Are early stage of love as "real" as long term love?

For a long time, I believed that love in LTR were somehow more authentic, valid or real than love at the beginning of a relationship.

When I see people crushing on another person and then getting extremely disappointed when things don't pan out, I thought that it probably wouldn't be as bad as someone losing their long term relationship. But I think that's wrong now... if anything, their pain and disappointment of failed infatuation is probably equally if not more intense.

Their experience of love is equally as self-sacrificial as long term love. So in that sense, it's pretty authentic. And when you think about it, you wouldn't really dismiss the early stages of your own relationship.

So that brings me to idea of love within rebound relationships. My current (false?) belief is their experiences of love somehow aren't entirely valid because it's simply attraction/infatuation but that seems like such a naive thought now.

It seems more likely that the real reason that rebound relationship doesn't have much of a success rate is because people haven't fully dealt with the break up of their old relationship. If they had, the chance of their rebound would be much more successful. Their experiences of love are real. The beginning stage of love simply paves way to long term love.

I guess I'm writing this post in order to redefine my understanding of love, as someone who loves psychology as an undergraduate, and as someone to understand my own situation and feelings better.

Is infactuation real? Well, yes. It makes the possibility of long term love possible. It is real in the sense that it is a real thing. Does it have the same power as long term love I don't know. I will use my own life as an example.

Would infactuation live through my PTSD and his severely non functional anxiety for years . Would it live through having a child with a disability. Would it live through the military lifestyle. Would it live through four miscarriages. Would it live through being apart for about seven years due to the military lifestyle.

I don't think that infatuation would've survived. I think our relationship survived the past 27 years because we had already progressed to true long-standing love by the time we encountered a lot of hurdles.

But is infatuation real ? Yes,absolutely. Does it hurt to lose a partner when you are infatuated yes I'm sure it does. But it might hurt less losing something of five months than unravelling a life that has been together for 27 years.

Thanks for that. That's a good way of looking at things, whether the love of infatuation would endure difficulties as well as long term love.

Having said that, I feel like infatuation would at least say that it would be willing to endure all that.

Absolutely it might be willing to do it. We say a lot when we are infatuated. We do believe it and mean it at the time.

Infatuation isn't "love", at all.

It's essentially a kind of "illness" for want of a better word lol.

"Infatuation as are defining it here, is a static process characterized by an unrealistic expectation of blissful passion without positive growth and development. Characterized by a lack of trust, lack of loyalty, lack of commitment, lack of reciprocity, an infatuation is not necessarily foreplay for a love scenario. People, however, have many reasons for making commitments. "

"In infatuation, your gaze, your thoughts and maybe your world revolves around someone. You have blinders on. It seems that all the world pales in comparison to this person’s looks, talents, intelligence, creativity, etc. What you might not see by keeping the blinders on, what can be serious flaws in any relationship, are the destructive traits and behaviors that degrade self esteem and cause some pretty negative effects on one’s choices and decisions. "

From:

That definition seems a little harsh on the person experiencing infatuation though. It seems sort of reasonable to expect the beginning stages of a relationship to lack trust, loyalty and commitment given the unknown nature of everything.

Would it be unreasonable to think of infatuation as the voice that says:

"I'm scared. But I want to hope, I want to believe, I want to trust. I want to develop our love."

Interesting that now that I've written that, it does come across as a little more selfish.

What you might not see by keeping the blinders on, what can be serious flaws in any relationship, are the destructive traits and behaviors that degrade self esteem and cause some pretty negative effects on one’s choices and decisions.

Sometimes I've seen people say that they love someone but don't like being in a relationship with that person. Infatuation seems like the initial stages of love. Is love really possible without it? Even with friendship, there are the initial bonding stages where you want to hang out a lot with a particular friend.

My school of thought is: love is a feeling. So if you feel in love you simply are in love. I think it's possible to get your heart smashed up pretty good by someone you've never been with and are never going to be with. Now, how different that is from a committed long term relationship? A long term committed relationship has a bunch of other feelings it gets to smash, like trust, commitment, faith, a built shared idea of the future. When you lose a long term partner you aren't just losing your connection to the feeling of love you are losing an idea of yourself. We build worlds with the people we choose to spend our lives with and you lose those worlds when you lose them. But I don't think that is because a long term relationship is "real love" and a short one is "infatuation". It's just the difference in time and energy. When you've shared your life and your deepest self with someone they become tangled up in your idea of yourself and in your ideas about life. That stuff is often harder to piece back together then your heart. Hearts are strong they are made of muscle and grit... ideas? philosophies? trust and faith? That isn't as simple.

Look up "limerence". (aka infatuation).

"The following is taken from a paper on limerence by Albert Wakin & Duyen B. Vo.

