Manipulator or just someone afraid of opening up?

Last night i had a serious discussion with my boyfriend and things went so great i was so happy with all of the things he said but later i went home and started thinking did i allow myself to be manipulated. I read all these articles and it all fits but it bothers me that it fits so well im worried i might just be trying to put him in this box because of my own trust issues or just maybe because its easier to just understand that way instead of allowing it to be a broad situation. First of all he was very drunk when he opened up about all this and before this time ive never seen him cry and got very little as far as emotions from him. Hes always told me he thinks that showing emotions gives other a weapon to use against you. Basically he told me that he has so much guilt for not sticking in his last relationship to give his son a chance at a real family. He said although he knows he didnt really feel it with the mother he just feels guilty for not sucking it up for his son. Now recently we almost broke up and he said that almost losing me made him face some of these things he really doesnt wanna face at all in himself. And he said he has all these feelings for me and if he where to open up i wouldnt believe the feeligs he has but he has to question himself on weather or not his fear of being hurt and vulnerable is stonger than those feelings he has. Now this would go along with whats said that manipulators give you rules to give themselves more time and what not. Also when i would try to add in something he would say no you cant understand me which i know is another thing thats to said about manipulators but then again hes right i dont have a child i cant really understand him. He was also saying how he doesnt know if he will stay because now i know all this stuff and hes never told anyone before and now i can use this to hit him hard if we ever break up if i wanna get to him. Now he did say he wants to go to counseling for me because it what i asked of him but then last night he said truth is we dont need counseling i do but he wont go because hes to prideful to get help( again i think just scared to face this). I want to help him because maybe him noticing that he needs help is a sign hes ready to move along with his life but maybe this is yet another things hes doing to manipulate me telling me what he thinks i wanna hear.i do love him and i want him to open up im so happy he told me all those things last night. And i want to be there for him so badly. I am patient for him to open up when he feels he is ready but i dont want to end up hurt eigher. I dont however wanna judge him wrong because i think i might just be trying to over simplify this and creating something he is not to protect myself from being hurt. What do you think?

Unfortunately drunken slobbering is not a "serious discussion". How long have you been dating? It sounds like he misses his ex and son and clearly is not over her. It sounds like he's still so broken up over her that he feels no one including you could possibly understand.

 

Why did you recently almost breakup? Don't be his therapist or mommy him. What you are experiencing is classic rebound where he's still trying to get over her and using you as a shoulder to cry on.

 

He's not manipulating you at all, he's blubbering on about her and his son and you want to "fix" this broken bird and "heal" him so you can have a relationship..

 

He even states he may not be ready for a relationship because he doesn't want to get hurt again. Huge Red Flag. Did his ex leave because of his drinking?

Last night i had a serious discussion with my boyfriend and he was very drunk when he opened up about all this .he has so much guilt for not sticking in his last relationship to give his son a chance at a real family. he would say no you cant understand me .He was also saying how he doesnt know if he will stay.

Weve been together 10 months him and the ex broke up 2 years ago now the reason they broke up for because he couldnt commit to what she wanted she wanted to be married live together he was only 19 and wasnt ready for that so he left what hes upet about is not giving his son a chance at having a full family he said he knew he didnt really see a future with her but shouldve stuck through it for the sake of his son having a normal family.part of t was also because his son doesnt call him dad since his ex to get back at him basically started dating a new guy two weeks later and created this pretend family as if new guy is the dad and it kills my boyfriend to know that.thanks for your response you are right i cant really see it as a real discussion it was more so that he actually opened up.

Do they share custody? Does he pay child support? It sounds like he wants to make it up to her and his son. At only 10 mos of dating and all this drama you may want to tread carefully. Do you think he has commitment issues?

Weve been together 10 months him and she wanted to be married live together he was only 19 and wasnt ready for that so he left what hes upet about is not giving his son a chance at having a full family.

First of all, depending on why you almost broke up, it could be completely unrelated to anything you just wrote. We can't give you any real guesses on his intent to stay without specifics in that area.

 

But do I think you're being manipulated? No. He drunkenly spilled his guts. That's the only time I've ever opened up about my experiences in the Army to my girlfriend. And, frankly, it is because she wouldn't understand. Plus, it's not easy to talk about. Basically, no one wins... unless a partner has a fragile ego and needs their partner to open up old wounds just so they can feel included.

