Weekends

My ex are separated for a full year now. Since the beginning we agreed on this arrangement:

1st week:

He has the children from Friday 12:00 till Monday morning 8:30.

So he picks them up at school and brings them back to school.

2nd week:

He has them after school on Wednesday till about 19:30 after dinner.

We had some minor issues with him dropping by announced to see the children at my place. I repeatedly told him not to do this and make a phone call ahead - not his kids but to me.

Vacations are 50/50.

Now he never paid for child support, I thought he would come to his mind and would suddenly see the need and start to pay. Yes, I'm an idealist. And a fool. So now I got a lawyer, he got a lawyer and suddenly he wants more time with the kids.

He wants them every weekend from Friday 12:00 till Monday 8:30. I'll get them in the weekend if I ask him and if it is for a birthday of the family or when I want to go to a theme park with them.

I feel heartbroken and betrayed. He has never mentioned before that he wants to see his children more often than that we had agreed on. I'm deeply suspicious that he only wants them every weekend so he can lower the child support. In fact, I'm almost certain of it.

I feel sorry for him. He was here last Saturday while we were celebrating our youngest daughter birthday. I pretended to be friendly towards him but tried to be busy enough not to talk to him frequently. I'm afraid he has ruined our relationship right now. I don't think I'll ever see him as a friend anymore but always as my enemy.

Is it my fault? Does he sees his children too less? Don't I try to let him be involved enough? I invited him for holiday celebrations, I make sure that when we have a parent meeting at school it fits in his schedule, I make brief conversations about our daughters developments when I see him. He has Never asked for a weekend extra but I'm open for an extra day if he would ask me.

I'm scared, stressed and sad.

He agreed initially to your verbal agreement. Which was basically him seeing his own children 3 days per fortnight.

You had them 11 days.

What's more important to you? The money or the time?

Yes I think he should pay child support but if he is seeing his own kids a quarter of the time you do, that should come into play with how much.

Your lawyer asked for x amount of money which equates to x amount of time.

It sounds like you and your lawyer were too greedy.

And your ex responded to that greed and demanded the time with his kids to reflect that money.

For a father to want his kids every weekend suggests to me that they are his priority. Good on him . He sounds like a lovely guy and father.

His reactions are more normal than not.

Court assigned support and visitation rarely can be avoided.

Btw,

People are funny. People are really funny when it comes to money.

You mentioned that you're afraid that he's ruined your relationship. What relationship? Your marriage has broken down to the point of divorce. The relationship that you should be having is strictly business. And that business is for both of you to raise and support your children equally and to the best of your ability. That means financially, physically and emotionally.

Short of abuse. danger to the children and when children are infants, there is absolutely no reason in this day and age that parenting time should not be split 50/50. None. Period. He has just as much right to have a fulfilling life with his children as you do. So you don't *let* him be involved. He *is* involved. That's his job as a parent.

I'd suggest you get a *real* parenting schedule. Something concrete. And *not* something complicated with times and dates changing all the time. This will be for the benefit of both of your sanity and more importantly, the stability of your children so they know exactiy when and with whom they will be with.

My ex-wife and I use a 2-2-5 schedule. See the following link for reference:

When the kids are with me, it is 100% my responsibility to care for my kids in every way. That includes me making adjustments in my work schedule, if they're sick, have school activities or whatever. I am truely a single parent and don't rely on my ex-wife at all. There will be rare life circumstances when you may have to ask if the other parent can take the kids but this should be a rare exception to the rule.

Point is. I would love to have co-parent relationship and half the free time. But my ex can't take care of the children during weekdays, he only wants them in the weekend.

I know the court in my country will rarely agree to this sort of arrangement because it gives the mom (or dad if flipped) zero 'play' time with the kids. The days they go to school are always too short to really relax or do something fun with the children. This is why him only the weekends is kind of upsetting.

I could care less about the money. I've been doing without his money for a full year now and manage just fine. Every amount of money I suggested to him was 'ridiculous' to him, he said: 'we never spend so much money on our kids. I suggest you write down when you buy them clothing or shoes and I will contribute to it.'

The last 5 weekends that he did had his kids he send them to a friend to sleep over because he had other plans. If he really misses his children I would suspect that A: he would have said that months ago to me. B: he changes his plans when he does has our kids.

I value our relationship as parents. Yes. Very highly. I want my children to see we are reasonable adults and when can walk through the same door and be in the same room for their benefit. We were reasonably amicable. But right now I just can't talk to him anymore. I wasn't greedy at all, there is a system to calculate the money that has to be paid and my lawyer just did that. I came up with a lower (40%) amount then that and he still didn't agree.

He is just really stubborn when it comes to money. He always was.

 

When the kids are with me, it is 100% my responsibility to care for my kids in every way. That includes me making adjustments in my work schedule, if they're sick, have school activities or whatever. I am truely a single parent and don't rely on my ex-wife at all. There will be rare life circumstances when you may have to ask if the other parent can take the kids but this should be a rare exception to the rule.