Intrusive and obsessive thinking about the LO. ...

Replay and rehearsal. ...

Anxiety and self-consciousness. ...

Emotional dependence. ...

Impaired functioning."

Is that not a good description of "illness"?!

Or put more simply it's when the infatuated person is not thinking with the brain located between the ears but the one located further south....

Of course love is perfectly possible without infatuation!

Western societies place a huge emphasis on this "feeling", so much so, that people refuse to marry without it. In fact, in Western societies some only marry with this ONE component present.

Kind of flimsy basis for an LTR or marriage IMO. But people only see what they want to see and hear what they want to hear. In my experience.

My school of thought is: love is a feeling. So if you feel in love you simply are in love. I think it's possible to get your heart smashed up pretty good by someone you've never been with and are never going to be with. Now, how different that is from a committed long term relationship? A long term committed relationship has a bunch of other feelings it gets to smash, like trust, commitment, faith, a built shared idea of the future. When you lose a long term partner you aren't just losing your connection to the feeling of love you are losing an idea of yourself. We build worlds with the people we choose to spend our lives with and you lose those worlds when you lose them. But I don't think that is because a long term relationship is "real love" and a short one is "infatuation". It's just the difference in time and energy. When you've shared your life and your deepest self with someone they become tangled up in your idea of yourself and in your ideas about life. That stuff is often hard to piece back together then your heart. Hearts are strong they are made of muscle and grit... ideas? philosophies? trust and faith? That isn't as simple.

Thanks. This is a good responses counter to the constant idea that love is a choice.

I'm not entirely sure what I believe about love being a feeling or a choice. To me, It feels like those debates about nurture/nature about how a child develops.

But I don't think that is because a long term relationship is "real love" and a short one is "infatuation". It's just the difference in time and energy. When you've shared your life and your deepest self with someone they become tangled up in your idea of yourself and in your ideas about life.

I suppose the thing with this school of thought is, that it's entirely possible to love someone who you don't know. Infatuation allows you to say that you love someone, when you don't know them entirely. There is a lot more of a faith/trust thing going on here.

So there are those who argue that it's only when you know someone on a deep level, that the feelings of love are valid because it has endured.

My school of thought is: love is a feeling. So if you feel in love you simply are in love.

As much as love is an action. Maybe more. So many can say they love someone but -they don't act lovingly.

As much as love is an action. Maybe more. So many can say they love someone but -they don't act lovingly.

Just because you love someone doesn't mean you know how to treat them. Love is a feeling... how to treat someone with respect and love is a life long project.

Obsession and infatuation are "feelings" too. And they are not "love".

In her book Love and Limerence: The Experience of Being in Love, psychologist Dorothy Tennov describes the typical features of limerence:

*Intense romantic desire

*A compulsive, obsessive, addictive quality to the experience

*The attachment increases in the presence of barriers

*Intrusive thoughts and fantasies about the love object

*Emotional swings from bliss to despondency, depending on the most recent interaction with the Love Object

*An uptick of chemical activity in the brain, powerful rushes of dopamine

*Feels intensely pleasurable but can also make the limerent person feel physically ill

Sure they are feelings... just like love. Love isn't a commitment. Love isn't some grand amazing thing that only happens after you've been through hell and back... love isn't trust. It's just a feeling like any other. What you do with that feeling is what makes a relationship.

It always amazes me that people are so afraid of love just being a feeling. That doesn't mean your relationship is any less amazing. It doesn't mean you are any less committed. It just means when you feel in love you are. Just like when you feel afraid you are.

If love isn't a feeling what is it?

Sure they are feelings... just like love. Love isn't a commitment. Love isn't some grand amazing thing that only happens after you've been through hell and back... love isn't trust. It's just a feeling like any other. What you do with that feeling is what makes a relationship.

 

It always amazes me that people are so afraid of love just being a feeling. That doesn't mean your relationship is any less amazing. It doesn't mean you are any less committed. It just means when you feel in love you are. Just like when you feel afraid you are.

 

If love isn't a feeling what is it?

Absolutely love and relationships are lifelong project. And you don't love everybody all the time, even when married, lol. It is only the trust and commitment and the law some days that keep you from not removing their head. And then you come back to sanity and love them again. And feelings are just that feelings.

Ah, what is love? Reams have been written and tons of ink used in trying to nail down "what is love".

Philosophers, psychologists and thinkers in general have had a go at trying to define "love" without a whole lot of success.

Here's one "try"

"You can be unconsciously in love with someone when you have the dispositions described in the last paragraph, but you became aware of love when the semantic pointer representing your attitude toward another outcompetes other semantic pointers currently active in your brain. "

For myself, love is everything infatuation isn't.

