Assets and marriage

I have been with my boyfriend for 2 years, there is a 13 year gap between us, we are both doctors, I’m early into my career and just at the stage that I can buy a property. He is significantly further on with assets already. He once casually mentioned pre- nup in a light hearted conversation. I didn’t respond but later asked him what he was thinking. He said he thought any assets before marriage should always remain his in the event of divorce. I felt/said that if I go on maternity leave / go part time / delay my career / reduce my pension as a result of having children then I would hope for some compensation for this. I said that if he continued to be earning and we acquired reasonable assets during this time then I agreed that there would be no need to divide pre marital assets. My concern is that if he goes part time or stops working early and stops earning then it may be reasonable to divide his assets. He has now said that he is planning to find a vehicle to protect his assets e.g. create a ‘company’ to protect his assets so that I can’t ever have a share of them if we get married. I told him my concerns and that we don’t know what our situation will be in the future. He didn’t seem to acknowledge any of my concerns and just said they’re my assets I’ll do what I want with them, my family cheated me out of assets and I’m not going to let anyone else. When I suggested the original idea of a pre- nup stating that our circumstances would be taken into consideration at the time of a divorce so there was a fair conclusion he said he didn’t want to, as there would be a chance that I may get a proportion of his assets. I told him that I wasn’t prepared to go into a marriage under the basis he was suggesting and he would have to make a decision, he said he would have to think about it. He has since been very, very nice to me.

Currently I feel like if he turned around and said he wouldn’t do the hiding assets thing I still probably wouldn’t feel safe. I feel like he has shown me what sort of things he would do and it feels quite deceptive. I don’t want his assets but I want to feel secure and I feel that he is trying to remove all possible protection from myself and take complete control of finances. I’m also thinking about when I have assets, is he going to try and get a proportion of my assets while his are hidden away somewhere. I thought it was fine to get into a relationship with an older man, now I feel like it would be better if we were at the same stage of life. It feels like he doesn’t have my best interests at heart and is just concerned about ensuring that I receive as little as possible in the event of divorce.

I am thinking that there isn’t a future for us if he would be prepared to behave in the way he is suggesting as I may always be wondering what he is up too. I also don’t want to be married to someone if I’m afraid to get a divorce for fear of having nothing afterwards – while he would be perfectly safe to get a divorce, I think this would make me vulnerable. I am sad though because I fell in love with him and was ready to devote myself to a marriage with him.

Any advice would be very gratefully received.

Just curious, why does this bother you so much? Child support exists outside of a pre nup, so that document wouldn't affect it. Ask yourself why you feel entitled to half of his assets, most of which he had before you, in the event of a divorce, when you have a lucrative career yourself.

You are talking about marriage and kids...how old is he?

It is normal in 2nd marriages for the person bringing a huge amount of assets from their previous life to safeguard those assets. You are both doctors....so from the day you marry all assets from that point forward are joint. How could he start working part time if you have started a family.

He isn't being deceptive. He has been very upfront. If this is giving you.pause...perhaps marrying someone that farther along in life isn't the.right match for you. You seem to be trying tomland softly from the divorce...before entering the marriage.

If she has to reduce her own career to raise children, when his own is unaffected, I would want to know what happens in that case too.

OP, I have heard many, many stories of high earning men who promise their wives the earth if they quit their own jobs to raise the children and support their husband in his career, and once the divorce rolls around have been very smart in how they've held their money so the wives never get compensation for those years. You at least have a great job, but I'd want to be very sure, very clear, about what happens in this situation before I married and had children with him.

Both of you have tangible concerns. From your perspective you have some points but if i were him i would reply like him.

I think it's better to find a doctor around your age so both of you will be on the same page.

I don't get the impression he's trying to do more than protect his pre-marital assets. Maybe you can propose an approach that would make you comfortable? This can't be a new problem others haven't resolved. I've never done these pre-nup discussions, always assumed it's got to be really difficult for hard feelings to not arise. One upside to having no money.

