High performers

I recently read that high performers frequently all work at the same company, or in the same department.

I'm wondering if that's true - has anyone ever had that experience or know anything about this?

I've worked at one company where we were all high performers, but since then I seem to work at companies where people are not interested in doing their best. It's demoralizing.

How would you go about finding companies where employees are generally highly motivated?

Lots of networking and word of mouth. Why do you think whether others are as productive as you are has such a strong effect on you? Why not just live up to your own standards?

I've worked in some world class organizations. All at or near the top of their industry. High Performers are spread through out.

Successful start ups. However, as the company grows, that initial concentrated group will get diluted with more run of the mill type employees.

Lots of networking and word of mouth. Why do you think whether others are as productive as you are has such a strong effect on you? Why not just live up to your own standards?

That's a fair question. I do live up to my own standards, which leaves me ostracized by my peers and frequently attacked by my managers. I sit in my corner and do the best work I can. I'm friendly, and I help whenever I'm asked. And it's shocking how much drama this creates.

Please don't get me wrong. I'm far from perfect. But I don't make it personal, I'm not there to make friends. I tell my jokes, and have casual conversations. But it's not enough.

A manager recently confided to me that although I had the best performance last year, they gave the highest review score to someone else...and they did it for political reasons. They want to create a new position for someone in the office, and if I had the highest review, HR would expect/require that the job go to me. The reason they have chosen this other person over me is because I have high standards, and the other person does not. They don't want to create waves among the staff by increasing the expectations or raising the bar.

Besides the obvious fact that I should never have been told this (and I trust the source), why would I want to continue working in an environment where doing well is a bad thing? It's simply not in my makeup to skate by. I've tried, and I can't do it.

The irony is that I never wanted a position like that in this department for the exact same reason they are giving it to someone else. I would drive the staff crazy, and eat myself alive. Not exactly the challenge I am looking for.

While it may sound romantic to be the lone wolf at work or anywhere else, the reality is that lone wolves frequently die within 3-6 months. I felt much happier in an environment where we all wanted to do better. It wasn't cut throat at all, as we all encouraged each other, and gave credit where it was due. We competed against ourselves, a trait I still carry.

I've worked in some world class organizations. All at or near the top of their industry. High Performers are spread through out.

I'm jealous, in a good way How did you know they were world class? What did you do to ensure you were going to a top notch company with high performers?

Successful start ups. However, as the company grows, that initial concentrated group will get diluted with more run of the mill type employees.

This is a good thought. I'll try Googling startups to see what i can find. Any other criteria, like number of employees or age of the business?

That's a fair question. I do live up to my own standards, which leaves me ostracized by my peers and frequently attacked by my managers.

With all due respect you cannot be a high performer unless you play nicely in the sandbox. You will undermine your technical skill and other "job" skills if you lack people skills. You are ostracized and attacked likely because you are not a team player and you don't put in the effort because of some misguided notion that it's because you have superior standards. Even if you worked on your own it might still hamper your success (i.e. you could lose clients or not get certain clients if you come across as superior or elitist at networking events).

Assume that they do want to do better -but their definition of better might be combined with better for the team/company, not just better for his/her own personal standards. Obviously there are companies where people do not value hard work but I suspect the main issue here is your atttitude, approach, people skills. You can stop getting in your own way if you choose.

I recently read that high performers frequently all work at the same company, or in the same department.

 

I'm wondering if that's true - has anyone ever had that experience or know anything about this?

 

I've worked at one company where we were all high performers, but since then I seem to work at companies where people are not interested in doing their best. It's demoralizing.

 

How would you go about finding companies where employees are generally highly motivated?

Great question, and one that I'd also like the answer to. I've worked for very large, fortune 100 companies and small mom-and-pop companies. I used to think the Fortune 100 companies were healthier, but my experience with my current employer has shown me otherwise. Here, I've worked for two different departments in the same building, located right next to each other, and the difference is like night and day. One department is filled with incompetents who cringe and wail at the sight of a challenge. The other is comprised of self-starters who clear hurdles without batting an eyelash. Lucky me that they are both located in the same place, so it was an easy change.

