Mother of an EXTREMELY difficult 6-year-old, really needs advice!

I came here to vent, get some dialogue going, and maybe someone reading this will have some real solid advice for me.

To give some background info, my daughter has a very high IQ, attends a gifted and talented magnet school, and receives accelerated and advanced instruction in math, science, reading, writing, and spelling. Although she has the capability of performing far ahead of her peers, her medically diagnosed ADHD has serious consequences in her social life. We tried medication, but ultimately opted to go without after seeing the additional negative side effects that it caused.

There are lots of behavior issues at school (not to mention everywhere else), which is seriously affecting her ability to reach her full potential. She is not only a disturbance to herself, but also takes much time away from the teacher and other students.

She is very much an attention-seeker. Her behaviors are nothing new - it has always been like this. All types of reinforcements have been tried - and nothings works. She also has a medical diagnosis of ODD (Oppositional Defiant Disorder), which basically means she refuses to comply with requests from authority figures.

I just don't know what to do with her. So, please, give me some tips, advice, etc. I look forward to reading your responses.

Thank you

Have you consulted a professional child development expert? That would be what I do first. Is she seeing a therapist? It could help her ODD, what other kinds of treatment (not medication) have you tried for her ADHD?

Having child with ADHD I would check out this: link removed

His video (F.A.T. City Workshop) will be the best way you can understand what your child goes through in school. I have two learning disabilities and I cry every time I watch it because it brings back so many memories of what I went through. He also has a video called something like, "Its So Hard To Be Your Friend" that I would check out.

I wanted ask another question, how much do you know about ADHD, ODD, and raising a gifted child? To start working on all these complex issues I would read everything you can get your hands on, do a lot of research, talk to child development experts, therapist, special education teachers etc. As they say knowledge is power,

My son has the same diagnosis as your daughter along with some others. As he got a little older and he began to understand cause and effect more he became a little less defiant. This takes time though and a lot of patience. He was about 9 or 10 when he started to settle more. Now he almost never defiant at school. He still questions every single rule at home consistently all day, but he is not aggressive about it, he just wants to know WHY he has to listen and he is very accepting when I tell him he can not do something and give him the reasons. Five minutes later though he will come up with new rules to ask why he has to follow though...lol.

link removed

My son was medicated from 4 to 12 but then we took medication away and he is still doing ok. Now that he is a teen he has become more defiant but teens are anyway.

I have done a lot of reading, and I know my daughter inside and out. I can predict what she's going to to in any given situation, and she is relatively good when she's with me; especially when it's just me and her. The most difficult obstacle I face is school. I know that she has so much potential. I know that it's difficult for her to concentrate and sit still. But, there are 26+ other students in her class. She thrives better in a smaller group setting where she can get more individualized attention. She's not always doing things to purposely bother others, but telling that to the school sounds like excuses. She can't sit still, but wants to do the right thing. So, she'll sit still, but move another part of her body...wiggling around, tapping, whistling, etc. She gets bored so easily, and defies doing her work because there's not enough stimulation - even though she's receiving accelerated curriculum. I feel like the school has labeled her as a problem child, but fails to see that this is a gifted child with a condition that really does get in the way. What do I say to the school? I think to myself, you boast about your gifted and talented magnet, so why is it so difficult for you to reach out to my child? She is SOOO smart, but is not doing well.

I feel like crying, and I'm not at all a crier. I feel so helpless. She doesn't get invited to play dates. The kids at school tease her. She's such a sweet girl, but I feel like this school is really hardening her. I've considered putting her in a different school, but where? She would not be academically challenged enough in a regular public school. She would never be allowed to skip a grade or two because of her behavior concerns. I've considered private school, but can't afford it for one. For two, a private school could just kick her out for the behavior things. I can't do online school because I have to work... So WHAT ARE MY OPTIONS?

People

...like to scratch their heads when these children grow up, asking themselves, how could such a bright child with so much potential turn into...fill in the blank...

I don't know...

I'd go with some of Moontiger's advice is to start soaking up all the information you possibly can about ADHD, ODD and raising a gifted child. There are lots of seminars for parents to attend always being held - have you ever been to one? They are great because not only can you go along and learn about your child's conditions, but you also have the opportunity to meet other parents there who are in similar situations. This would be a great benefit as you might get some ideas from other parents as to how they go about things. It's nice having support from other parents in similar situations, too.I would recommend you some organisations that hold seminars but they are unfortunately all in Australia...

Also, what has your teacher done to accommodate your child's behaviour? As a teacher myself, whenever I have a child coping with various diagnoses like yours, I modify the curriculum for them to suit their own needs and style in which they learn. Victoria also mentions how her son has begun to understand the cause and effect consequences of behaviour. If there is something she really likes, this can be taken away from her by you and her teacher to consistently demonstrate that if she is defiant to certain requests, she will not be able to go on the computer, play with a certain toy, or watch a particular TV show that she likes. And it needs to be consistent throughout home AND school so make you communicate with your teacher

Yes, it took a ton of time with back and forth between me and the school. His early years we not auspicious in the behavior dept I can tell you which of course affected his work. The early school years with these kids are pretty rough and it takes A LOT of patience. I feel for you. There were days I was in tears and wanted to bang my head. It was not till grade 4 or 5 that we really started ti iron out the bugs.

