Marriage issues - feel like I don't exist

Please don't tell me to give up and get a divorce. I will come to that when I am ready. But for now I want to try because we had an amazing relationship. We were happy. Then video games became the mistresses and laziness ensued.

Back March last year, I was extremely frustrated by my husband not helping with anything even the usual man things like mowing the yard, trash? Etc. I felt like a mother or a maid. I told him I needed help. He said he'd work on it. He will the day after we argue then forget it again. I told him I would start being grumpy if he didn't help because I work hard at work and then come home to work more on the house instead of having fun like he does after work. I warned him. I told him wes grow apart and hed get uaed to spensing more time on the computet and never get off. Rhen I told him I'd end up resenting him and we'd get divorced.

Now, he spends 6 hours a day on video games (work days), occasionally says hi to me when I come home but basically acts like I don'the exist. We don't eat togethar as of the past few months or do anything but maybe watch some tv before bed. He says because I've "nagged" him and was in a poor mood he doesn't feel like spending time with me. But still loves and appreciates me in some weird way I don't understand.

If I get upset it ruins his day to the point he won't even watch tv with me and just stay on games until bed. He can't understand why I'd be upset that he jumps out of bed in the morning going crazy about needing to be on time to work so he can't talk to me for a few mins or give me a real kiss goodbye then I find him playing a 5 mins game before work.

There's too much to explain. I know he loves me. It's not like he's just using me. He just has messed up priorities and can't remember anything important. I feel worthless. The computer is more enjoyable than me. Going out every Friday and some Saturdays all day is better than me.

If I ignore him he feels unloved. But he's ignoring me and expects me to never get upset even when he's ignoring me. Like I'm the only one who can make this better by showing how I'm not always grumpy and I'm sweet and loving.

So how do I make him want me. How do I make him need me? I know he's screwed up but obviously I'm the only one who can make this better since I'm doing something about it. I'm working on not being grumpy when I totally have a justified reason. If I make him want me again and show him our relationship again and it goes back to normal, we can work hard to keep it there.

Do I completely ignore him risking him feeling unloved and pull and way further? Or do I just announce I'm leaving and never stay at home until he starts acting like I matter. Do I make male friends and make him jealous? I just need him to notice I'm not there and hurt. And realize how stupid he's been and want to be a real husband. Or am I supposed to just be this amazing perfect person and treat him like he's being amazing to me so he feels loved again regardless of how much attention he pays and shower him in love. Not that he deserves it right now since it will be completely one sided and I also don't want him to think he can do what he wants and get everything he wants without actually being present in the relationship. But he's been childish and he thinks he's the victim here.

He's not an actual child so the only real consequence is getting divorced but that's kind of extreem. Other ideas would help. Even if I threaten, it just makes him feel more unloved because he's never wanted one and then he pulls the "see you're the one threatening divorce you're the one who doesn't want me".

The truth is we both feel hurt and unloved. But instead of communicating, he withdrawals completely and doesn't seek attention. Just pushes me away and I'm sad and lonely all the time which makes me not myself. So I either find a way to fix this or it falls apart.

Please don't tell me to give up and get a divorce. I will come to that when I am ready. But for now I want to try because we had an amazing relationship. We were happy. Then video games became the mistresses and laziness ensued.

 

Back March last year, I was extremely frustrated by my husband not helping with anything even the usual man things like mowing the yard, trash? Etc. I felt like a mother or a maid. I told him I needed help. He said he'd work on it. He will the day after we argue then forget it again. I told him I would start being grumpy if he didn't help because I work hard at work and then come home to work more on the house instead of having fun like he does after work. I warned him. I told him wes grow apart and hed get uaed to spensing more time on the computet and never get off. Rhen I told him I'd end up resenting him and we'd get divorced.