But I know that I'm probably not going to be working here forever. And I'll be damned if I get stuck in another cesspool like the one I transferred out of. So how to avoid the crap situations? I'm not looking for a job right now, but I do follow industry news and keep my eye out for people and companies who have successfully completed interesting, challenging projects. That way, when the time comes, I'll know the landscape.

I think talent distribution varies by industry. In my profession, I find that people are actually more important than the companies. Case in point: my company with the department of incompetents. My COMPANY designs and builds high profile projects around the world, but that DEPARTMENT does construction details for sneeze guards in fast food restaurants. Poorly, I may add.

Another thing: management is quite important. I am lucky to have excellent managers. The environment in my department is one of mutual respect and collaboration. And I wonder if the skill that my managers have in maintaining that environment comes from their experience as coaches when their kids were growing up. Whatever it is, it's really great.

They say to interview your interviewer when you are applying for a job. I will certainly do this going forward. Coaching experience may be on my list of questions.

Wow. That's a whole lot of assumptions and judgement. Why would you think I don't have people skills, or that I'm not a team player? Why would you think I'm somehow superior or elitist in my behavior?

Isn't it equally possible that I actually work in a company where they don't value hard work, especially as management has said as much by mentioning my high standards?

Just curious as to how you came to your conclusions.

Wow. That's a whole lot of assumptions and judgement. Why would you think I don't have people skills, or that I'm not a team player? Why would you think I'm somehow superior or elitist in my behavior?

 

Isn't it equally possible that I actually work in a company where they don't value hard work, especially as management has said as much by mentioning my high standards?

 

Just curious as to how you came to your conclusions.

You must have misread my post - I know I didn't write anything like those extremes and indeed addressed all your concerns. Came to my conclusions based on what you typed and my 20 plus years experience working mostly with "high performers" (as well as being one and evolving as a team player and effective manager) plus in a small business as well as government/nonprofit - but not what you wrote in your post that I quoted -what I wrote to you. Oh and I also returned to work outside the home almost 3 months ago so the experience of being the new kid again.

Of course they value your high standards and high productivity- but reread my post as to why despite that there might be another reason you're not advancing. Good luck!

Ah. We're in a miscommunication rabbit hole, I think.

There wasn't any mention of me not advancing. The career path we've been working on never involved managing this team. They're heading me up through another team that will soon be formed, and then on to my own company/line.

I'm not upset that someone else is going to promote to manage this team. As I said, that would never be a good match.

I'm concerned that overall the company has no intentions of raising their standards for employees. I'm upset that they would hamper or affect my performance scores to make sure no one tries to raise the bar. I'm beginning to believe this would be the same even when running my own entity.

We are a non-profit hospital chain. We provide millions of dollars in free health care to those in need. What we do is important, and my department frequently has a direct affect on how much we can provide. In essence, our work can have a very serious impact on people who depend on us.

I'm not saying we should be intense as we work every day. I am saying we should consider these things as we work.

For example, we are losing a lot of necessary equipment lately, just being old and worn out. We've been refused funds using the normal channels. I've found another channel to request funding. My coworkers have a big issue with this, even though it is my job, and is certainly within my scope to do so. It has nothing to do with them or their workload, so it really isn't even their concern. (The only reason they know about it is because senior leadership announced it. I certainly don't talk about this stuff.)

My direct manager's immediate response was to stop by my desk, and make a snide comment that I think his whole team is stupid. He invariably says something like this whenever senior leadership is happy with me. The team is giving me the cold shoulder.

This kind of reaction is exhausting. To me, whatever one person does makes the whole team/dept look good, or bad. This isn't a glory hunt. Instead, I see it as having a responsibility to the patients we are cancelling. I was given the green light when I presented the idea to my managers.

At any rate, I don't think I want to keep putting years into a culture like this when there's no hope of it changing. And so, my question on how to find companies or departments where the people are highly motivated.

" The reason they have chosen this other person over me is because I have high standards, and the other person does not. They don't want to create waves among the staff by increasing the expectations or raising the bar."

My guess is this was not the actual reason and more like the "snide comment" you mentioned.

It depends on what your goals are. To me the definition of "high performer" within a company include, as an integral and essential part, being a team player and working nicely in the sandbox. So, that includes a focus on communication skills - do you use the sandwich method when you deliver a criticism (positive/negative/positive); have you studied how to communicate with various individuals -e-mail (how many?) face to face(timing?) phone,etc. A focus on the bottom line is essential too but unless you're going to be an entrepreneur without needing clients, then you probably need to realize that part of improving the bottom line is in how you go about getting there.