^ Agreed! I teach 5 to 6 year olds and it's the most difficult time because it's often their first experience of a very different, structured and particular environment (school). It will take some time to adjust.

Thanks Karliah. The teacher and I talk on a very regular basis. I think the problem is that she has to spread her attention to so many other children, and my daughter really only thrives well when in a very small group. She really craves that individualized attention, and will do whatever it takes to get it. I am as consistent as ever with discipline. No TV during the school week, rarely ever on the weekend, writing sentences about her behavior, time-outs, loss of extracurricular activities. But the thing is, she will know that's she's going to lose things, but still do the same things anyway. I know some days her behavior is voluntary like other children, but probably most of the time, she's doing things before she's had time to process and think them through. She'll really want to do the right thing, but make mistakes without realizing it until it's done. I feel devastated because so much of my time with her is spent on drilling rules, expectations, and consequences, in order to address everything that's happened in a day, that we don't have much time ever to just sit back and enjoy each other. I would say that I'm frustrated with my daughter 28 days out of every month. It's really difficult.

I just would like to know if there's anything I should be saying to the school? Anything I could ask for? She was recommended for an IEP last year in Kindergarten, but was denied at the beginning of this school year. I think it was because she had a lot of time to spend with me over the summer while I was off (I do contracted work). So, when the school year started, she was behaving so well. But, as soon as I went back to work, everything started full-force again. It's pure chaos.

I'm really worried that this will continue on that long! We are ALL miserable!!!!

My son was in JK at 3 plus he had a hearing processing disorder and a speech problem so he could not hear them and they could not understand him and he was barely out of babyhood. So his start to school was not great. He had A LOT to adjust to. School is just entirely different than home and it takes time and patience especially with an exceptional child for whatever reason.

REALLY push for that IEP. This help my son a lot because he had his own EA to keep him on track. As the parent of an exceptional child you really have to fight for them, It takes a lot of nattering and complaining and talking and negotiating.

So, what should I say to the school? We talk about the behavior, but it never changes. I feel like they were so involved when they were trying to push the IEP last year (= more $$ for the school), but when that was dropped, so it seems that their care for the matter did as well.

Keep asking for that IEP, keep asking for that psycho- educational testing that will get her the IEP. You basically have to keep all over them like white on rice or nothing gets done.

I just would like to know if there's anything I should be saying to the school? Anything I could ask for? She was recommended for an IEP last year in Kindergarten, but was denied at the beginning of this school year. I think it was because she had a lot of time to spend with me over the summer while I was off (I do contracted work). So, when the school year started, she was behaving so well. But, as soon as I went back to work, everything started full-force again. It's pure chaos.

Does the teacher have an ILP/IEP for her? (Individual Learning Plan?) Even if she's not funded to be aided or on a program, the teacher should still go to the effort to write up an ILP especially for her. In the ILP the teacher can include small, achievable goals for your daughter. For example, one goal might be, to work cooperatively in both small group AND whole class situations. That way, the teacher and yourself both have a very specific goal to work towards, and when that goal is achieved, move on to a new goal. So perhaps ask the teacher if your daughter has an ILP and if she thinks it would be work creating one. I have ILPs for a handful of kids in my class.

Also, you say that your daughter performs better in small group situations - throughout my time teaching, I have learnt that almost all children (especially young children) cope better in small group situations. I wonder if your teacher is incorporating a lot of small group tasks into the daily routine? Does the school have integration aides?

Anyway, good luck It sounds like you are doing a wonderful job. I can understand how chaotic and hard it is at times!

You should look into parent advocacy groups in your area. They can coach you on the law, what your rights are as a parent, what the school can and cannot do, etc. If her school district is not able to meet her needs and she is not thriving where she is, they may have to pay for her to attend school in an "out of district placament".

Who specifically denied her the IEP? Was it the special education director?

Definitely talk to advocacy groups and/or your local disability law center. If your child has been done a disservice, they can help you pressure the school district to do what they need to do to meet her needs. She has to have an IEP in order to get services. Appealing the denial for the IEP is step 1.

It makes no sense to me that she has ADD, ODD, and documented behavioral issues in school, but is being denied an IEP. It sounds like you are being jerked around. If they know you are seeking advice from advocacy groups, law centers, etc....and that you might take it to litigation...I bet they will start moving fast and be more willing to work with you.

There are lots of behavior issues at school (not to mention everywhere else), which is seriously affecting her ability to reach her full potential.

I also want you to know that I feel your pain on this one. It's really hard when you can't live a normal life and everything is a massive effort because you have to constantly deal with negative behaviors.

Does she respond at all to positive behavioral supports/reward systems? Have you seen those behavior charts designed for kids who need a visual representation? I use this one with my son, and I've found it is one of the better ones for the price : link removed

How long did you try these parenting tactics?

Bored without stimulus? How much T.V., computer, games, etc. does she spend on per day? Medication is not the answer. In order to excel academically and socially she needs to understand the "rules" and how to keep herself in check without disrupting others.