Hmm... Thanks for the insight.

Perhaps the whole idea of love being a choice as opposed to feelings is acknowledgement to the idea that love is a conscious thought, as opposed to something that is purely instinctual. Sort of like the whole discussion about what's the difference between emotions, feelings and thoughts.

As it stands, it currently seems like it's all part of the package to me. This is my current understanding of love and it's different stages?

 

For myself, love is everything infatuation isn't.

Can you help me follow that thought? What are the things love is, that infatuation isn't?

Hmm... Thanks for the insight.

 

Perhaps the whole idea of love being a choice as opposed to feelings is acknowledgement to the idea that love is a conscious thought, as opposed to something that is purely instinctual. Sort of like the whole discussion about what's the difference between emotions, feelings and thoughts.

 

As it stands, it currently seems like it's all part of the package to me. This is my current understanding of love and it's different stages?

We absolutely have an instinct to love. And we can love anyone I don't think that is really a choice it is the trust and commitment that are a choice. The relationship is a choice. And the trust and commitment and relationship expand the love.

Although I don't quite think infatuation is exactly what love is.

Aahh, Rose, you'll have to do the reading yourself about that! lol.

Love is healthy; obsession isn't, nor is infatuation.

See earlier post again.

To add:

What's the difference between healthy and obsessive love?

The difference between healthy and obsessive love is that with the latter, those feelings of infatuation become extreme, expanding to the point of becoming obsessions. Obsessive love and jealousy that is delusional is a symptom of mental-health problems and is a symptom that occurs in about 0.1% of adults. Individuals who suffer from delusional jealousy often interpret minor experiences like a coworker saying hello to their spouse or romantic partner looking at a passerby as positive proof that their loved one is being unfaithful. Male alcoholics have been found to be particularly vulnerable to developing delusional jealousy. Females are more likely to develop obsessive love toward people they know rather than toward a stranger. The objects of love for women who love obsessively are often people who have been in the role of helper in their lives. In the uncommon instances that obsessive love involves violence, men and women seem to be perpetrators of such violence at equal rates. Risk factors for developing obsessive love include a lack of full-time employment as well as having family members who have psychiatric problems, particularly a delusional disorder.

Hmm... Thanks for the insight.

 

Perhaps the whole idea of love being a choice as opposed to feelings is acknowledgement to the idea that love is a conscious thought, as opposed to something that is purely instinctual. Sort of like the whole discussion about what's the difference between emotions, feelings and thoughts.

 

As it stands, it currently seems like it's all part of the package to me. This is my current understanding of love and it's different stages?

I like that! Love being a choice. A conscious thought. I think that's pretty charming. For me that is commitment. When I'm commited to a relationship is when I am choosing my partner over and over again. I choose to work to keep the feeling of love alive. I choose to stay and build.

But I love people without that commitment. And I love people against my rational desires. I choose people with my conscious thought. So I think of the choice as commitment.

We absolutely have an instinct to love. And we can love anyone I don't think that is really a choice it is the trust and commitment that are a choice. The relationship is a choice. And the trust and commitment and relationship expand the love.

Just to clarify, are you talking about the relationship when you talk about commitment and trust? Or commitment in the sense of maintaining love.

What is your opinion of people who say that they love their ex's/family members but at the same time acknowledge that they no longer want to be in a relationship with the other person, or that they don't trust the other person to have their best interests at heart.

It just seems like the idea of long term choice based love isn't too terribly dependent on the relationship itself, but instead wishing the other person well.

Aahh, Rose, you'll have to do the reading yourself about that! lol.

 

Love is healthy; obsession isn't, nor is infatuation.

 

See earlier post again.

I'm well read on limerence (I'm pretty sure I introduced the concept to this board... it's one of my favorites.) But obsession and infatuation are just products of some people dealing with the very strange reality of falling in love. I go through a limerence phase most of the time when I fall in love and it's... well it's kinda awful. But to me that is just a reaction to very new love.

Heh heh I wouldn't know, Rose. I am a very hard-headed sort of woman.....

Just to clarify, are you talking about the relationship when you talk about commitment and trust? Or commitment in the sense of maintaining love.

 

What is your opinion of people who say that they love their ex's/family members but at the same time acknowledge that they no longer want to be in a relationship with the other person, or that they don't trust the other person to have their best interests at heart.

 

It just seems like the idea of long term choice based love isn't too terribly dependent on the relationship itself, but instead wishing the other person well.

Well, yes ,a relationship is commitment and trust but it is also maintaining your love. It is all 3.

You can love someone but never want to have anything to do with them. For instance my parents loved each other and I do believe truly but them having anything to do with each other was an unmitigated disaster.