 

Now, he spends 6 hours a day on video games (work days), occasionally says hi to me when I come home but basically acts like I don'the exist. We don't eat togethar as of the past few months or do anything but maybe watch some tv before bed. He says because I've "nagged" him and was in a poor mood he doesn't feel like spending time with me. But still loves and appreciates me in some weird way I don't understand.

 

If I get upset it ruins his day to the point he won't even watch tv with me and just stay on games until bed. He can't understand why I'd be upset that he jumps out of bed in the morning going crazy about needing to be on time to work so he can't talk to me for a few mins or give me a real kiss goodbye then I find him playing a 5 mins game before work.

 

There's too much to explain. I know he loves me. It's not like he's just using me. He just has messed up priorities and can't remember anything important. I feel worthless. The computer is more enjoyable than me. Going out every Friday and some Saturdays all day is better than me.

 

If I ignore him he feels unloved. But he's ignoring me and expects me to never get upset even when he's ignoring me. Like I'm the only one who can make this better by showing how I'm not always grumpy and I'm sweet and loving.

 

So how do I make him want me. How do I make him need me? I know he's screwed up but obviously I'm the only one who can make this better since I'm doing something about it. I'm working on not being grumpy when I totally have a justified reason. If I make him want me again and show him our relationship again and it goes back to normal, we can work hard to keep it there.

 

Do I completely ignore him risking him feeling unloved and pull and way further? Or do I just announce I'm leaving and never stay at home until he starts acting like I matter. Do I make male friends and make him jealous? I just need him to notice I'm not there and hurt. And realize how stupid he's been and want to be a real husband. Or am I supposed to just be this amazing perfect person and treat him like he's being amazing to me so he feels loved again regardless of how much attention he pays and shower him in love. Not that he deserves it right now since it will be completely one sided and I also don't want him to think he can do what he wants and get everything he wants without actually being present in the relationship. But he's been childish and he thinks he's the victim here.

 

He's not an actual child so the only real consequence is getting divorced but that's kind of extreem. Other ideas would help. Even if I threaten, it just makes him feel more unloved because he's never wanted one and then he pulls the "see you're the one threatening divorce you're the one who doesn't want me".

 

The truth is we both feel hurt and unloved. But instead of communicating, he withdrawals completely and doesn't seek attention. Just pushes me away and I'm sad and lonely all the time which makes me not myself. So I either find a way to fix this or it falls apart.

Usual "man" things like mowing the yard and trash? Those are not "man" jobs. Those are anyone jobs. I take out the trash every day because there is no one else to do it. My two year old can't. Even when I was married I took out the trash. If we didn't live in an apartment when I was married I would have mowed the lawn. Or at least we would have traded off. Those are not gender specific jobs.

Have you gone to counseling? Have you asked him to go to counseling? That's the only way you're going to fix things. If that doesn't work then sorry your only option is divorce unless you are comfortable living with a man-child. That's what you have.

You cant' "make" him want you. If he doesn't want you he doesn't. If he's more involved in video games and you or counseling can't get him to stop then nothing will. Sounds like he's addicted to video games. If he was a drug addict or alcoholic would you stay?

No don't go make him jealous. That won't solve anything that will make it worse.

There's your problem you don't communicate. If you want to save your marriage you two need to communicate better. So seek out therapy. THAT is really your only option other than divorce.

It's easy for guys to fall back into *solitary male* phase and for things to go back to the way they used to have it, i.e. sitting on the couch playing games while their mum does all the housework and not realising their responsibilities. I think that's pretty much what's happened here and naturally you're upset.

So the question is, how do you get out of this rut without sounding like the nagging mum that wants him to mow the lawn and spend time with you?...

What sorts of games are these? - are the *anytime* games like (showing my age here) Doom or Duke Nukem where you turn them on, play them and can turn them off with no consequences, or are we talking PvP games where if he DOESN'T play, some sort of consequence happens, for example other people will destroy his base or he wastes building time etc (classically called the MMORPGs). If it's the first one, you have no problem... he can leave them, hit pause and he probably won't care that much. If it's the PvP games, they can get incredibly addictive and he might even be timing his sleep patterns to wake up to aid in game play.