Ugh. I can see both of your concerns, but if I were in your shoes, I would not marry him. If you divorce, he's going to play hardball. Yes, you'll get child support, but that doesn't last forever...and he may want joint custody which will drastically decrease how much CP you get. Honestly tho, I'd probably walk from this one. The red flags are there. And really, by the time your career is in full force, your going to have a husband who may be dependent on you for his own care. Find someone your age and build your life together.

With seventy percent of divorces being initiated by women, and having personally witnessed a pretty female 'friend' whom I used to know tell me she was marrying this middle aged fat bloke for his money I can't say I blame this guy. Any child maintenance would be decided by a court outside of a prenuptial, so what's your problem? Are you sure he's not testing you?

I think the guy has been burned and is being upfront and honest. She doesn't deserve his assets that existed before she came along.

Should they marry and build a life...assets from here on in become joint. If he owns a house...by virtue of marrying him and without a penny down...it becomes half hers?

I think you should see your own lawyer, Op and decide if HIS prenup (should it ever come to that since you are only dating a short time) is fair to you and you can certainly negotiate the terms of said prenup if HIS document is not looking fair to you and YOUR lawyer.

Here where I live, any assets bought into the marriage are split only on what has been accumulated since the marriage. For example: If I bring in a house, at the time of marriage that is worth $100,000.oo That would be mine and mine alone. What WOULD be split was what the property accumulated in value at time of divorce. So: If it was worth 200,000.00 at time of divorce only 100,000.00 in accrued equity during your marriage would be split. You would get $50,000.00 of that 100,000.00 only.

You are NOT entitled to anything that he accumulated before you came into his life and frankly, I'm surprised that you would want any of it. Yes, I agree that he should continue to contribute to your pension plan should you stay home and loose income and the ability to add to it, in order to raise his children but do you really think that you would be doing that after working so hard to become a Doctor?

Anyway, I think you're making this way more complicated then it has to be so if you think you are going to be married to this man, see what it is he wants to have in this prenup once you both decide that you will be together and marry, and then take it to your lawyer and discuss and negotiate.

Quote: 'we are both doctors, I’m early into my career and just at the stage that I can buy a property'

So what's exactly stopping you buying a house, putting it out to rent, instead of looking at his property? That way if things went wrong you'd have something to fall back on. If I'd signed any arrangements like this with my partners over the last few years I'd be living in a cardboard box for my retirement.

I don’t want half of his assets. The thing that really concerns me is that he is not asking for a pre- nup. I would be happy to consider a pre- nup, which said it would consider the sacrifices and time in work / time together etc. that we had both made to come up with a fair conclusion.

The really concerning thing for me is that he has told me he doesn’t want a pre- nup, because then there would be a risk that I may get a proportion of his assets i.e. it would give me some protection. He is suggesting creating some king of fake company to hide his assets so a court doesn’t even consider them in a divorce. At least a pre- nup would consider both of our concerns and circumstances and protect us both. But this feels like he is not prepared to acknowledge my concerns.

He could easily decide to retire early or go part time and stop contributing as much once we were married. Then we may not have accumulated that much during the marriage and I could end up with very little and he would be fine. Another worry is that if he is then in a much better position financially he may have a better chance of getting custody of children. This is probably my biggest concern, I am extremely family oriented and I feel like if I ended up financially insecure without having custody of my children, this would be a disaster for me and I would probably be a very unhappy person.

Seems like there's as much energy these days planning the divorce as planning the wedding. I don't see the advantage of marriage anymore but maybe I'm just cynical..?

I am really concerned now, OP. It sounds like you're agreeable to a prenup, and it makes sense in this case honestly. But he doesn't want that, he wants to make a fake company to hide assets? That sounds highly illegal.

Have you considered that maybe he's doing this either a) to hide assets from you or b) to evade taxes? Just a thought. Have you seen his financial documents or statements at all? Or does he want you to stay in the dark?