I don't agree with your analysis -I think they care as much as you do, I think they recognize your high standards and I think the way in which you act/react/interact when presenting your ideas/work, etc might rub people the wrong way despite their equally high standards. Might. Take it or leave it -fine with agreeing to disagree.

I'm jealous, in a good way How did you know they were world class? What did you do to ensure you were going to a top notch company with high performers?

Well, their name on brand speak for themselves. 1 was a Big 4 accounting firm, another was one of the largest banks in the country, another was the world leader in its industry, the one I am at now is the top retailer in its segment in the country.

I should've put this part in quotes, as this is exactly what the senior manager told me:

" The reason they have chosen this other person over me is because I have high standards, and the other person does not. They don't want to create waves among the staff by increasing the expectations or raising the bar."

That entire paragraph was a direct quote.

At any rate, I completely agree that professionals learn to deal well with all kinds of people. I do my best with the team. I take the high road, I stay friendly and professional. I provide help when asked - I think offering would be taken as an insult - and I provide them with my contacts when they ask me/have need.

As for my manager, he's been after me since I transferred to this location. He wanted to hire someone else, a contractor, but this person was blacklisted for screaming and swearing at a high level executive. Instead, I was hand picked and relocated by his manager.

At first, the team was convinced I was a spy, that I would listen to their gossip and report it to management. They ended up confessing this to me later on when absolutely nothing ever happened. Now they get angry if I do something well. They get over it, I don't change my behavior at all, but it wears a person down.

As for interactions...I do face to face, and emails, depending on what it is. Sometimes I solve their problems from behind the scenes. Their work overlaps a great deal. My job is off to the side, so I don't have as much day to day interaction. I don't sit in the same area as they do, either. My social/casual time with them basically revolves around the kitchen. They are very friendly, sharing kid stories, vacations, etc, as people do...up until management says I've done something well. Then it's complete ice.

I absolutely never offer constructive criticism of any kind, as it's not my place to do that...with one exception -

I've been training someone to fill my current role for the past 7 months, as I've been assigned new work for my own career path. She gets angry with me when I kick work back to her for corrections. It's not how I'm doing it that offends her. I've asked, so that I can modify my style if needed. She just wants to cross things off of her to-do list. She isn't so concerned with how well things are done. That is exactly what she said. I'm not making any assumptions here. Our direct manager is fine with it. His manager and the rest of senior leadership is not fine with it, and told her she would either work to my standard, or they would have me train someone else who would.

Although she hates that part of it, she's thanked me many times for how much effort I've put into training her, and that she would never have had this opportunity if it wasn't for me. And yes, she, too, gives me cold glares when my work is good.

Obviously, this leaves me in a tough spot. Maybe this is what you're picking up on, and then thinking I'm treating them badly in some way. In all honesty, it would be easier if I thought I could modify my behavior, and make this a happier work environment for me. I just don't see what else I can do.

One of our senior leaders is resigning. He said, "They knew they just had to wait me out. And they did." He tried to raise the bar. They ignored his directives.

I don't know if they care or not. I've never asked. But I do know that they refuse to improve their work, or create efficiencies, or take on anything new. They refuse loudly and publicly.

Several months ago, we were all eating lunch. One of the women was snapping at me. I asked what I had done to make her upset. She sputtered a bit...and then said, "It's your face. I don't like your face. You're always so....focused."

I'm still not sure how to respond to that. Apologize for my face or for being focused? Again, no one is really pointing to anything I do, or anything I know how to fix. I think we are very different people with very different goals. I need to find a group that is more comfortable for me.

You mentioned how I present my ideas, etc. My work has nothing to do with their work. My ideas are presented through the food chain - my manager (who says nothing at all), his manager who usually kicks it up even further, and then to the VP. These are all private meetings.

I'm not trying to convince you of anything - but it's good to discuss it openly.

Being a high peformer too (deadline today!)I will re-read later -no need to emphasize what you were told -in my opinion that is not the whole story.