Find out and report back!

Either way, you need to get him out... get his mind busy! Plan a dinner for a few days in advance or something so he HAS to get out and so he can plan his time around it. You can't just spring those things on guys as we often PLAN to do nothing on a day so not giving us notice is like taking away our free time. Once he's out, show him all he's missing... the conversation, love, affection, but try not to make the talk *business* like chores, bills, holidays etc... these can be hard work to think about.

Sorry to hear this. Unfortunately you have a mother-child dynamic and since he won't stop, you have to.

As you know, pleas, notes, nagging, reminding, begging, threatening, warning, etc. don't work and in fact give him more things to ignore and resist and laugh at in this mother-child power struggle.

Stop doing everything. Stop shopping, cooking, cleaning, babying, nagging, mothering, etc.

Come home from work with take out for yourself, eat it, then go do whatever you like. Watch tv, go shopping, visit friends, take classes at night, get a part-time job...whatever you want.

He can fend for himself when you stop the mothering madness. Leave him be. It will not change until You change.

I'm just saying a lot of men feel like it's many to mow but not cook. I can mow and I do. I do everything. We have been to counseling twice. First time he was receptive and second time it just made him feel like a "terrible person" I just don't know if it would help since we've been there and didn't get desired results. I put post it notes everywhere to remind him so he didn't feel like I was nagging and now he doesn't even see them. I'm not ruling it out, definitely, I just don't want him to respond like last time and put away.

Stop mothering and postit notes is just nagging and mothering in writing. As you can see it doesn't work. Stop doing things that don't work. Just stop all the mothering behaviors.

I put post it notes everywhere to remind him so he didn't feel like I was nagging and now he doesn't even see them.

Sorry to hear this. Unfortunately you have a mother-child dynamic and since he won't stop, you have to.

 

As you know, pleas, notes, nagging, reminding, begging, threatening, warning, etc. don't work and in fact give him more things to ignore and resist and laugh at in this mother-child power struggle.

 

Stop doing everything. Stop shopping, cooking, cleaning, babying, nagging, mothering, etc.

 

Come home from work with take out for yourself, eat it, then go do whatever you like. Watch tv, go shopping, visit friends, take classes at night, get a part-time job...whatever you want.

 

He can fend for himself when you stop the mothering madness. Leave him be. It will not change until You change.

But do I tell him what I'm doing, just announce it not invite him? I'd be mad if he just walked out and left all the time without at least telling me he's leaving or something. And about the cleaning. There's some OCD in the family and I cannot focus if the house is a mess. I freak out. And I'm not living like a pig or focing my friends to hang out in it. Can I just throw all his crap in a box when I find it and make a mess of the computer room?

Stop the OCD and mothering. That's your problem, not his. Tell him, "bye honey, going out with friends, see you later".

There's some OCD in the family and I cannot focus if the house is a mess.

Stop mothering and postit notes is just nagging and mothering in writing. As you can see it doesn't work. Stop doing things that don't work. Just stop all the mothering behaviors.

Then that brings me back to doing everything for him that is necessary for the health of our animals and keeping the house in working order so stuff doesn't get destroyed. I'll ignore anything that's his but it's my house too and I'm not going to abuse it or my animals.

Stop the OCD and mothering. That's your problem, not his. Tell him, "bye honey, going out with friends, see you later".

I shouldn't be forced out of MY own home. And sorry but I can't just ignore the mess and let cockraoches and ants reign. OCD is a real thing not something you can just end. I'm not horrible, I just can't focus unless everything in my space is clean. In a normal way not excessive.

Marriage means responsibilities for both. He needs to clean his own mess. My mess is my problem but his is not.

"So how do I make him want me. How do I make him need me?"

"I know he loves me."