 

I'm not completely sold that his sharing implies he's stuck on his ex. I think society tends to downplay the impact it has on fathers who effectively lose their children. I think it's very reasonable he feels guilty and misses his kid to the extent he does think on whether he should have sucked it up, particularly if he's the one who initiated the separation. I wouldn't expect that potential regret to ever leave his head, and you'd have to be OK with the fact it exists. I don't know any loving parent in that situation who wouldn't think about what it could have been like to be in their child's life 100%. I'd find it disturbing if he didn't.

 

But while it's a sobering aspect you'd have to accept should you two last, there's no benefit in talking to his current partner about wondering what it would have been if he'd stayed for his kid. Just as much as he's "afraid" to, I'd say he's not opening up about it to you because it's simply a stupid idea.

 

He's right that he needs counseling for himself.

 

What issues do you feel could be helped through couples counseling?

So honestly im very afraid of saying why we almost broke up because of fear of judgement of me or him based on our actions but i really like your reply and i feel like you really understand him so maybe what you have to say will be super beneficial and im glad you mention the army he was in the marines and says they taught him to shut down his emotions.so here i go umm so i saw him responding to craigslist casual encounter ads non of these convesations went anywhere it was just him replying to the ads and i believe that hes never met with any of these people there is no evidence that he has opon finding out i confronted him crying and he said he doesnt wanna hurt me and it was just an escape i was fine that day i guess because of all the emotions i didnt give myself time to process it all but it was still in my head. sure enought the other day we where texting and i couldnt repress it so i brought it up again and he tried to get out of the convo to which i said you know i guess we both know it wont work after this and he apologized for causing me pain and that im a great girlfriend and women and i should keep being me and meet someone thats not a piece of like him i was super hurt so i started asking all these questions why,why me,how could you, just going off to my surprise responded because he does not go for the whole texting someone a million times thing and said i really do love you i never met with anyone never wanted to. i told him i needed some time away and stopped talking to him the next day which is yesterday he texts to see me and i went because hes not the type to admit he actually misses me.i get there hes drunk and the whole conversation happend the first thing he said was im sorry its an escape telling me that i cant understand the guilt he feels and that i probably think of him as this and that thats not it that its not about ing people or me not making him happy or him being a perve its that when hes alone with his thoughts he does it to avoid his thoughts and he said when it finally hit him that he could actually lose me it forced him to face things in himself he doesnt want to see . He added that maybe now that i know maybe i can help him because he has never told anyone any of the stuff i heard about his guilt and pain yesterday. Now i can understand that and im happy that he realizes he wants to work on it i think its a good thing, what does concern me is that the first time we had the fight and i didnt make a move to leave it didnt bother him but then when he thought he could lose me then it hit him. Maybe he doesnt feel guilty or feel that what he does is wrong so idk if this points to the possibility of him stopping this or no. I do hope im not being naive with this i get the gut feeling that he loves me and i want this to work out as stupid as that sounds. And with the couples counseling first of deal with this issue and second i knew he wouldnt go for counseling so i thought maybe as a couple going it would make him more comfortable seeking the help from it.Im sorry that was a complete ramble i hope it makes any sort of sense

Yes they sahre custody he pays child support. I didnt think he has commitment issues up until all this came out and no i see it could be a problem i dont think what happened between him and the ex was because he was afraid of commitment it was just that he was so young but i think this could make him now fear committing.

Also i would like to add in that i would stay if and only if i see progress towards something different i can be understand him needeing time to adjust and start working on this but i will not take this escape thing he does as a permanent situation

Being so young and getting involved with a guy not only with ex drama but, browsing sex ads and with a kid should make you pause. Also never ever hope to fix or change anyone.

 

This is a good learning experience for you so when this falls apart you'll recognize red flags and deal breakers much sooner and also that when dating...what you see is what you get.

Also i would like to add in that i would stay if and only if i see progress towards something different i can be understand him needeing time to adjust and start working on this but i will not take this escape thing he does as a permanent situation

Being so young and getting involved with a guy not only with ex drama but with a kid should make you pause. Also never ever hope to fix or change anyone.

 

This is a good learning experience for you so when this falls apart you'll recognize red flags and deal breakers much sooner and also that when dating...what you see is what you get.

I do agree with this.

 

It's a matter of thresholds. He put himself in a pretty crap situation he's trying to mentally cope with. Granted, he was young, so I can understand the sympathy. But you can sympathize without playing some pretty bad odds. Plenty of men out there without baggage that's too heavy for the plane.

