go? I'm so glad he is a great parent to your child -that's worth its weight in gold of course. And of course marriage is important to you - no need to apologize or defend that value. (I have the same value). Would he be willing to talk to a counselor?

I'll certainly suggest it. It's hard to find such a devoted father in every other aspect. Thank you for your advice.

He's very careless with money whereas I'm very careful. I think you might be right about the stalling and that was my though but I needed a second opinion. He's a great father in terms of showing our daughter care and affection. That's not something I'd throw away easily. I wasn't at all thinking marrying him would change how he is just to be clear. I wanted it for a child to grow up in a traditional household as much as possible. And I guess it is important to me.

It just strikes me as odd that he demands you pay for half of the ring or buy him one of equal value. In theory I see what he's getting at in terms of not spending a lot on a ring (though it doesn't sound as though that's what you're asking for anyway) but this request of his seems cloaked in resentment. To me, it speaks to an undercurrent of discord between you two.

What does he spend his money on? How has the overall relationship been?

Let me just clarify I already stated $600 is more than enough

To be honest, I'm a bit perplexed when the dude's allegedly struggling to pay for one kid, let alone the second one he's had with you, and you'd rather he drop 600 bones on a ring than chip in for diapers. So it's cool for him not to provide so long as the needless spending is done on you? Doesn't seem to add up.

And even that aside, there is something to be said for not wanting to sacrifice mutuality with the engagement or, less ideologically, simply not feeling enough incentive to drop hundreds of dollars doing so. I do like what a lot of Jewish couples around my neighborhood do. The guy buys a ring and the woman buys him a watch. Personally, introducing a one-sided material aspect to what could and should otherwise be a perfectly mutual agreement to wed conflicts with my very strong views on gender equality. But it doesn't sound like, for him, it's much more he can't be arsed, which really I think is fine on its own.

If he should be dropping money on anything marriage related, it should be, as suggested, pre-marital counseling. Going into a marriage when you two don't see eye-to-eye on the number one cause of divorce is, to put it nicely, a very silly idea.

So I think there should be a ring. But, it should be a ring that's affordable. I love the ring/watch tradition and that is what my mother's generation did in the 1950s when she and my late father married. I bought my husband's wedding ring for him while mine was a family heirloom from my husband's family.

I'm not marrying him to change him. Anyone going into a relationship thinking they'll change the person is set for failure in my opinion.

I have a $20 dress. I'm happy with not having an extravagant wedding. The registry is fine. I'm not a bratty child. It's not the materialistic side of it. It's that I feel as if I'm paying for his exes mistakes and I'm truly at a loss as to how to fix that. I've tried discussing it and he says I'm being ridiculous and ends the conversation every time.

I wouldn't say our relationship is unstable. I don't let it outwardly show. I'm all about keeping things calm and stable for our child and his.

So... this is actually a characteristic of a relationship that may not be healthy. I get keeping things calm and stable for your child - but I also believe that a part of that absolutely has to be both partners having a voice in the relationship.

Wanting something, telling your partner about it, and them saying it's ridiculous...what would you tell a girlfriend if she were in your shoes?

I wouldn't put a monetary value on the ring - but he knows it's important to you - he could pick up an inexpensive one for less than you're going to pay in fees. He knows it's important to you and doesn't seem to care... that's what bothers me about this post.

Well I guess when you don't have all the facts it's hard to understand. At no point did I say I would rather him chip in for a ring than help support our baby. Obviously anyone with half a brain would prefer long term support that a token gesture like a ring. Everyone seems to be misinterpreting what I was getting at with the ring. My point was that he was the complete opposite in his previous relationship.

The reason he doesn't have money is that he doesn't budget and wastes money. I only earn $150 more a week and I manage with more debts than him.

Well I guess when you don't have all the facts it's hard to understand. At no point did I say I would rather him chip in for a ring than help support our baby. Obviously anyone with half a brain would prefer long term support that a token gesture like a ring. Everyone seems to be misinterpreting what I was getting at with the ring. My point was that he was the complete opposite in his previous relationship.

The reason he doesn't have money is that he doesn't budget and wastes money. I only earn $150 more a week and I manage with more debts than him.

No one is saying its an either or - a ring or a baby.

The thing is - if he wants to marry you - he should purchase your ring and you should purchase his wedding band. To ask a bride for money for her ring is just crazy. It doesn't have to be elaborate. I know lots of couples who have silver continuum bands that don't tarnish like silver and guys that have different materials because they work in an industrial setting. A ring need not be pricey at all. But an effort needs to be made. If its important to him, just like supporting his first kid is and just like blowing it on whatever is, he will do it. Some of the best rings are rings that someone took a class to learn how to make out of a coin. Its the looking and the going and doing because you care about it. And saving money by going to a mom and pop vs a mall jeweler, etc.

At any rate, it seems like you think its an either or - either marry him or you are denying your child a loving father. he will be a loving father regardless if you are married or not. Regardless if you stay with him or not. It almost seems like you feel you *should* marry because of the child - not that you are in love and totally compatible.

Firstly, I would not marry right now. you have issues to sort out. A marriage doesn't work if you are ering over paying "50 50". and you certainly can't trust him with money, either. The biggest reasons for divorce are money, kids (the stress of fertility issues, parents breaking up over the stress of severe special needs children/parenting methods, stepkids) and sex (lack of, lost interest, too much or cheating). So you really need to straighten this out and either you both agree that you hold the purse strings and he is given pocket mad money/discretionary and you play the parenting role with money. (if he is cool with this - it is harmonious - if not it is going to cause major resentment and possible future divorce).

You say you want a traditional home for your child, but its not a traditional home if you divorce when your child is 4 years old because you don't feel respected or love and there is friction between the parents. So you either need to coparent with him and find a man who is better matched to you to marry, or you need to work these things out so you are not walking into a future divorce.

Well I guess when you don't have all the facts it's hard to understand. At no point did I say I would rather him chip in for a ring than help support our baby. Obviously anyone with half a brain would prefer long term support that a token gesture like a ring. Everyone seems to be misinterpreting what I was getting at with the ring. My point was that he was the complete opposite in his previous relationship.

The reason he doesn't have money is that he doesn't budget and wastes money. I only earn $150 more a week and I manage with more debts than him.

Sorry I only signed up yesterday and I'm still learning how to use this lol I replied to the wrong thread

This is a bunch of crap. Get rid of this loser and find a REAL. man. Good GRIEF.

Alice:

"I wouldn't say our relationship is unstable. I don't let it outwardly show. I'm all about keeping things calm and stable for our child and his."

I wanted it for a child to grow up in a traditional household as much as possible.

What don't you let outwardly show?

And:

"But the reason I pay for so much for the baby is that no matter what I want to buy he says it's not needed or extravagant ( even a high chair). "

And this is the devoted "father" figure you are talking about?

Moving on.

You are marrying a man who will be your partner in life. THAT is what will bring stability into your life and home. (Not sure what you mean by "traditional".)

If your relationship with your husband is not great then it WILL affect the children. So, think of you and him first and foremost.....