These two sentence tell me you have no idea what a genuine marriage should be.

Maybe his mistreatment of you caused you to 'learn his ways', in the hope that appeasement may somehow bring him closer?

Instead of thinking divorce; do feel you were ever married to him in the first place? (e.g, he lied, he's a mama's boy, hid addictions, etc.)

If so, then he duped you or reneged on his vows and promises.

If so, that puts you squarely in a non-marriage category.

Is that what happened?

I shouldn't be forced out of MY own home. And sorry but I can't just ignore the mess and let cockraoches and ants reign. OCD is a real thing not something you can just end. I'm not horrible, I just can't focus unless everything in my space is clean. In a normal way not excessive.

 

Marriage means responsibilities for both. He needs to clean his own mess. My mess is my problem but his is not.

If you let something sit there for like a day you aren't going to get cockroaches and ants. Yes you both have responsibilities.

So here's what you do. Tell him you both need to go to counseling and maybe separately need to go. He needs to confront his little video game obsession and stop being a man child. You need to stop mothering him.

If you want to go out, just go out. Say, as suggested, "Bye see you later."

 

What sorts of games are these? - are the *anytime* games like (showing my age here) Doom or Duke Nukem where you turn them on, play them and can turn them off with no consequences

He went through playing Rocket League for a over a year and barely touching anything else. Nothing lost there. Recently he's been playing ARC and on his own server because friends at work started and he got back into it. So all he would miss out on is leveling up at the same time as his buddies from work or hunting dinosaurs with them. Plus they start new maps all the time anyway.

Okay, so what's YOUR solution to the problem?

You've shot down what other people have suggested.

It sounds like he's not willing to go to counseling again OR you're not particularly willing to bring it up again.

Since you have pets, and wish to observe general hygienic living conditions, you can't just completely ignore the messes he makes.

So what's the solution?

You continue on as you are, and get used to it. Or you do something that's going to force change.

Those are your two choices.

What's going to force change? Possibly nothing. Obviously, the ultimate consequence would be you leaving him to his own filth and getting your own place. Doesn't sound like you're there yet.

That being said, I have a few suggestions for you:

1.) Stop doing his laundry, the cooking, etc. You can cook for you, for entertainment, whatever. He doesn't contribute, he doesn't eat. Get him his own hamper for his dirty clothes.

2.) Restrict WHERE eating happens. (Meaning - he eats in the kitchen, exclusively. No food elsewhere in the house.)

3.) If you can't treat your pets as they deserve to be in this situation, find them homes (even temporarily if you have to) where they can be loved and cared for and relieve some of the stress on you.

4.) Lose the Me vs. You mentality. You're partners. Sit down and have a conversation about what partnership means to both of you. Tell him how you're feeling - not in a way that you're blaming him, but say: Hey, I came home from work today and did x, y, z. I'm very tired and would like to relax, but noticed that x, y, z was not done. I need you to help me with things so that we can both have downtime and share our lives. (Maybe not that verbatim, but you get the idea.)

5.) Come up with a plan TOGETHER, and talk about consequences of things not changing as well. No ultimatums, no threats. An important part of this plan should also be how you should address things that aren't getting done AND things that are bothering you. He may have a way for you to communicate with him that's more effective. All you can do is ask.

Your post-it notes are nagging. Reminding him constantly of anything is nagging, no matter how you do it.

(Maybe number 5 should be number one.)

Unfortunately you are married to a 10 year old boy and you treat him like that. Do you plan to have children. Did you want a family or a real husband?

he would miss out on is leveling up at the same time as his buddies from work or hunting dinosaurs with them.

]

Threatening him and doing nothing to back it up only back fires. He calls your bluff and continues on as always.

You say he loves you, but does he do exactly that suggests he loves you? You didn't share that part.

Him isolating, refusing to being part of team and basically looking out for himself isn't selfish and unloving.