 

Feel free to keep giving him a chance if you'd like, but if he's unable to find a way to cope with things so that they don't spill into your relationship, then you'll know what unfortunately needs doing.

I know a lot of ex-marines and ex-military, cops too. If they have baggage, the good ones sort it out with therapy. The bad ones, yeah they can have trouble of the nightmares, PTSD flashbacks, paranoia, easy to spook variety. But using it as an excuse to cheat - and that is what Craiglist casual encounters are, come on that's a blatant ad for sex with some stranger no expectations beyond sex - and blaming it on PTSD? That part is manipulative as all hooey and has nothing to do with his experiences. IF he's even really been in the Marines and isn't pulling a whole wounded warrior gig on you to get a pass on bad behaviors.

 

I am skeptical about that, because in my experience the guys who pulled slimy things like cheating or stealing and tried to blame it on their war experiences were deliberately faking that to get sympathy and get "passes" on simply bad behavior. Bad experiences don't suddenly make people turn into chronic cheaters or liars or criminal, nope. Guys really traumatized by war or bad experiences, women too, they just won't talk about it or it'll come out in paranoia, or nightmares, occasional full-on hallucinations that they're back in the war again in some particularly horrific incident. They don't really go out cheating as a way to deal with it, in fact many of the ones I know are kind of leery and suspicious of people so the last they they'd want to do is get naked with a total stranger when they have someone else at home.

 

I call bullship, frankly. And no, if he really is a former marine then he needs to get into therapy. "love" alone and giving someone passes on bad behavior doesn't make PTSD or issues from combat any better, only worse. Tell him he needs to seek therapy, but the cheating is only and solely on him completely and has nothing to do with whatever war he's been in. I know plenty of former military that went through horrific things, but I've never seen someone who was a good honest faithful person suddenly turn into a full blown cheater over that. Maybe it happens, but I'm really skeptical about that.

 

Things like freaking out when you come through the door and they forgot they were expecting you? Drinking too much? Night terrors? Diving to the ground when a car backfires? Yeah, that's PTSD. Sorry for my skepticism, but I run into too many people who pull the whole "I did a bad thing, because I was in a war" and it turns out they were never even in the military or were discharged dishonorably in the first few months.

The bad ones, yeah they can have trouble of the nightmares, PTSD flashbacks, paranoia, easy to spook variety.

Just to clarify, and I know offense was intended here-- but you don't "sort out" dozens of dead children who have been blown to ****. You don't "sort out" friends getting shot up. These are things that stay around forever. Yes, with therapy, you do the best you can with it, and you owe it to yourself and whoever you have as a partner in the future to seek professional treatment, but it doesn't go away. You simply will slip. I have a feeling it wasn't at all intended, but I do take offense to these very understandable symptoms being ascribed to "the bad ones." If you don't want to date someone who has nightmares, flashbacks, paranoia, and who isn't a fan of being around explosives, then don't date a combat vet, period.

 

That all said, I completely agree with the rest. PTSD is never an excuse for cheating. Cheating can be a result, but it's never an excuse. The moment someone pulls that on you, legit former marine or not, you make your way out the door. If they're willing to use PTSD as an excuse now, you can be sure they will later because PTSD doesn't go away.

he said truth is we dont need counseling i do but he wont go because hes to prideful to get help( again i think just scared to face this).

 

If your relationship doesn't improve, I'd raise this statement and tell him, "I adore you and can picture the two of us together in the future. That's why I need to walk away while we both still think highly of one another, in order to preserve that potential. If you ever decide that you're willing to seek counseling, you can let me know. If I'm still available then, we can meet to catch up. Otherwise, I wish you the best."

 

When people demonstrate that they are not healthy relationship material for you, the reason 'why' is irrelevant to you, it's only relevant to them. You can't fix another person, but you can harm them further by enabling the drama that takes you both down. That's not helpful, because it just adds to the guilt they already carry while enabling them to continue running the con that they don't need professional help.

 

If you buy into that, you're reinforcing the idea that someone who needs help doesn't 'really' need it, and you're allowing them to take two people down with their pride. I'd skip that. I'd demonstrate that I respect myself enough to draw a healthy line. While he may have good reasons for wanting to pretend he's okay while continually harming your relationship, the best possible help you can offer him is to adopt enough strength for the both of you to put a stop to that. He has the option to get real help. If he decides to do that, then that's how he can continue a relationship with you. Otherwise, he's welcome to contact you if he changes his mind.

 

Head high.