Everyone in the house needs to be on the same page (all enforcing rules the same to all children) You're not going to see results after three days... it takes time. 3 weeks to break a habit, so just think of it in those terms. Maximum of 1 warning, sometimes none. There doesn't need to be a discussion or compromise about it, it's simply "because I said so" and "end of story"

I do believe in ADD, but not at the rate that it is diagnosed. I don't know you or your child, but already I am hearing lots of excuses for her.

It makes no sense to me that she has ADD, ODD, and documented behavioral issues in school, but is being denied an IEP. It sounds like you are being jerked around. If they know you are seeking advice from advocacy groups, law centers, etc....and that you might take it to litigation...I bet they will start moving fast and be more willing to work with you.

I'm assuming an IEP is the equivalent in Australia of a child to receive special funding if they are diagnosed with a certain condition and to receive extra help in the classroom with this funding? You would be surprised how hard it is to get funding/IEP approved. I have had children in my classroom with low-functioning autism and a whole plethora of other mental disabilities who have been denied funding/IEP. It's very, very difficult to get approved and often if the child is very smart the application will get denied. It really sucks.

I'm not sure if anyone else mentioned this, but I would suggest CBT (cognitive behavioral therapy). CBT basically allows you to SEE your behavior and make a conscious decision to behave differently.

Cognitive behavioral therapy can be effective by itself, or in conjunction with medication, if you are able to live with the negative side effects until the medication is not needed.

Hope this helped and good luck!

Buddha5: You are one of those individuals that would be thoroughly stressed out and exasperated if presented with caring for my daughter. Your comments show that you not only don't understand this type of child, but would also likely label her as a problem child.

My struggle is so much deeper than you could ever imagine. Even the school, which is a very good school and caters to the academically gifted child, has difficulty with my daughter. This isn't about three-days' worth of time. This is a 6 1/2 year battle with numerous adult interventions: pediatrician, psychologist, psychiatrist, therapist, teachers, principal, family members, and coaches.

I have vested much time in reading, research, and discussions. Charts have been used - one is in use right now. She SO wants to be accepted and loved by others, but for some reason is ill-equipped to do so.

For a sweet girl who is also very bright, there should be no reason why she doesn't excel greatly. But she obviously has many obstacles.

I use to think that I was an awful mother, and I would blame myself. But, I have a younger daughter who is a model child, and is reassurance that there are specific issues that need addressed in my first child - which has nothing to do with my parenting ability.

I thank everyone for their thoughtful responses. I sent an email to the teacher last night requesting the IEP again. I think she would do great if she had her own EA. I also created a template for a behavior chart to be used in school. Since conferences are around the corner, hopefully we'll start to see the ball rolling.

I vest all that I can into my girls, because I know how much it matters. What I do for them now directly affects the quality of life they'll have as adults, and I think it's critical to get it right for them!

I commend you for all the work that you've done and continue to do with your daughter. Unless you've gone through this with a child, you really can't understand it.

I hate to say this, but accept the fact that you've got a long road ahead of you. My daughter, is very similar to yours, and it wasn't till she was in grade 5 that the behaviour started to become "normal" - in that, she wasn't getting into trouble on a regular basis. She's now in grade 11 and on the honour roll, but it was a huge task to get her to this point.

Get an IEP! If you have to do a private psycho-educational test, do so! I know it's expensive, but check if your work benefits will help to cover the costs.

Also, accpet the fact that the school can only do so much. Don't view them as an enemy, I know we tend to go into Mama Bear mode when it's our child that's being targeted, but you'll accomplish much more if you're on the same side. As a teacher myself, it's exhausting having these types of kids in your class. I had one year with 7 diagnosed ADHD kids in my class and I almost went insane! You're right, they do thrive in the small group setting, but reality is, they won't get that in the public school setting all the time (but the IEP should help). If you can swing it, try to volunteer in your daughter's class. I used 1 sick day a month to volunteer in daughter's class when she was young and it was a real eye opener. That way I could make some suggestions that had real world applications to both the teacher and my daughter.

We too chose not to put my daughter on ADHD drugs and tried to control the issue holisticly. No processed foods (especially sugar), lots of Omega 3s, no TV during the week and it did help to some extent. When my daughter entered high school, she chose to go the drug route (Adderal) and it made a huge difference with her ability to focus and control impulsivity. I still would advocate when I child is young, they not take the drugs if at all possible due to the negative side effects (insomnia, decreased appetitie).

My daughter still is the type to march to her own drummer. She doesn't pick up non verbal clues that are so important in social activities, so she still struggles with friendships. She does have two friends now, who are quirky, smart ADHD kids like herself, they seem to get each other. She also seems to be accepted at her High School (no bullying), and has a large group of aquaintences - I've found as the kids get into High School and thus a larger pool of peers, the kids become more accepting of the obviously different kids.

How about the paddle? That seemed to work pretty good for most children. Didn't need expensive medications, doctors, expensive shrinks to tell parents to discipline their children.

How about the paddle? That seemed to work pretty good for most children. Didn't need expensive medications, doctors, expensive shrinks to tell parents to discipline their children.

Aggression does not work with these children it actually makes that much worse.