If he wete suggesting a prenup, no problem. What he's suggesting is sketchy and possibly illegal.

I don’t want half of his assets. The thing that really concerns me is that he is not asking for a pre- nup. I would be happy to consider a pre- nup, which said it would consider the sacrifices and time in work / time together etc. that we had both made to come up with a fair conclusion.

 

The really concerning thing for me is that he has told me he doesn’t want a pre- nup, because then there would be a risk that I may get a proportion of his assets i.e. it would give me some protection. He is suggesting creating some king of fake company to hide his assets so a court doesn’t even consider them in a divorce. At least a pre- nup would consider both of our concerns and circumstances and protect us both. But this feels like he is not prepared to acknowledge my concerns.

 

He could easily decide to retire early or go part time and stop contributing as much once we were married. Then we may not have accumulated that much during the marriage and I could end up with very little and he would be fine. Another worry is that if he is then in a much better position financially he may have a better chance of getting custody of children. This is probably my biggest concern, I am extremely family oriented and I feel like if I ended up financially insecure without having custody of my children, this would be a disaster for me and I would probably be a very unhappy person.

You are a doctor therefore you will always have a good salary. If you don't feel confident enough to proceed this way maybe it's better to find someone else.

PS.He is a wise dude .

I am really concerned now, OP. It sounds like you're agreeable to a prenup, and it makes sense in this case honestly. But he doesn't want that, he wants to make a fake company to hide assets? That sounds highly illegal.

 

Have you considered that maybe he's doing this either a) to hide assets from you or b) to evade taxes? Just a thought. Have you seen his financial documents or statements at all? Or does he want you to stay in the dark?

 

If he wete suggesting a prenup, no problem. What he's suggesting is sketchy and possibly illegal.

Well not exactly . He could make a trust and it's not illegitimate . Even if he does something illegal i don't think that the OP should get involved. It's his personal financial documents.

Well not exactly . He could make a trust and it's not illegitimate . Even if he does something illegal i don't think that the OP should get involved. It's his personal financial documents.

OP didn't say a trust though, she said a fake company, which is likely illegal.

Without a prenup, I'd argue it is her business. His assets and his debt would be shared between them, as is hers. If a couple wants to not get married and keep their finance to themselves, fine, but it's a great disservice to her to expect her to stay in the dark (if that's what he's intending) after marriage when his financial issues can and will affect her simply because they are married. I knew a couple whose husband did some illegal crap with money. She was in the dark. He went to jail and she was ruined.

Never ever be in the dark about a spouse's finances.

I'm not sure why they can't each get a lawyer and get a proper prenup drafted between them. OP seems in agreement for that. Why not him?

OP didn't say a trust though, she said a fake company, which is likely illegal.

 

Without a prenup, I'd argue it is her business. His assets and his debt would be shared between them, as is hers. If a couple wants to not get married and keep their finance to themselves, fine, but it's a great disservice to her to expect her to stay in the dark (if that's what he's intending) after marriage when his financial issues can and will affect her simply because they are married. I knew a couple whose husband did some illegal crap with money. She was in the dark. He went to jail and she was ruined.

 

Never ever be in the dark about a spouse's finances.

 

I'm not sure why they can't each get a lawyer and get a proper prenup drafted between them. OP seems in agreement for that. Why not him?

Ok you have a point there.

As for the prenup i thought(heard it from folks here) that the court could nullify it .Maybe this is his fear.

Ok you have a point there.

 

As for the prenup i thought(heard it from folks here) that the court could nullify it .Maybe this is his fear.

There is always that risk, depends on what's going on though. Prenups can be tossed out if one side claims coercion or not having proper legal counsel. The key is to have both sides get their own lawyer and have them draft an agreement that is fair to both sides. Child support and custody cannot be dictated through a prenup. It only handles alimony and assets. This is a mistake many people make.