I admire you. But my ex would never do this sadly enough. Not going to work is not an option for him. It never was. When we were together he only saw them in the weekends. He was off to work from 6:00 till 19:30 and then went to the gym from 20:00 till 22:30 every weekday (except Friday). His work and gym-routine are just AS important to him as his kids.

He agreed initially to your verbal agreement. Which was basically him seeing his own children 3 days per fortnight.

You had them 11 days.

Actually he saw them four days per fortnight and I ten. I agree that it sounds unfair and it probably is. But he can and was always aloud to ask for more time. We live ten minutes away from each other and the children can walk to his house. I would never keep the children away from him. So they did see each other more often then those four days.

And it was OUR verbal agreement. He enjoyed himself very much having some weekends for himself without the kids. I know he has lots of friends and went out every weekend. And the last 5 weekends that he did had the kids...

His reactions are more normal than not.

Court assigned support and visitation rarely can be avoided.

 

Btw,

People are funny. People are really funny when it comes to money.

I think this teaches you a lot about people, when you go through a situation like this. Lester is correct. People are (often) really, really, REALLY weird about money.

There's a saying I read somewhere that really stuck with me: You learn more about someone at the end of a relationship than at the beginning. You get to see them at their worst, and it's interesting and sad and often heartbreaking.

I have a friend that has similar visitation with his children (re: what you described above as agreeing to), though he fought for sole custody. People usually ask for the maximum, and then there are negotiations that get to what amounts to (hopefully) a fair and equitable arrangement. At least, that's how it's supposed to work here in the States.

Things I would consider, and try to take a step back and think about logically:

Do the kids feel like they get enough time with him?

How involved was he before the split?

How involved is he now?

Is he a positive influence in their lives? (He gets visitation no matter what, but is there a reason for limiting it so severely?)

Does he come to school functions?

Is he involved with their activities?

Every other weekend and one day per week on the off weeks is not much time with your children. Would YOU be happy with that amount of time?

If you guys can work together and come up with an arrangement that you agree is fair, rather than letting the lawyers figure it out/fighting over it and doing ridiculous amounts of haggling like they are property rather than people, odds are good that you and the children will be happier with whatever comes about. Every weekend for one or the other of you doesn't seem practical either. Every other weekend does, but maybe offer additional week days if he can work with that, let them stay overnight on that week day, or give 2 week days during the off week, let him have them Thurs - Mon morning on the weeks that it's his weekend.

PS: If the courts were to give him week day times...he'd have to adjust his schedule accordingly. That is one of the definite pros to having a formal arrangement - it's enforceable.

So you had an arrangement that worked for all of you just fine. Then you decided that he needs to pay child support and got a lawyer - things went downhill fast. You say that you don't care about the money - if that's the case, then why did you hire a lawyer to fight for child support? The thing is that you are correct that now it's no longer about what's good for the children and the adults, it has turned into a fight over money.

He thinks kids don't cost that much? So humor him and collect all receipts for a few months - clothes, food, outings, everything. He needs to see the money spent, let him. Put it all in a spreadsheet for him just how much kids actually cost to raise per year and as they get older, it will increase too. Perhaps when he sees the reality, he will adjust attitude accordingly. Right now he probably thinks he will be paying for your spa appointments instead of kids. Perhaps then you can both actually have a rational conversation and come to a fair agreement on how to split those costs and chuck the lawyers out of the mix.

^"Right now he probably thinks he will be paying for your spa appointments instead of kids."

- I guarantee it.

It's part of the titt-for-tat revenge game that most go through. (Even if super rich, op noble thoughts are most likely rooted in it.)

Formalizing it is the best way to reduce the negative, endless fights/one-upmanship that kids will be exposed to. (Putting the kids first)

Adding up receipts will never come close to the real cost of raising a child. Government/economic experts will give you basic numbers, but even these, in my real life/been there, done that experience are very low.

Here one of hundreds available:

It only goes to 17 (ha!), and doesn't include ALL the stuff a modern child really wants and will, if possible, get. (Expect to pay till at least 26..., oops, I forgot, that's when the weddings start!

Thanks everyone for your honest answers. We still haven't gone to court (what a slow process!!) and our relationship as parents is still weird. He acts like nothing is going on and I act the same. I think the children still have no clue on what's going on because even I would be fooled by his behavior.

Mutual friends of us who were at the same parties as we were have complimented us on our 'friendly' conversations we still seem to have. The world is full with frauds like us I think.

I've let myself accept the situation as it is. If he wants them every weekend and the court agrees than I'll let it be. I can see some (if little) benefits in this situation - all weekends without kids will sure come with a lots of rests and naps for me. The amount of money he saves for alimony is futile to me. I don't Need it.

What I seek is recognizing from him that I have done all the hard work. I was there for the children - we both choose that I would be a stay at home mom. We both choose that he could go to the gym every evening and i would suck it up. I realize he will never see it like that, but maybe he will realize how it much it 'costs'.