That's invaluable -what she said about "focused" -my guess is you look too intense/unfriendly and perhaps distant so that you seem focused on work to the exclusion of interacting in an engaged way with your colleagues.

In my life, if I had experiences like you I tried my hardest to be humble and look inward at any things I was doing that were not working. And I still do because my main job is as a parent so I am constantly under the microscope in several ways. But 99% of my input came from my non-parenting work experience.

This might be the wrong company. However, I'd seek the advice of a life coach who comes highly recommended and/or a trusted friend who will be straight with you - you seem more open to listening now. Changing jobs is stressful so why not decrease that by doing some inner work as needed?

To add- I don't think you're treating anyone badly at all. I do think you might be getting in your own way of getting into a company that is a better fit because I think that even if you got a position with a branded company or a start up with high perfomers the way you choose to regard your colleagues/your vibe/energy, etc might put people off.

I've worked in a few toxic environments.I get it.Just suggesting that you might want to look more inward.

the way you choose to regard your colleagues/your vibe/energy, etc might put people off.

I've worked in a few toxic environments.I get it.Just suggesting that you might want to look more inward.

Let's talk about this. It could be helpful.

This team...they are nice people, even the one woman who makes disparaging remarks to everyone (the one who commented on my face and focus). She's got her issues, as we all do, but she isn't intentionally cruel. None of them are.

They simply want to keep doing things the same way, and they don't want to take on new skills or projects. I'm perfectly happy to leave it alone - it's not my role to direct them. Encourage yes, direct no. The flip side is that they are not willing to leave it alone. Every time they find out I've done well, they demonstrate their disapproval to me.

My work affects them peripherally, and I send them a monthly analysis to show this. Other than that, we have very little work interaction.

My colleagues, as opposed to my team, are all across the country and in other departments locally. Those relationships are good. We are able to call each other to brainstorm occasionally, which almost makes it harder to be in my current office. I enjoy those conversations, of pursuing better ways to accomplish something, of considering the total flow of a particular idea. It challenges my mind, and makes me feel interested in my work, connected, if that makes sense.

I don't look down on my team. I don't think I'm better than they are - if I did, it might be easier to dismiss their reactions. I think that I want different things from my work environment.

I tried different things to bond with them when I first relocated. I organized monthly lunches off site where we could just hang out, away from work. I knit socks for them all. That was all great, up until I had my first major success. That's when they started freezing me out whenever it's about work. Personally, they seem to like me fine. It's an odd dynamic.

Selfishly, I'm there all day and I don't want to battle this stuff. I feel that they are pressuring me to be standard, fine, ok. That's not in my makeup. I can't sit idly by and say, "Oh, look, we're being charged twice and it adds tons of complexity to the process. Whatever." I have to drive forwards and ask if we can talk about this, look at this.

And that is what causes this chasm. If you're seeing other solutions that I'm not, please let me know - here or in IM.

As for the company, the same attitudes seem to be rampant. I find that I'm sending emails to my prior location, thanking them for doing it right, or on time. I don't phrase it that way, of course, but that's what I'm doing.

There is no doubt I can keep working here, and advance as planned. The company is going through some major restructuring. I'm not privy to very much behind the scenes, but they share some of it with me when it provides me with options, or a change of some kind. I'm very open to constructive criticism, and often seek it out. You're right when you say there was a lot more to that conversation about my review score, but I can't share it here, and it wasn't about me, my performance, or my relationships.

This really isn't about a failure of any kind. It's about what kind of sandbox do I want to play in? Some days I think I should keep more distance between the team and myself. Other days I think I'm senior to their positions, yes, but maybe there should be more distance between the positions to make it comfortable for us all. How do I succeed without them resenting it? And, why am I even asking this question?

"They simply want to keep doing things the same way, and they don't want to take on new skills or projects. I'm perfectly happy to leave it alone - it's not my role to direct them. Encourage yes, direct no. The flip side is that they are not willing to leave it alone. Every time they find out I've done well, they demonstrate their disapproval to me."

You are assuming and you are assuming that your way is superior - sure, bottom line is presumably "superior" but management might factor in other things and you might believe it will be better for bottom line but - let's say that holding those people to your standards decreases employee morale and they leave/are even less productive - then the company has to spend $ hiring new people. For example.