I just don't understand why he's way more willing to make a fake company than to simply NOT get married. Getting a prenup would be far safer for him. Judges are used to people making fake fronts to hide assets.

I think he wants to keep me in the dark. His financial situation seems different every time he mentions it. I am not in this for his money. I want a genuine marriage, based on love and trust. I can understand why he may want a pre- nup and I would want to come to agreement that we would both feel happy and secure with.

I think that hiding his assets is deceptive and makes me vulnerable because we can’t predict the future. The reason why I think this may not be fixable is that even if he turns around and says he wouldn’t do this, I will always wonder if he is doing something dodgy when we are married in order to evade any potential loss to himself.

A couple of weeks ago we were going to get a place together and we were keen on a property, I then cancelled a second viewing and said I think we should probably get married before we do anything else serious. Within a week he mentioned this assets and company thing. So now I am certainly not getting a property with him and am looking into buying a place of my own, that way I will have a place to go if I decide to leave in addition to an investment of my own.

Currently I feel like there is no longer a future for us because it seems like he is not concerned about us both and is just concerned about himself. I think inside I would like there to be an answer that makes this ok so we can carry on together because I love him. However, I think this is wishful thinking and I may need to face the hard truth.

Very smart move Doc. Never buy an asset without being married. Headache city.

Buy a place for yourself. You will always have a place.

Was he married before? Does he have kids from that marriage? Are you sure he is.really willing to have a 2nd family?

I'm sorry, this is super sketchy. Of course you are not in this for the money. But you know he's not being honest with you and you know something is up. You are being fair and are willing to get a prenup, very fair. He is wanting you to marry him without a prenup while keeping you in the dark about his financial status. That is really messed up on his part.

My feeling is this. What if you sat down with him and told him your feelings. Pull out your own financial stuff, and say "okay, we are going to get married and since this is the start of our marriage, I'd like to start with a fresh start and look over all of our own assets and accounts and see what we want to do together in regards of protecting each other's assets in the event of a divorce".

If he cannot be 100% transparent with you as his future soon to be wife, then I would not marry this man. I fear something bad would happen. I'm really sorry you're going through this.

Holy hell, do not marry this guy. He's already all but told you he is going to take everything including yours if you two should divorce.

I believe in prenups absolutely, but what he is proposing is all on his side with no benefits and a whole lot of losses to you. Yes, he's shown you who he is and what he's capable of and it's not good. Make sure you do not put any property you buy or anything you own with his name on it for starters, keep your assets separate. As a woman you are just as entitled to protect your own assets as he is, doubly so if you factor future children and your own ability to care for them with or without a partner there to help you.

At the very least have your own prenup drafted and tell him you'd never sign anything until it's mutual and both parties agree across the boards. Prenups should be agreeable and fair to both parties involved, not just one. My husband and I each drew up prenups, hashed out the terms to be equitable on both sides and allow plenty of protections on all sides factoring in everything beforehand. We did not marry until we both felt good about what we were doing. I highly recommend it for all having seen too many friends and family end up broke over divorces gone ugly.

Protect yourself. Personally, I'd already have bailed on this one.

He has never been married and doesn’t have any children. He does tend to brag about the many beautiful girlfriends he’s had – anyway that’s not the point.

I’m so relieved I didn’t go ahead with getting a property with him because it would have been so easy to follow my heart and not listen to my head.

I think I will need to talk to him about this; I just feel scared that he will say all the right things and I’ll forgive him and then end up in a bad situation. I’m also scared that it will cause an argument. I’m also currently pretending everything is ok to give me time to find a place for myself and discuss future placements at work.

I really appreciate your replies; it is very helpful to talk this through ☺

The more you tell me about you boyfriend, the more I think you should not be marrying him at all. I have my own ideas about protecting my assets, marriage etc. etc., but from what I read he does not seem like an honest man to me. That would be a red flag to me.