I agree with others before me.

No, you don't need to live in filth.

You do all you need to do to take yourself and your pets, and no more.

He wants to be on his own, he can fend for himself.

If so, then he duped you or reneged on his vows and promises.

 

If so, that puts you squarely in a non-marriage category.

 

Is that what happened?

We did have a real marriage and a real relationship. I know the difference. He wouldn't have stayed with me if he didn't really love me because I know how he is. If he doesn't want to do something he won't. And he didn't propose until he was ready. That and I have some family stuff going on and personal stuff that no one has ever wanted to put up with. Most would walk away. I would.

Friends tell me he loves me. Family does. He did loving things and he did help out a lot more than he currently does and used to spend actual quality time with me.

It's so hard to properly explain months in a few paragraphs.

Anytime we've had problems he goes into himself and ignores the relationship. Then we learned to deal with it and did so properly by talking and working it out and listening to eachotheright I feel like we haven't argued in so long before this that we forgot how to deal with conflict and are back to our old ways of 6 years ago.

Unfortunately you are married to a 10 year old boy and you treat him like that. Do you plan to have children. Did you want a family or a real husband?

]

 

Neither of us want kids and I always joked that it would ruin our marriage anyway. We did talk about it hypothetically and he said he would care about the kid because it would be his and all. Either that would be the kick in the butt he needed to come to reality or we'do end up hating eachother.

 

I've seen him be a real husband before. Just not for the last year. He has self control but only uses it when it benefits him directly like for work or something. I just want him back. He tells me he's sorry and that he wants to work on it etc. Falls through on promises. I tell him to be honest and i wont expect anything if he doesnt promise anything. I wouldnt tell him to help if he said he wouldnt do it anyway. And I think he honestly wants wants things just won't put the effort it and forgets. Priorities. I don't feel like I should have to fight to be on top. Even though I feel alone, I still put our relationship first. I love him always not just when I feel like it. That's what I promised as a wife.

Okay, so what's YOUR solution to the problem?

 

You've shot down what other people have suggested.

 

It sounds like he's not willing to go to counseling again OR you're not particularly willing to bring it up again.

 

Since you have pets, and wish to observe general hygienic living conditions, you can't just completely ignore the messes he makes.

 

So what's the solution?

 

You continue on as you are, and get used to it. Or you do something that's going to force change.

 

Those are your two choices.

 

What's going to force change? Possibly nothing. Obviously, the ultimate consequence would be you leaving him to his own filth and getting your own place. Doesn't sound like you're there yet.

 

That being said, I have a few suggestions for you:

Sorry it seems like I'm shooting down ideas. I think these are great and I will get a new hamper in the bathroom tonight. I guess I've just tried talking to him about consequences before and it doesn't seem to resonate. But maybe I'm not communicating effectively or with the wrong tone. I'm just so tired. This has been the toughest year of my life in all wayss possible and I'm worn down so it's hard to be smiley and happy and I know that doesn't help. But it seems to bother him even if I'm just neutral. It's hard to not get upset when I find out he has been feeling negatively about us or me and hasn't said anything about it. Like he knew but wouldn't allow an opportunity for me to change my negative behaviour and now it's too late.

Getting my own place, no I'm not there. And I own the house, technically, and a lot of what's in it. I'd have to kick him out. That's a lot to do deal in itself haha. And I care for the animals 100%. My dogs are my life and I will always care for them with full effort. I just don't see why he can't help feed them and worry when I'm out of town that they don't get their meds which is super important. We got them togethar so they are ours not mine.

Threatening him and doing nothing to back it up only back fires. He calls your bluff and continues on as always.

 

You say he loves you, but does he do exactly that suggests he loves you? You didn't share that part.

Him isolating, refusing to being part of team and basically looking out for himself isn't selfish and unloving.

 

I agree with others before me.

No, you don't need to live in filth.

You do all you need to do to take yourself and your pets, and no more.