I don't think it's about lunches or socks - I think it's about considering whether what you think of as "success" is thought of that way in the company.

Also how are they aware of your success given your little interaction with them?

Of course this might be the wrong place. I completed my long job search in September including 6 intense weeks of preparing the application, for the interview, etc - so I wouldn't jump to leave unless you're sure "it's no me it's them/this place."

Ok. I'm exhausted. Since you can't hear my tone as I write, I'll say that it's calm, gentle (in spite of my directness), and a wee bit tired.

I've never said my way is superior. I've never asked them to do things my way. I don't define success for anyone but myself. I've talked about this with friends and former managers for the last 3 years that I've been at this company. They are saying it comes down to the fact that there are companies that thrive on innovation and companies that remain rooted where they've been. Some companies embrace change, and others hate it. Some companies can maintain a healthy balance between the two extremes, and some can't. It's the same with people.

If I'd had an entire work history filled with my current dynamic, then I'd be forced to put this on me. When it's been one company, then I have to look to see what's going on for both sides.

I simply want to work with people who enjoy challenges, brainstorming, celebrating successes together, and all that. I want to work where my efforts aren't seen as an attack on their efforts. I want to work where we actively help each other become better.

I like the career path I'm currently on, and will continue here until I get what I need for the next steps. I also want to make sure I don't go to another company with this same culture. Asking now gives me time to look around, investigate, and establish contacts.

Please don't get me wrong. I appreciate how much effort you've put into this. I've talked far too much about myself, and I'm feeling the need for my introvert cave.

"I simply want to work with people who enjoy challenges, brainstorming, celebrating successes together, and all that. I want to work where my efforts aren't seen as an attack on their efforts. I want to work where we actively help each other become better."

You continue to misinterpret what I wrote so I agree that typing more isn't helpful. I do think you think that your way is superior because it will save the company money. I asked you to consider whether that might not be the case -saving money but then having to spend it in other ways (i.e. retraining people, retaining people, having people leave if you increase the standards -there might be other things going on).

If this is the only time you've had this experience -and I've mentioned a number of times that of course it might be your particular environment - then sure it might be the wrong fit and you should get out there and network your awesome behind off to meet others from "branded" companies for example.

I also work at a nonprofit now - and thought of our discussion when I received an awesome compliment that was publicized to the higher ups and everyone in the department. I am not at all concerned about backlash or being "attacked" as you put it. But, I guess we'll see -haven't even been there 3 months yet.

Congrats on your awesome compliment!! Sounds like you did your homework before taking this job, so I'm sure that your team will be happy for you.

Thanks for hanging in there with me. Written communication can be challenging. You might've been writing from your experience, and I'm replying from mine - and we don't know each other's perspective or background.

From a management background, I've found that well-trained, engaged employees are worth their weight in gold. That's always been my aim when I've managed teams, and I would never change it. Sure, it means my staff ends up leaving through promotions or better opportunities, but then I usually get the best employees applying to fill their spots.

In my current job, I manage a process, not people. I burned out, and needed a break. A great opportunity came up some months ago in my old location, but I ended up withdrawing.

I would love to see my team really into their work, and feeling like rock stars. It's not about money, or company savings. I'd also like to see them with some job security when the restructuring is done.

Thanks again for your input. Much appreciated

I lucked out with the working environment I am in. 7 plus years as a full-time mom and being newish to my city plus needing a part time job with at least some telework left very slim pickings.

Can you renew your interest in the opportunity you withdrew from or ask those people for job leads?

Your idea is a good one. The opportunity was with this same company, and had the same kind of culture, which is why I withdrew. We have other locations across the country - I'm not sure how the culture is for each city, so it's a possibility. More jobs will be created as we continue restructuring. I've been strengthening my connections in the home office, and that might come in handy at some point.

I was a full time mom, too. I remember how hard it was, and how amazing. It's not easy transitioning back into work, especially in a new(ish) town. I'd expect you'll have some good local people to network with very soon. It's exciting! A little scary, but definitely exciting.

Yes I started building up my professional network about 5-6 years ago so that helped. And kept up with my former city connections. I understand not wanting to stay within the same company culture! I wouldn't do the lunch/socks thing- just try to get objective views (from the outside or inside) on what you might want to change about communication skills, etc - it can't hurt!