 

He wants to be on his own, he can fend for himself.

IS not ISN'T

IS not ISN'T

I know it is. It is very selfish. But I don't think he understands how I feel or what he's doing. His parents relationship was super traditional. Even though he says he knows he needs to do a,b, and c. He's never lived alone and I think that's a huge part. He doesn't know how hard it is to take care of everything himself. I think he thinks I'm an emotional wreck and make a bigger deal out of things when they arent actually problems. Example, his ex. Used to yell at him all the time and say stupid stuff when she was mad and crying. So when we had our first video game issue, he thought I was just upset and saying things I didn't mean so he didn't pay attention to it. He didn't realize I was serious until he told me that and I explained it was a real concern and I felt like I didn't matter to him.

He thinks I'm mad at him all the time and I hate him and blah blah blah. His family pretty much shows no emotion. I don't think he talked to anyone growing up on a more personal level. His emotions show differently than what I've been used to and he misinterprets mine all the time. Because if I cry I'm apparently angry. If I don't say anything and try to stay calm I'm angry. He just assumes I'm angry without me proving it then goes on and I do get upset. Sad.

Ok. . .We've covered that this situation appears to be stuck.

What is the first thing you are going to do to get it unstuck?

Remember, talking, nudging and threatening hasn't worked.

What are you going to do differently?

And. . you never answered my question. You say you don't doubt that he loves you.

What is it he 'does' that shows you that he loves you?

It sounds like you have some common goals values and have gotten along in the past. Unfortunately he's in 'yes dear' then tune you out mode. Has your OCD or the family issues or anything gotten worse recently on your end?

Have you read the book "Living with the Passive-Aggressive Man: Coping with Hidden Aggression" by Scott Wetzler, PhD? it may have insight and coping tips for what's going on.

Neither of us want kids. I've seen him be a real husband before. Just not for the last year. He tells me he's sorry and that he wants to work on it etc. Falls through on promises.

Ok. . .We've covered that this situation appears to be stuck.

What is the first thing you are going to do to get it unstuck?

 

Remember, talking, nudging and threatening hasn't worked.

What are going to do differently?

 

And. . you never answered my question. You say you don't doubt that he loves you.

What is it he 'does' that shows you that he loves you?

I guess I won't go into the computer room at all. I'm putting a second hamper in the bathroom. I won't offer him warm leftovers or dinner anymore which means I'm sure he won't make me anything when he cooks. I'll try and stay out of the house and busy until this gets bettER.

I don't know how without writing pages. When he talks to me he means it. When he is feeling loving he is amazing. He can be super sweet. He never did for others what he's done for me, he agreed to couples counseling and didn't fight me. He keeps saying he wants to make it better. He just won't act on it cause it's not easy. And he's in lazy mode. I know that he would do this to someone else and it's not because he doesn't love me. He needs to sort out his stuff and we got togethar our 1st year of college so he didn't get proper experience first. I told him he could leave and go find someone else who would clean and be a traditional wife. Or someone that would play video games with him all day. He said he didn't want that. If he doesn't like someone he won't go there. Like I said, he doesn't do what he doesn't want to. No matter what.

It sounds like you have some common goals values and have gotten along in the past. Unfortunately he's in 'yes dear' then tune you out mode. Has your OCD or the family issues or anything gotten worse recently on your end?

 

Have you read the book "Living with the Passive-Aggressive Man: Coping with Hidden Aggression" by Scott Wetzler, PhD? it may have coping skills for what's going on.

No. My OCD is very minimal. I keep it to myself. You wouldn't know it, my house isn't spotless. My standards aren't too high. Promise. Family stuff has been way better this year than in a while. He hates my father because he has basically verbally abused me infront of him several times and he doesn't like me treated like that. And he's upset my father won't jump up and apologize. He can't let go and that's his fault. My dad has been amazing recently.

I'll check the book out, thanks.